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Russia - Ukraine WAR Warning: Political Discussions

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bcw1029 said:
Wholeheartedly disagree. Unfortunately for Russia, they will no longer be a world power after this war and they could have avoided this.

Still waiting for that profiteering off of our money evidence. I don’t care how many mansions Zel has, looking for evidence.
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I know you want direct cash payments but that isn't going to be possible and you know it... but here it is from the Biden admin itself. The Panama papers make it clear that Zelensky has been grifting since he first ran for politics. His old boss Kolomoisky gave him millions to be loyal to him. He has multi million dollar homes in Miami, Switzerland, Israel and smaller homes in other countries. Kolomoisky was the guy who owned the bank where over $1billion in US aid went missing under Obama.... it was the billion that Biden threatened to withhold unless the prosecutor got fired.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/bi...20b-ukraine-aid-house-republicans-warn-audits



UKRAINE

Published November 27, 2022 9:54am EST

Biden admin scrambles to track $20B in Ukraine aid as House Republicans warn of audits​

Biden's admin reportedly inspected just 10% of weapons going to Ukraine between February and November​

 
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https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021...ine-leader-seeks-to-justify-offshore-accounts


Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s office has sought to justify his use of offshore companies as protecting him against pro-Russian forces, following leaked revelations in the Pandora Papers.

A former comedian, Zelenskyy was elected president in 2019 on promises to fight corruption and reduce the influence of oligarchs in the ex-Soviet country.

But the files obtained by the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists (ICIJ) and published on Sunday claimed that Zelenskyy and his partners established a network of offshore companies back in 2012.

The Pandora Papers are based on documents leaked to the ICIJ and exposed the offshore dealings of kings, presidents and prime ministers, including Jordan’s King Abdullah II, Czech Prime Minister Andrej Babis and Kenyan President Uhuru Kenyatta.

According to its findings, two of the offshore companies belonging to Zelenskyy’s partners were used to buy three lavish properties in central London.

The report also found that Zelenskyy, just before he was elected, transferred his stake in one of the offshore companies to his top aide Serhiy Shefir – the target of a shooting attack last month.

Supporters of another ex-president, Petro Poroshenko – a billionaire defeated by Zelenskyy in 2019 and who also appeared in an earlier investigation into offshore companies – accused Zelenskyy of tax evasion.

“He and his accomplices took funds offshore without paying any taxes to the Ukrainian budget,” Iryna Gerashchenko, a lawmaker from Poroshenko’s faction, wrote on Facebook.
 
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hmt5000 said:
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021...ine-leader-seeks-to-justify-offshore-accounts


Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s office has sought to justify his use of offshore companies as protecting him against pro-Russian forces, following leaked revelations in the Pandora Papers.

A former comedian, Zelenskyy was elected president in 2019 on promises to fight corruption and reduce the influence of oligarchs in the ex-Soviet country.

But the files obtained by the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists (ICIJ) and published on Sunday claimed that Zelenskyy and his partners established a network of offshore companies back in 2012.

The Pandora Papers are based on documents leaked to the ICIJ and exposed the offshore dealings of kings, presidents and prime ministers, including Jordan’s King Abdullah II, Czech Prime Minister Andrej Babis and Kenyan President Uhuru Kenyatta.

According to its findings, two of the offshore companies belonging to Zelenskyy’s partners were used to buy three lavish properties in central London.

The report also found that Zelenskyy, just before he was elected, transferred his stake in one of the offshore companies to his top aide Serhiy Shefir – the target of a shooting attack last month.

Supporters of another ex-president, Petro Poroshenko – a billionaire defeated by Zelenskyy in 2019 and who also appeared in an earlier investigation into offshore companies – accused Zelenskyy of tax evasion.

“He and his accomplices took funds offshore without paying any taxes to the Ukrainian budget,” Iryna Gerashchenko, a lawmaker from Poroshenko’s faction, wrote on Facebook.
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Interesting. How much did it show Zelensky having?
 
BigBlueFanGA said:
That isn't the definition of a straw man. I never claimed good or bad. You just made another straw man. I simply equated the 2 and I'm correct.
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I've sufficiently explained to you why what you made was a straw man argument.

