POLITICAL THREAD

[AustinTXCat]

Note the date.

 

[Kaizer Sosay]

Anyone that is a huge Trump supporter in no way could consider themselves to be a Libertarian.

False

 

[jameslee32]

"Another fundamental pillar of our new strategy is the integration of all instruments of American power — diplomatic, economic, and military — toward a successful outcome. Someday, after an effective military effort, perhaps it will be possible to have a political settlement that includes elements of the Taliban in Afghanistan. But nobody knows if or when that will ever happen."

President Trump

 

[PhattyJ4UK]

I wished cancer on him on the night wisconsin beat us in 2015. He ran and told a few mods and I was banned for a month.

I still have no regrets with that thought. dude is a total piece of shit. DGAF what his opinion is. Anytime he says, "Americans think Trump..blah blah" It's just him projecting his opinion on what he thinks. Classic case of "projection by identification".

im sure he was enjoying himself that night. this actually makes me feel better. i was pretty ashamed that someone so stupid, so moronic, so child like was a UK fan. must be a louisville troll!!

 

[P19978]

Trump's views on trade are in line with libertarian thinking; reduction of red tape, etc.

So there's hope for you libertarians yet lol.

 

[Vandalayindustries]

You're correct, Qwes. No Libertarian I know wants illegal immigration. Never met a one. I know Jary Gohnson (Rex Kwon-hahaha) was all for amnesty, but a majority of us are not. Believe it or not, some of us Libertarians actually love the Constitution.

Not like the fake libertarians who are nothing more than liberals in a Che Guevara t-shirt.

One of the core beliefs of the Libertarian party is freedom of movement. They strongly believe with criminalizing illegal aliens. As long as they're peaceful, the Libertarian party would welcome anyone into the country - legal or illegal.

You may 'think' you're a libertarian, but if you don't believe that, you're really not all in. Maybe you're more of a Constitutionalist, which has a lot of similarities.

 

[Vandalayindustries]

False

Then you're ignorant to the core beliefs of being a Libertarian.

 

[WayneDougan]

One of the core beliefs of the Libertarian party is freedom of movement. They strongly believe with criminalizing illegal aliens. As long as they're peaceful, the Libertarian party would welcome anyone into the country - legal or illegal.

Which shows how out of touch libertarians are with reality, and that's why nobody really takes them seriously.

 

[Bill Cosby]

"Another fundamental pillar of our new strategy is the integration of all instruments of American power — diplomatic, economic, and military — toward a successful outcome. Someday, after an effective military effort, perhaps it will be possible to have a political settlement that includes elements of the Taliban in Afghanistan. But nobody knows if or when that will ever happen."

President Trump

If terrorists can blow up buildings in the US and go on to mentor the future POTUS, I guess it's not entirely off the table that reformed terrorists would play a part in an Afghan government

 

[Willy4UK]

"Another fundamental pillar of our new strategy is the integration of all instruments of American power — diplomatic, economic, and military — toward a successful outcome. Someday, after an effective military effort, perhaps it will be possible to have a political settlement that includes elements of the Taliban in Afghanistan. But nobody knows if or when that will ever happen."

President Trump

Still stronger than any Obama military and doing it with less spending.

Go on, tell more about how Obama was the anti-war president LOL

 

[fuzz77]

I love how your try to lump all minorities into a class as one. That is very, very racist and shows your white bias.

What class are the minorities all lumped into?

 

[fatguy87]

Is this true? Never researched their platform but have never heard a libertarian have this viewpoint other than the liberals on here than pose as libertarians.

It is true that many libertarians would support dissolving illegal immigration and open the borders of the country. To them, a free market must also necessitate the free movement of labor as well. There would be extenuating circumstances for criminals and other immigrants engaged in illicit operations, of course.

Libertarians come in many flavors so this isn't universally true. You'll see some with a more nationalistic bent while others are actually willing to compromise libertarian ideology with the current societal realities.

 

[fuzz77]

Still stronger than any Obama military and doing it with less spending.

Go on, tell more about how Obama was the anti-war president LOL

Less spending? Hasn't Trump asked for MORE military $$?

 

[LairISBackBackAgain]

Would anyone really care if we just wiped out North Korea with a bunch of nukes?

 

[BigSexyCat]

What class are the minorities all lumped into?

OMG!!! Your white privilege is so bad that you can't even tell when you make an overt racist remark.

 

[LairISBackBackAgain]

Less spending? Hasn't Trump asked for MORE military $$?

We are fuzz today? Rq tonight to bash Trump's speech in Phoenix?

 

[Willy4UK]

It is true that many libertarians would support dissolving illegal immigration and open the borders of the country. To them, a free market must also necessitate the free movement of labor as well. There would be extenuating circumstances for criminals and other immigrants engaged in illicit operations, of course.

