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Ho-hum another school shooting...

Yeah....I don't have a problem with CC, but there's a lot of careless people and people who think a gun is a toy. There was an old codger here a couple of years ago who saw someone he knew in line when he walked into a Dairy Queen. He thought it would be funny to walk up behind him, put his gun in his back and tell him this is a robbery and to give him all his ****ing money. His friend didn't appreciate it, and I'm pretty sure he didn't think that maybe the other customers wouldn't find it funny, and didn't think that maybe a DQ employee might call 911, which they did. Could have been worse though. At least there wasn't another customer carrying that was as stupid as he was and wanted to play hero.

I've never met a CC person that wasn't competent and very serious about the responsibility, but of course, idiots exist.

I'd get a CC permit, but it's all I can currently handle to make sure I leave the house with my keys, wallet, phone, and reading glasses every day. Maybe someday. Glad there are responsible CC people out there.
 
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I've never met a CC person that wasn't competent and very serious about the responsibility, but of course, idiots exist.

I'd get a CC permit, but it's all I can currently handle to make sure I leave the house with my keys, wallet, phone, and reading glasses every day. Maybe someday. Glad there are responsible CC people out there.

I think by and large they are responsible people, and they should be because it's a helluva responsibility. I personally know 5 people who CC. Three are extremely competent, level headed people. One is a sweet, but extremely dingy lady, and I wouldn't be shocked if she winds up accidentally shooting herself or someone else one day. The other is a paranoid, quick tempered dude that I wouldn't be surprised to read about in the paper one day where he shot someone who he felt "threatened" by.
 
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I'd guess that 90-95% of the people who get their carry permit never carry a weapon after about the first month.

It sounds like a great idea when you sign up for it, but by the time you find a comfortable holster, figure out the issues that may or may not come with it (like retention when you drop your pants in the bathroom, etc.), and get used to wearing it, most people throw in the towel. There is no "one size fits all" holster, and you can easily end up with a couple hundred dollars in gear before you find the right fit. (That said, I'm gonna throw out some props to the guys at Black Arch - their ADM is the best I have found. https://www.blackarchholsters.com/ )

As far as competency thing goes, that's a tossup. Three people of the 15 in the course I took were asked to leave because they showed up with loaded weapons. Two others were asked to come back for another class because they couldn't follow instructions and didn't bring a cleaning kit, and one more was booted because she couldn't disassemble her weapon.

The people I know personally who carry are pretty much in line with the type Ida mentions - they practice at least monthly, most have taken at least one advanced pistol course post CDW certification, and know their shit.

That said, carrying and having to use the weapon are two different beasts. I had the misfortune of having to pull a weapon in a "crazy person" encounter last year, and all the practice and training I have done were barely enough to keep me calm during the encounter. The appearance of the weapon de-escalated the situation and the crazy person got back in their car and left, but I was pretty much done for the day afterward. My nerves were so shot from the adrenaline rush and the subsequent crash that I could barely function. Not something I recommend, and I have no idea how I would respond in a situation where there was an actual shooter. I don't really want to find out.
 
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I'd guess that 90-95% of the people who get their carry permit never carry a weapon after about the first month.

It sounds like a great idea when you sign up for it, but by the time you find a comfortable holster, figure out the issues that may or may not come with it (like retention when you drop your pants in the bathroom, etc.), and get used to wearing it, most people throw in the towel. There is no "one size fits all" holster, and you can easily end up with a couple hundred dollars in gear before you find the right fit. (That said, I'm gonna throw out some props to the guys at Black Arch - their ADM is the best I have found. https://www.blackarchholsters.com/ )

As far as competency thing goes, that's a tossup. Three people of the 15 in the course I took were asked to leave because they showed up with loaded weapons. Two others were asked to come back for another class because they couldn't follow instructions and didn't bring a cleaning kit, and one more was booted because she couldn't disassemble her weapon.

The people I know personally who carry are pretty much in line with the type Ida mentions - they practice at least monthly, most have taken at least one advanced pistol course post CDW certification, and know their shit.

That said, carrying and having to use the weapon are two different beasts. I had the misfortune of having to pull a weapon in a "crazy person" encounter last year, and all the practice and training I have done were barely enough to keep me calm during the encounter. The appearance of the weapon de-escalated the situation and the crazy person got back in their car and left, but I was pretty much done for the day afterward. My nerves were so shot from the adrenaline rush and the subsequent crash that I could barely function. Not something I recommend, and I have no idea how I would respond in a situation where there was an actual shooter. I don't really want to find out.