BigBlueFanGA said:
So defending their sovereign country is now arrogance. WOW
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This is also a straw man argument. The argument he was making was that refusing the negotiating table was Zelly's arrogance. THAT HIS insistence on fighting to reclaim up to and including Crimea no matter what the cost (our $$$), was his ego.

You mischaracterized that argument as defending one's country in general is arrogant, which is not at all what he meant.
 
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bcw1029 said:
Wholeheartedly disagree. Unfortunately for Russia, they will no longer be a world power after this war and they could have avoided this.
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I know you disagree. They could've avoided it, yes.

So could've we.
 
bcw1029 said:


Still waiting for that profiteering off of our money evidence. I don’t care how many mansions Zel has, looking for evidence.
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He's a con.


FjZGpLKXwAgYbxo

h/t frontrunner political thread
 
Gassy_Knowls said:
No you are not correct.

Not surprised though. You look in the mirror and don’t see your narcissism
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Since you mentioned narcissism. This guy look up photo op in the encyclopedia and this guy is the GOAT

us.yahoo.com

Ukraine's Zelenskiy meets troops near eastern front, says 'all our people will be free'

KYIV (Reuters) -Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy visited troops close to front lines in eastern Ukraine on Tuesday and expressed thanks to everyone involved in the war effort to mark the country's Armed Forces Day. Addressing servicemen later in the presidential palace in Kyiv, Zelenskiy...
us.yahoo.com us.yahoo.com
 
SDC888 said:
I've sufficiently explained to you why what you made was a straw man argument.



This is also a straw man argument. The argument he was making was that refusing the negotiating table was Zelly's arrogance. THAT HIS insistence on fighting to reclaim up to and including Crimea no matter what the cost (our $$$), was his ego.

You mischaracterized that argument as defending one's country in general is arrogant, which is not at all what he meant.
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Thats right. This likely is the high water mark for Ukraine. How many wars was it said “they’re finished” only to get smashed in the end? If Russia builds momentum from this stalemate they aren’t going to negotiate. Ukraine isnt taking Crimea without a devastating strikes from Russia. Do you hear of people in sevestapol pining to be part of Ukraine. Same with rebel held areas in Donbas? Russia is regrouping and there isnt anything Ukraine can do about it. Zelensky wants to double his losses for regions who care less for Ukraine? Senseless only a narcissist would have those ambitions. King selfie zelensky
 
Wildcats1st said:
Thats right. This likely is the high water mark for Ukraine. How many wars was it said “they’re finished” only to get smashed in the end? If Russia builds momentum from this stalemate they aren’t going to negotiate. Ukraine isnt taking Crimea without a devastating strikes from Russia. Do you hear of people in sevestapol pining to be part of Ukraine. Same with rebel held areas in Donbas? Russia is regrouping and there isnt anything Ukraine can do about it. Zelensky wants to double his losses for regions who care less for Ukraine? Senseless only a narcissist would have those ambitions. King selfie zelensky
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No one says much with a rifle pointed at their head...literally, genius.
 
SDC888 said:
I've sufficiently explained to you why what you made was a straw man argument.



This is also a straw man argument. The argument he was making was that refusing the negotiating table was Zelly's arrogance. THAT HIS insistence on fighting to reclaim up to and including Crimea no matter what the cost (our $$$), was his ego.

You mischaracterized that argument as defending one's country in general is arrogant, which is not at all what he meant.
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You've explained yourself but it was neither sufficient nor correct. Maybe I misread it. I remember him saying that specifically.
 
SDC888 said:
I've sufficiently explained to you why what you made was a straw man argument.



This is also a straw man argument. The argument he was making was that refusing the negotiating table was Zelly's arrogance. THAT HIS insistence on fighting to reclaim up to and including Crimea no matter what the cost (our $$$), was his ego.

You mischaracterized that argument as defending one's country in general is arrogant, which is not at all what he meant.
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His quote: " I want Ukraine to go to the table before they end up truly destroyed bc of their arrogance."

Again, they aren't going to the negotiating table because Russia demands part of their nation. This is known, therefore, all he is saying is that defending their nation is arrogant.
 
