Russia - Ukraine WAR Warning: Political Discussions
- Thread starter Canned Heat
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Magyars and Bulgars are two entirely distinct peoples, different ethnicity and language.
Ukrainians and Russians are the same people, speaking a dialect of the same language. They have a shared history and culture.
Our media and politicians left/right/center all want war. It's not our war. It's just not our problem to fix militarily; has nothing to do with whether or not the invasion was just or not. It obviously wasn't.
And then this is another thing - 3 months ago you people couldn't name 3 Ukrainian cities if your lives depended on it. Now you're suddenly experts on Eastern European history and all things Russia/NATO after spending time on your google machines and watching TV talking-heads tell you what you wanted to hear, quick to call anyone who disagrees with what you've "concluded" over the last few weeks dumb.
The logic is very simple, if Russia's current goal was to take the whole of Ukraine, and they are struggling to do so against an inferior and less equipped opposition, then they would find actual NATO forces in Poland/Romania/Baltics inconceivably difficult to contend with, entirely insurmountable after expending so many troops and resources in Ukraine.
If the purpose of NATO was to defend Europe from Russian imperialism, but it's own expansion and dealings with a nonmember in Ukraine unnecessarily brings the US into direct conflict with Russia through the bumbling actions of our exceedingly incompetent politicians, then yes, it has not only outlived its usefulness, but become completely counterproductive, achieving nothing but the exact opposite of what it was designed.
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You bring this up a lot but its no more Russias home than Arizona is to Mexico. What used to be is irrelevant, especially that far in the past.
So what? The founding city of Serbia is Pristina in the 1200's. Is it in Serbia? ANSWER: No.
Just how many Nazis are there in Ukraine?
Why should Poland/Romania/Slovakia (NATO members) be any more involved in this than the US? Not by their choice, they're involved due to all the refugees they've taken in. How is that their problem? If it's theirs, why shouldn't USA be taking refugees from Latin America?
“Who cares about history. As long as Ukraine is the victim now is the only thing that matters”
Rationalization at its finest
Rationalization at its finest
I always used to get annoyed when I met someone abroad and they immediately assumed I didn't know anything about the world because I was American.
Reading this thread has helped me better appreciate why, i fully sympathize.
Reading this thread has helped me better appreciate why, i fully sympathize.
Sharing is the Russian litmus test for Nazi's? So hilarious when people here buy their BS hook, line and sinker. 🤣
Didney Wurl would approve this drunken message.
Didney Wurl would approve this drunken message.
Especially the ones with a message written on it. Don't tell Bill. He might dream up an entirely new excuse for Putin.
"Russia will descend into economic, financial and technological decay, while Ukraine is marching towards the European future, this is what I see," she said.
Someone better tell the Ukrainian ambassador to the US, she said that was the very missile that hit the train station.
Seems implausible to me that a missile traveling 150 to 200 mph with a war head that exploded would have 3/4 of its fuselage intact. So why are they lying about that part?
Thinking we’re being sold BS isn’t “ making excuses for Putin”. If we’re serious about helping Ukraine defeat Russia then send them what they need to win. What the west is doing now won’t do that. I don’t trust our leaders that we know were getting kickbacks in Ukraine prior. This is aid on steroids going to Ukraine now. We’ve sent close to 2 billion dollars in the last month in cash, not including military aid.
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RUS unit-level leadership not only dumb, but also f*cking idiotic beyond comprehension.
Deaths in Ukraine<Deaths from a NATO war with Russia.
My contention is that diplomacy hasn't been tried. We have 2 break away provinces that want out and 2 other areas that would probably want out but are afraid of the mercenaries. I put up a video of Zelensky saying he would be willing to negotiate on Donbas and the next day he walked it back and said they'd fight to keep all of Ukraine. Our state dept is going around buying up military equipment from Greece, Cypress, Middle East, and Nato countries. He was willing to deal because of the situation but he was told to stick it out and he'd get help. The people that would further this war for their own ends are evil mofo's.
Again, there won't be a NATO war with Russia. Russia knows what would happen.
Explain to me the rationale of invading Syria because "of course we invade a country that uses chemical weapons on its own people" and then saying.... "Russia is killing women and children and targeting schools and hospitals and private citizens and using chemical weapons"... and saying that nobody is calling for boots on the ground?
How do you read that 2 different ways?
By the time we chased ISIL into Syria, it was a horribly fractured state. We couldn't allow ISIL to hide there. On top of that, Syria was in a civil war. You've mentioned this before but I dont find the circumstances analogous.
