Semi-Finals Gonzo vs. Catsfan3523

[LukaszObrzut]

I don't think any team beats Gonzo. I like Catsfan team, but following the NBA as I do makes me love Gonzo team.

You guys don't even mention Rubio, who is just fine on a squad that he's not counting on to score but control the game. I see no problem after cp3 is gone when you account for the young guys Fultz/Rubio are surrounded with. Fultz wasn't #1 bc he's hyped to be a nobody.

Cp3, AB, cov, Leonard, dray lineup.. I wish I could see that in real life. Really nice.

 

[catsfan3523]

I don't think any team beats Gonzo. I like Catsfan team, but following the NBA as I do makes me love Gonzo team.

You guys don't even mention Rubio, who is just fine on a squad that he's not counting on to score but control the game. I see no problem after cp3 is gone when you account for the young guys Fultz/Rubio are surrounded with. Fultz wasn't #1 bc he's hyped to be a nobody.

Cp3, AB, cov, Leonard, dray lineup.. I wish I could see that in real life. Really nice.

Who on his team can score outside of Kawhi?

 

[LukaszObrzut]

Who on his team can score outside of Kawhi?

For one the defense is elite, defense turns into offense

Secondly, Lopez is instant offense for a big guy. AB averaged 16 per. RoCo is streaky sorta like Jr Smith, but i personally think is the better player there. He can go out a steal a game with his 3 ball. Cp3 still averaged 18 per and carried the scoring load as much as possible for the Clippers in the UTA series. Harris and Morris are not non existent scorers either. I really don't see that as a problem.

 

[brianpoe]

I'm going with catsfan, simply because I too can not stand Paul or DG, and my good friend Gonzo totally oversold his team so much in this thread that I really want Paul and Green to lose everything, including this poll.



Apologies to gonzo, still a fan.

 

[GonzoCat90]

I'm going with catsfan, simply because I too can not stand Paul or DG, and my good friend Gonzo totally oversold his team so much in this thread that I really want Paul and Green to lose everything, including this poll.



Apologies to gonzo, still a fan.

No problem. You're not the only one voting with their emotions instead of their brain.

 

[GonzoCat90]

Your DPOY has never been able to stop Davis. It' not a good matchup for him at all. Green is a 6-6 PF who can't guard Davis. Davis has averaged 25-13 against the warriors throughout his career.

Kawhi and Bradley are good defenders but neither one of them can guard Davis. Paul isn't quick enough any more to keep up with Irving and he's not going to be the same player of the next 7 years.

You can throw depth or injuries at me all you want but honestly who on your team is capable of scoring besides Kawhi?

CP3 is around 19 a game, Lopez is 21, Bradley 16, my entire bench is around 15 and Fultz is going to be a 20+ guy sooner rather than later.

You should also factor in assists. If Paul scores 18 and dishes out 10 assists, or Draymond scores 13 with 8 assists, that's as much offense as a guy who scores 25 with 5 dimes. Especially since my guys all do it with great percentages.

But again, if we're going to ignore statistical data and just go based on names people know with no injuries or defense, then efficiency shouldn't factor in either. Pete Maravich is better than Magic Johnson because he averaged more points.

 

[dvillecatfan]

Gonzo, be happy...you got chris paul farther than he has ever been in a playoff.

 

[catsfan3523]

CP3 is around 19 a game, Lopez is 21, Bradley 16, my entire bench is around 15 and Fultz is going to be a 20+ guy sooner rather than later.

You should also factor in assists. If Paul scores 18 and dishes out 10 assists, or Draymond scores 13 with 8 assists, that's as much offense as a guy who scores 25 with 5 dimes. Especially since my guys all do it with great percentages.

But again, if we're going to ignore statistical data and just go based on names people know with no injuries or defense, then efficiency shouldn't factor in either. Pete Maravich is better than Magic Johnson because he averaged more points.

Since you talk about injuries for my team so much how about some of your key players only playing in 60 games?

Brad Beal played in 77 games, Davis played in 75, Kyrie played in 72 and they are injury prone? But yet Chris Paul played in 61, Avery Bradley in 55

 

[DraftCat]

Gonzo, be happy...you got chris paul farther than he has ever been in a playoff.

This is hilarious

 

[GonzoCat90]

Gonzo, be happy...you got chris paul farther than he has ever been in a playoff.

I give all the credit to Kawhi and Draymond. Great champions. And Steven Adams who has been to the Finals. And Bradley has been to the conference finals.