Agree it is a scary situation whether you are the one holding the gun or the one having it pointed at you. Been in both situations with no shots fired but, it was unnerving.
 
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Here is one more idea that I like that is along the lines of intervention, but it goes one step further. Temporarily restraining someone that has signs of being off the rails, access to their weapons. It's called GVRO Gun-violence restraining orders:

Link
 
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The NYPD's hit rate in an active fire situation is 18%. You think teachers are better than that?

If we are arming teachers, should we be arming movie theatre employees and bartenders of clubs? (wasn't there an armed guard at the club in Orlando?)

Do you not think that teachers aren't susceptible to mental illness?

Do you think 18 year old kids at their prime couldn't wrestle a gun away from a teacher?

More guns isn't the answer.
 
The NYPD's hit rate in an active fire situation is 18%. You think teachers are better than that?

If we are arming teachers, should we be arming movie theatre employees and bartenders of clubs? (wasn't there an armed guard at the club in Orlando?)

Do you not think that teachers aren't susceptible to mental illness?

Do you think 18 year old kids at their prime couldn't wrestle a gun away from a teacher?

More guns isn't the answer.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

1. Depends on who they are
2. Depends on who they are
3. Ur mom
4. Ur mom
5. No crap

Well thought out questions. I can tell you spent a lot of time thinking about this very complex issue.
=========================
please watch the name calling
 
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The NYPD's hit rate in an active fire situation is 18%. You think teachers are better than that?

If we are arming teachers, should we be arming movie theatre employees and bartenders of clubs? (wasn't there an armed guard at the club in Orlando?)

Do you not think that teachers aren't susceptible to mental illness?

Do you think 18 year old kids at their prime couldn't wrestle a gun away from a teacher?

More guns isn't the answer.
Neither is less guns. Armed > then unarmed. Armed =chance unarmed=no chance. simple really
 
I just read an article that said an armed deputy was on the campus of that school the entire time of the shooting and did not enter the school. He has resigned. That should be some kind of actionable offense. HIs cowardice probably cost some people their lives.
 
This gets my vote for Biggest Dumb Ass Republican Failed Analogy of the Day. Congratulations!

This is a bit of a weak attempt to deflect criticism away from weak gun access laws. Obviously those killed in automobiles are accidental, while most deaths from guns are purposeful. However if they want to do that kind of comparison you have to point out that driving an automobile requires training, passing a test to get a licence and having liability insurance. none of which applies to gun sales. That's not to say driving can't be made safer as it can. I advocate recurring driving checks say every 5 years which includes a vision check. Autonomous driving cars will be standard in another decade and that will add to automotive safety.

We can also do a lot more to enhance public safety from shootings. I think the universal background checks have now gained steam with Senator Tomey indicting that he plans to reintroduce the Tomey/Manchin bill, and the President has indicated he is onboard with that. I also think we will see more attention to the so-called "red flag laws" which allows law enforcement to intervene and confiscate weapons from someone that has indicated their intentions of committing a crime like a mass shooting, like Nicholas Cruz did. It would require a court order and have a limited time frame while they can sort it out. I also think Warrior-Cats idea of having retired police and military serve as volunteer guards at schools has merit, but for this to be effective they would also need to enhance the structure so that there is only one or a few hard entry points, and surveillance cameras at key locations. That's a much better idea then arming teachers who by and large oppose that idea.
 
I'm a teacher. Go ahead, let me have a gun in the classroom. If a shooter comes after any of my students I'd try to protect them either way. Better to have the means to do so.

Honestly, if teachers could have guns in school, just the possession of them alone would eliminate most of these shootings. Most of these guys want sitting ducks, not a gunfight from the get-go.
 


Are you purposely making the worst analogy of all time or just joking around? I'm not super into on one side or the other but this analogy was so horrible but I couldn't tell if you were joking or not. However if you need a gun to get to work in the morning or go grocery shopping or generally to function in day to day life then maybe this analogy makes sense.
 
Are you purposely making the worst analogy of all time or just joking around? I'm not super into on one side or the other but this analogy was so horrible but I couldn't tell if you were joking or not. However if you need a gun to get to work in the morning or go grocery shopping or generally to function in day to day life then maybe this analogy makes sense.

Is the purpose to prevent tragic deaths? Or
just certain kinds of tragic deaths?

It’s not a terrible analogy. People
Functioned in daily life a long time before automobiles, after all.
 
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