BigBlueFanGA said:
Ok, where does that number come from?
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I litter ali linked a story that talks about the Panama papers and what it was. The Pandora papers were latter hacks from the same group of journalist. It exposed illegal income and tax evasion by dozens of politicians across the world. Several had to resign and a couple were jailed.
 
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hmt5000 said:
I litter ali linked a story that talks about the Panama papers and what it was. The Pandora papers were latter hacks from the same group of journalist. It exposed illegal income and tax evasion by dozens of politicians across the world. Several had to resign and a couple were jailed.
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I read the 2 articles. I didn't see a number listed.
 
hmt5000 said:
I litter ali linked a story that talks about the Panama papers and what it was. The Pandora papers were latter hacks from the same group of journalist. It exposed illegal income and tax evasion by dozens of politicians across the world. Several had to resign and a couple were jailed.
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Yeah, I did read them. One issue they noted is that most of the actions were not illegal, but some were. I have no idea about Zelensky and his group.
 
BigBlueFanGA said:
Yeah, I did read them. One issue they noted is that most of the actions were not illegal, but some were. I have no idea about Zelensky and his group.
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OH ok. So you wanted me to link the entire 11.5 million documents and point to specific pages showing Zelensky's offshore co's?... LOL. The journalist that went through the docs estimated at that number.
 
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hmt5000 said:
OH ok. So you wanted me to link the entire 11.5 million documents and point to specific pages showing Zelensky's offshore co's?... LOL. The journalist that went through the docs estimated at that number.
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Ok, I simply didn't see where he did that. It's an awful lot, even with his production company. I'd have to see it laid out. That said, it has nothing to do with Russia illegally invading, destroying and trying to annex any or all of a sovereign Ukraine.
 
BigBlueFanGA said:
You simply hate. Of course, you could explain how he's a con but you won't.
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No, man. I don't "simply" hate. That's you and your lot (you know that's true.)

He's very obviously enriching himself at the expense of the Ukrainian people as he very obviously has in the past. What hmt posted is damning enough. I don't "hate" him. He is to be pitied, as are the Ukrainian/Russian people for what's beset them at the hands of incompetent and corrupt leaders.

BigBlueFanGA said:
You've explained yourself but it was neither sufficient nor correct. Maybe I misread it. I remember him saying that specifically.
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What are you talking about? You are making straw man arguments because you don't want to "debate" in earnest what's being presented. You want to "debate" something else, ie, the strawman you create.

You are all like that. I'm not going to sit here and walk you through fundamental logic any more than I already did.
 
BigBlueFanGA said:
His quote: " I want Ukraine to go to the table before they end up truly destroyed bc of their arrogance."

Again, they aren't going to the negotiating table because Russia demands part of their nation. This is known, therefore, all he is saying is that defending their nation is arrogant.
Click to expand...
Yep and nope. Yep I wasn’t zelensky to negotiate to end this. Nope Crimea and Donbas will never be Ukrainian again. The world allowed Putin to have Crimea in 2014. He’s not giving it back. Neither will any Russian. The history of Crimea is Russian. All through Russian history until 1954 Crimea was russian. Except for the time it was independent. Why the soviets transferred it to Ukraine well it should have gone back to russia when the Soviet Union fell. But russia had no leadership and the west pounced. Crimea is not Ukraine!!! For 40 years it was part of the Soviet Union governed by Ukraine. It could be considered stolen land tbh. This is what you hawks don’t get. If you had your way you’d find some way to give zelensky Moscow
 
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Wildcats1st said:
Yep and nope. Yep I wasn’t zelensky to negotiate to end this. Nope Crimea and Donbas will never be Ukrainian again. The world allowed Putin to have Crimea in 2014. He’s not giving it back. Neither will any Russian. The history of Crimea is Russian. All through Russian history until 1954 Crimea was russian. Except for the time it was independent. Why the soviets transferred it to Ukraine well it should have gone back to russia when the Soviet Union fell. But russia had no leadership and the west pounced. Crimea is not Ukraine!!! For 40 years it was part of the Soviet Union governed by Ukraine. It could be considered stolen land tbh. This is what you hawks don’t get. If you had your way you’d find some way to give zelensky Moscow
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Actually, if you go back you'll find that I said this will end with Ukraine keeping everything except Crimea. Russia will not be keeping eastern Ukraine. Crimea was allowed and clearly, this is not.
 