None of them are Anthony Davis or Brad Beal or anything though. I can see where they'd choke in these big moments.

 

[GonzoCat90]

Since you talk about injuries for my team so much how about some of your key players only playing in 60 games?

Brad Beal played in 77 games, Davis played in 75, Kyrie played in 72 and they are injury prone? But yet Chris Paul played in 61, Avery Bradley in 55

Yes, because one year isn't a statistical trend. This really isn't hard to understand.

 

[catsfan3523]

Yes, because one year isn't a statistical trend. This really isn't hard to understand.

I'm just saying. It's such a big deal but yet several of your key guys missed over 20 games last year and the ones your talking about on my team all played over 72. And they could never start a new trend of staying healthy? Steph Curry missed a ton his first few years and everybody said he'd never be much because of his health and look at him now.

I'm a huge fan of Kawhi and I think he is great. I just don't like the makeup of your roster. Kind of reminds me of the Grizzlies teams from a few years ago. Draymond is a good system player. I really don't think he would be very good in a different scheme.

 

[Aike]

No problem. You're not the only one voting with their emotions instead of their brain.

I love this game.

 

[GonzoCat90]

I'm just saying. It's such a big deal but yet several of your key guys missed over 20 games last year and the ones your talking about on my team all played over 72. And they could never start a new trend of staying healthy? Steph Curry missed a ton his first few years and everybody said he'd never be much because of his health and look at him now.

I'm a huge fan of Kawhi and I think he is great. I just don't like the makeup of your roster. Kind of reminds me of the Grizzlies teams from a few years ago. Draymond is a good system player. I really don't think he would be very good in a different scheme.

It's possible, but highly unlikely. Brilliant pick though, knowing folks here wouldn't be critical of Davis. AD for 82 games should be a top 3 pick in this game.

And I totally disagree on Draymond. He's the key for why the Warriors system works. He alllows them go to small. He allows Steph to not carry the playmaking load. He's their toughness. He's their ball mover (and kicker). He's a shooter from the PF/C spot.

If those Grizzlies teams had CP3 instead of Conley, Kawhi instead of Tony Allen and Draymond instead of ZBo, they'd have won a title. Talent matters. And my talent fits my system.

Three of the top 10 playmakers in the league. Four of the best 7 defenders in the league. Shooters at every position. The top rookie. Only one guy who's even 30. Versatility. Experience with winning. Tough guys.

But I have Chris Paul and Draymond Green. When having two of the top 20 players in the league becomes a negative, you're in trouble. Thought maybe making it clear that we're talking "best" and not "favorite" this year would offset that, but I clearly misjudged the room.

 

[GonzoCat90]

I love this game.

Amen. It beats the hell out of "who do you think will start? Who do you think will go pro?"

We should go to the lair and do a football GM draft.

 

[catsfan3523]

It's possible, but highly unlikely. Brilliant pick though, knowing folks here wouldn't be critical of Davis. AD for 82 games should be a top 3 pick in this game.

And I totally disagree on Draymond. He's the key for why the Warriors system works. He alllows them go to small. He allows Steph to not carry the playmaking load. He's their toughness. He's their ball mover (and kicker). He's a shooter from the PF/C spot.

If those Grizzlies teams had CP3 instead of Conley, Kawhi instead of Tony Allen and Draymond instead of ZBo, they'd have won a title. Talent matters. And my talent fits my system.

Three of the top 10 playmakers in the league. Four of the best 7 defenders in the league. Shooters at every position. The top rookie. Only one guy who's even 30. Versatility. Experience with winning. Tough guys.

But I have Chris Paul and Draymond Green. When having two of the top 20 players in the league becomes a negative, you're in trouble. Thought maybe making it clear that we're talking "best" and not "favorite" this year would offset that, but I clearly misjudged the room.

Who would you have taken at my spot over Davis? You can make an argument for Westbrook but I had him last year and it was hard to build around him.

 

[catsfan3523]

It's possible, but highly unlikely. Brilliant pick though, knowing folks here wouldn't be critical of Davis. AD for 82 games should be a top 3 pick in this game.

And I totally disagree on Draymond. He's the key for why the Warriors system works. He alllows them go to small. He allows Steph to not carry the playmaking load. He's their toughness. He's their ball mover (and kicker). He's a shooter from the PF/C spot.

