Russia - Ukraine WAR Warning: Political Discussions
- Thread starter Canned Heat
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NATO members have a responsibility to act. Putin should have no confidence in anything. As usual, the Russians are great a sabre rattling and running their mouths but their men and equipment are sub-par. If he is making that bet, he will lose. He better worry about the state of his country due to this war. The sanctions aren't going away anytime soon regardless of what he threatens. Even if they pull out tomorrow the sanctions will continue. Russia will end up crippled for decades.
Agree. Several Warsaw Pact nations joined NATO. Additionally, based on this latest unfolding Kremlin adventure, Russian military planners probably want no part of well-disciplined/equipped/trained Bundeswehr panzer units or British or US armor battalions.
ATC, I think you missed the WSJ article a couple days ago where the head of German military says their army is a shell, a laughing stock.
Our ENTIRE government has been in bed with China since the 1970s. That includes Reagan and Trump. You can only see things in terms of Trump/Biden. Trump did not save this country. He merely brought some things to the attention of the people that needed to be addressed. As much as Trump ran his mouth, the China trade deal didn’t do shit, and it was the pandemic and China lying about it that are forcing companies to relocate.
Biden hasn’t exactly kissed China’s ass. This Russia stuff takes the forefront right now, and we won’t forget China. In due time, that will be addressed. If not, a Republican will win in 2024. One still may, anyway.
I thought they would have sent a millions pounds each of brats and cheese. And maybe a million barrels of beer.
Anyone believing any media source is just foolish. Some of it may be true but there are no guarantees. This is a propaganda war with kinetic elements that are very real
Checking the boxes gets us people who have no clue of what they are doing. They simply follow the ignorance of the green new deal architects who themselves do not understand what they are proposing and the effects it will have on the economy.
Nato cut and run from Afghanistan and Putin watched
Then he attacked Ukraine full blown and now nato watches.
I don’t think Putin has any regard for nato. He isn’t scared of nato it’s the contrary nato is afraid of russia or they would call Putin’s bluff and save Europe from a wider war. The way Putin sees it the USA nor England or any other will go to war for Lithuanian. I also believe there will be some fractures in nato in the next year as they begin to bicker over sanctions against russia. They are together now and looks nice but nato knew of the Russian buildup and did nothing pre invasion because they couldn’t agree. Compromise will only work for so long when you have the likes of Hungary turkey germany and the USA. That’s 4 competing world views.
one more thing. It’s evident russia didn’t bring out it’s fine China for Ukraine or they want to get rid of all the old Soviet stuff first and save it for nato. I think Putin is on a mission to completely destabilize the world and he’s gonna go head to head with nato before it’s all said and done.
Interesting perspective. Not saying you're wrong, could be, just don't know.
False. Biden has as well as others in the country kissed China ass but, you missed the point. The point being someone suggested sanctioning China as well to deter them attacking Taiwan. I simply said that would put an immediate hurt on the American economy that is already hurt.
Sorry but you're simply wrong.
Five Myths About NATO and Afghanistan
Commentators trying to pass blame for the handling of the Afghanistan withdrawal get the alliance's role in the conflict wrong.
www.lawfareblog.com
Putin has done nothing but show the weakness of the Russian military, it's equipment, soldiers and will. If you think he did that on purpose to embarrass himself on the world stage, I'm not sure how to help you.
Bingo. I have been saying this the whole time about their equipment. They have done this before.
I'd like to know where all this abundant, magical, fossil fuel free electricity our Energy Sec. is talking about is going to come from immediately in this forced "energy transition".
Was there a major breakthrough in cold fusion I haven't heard about?
Did aliens visit the oval office and give Biden extraterrestrial technology to produce "clean" energy that's available NOW?
Meanwhile, here in reality, people won't be able to pay their bills or support their families. Looks like we're f**ked. I'm not surprised. Whoever voted for these idiots, well, nevermind.
I will say he's wrong. As for Ukraine, NATO has no role there. They were in Afghanistan because a member (us) was attacked. Ukraine isn't a member. The rest of his post is nearly bizarre. Russia doesn't have the wealth to compete any longer. It is on full display now. Their new killer tanks barely run and they've only afforded to buy a few. Their airforce can't even control Ukraine. Their mighty navy has 1 running aircraft carrier and it quite literally barely runs. The only thing Russia has to worry about is nukes and if they want to die along with the rest of the world, they can push the button but I doubt they are interested in dying too.
So they are intentionally looking like the keystone cops? They don't have the defense budget to support some incredible arsenal like you guys are wringing your hands about.
8 days into a war and he has major cities surrounded doesn’t seem like embarrassment to me. Sure our media spins it that way but the autocratic world sees progress rapid progress. The problem with the west has always been instant gratifying culture. Well in 3 mos when Moscow is finished and has their puppet government no one will remember how it began. When Putin gains control of Ukraine he wiSorry but you're simply wrong.
Five Myths About NATO and Afghanistan
Commentators trying to pass blame for the handling of the Afghanistan withdrawal get the alliance's role in the conflict wrong.
Putin has done nothing but show the weakness of the Russian military, it's equipment, soldiers and will. If you think he did that on purpose to embarrass himself on the world stage, I'm not sure how to help you.