BigBlueFanGA said:
Actually, if you go back you'll find that I said this will end with Ukraine keeping everything except Crimea. Russia will not be keeping eastern Ukraine. Crimea was allowed and clearly, this is not.
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Yeah they will. The people in Donbas have been revolting against Ukraine for many many years. There are mass graves ukraine filled with the dead from Donbas. They have sought independence since 2014 there’s absolutely no desire to be part of Ukraine in that region. That’s why I call zelensky arrogant. He wants to force a unified Ukraine in his image not in the image of the will of the people. The over throw of yakanovych was the toppin point. Ukraine has been intentionally killing pro Russian people in Donbas. Ukraine and these borders are very young. This is the high water mark for zelensky. Since Russia is being forced to regroup they will take more territory. The only thing to save Ukraine isn’t zelensky. It is western technology and training.
 
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Wildcats1st said:
Yeah they will. The people in Donbas have been revolting against Ukraine for many many years. There are mass graves ukraine filled with the dead from Donbas. They have sought independence since 2014 there’s absolutely no desire to be part of Ukraine in that region. That’s why I call zelensky arrogant. He wants to force a unified Ukraine in his image not in the image of the will of the people. The over throw of yakanovych was the toppin point. Ukraine has been intentionally killing pro Russian people in Donbas. Ukraine and these borders are very young. This is the high water mark for zelensky. Since Russia is being forced to regroup they will take more territory. The only thing to save Ukraine isn’t zelensky. It is western technology and training.
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No, a loud group backed by Russia. Most of the people there do not support Russia. That's Putin propaganda.
 
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Wildcats1st said:
Yeah they will. The people in Donbas have been revolting against Ukraine for many many years. There are mass graves ukraine filled with the dead from Donbas. They have sought independence since 2014 there’s absolutely no desire to be part of Ukraine in that region. That’s why I call zelensky arrogant. He wants to force a unified Ukraine in his image not in the image of the will of the people. The over throw of yakanovych was the toppin point. Ukraine has been intentionally killing pro Russian people in Donbas. Ukraine and these borders are very young. This is the high water mark for zelensky. Since Russia is being forced to regroup they will take more territory. The only thing to save Ukraine isn’t zelensky. It is western technology and training.
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So after millions fled, the choice is still split. Congratulations on once again slurping up Putins spewed propaganda.

 
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Wildcats1st said:
Yeah they will. The people in Donbas have been revolting against Ukraine for many many years. There are mass graves ukraine filled with the dead from Donbas. They have sought independence since 2014 there’s absolutely no desire to be part of Ukraine in that region. That’s why I call zelensky arrogant. He wants to force a unified Ukraine in his image not in the image of the will of the people. The over throw of yakanovych was the toppin point. Ukraine has been intentionally killing pro Russian people in Donbas. Ukraine and these borders are very young. This is the high water mark for zelensky. Since Russia is being forced to regroup they will take more territory. The only thing to save Ukraine isn’t zelensky. It is western technology and training.
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How many times are you going to repeatedly state “they are regrouping” only to be proven constantly wrong with battlefield losses over and over again? You’ve been saying this for months. They can “regroup” all they want, won’t matter if there are masses of Russian soldiers leaving their high command, purposely surrendering, or dying due to inferior weapons capabilities. Look at the map, Russia is gradually losing territory.
 
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bcw1029 said:
How many times are you going to repeatedly state “they are regrouping” only to be proven constantly wrong with battlefield losses over and over again? You’ve been saying this for months. They can “regroup” all they want, won’t matter if there are masses of Russian soldiers leaving their high command, purposely surrendering, or dying due to inferior weapons capabilities. Look at the map, Russia is gradually losing territory.
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Thats mean, you're gonna make him cry.
 
Saudi Arabia got Biden to drop their threat of charges against MBS over the Kashoggi murder as well as getting the arms dealer.

The whole world is laughing at Biden right now. China just met with Saudi Arabia to discuss them joining brics. The longer this goes on with Biden calling the shots the worse it is for our country. We need to run clock until this old fool is out of office.
 
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