If those Grizzlies teams had CP3 instead of Conley, Kawhi instead of Tony Allen and Draymond instead of ZBo, they'd have won a title. Talent matters. And my talent fits my system.

Three of the top 10 playmakers in the league. Four of the best 7 defenders in the league. Shooters at every position. The top rookie. Only one guy who's even 30. Versatility. Experience with winning. Tough guys.

But I have Chris Paul and Draymond Green. When having two of the top 20 players in the league becomes a negative, you're in trouble. Thought maybe making it clear that we're talking "best" and not "favorite" this year would offset that, but I clearly misjudged the room.

I've just never really felt Green is all that good. He is good defensively but I think if you put him on a different team he would just be another player. I don't see him as the type of player to be able to carry a team. I know he would have Kawhi but he'd still probably be the 2nd option.

 

[GonzoCat90]

Who would you have taken at my spot over Davis? You can make an argument for Westbrook but I had him last year and it was hard to build around him.

Here? No one.

In reality, the MVP in his prime who just averaged a triple double for the first time in 50 years and took a shaky team to the playoffs.

I've had Russ in this too (thought I had him last year, paired him with Simmons and a bunch of versatile guys), and suffered the same fate I'm getting this year. So you clearly made the smart pick.

 

[catsfan3523]

Here? No one.

In reality, the MVP in his prime who just averaged a triple double for the first time in 50 years and took a shaky team to the playoffs.

I've had Russ in this too (thought I had him last year, paired him with Simmons and a bunch of versatile guys), and suffered the same fate I'm getting this year. So you clearly made the smart pick.

Yeah I like Westbrook, it was just hard to build a team around him in this. Maybe it was the year before last when I had him. I just know I didn't make it very far with him as my first pick.

 

[WildMoon]

I picked catsfan.

 

[crawfords corner]

Congrats Catsfan


Catsfan team would look something like this

Irving
Beal
Crowder
Davis
Howard

2nd team

Beverley
Ariza
Young
Collins
Turner

Harrison and Smith have a tough chore in stealing minutes because of Beverley's defense. Smith could go in if just looking for scoring. Harrison is this team's 12th man.


Gonzo Team like this

Paul
Harris
Leonard
Green
Lopez

2nd team

Rubio
Fultz(Could be switched with Harris)
Covington
Morris
Adams

On this team out of necessity Fultz will have to learn to play more off the ball. Luckily for him he has Rubio or Paul whenever you play him. Huge question would be the impact of Green though. He's going to be less effective in this scenario. This is not the GSW. Not saying he's been made completely by that system, but it has a ton to do with it. A plus here is that when Paul retires you'd have Fultz to take over full time. A hole would be there at SG, though.


First thing I gotta say is when doing what I did above it really became quite clear these two teams were pretty evenly matched. Obviously these two owners won't play exactly like I would have my team play, but I don't think I'm that far off from how the starters and bench would look.

 

[LukaszObrzut]

Congrats Catsfan


Catsfan team would look something like this

Irving
Beal
Crowder
Davis
Howard

2nd team

Beverley
Ariza
Young
Collins
Turner

Harrison and Smith have a tough chore in stealing minutes because of Beverley's defense. Smith could go in if just looking for scoring. Harrison is this team's 12th man.


Gonzo Team like this

Paul
Harris
Leonard
Green
Lopez

2nd team

Rubio
Fultz(Could be switched with Harris)
Covington
Morris
Adams

On this team out of necessity Fultz will have to learn to play more off the ball. Luckily for him he has Rubio or Paul whenever you play him. Huge question would be the impact of Green though. He's going to be less effective in this scenario. This is not the GSW. Not saying he's been made completely by that system, but it has a ton to do with it. A plus here is that when Paul retires you'd have Fultz to take over full time. A hole would be there at SG, though.


First thing I gotta say is when doing what I did above it really became quite clear these two teams were pretty evenly matched. Obviously these two owners won't play exactly like I would have my team play, but I don't think I'm that far off from how the starters and bench would look.

Gonzo best lineup is:

Paul
Bradley
Covington
Leonard
Green

 

[Big_Blue79]

Wish I had voted on this in time. I think I give a slight edge to Gonzo. I'm not really too worried about the "loser" argument or injuries angle (Beal is young and seems to be healthy now, AD is largely precautionary, and they're hard to project). But the wing depth for Catsfan is really bad. Otherwise I like the team, but that's a big issue. Gonzo has the edge now and probably in years 6-7 (high on Fultz and Harris).