I think Russia watched the USA botch things by leaving billions in equipment in Iraq only to fall into isis hands. They know they can destroy Ukraine with Soviet era equipment and can leave it and head back to Russia without concern of it falling into NATO hands.
one other thing. Sanctions and the destruction of the Russia economy. Once they are in an economic depression which will be soon why wouldn’t Putin go for a much bolder grander war?? It could be the only thing to save his country from economic collapse.
the view you have is very naive
Part of their problem which they still have to address even after their recent skirmishes is the fact that for a long time after the cold war and even now, they only have about 75% soldier strength manning their equipment relying heavily on poorly trained reserves (2 million strong I believe) being called up at a moment's notice to fill the void and man the equipment and be ready to fight. They also have a lot of older equipment because they believe sheer numbers matter. Agree also with not being able to afford newer equipment but, that has been a problem for them for a while now.
True. But that is not why Lukoil issued the statement. Even though the Russian oil market has not been sanctioned they are getting hammered right now. Traders don’t want to trade it, shippers are wary of shipping it and tankers are leary or refusing to load at Russian ports. And some banks are refusing to extend credit to anyone wanting to finance the purchase of Russian oil. This will only get worse for Russian oil companies.
No, I just think they use their weakest assets in the beginning to avoid losses on the more advanced equipment. Just throwing pure numbers at the enemy hoping to overwhelm them.
edited: not saying it is sound strategy or smart.
No, it's valid. There isn't a western nation afraid of Russia as evidenced by harsh sanctions sure to piss Putin off. Putin may well be holding back better equipment. That's mainly because he can't afford to replace it if it is lost. We certainly don't need their screwed up technology. Get out from under your desk and stand straight up. Russia is weak except for nukes.
Ukraine barely has a military and few sophisticated weapons. The fact that Russia controls very little in 8 days supports my position, not yours. As for a larger war after he is financially ruined, does that really make sense to you? Wars are expensive, how will he pay for it?
I don't disagree but I don't believe they have a large stockpile of of advanced equipment. Those killer tanks have been a fiasco and they can't even afford to buy them. Just what advanced equipment?
Did not say a large stockpile but only that they will use the old first because of sheer numbers trying to overwhelm. Putin don't give a damn about the troops. China uses a similar tactic or have for a long time before they started stealing technology and upgrading their equipment.
Assuming there are Russian plants in this thread, you are one of them.
I'll take what comes out as pro-Ukraine with a grain of salt. Will you do the same for anything pro-Putin/pro-Russia????
We cannot implement a no fly zone at this point. If we do, we are going head to head in the air against Russia. WW3
Russia, as long as Putin is in power, will take their time to do what they want to do in Ukraine. And eventually they can destroy the moral of the country.
Russia, under Putin, has been trying to take lands they believe are theirs. They attacked Georgia, they attacked Ukraine for Crimea.
but we are seeing a strangely unified effort from many European nations WHO depend on Russia for energy needs. This is important, for non WW reasons.
the best we can hope for is a change of leadership in Russia. It’s happened before and I believe it will happen again.
Russia, as long as Putin is in power, will take their time to do what they want to do in Ukraine. And eventually they can destroy the moral of the country.
Russia, under Putin, has been trying to take lands they believe are theirs. They attacked Georgia, they attacked Ukraine for Crimea.
but we are seeing a strangely unified effort from many European nations WHO depend on Russia for energy needs. This is important, for non WW reasons.
the best we can hope for is a change of leadership in Russia. It’s happened before and I believe it will happen again.
Quick thinking about politics and just think what makes the most sense. We pushed Russia and Putin answered the call. We have to deal with it.
Russia have different interests than we do. We hoped that their economic interests in Europe would make them align.
However, we destroyed their communist efforts of being the top dog. And Putin is a child of that. I think he is willing to go as far as he can go before they turn on him.
we can argue all day , the thread, political as far as that goes, but we have to deal with the TODAY.
Russia have different interests than we do. We hoped that their economic interests in Europe would make them align.
However, we destroyed their communist efforts of being the top dog. And Putin is a child of that. I think he is willing to go as far as he can go before they turn on him.
we can argue all day , the thread, political as far as that goes, but we have to deal with the TODAY.
The nuclear plant they took over last night supplies power to 25% of the country. They are obviously about to take all the plants over and blackmail them into submission.
I’m sure Putin’s has whipped them into frenzy over their decorated General being killed, etc. and they are blood thirsty fiends at this point.
I’m sure Putin’s has whipped them into frenzy over their decorated General being killed, etc. and they are blood thirsty fiends at this point.
Ukraine weapons are getting more & more sophisticated by the day with all the shipments coming in. I've heard nothing of this, but I now wonder if US doesn't have covert advisors in U to train in those weapons' usage.
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Russia has blocked access to Facebook. Totally wrong take. Nothing has radicalized, misinformed, and dumbed down more people than Facebook.
With Putin and his minions profiting hugely from it. Good. China and Russia don’t need social media.
Show me. Show me an example of Biden kissing Xi’s ass. I won’t argue the second point.
Read it again. He just emphasized the word “who” because the Euro countries depend on Russia so much. You were too busy correcting his grammar to notice.
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