Why did we go into Syria? Last time you said because they were gassing their own people.... So if someone uses chemical weapons... We go in? I don't see how you can't see the hypocricy in us invading Syria but being against Russia invading Ukraine while also not attacking Russia if we think they are committing war crimes. Pick a set of rules I can follow instead of just square pegging and round holing.
Vee have vays of making them pronounce their vowels!
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So which is it . . . .
(1) Is it foolish to assume Americans know nothing about the world, or
(2) Is it correct for you to assume no one on this forum could have named 3 Ukrainian cities.
On one page of one forum, you both condemned being judged as ignorant because you are American, then endorsed that judgment by re-expressing it.
I bet Putin could name 40 cities in Ukraine, but that no more justifies his invasion, than would (some) Americans’ comparative ignorance about the country negate their justified revulsion at its invasion.
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You're trying to conflate the 2 situations. There is nothing similar.
well you need 2 different situations to be able to tell that you have absolutely no moral basis for what you are arguing. Why do we have a right to go into Syria but Russia doesn't have a right to go into Ukraine. Don't blow it off. People are dying. quit being that guy. Children are dying. What is the line... is there a line? 14000 people died in the Donbas. Why doesn't Russia have a right to go in and stop it if we have the right to go into Syria and stop their war against isis?... Which we were actually fighting in 3 other countries....
If you are against the Russian invasion.. fine... me too. But im against our war in Syria and I don't see how you can be for it. Or our war in Iraq. We were lied to. They didn't have weapons of mass destruction. WE WERE LIED TO SO WE WOULD GO TO WAR. You should be angry about that. Do you know how many veterans are committing suicide each year?
As I have said before, we need to just take care of ourselves until we can right our ship. Because of the weakness of our government leaders Europe needs to handle their backyard right now and if Russia were to attack Europe, then we have an obligation to get involved. Monetarily speaking, Europe needs to show they will pay their fair share as well.
As far as refugees from Latin America? What countries there are fighting each other and killing off their own? We need to secure our borders because at this point, we can't even take care of our homeless much less the millions crossing our borders. Beating a dead horse on that one. You will never change my mind for that.
Stereotypes are not born without any reason.
And there's a difference between being foolish and being ignorant. Which is it?
It's both.
Russia doesn't have unit level leadership. That's one of the big reasons their military is complete garbage.
The capture of Chernobyl might take the cake on stupidity.
They grab the least valuable and most dangerous real estate on earth, and then dig defensive positions into highly radioactive dirt, as though someone might try to take it back.
That’s like someone breaking into your house, and you find them wallering in your septic system.
Upon last Thursday, the sun has riz, the sun has set, and the Bear ain’t near Dnipro yet.
There is one report this morning the “refitting” of troops withdrawn from around Kiev might last another month, as some entire units “are essentially eliminated.”
I’m sure Russia would like to encircle and trap tens of thousands of Ukrainian defenders by taking Dnipro in central eastern Ukrain, but any report that anything in this war will occur from “Monday ‘till Thursday,” needs to be taken with a grain of salt.
This 72 hour”special operation” has passed from an hourly measurement, to a daily count; thence to a weekly measure; and now to months . . . .
Absent a palace coop in Russia or Ukraine, this war could go a year or longer.
it's contradictory to say on one hand we need to just take care of ourselves but that goes out the window if Europe is attacked. How are we more capable just because Europe is attacked?
Drug cartels are killing defenseless civilians. They have more to fear than Ukrainians that are leaving do.
Thanks for the defining the number of Nazis in Ukraine.
We'll agree to disagree on whether or not Iraq had WMD's. The delays forced by Hussein easily gave them time to move everything to another country like Syria. I doubt you and I have enough information on what really happened in Iraq.
As for Donbas, Russia encouraged the separatists, armed the separatists and supported the separatists. Russia created the mess but Ukraine HAS EVERY RIGHT to defend its sovereign territory against ANY attacker.
Again, there is nothing similar with this and Syria.
What is your proposed diplomatic solution that will secure Ukraine from Russia for the next 50 years?
There are not two breakaway provinces. Both were only partially taken over by Russia. And Crimean was a Russia takeover also.
You have no idea what Zelenskyy was told & are just makin sh!t up to suit your anti-Ukraine narrative.
Even worse, Ukraine did try diplomacy with the Budapest Memorandum in which Russia agreed not to attack them if they gave up their nukes, which they did. Russia is an untrustworthy state, read that as pathological liars. There is no diplomatic solution that could ever be depended on. Killing every soldier Russia sends to Ukraine, even if it takes a decade, is the best long term solution.
Bullshit. Russian lieutenants fill the leadership, planning, training, and disciplinary roles of both a U.S. platoon leader and platoon sergeant.
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