Maybe Bernie Sander Libertarians or California Libertarians lol

That second bolded. Yeah, illegal immigrants. That's what illegal immigrants are. Criminals.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

There's no way a true Libertarian would be a big fan of Trump. Maybe when compared to the alternative, he's seen favorably, but I dislike a ton of stuff he's done. Most libertarians would want to be much more isolationist and Trump has done nothing in that regard. In fact, we're probably less-isolationist than before.

His immigration policies are exactly counter to the libertarians. Tariffs on China and other imports, he isn't cutting Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security. He isn't cutting other government programs at all.

I could go on and on and on.

Free trade, free migration, and less dependence on the government are necessary to a true libertarian.

Anyone that is a huge Trump supporter in no way could consider themselves to be a Libertarian.

Many of the reasons i stopped identifying as libertarian, although i retain many of the concepts. Previously it was based on a concept or loose set of ideas. Now they crow about hard and fast rules, which they refuse to deviate from.

Congrats on becoming exactly what you initially opposed.

 

[fuzz77]

I think Trump saw what happened to Iraq once Obama left and doesn't want that mistake to happen again. Not that we should be there forever, but Trump wants to at least win since we are there, and then get out.

Win?
Didn't we win in Iraq?

Tell me what victory looks like in Afghanistan.
It will look the same way when we get out regardless of when that happens.

 

[Willy4UK]

Less spending? Hasn't Trump asked for MORE military $$?

Actually no. He has cut the spending. On everything. More #FakeNews.

 

[screwduke1]

Not a libertarian but I think its safe to say left wingers have pretty much hijacked libertarianism. Still good ones around like Willy, but if they can't do any better than Gary Johnson as a party, that's pretty telling. Johnson is pretty close to a full blown liberal, hes no libertarian. Trump is more libertarian than he gets credit for, IMO. Populism has quite a few libertarian beliefs. Trump on the economy is pretty libertarian, so is he on social issues for the most part. Might even be missing something but those 2 issues popped in my head first.

 

[PhattyJ4UK]

remember when Trump was blasted for saying Putin is a better leader for his people than obama is for his?
and still to this day people like rwarnold/fuzz and Bking etc etc make jokes about it.. well...

is kim jong un a more qualified leader than president trump???

lol, of course a fricken dictatorship has a smoother transition to power. what a joke of an article

https://www.yahoo.com/news/kim-jong-un-more-qualified-145207171.html

 

[Willy4UK]

Not a libertarian but I think its safe to say left wingers have pretty much hijacked libertarianism. Still good ones around like Willy, but if they can't do any better than Gary Johnson as a party, that's pretty telling. Johnson is pretty close to a full blown liberal, hes no libertarian. Trump is more libertarian than he gets credit for, IMO. Populism has quite a few libertarian beliefs. Trump on the economy is pretty libertarian, so is he on social issues for the most part. Might even be missing something but those 2 issues popped in my head first.

A few us good guys still on board. lol

But you're right, the Libertarian party has been hijacked. 100%.

 

[WKBlu]

 

[BigBlueDave]

Johnson has to be pro immigration to get any traction in New Mexico. The state is over half Hispanic and crossed the tipping point long ago. It is New Mexico.



at Vandalay.

A true libertarian wouldn't care how Willy identified.

Next he'll tell us a true fan would do this or do that.

 

[WKBlu]

 

[screwduke1]

A few us good guys still on board. lol

But you're right, the Libertarian party has been hijacked. 100%.

I think Ron Paul has something to do with it. A lot of people jumped on his bandwagon because they thought it was cool. You got a lot of those people in the party now.

 

[qwesley]

The Mass plan devised by Mitt Romey was given as a model.

They have a balanced budget amendment
They get money from a higher govt authority (feds)

Can we do have our Fed govt do a balanced budget and get funding assistance from the UN?

 

[qwesley]

Didn't we win in Iraq?

Depends, your guy got a bunch of Yazidis executed and turned into sex slaves for ISIS by ignoring his own foreign policy advisors. Who knows, that might be a win in your book.

 

[WKBlu]

 

[screwduke1]

remember when Trump was blasted for saying Putin is a better leader for his people than obama is for his?
and still to this day people like rwarnold/fuzz and Bking etc etc make jokes about it.. well...

is kim jong un a more qualified leader than president trump???

lol, of course a fricken dictatorship has a smoother transition to power. what a joke of an article

https://www.yahoo.com/news/kim-jong-un-more-qualified-145207171.html

Articles like this should be used in Trumps re election campaign. Plaster it all over the rust belt.

 

[CrittendenWildcat]

"Another fundamental pillar of our new strategy is the integration of all instruments of American power — diplomatic, economic, and military — toward a successful outcome. Someday, after an effective military effort, perhaps it will be possible to have a political settlement that includes elements of the Taliban in Afghanistan. But nobody knows if or when that will ever happen."

President Trump

I was listening to 1A on NPR this morning. They talked about how Trump asserted our aim of "victory" in Afghanistan. I think everyone on the panel agreed that a true victory was unattainable, we can't defeat the Taliban. Some sort of negotiated peace is a virtual necessity. So why would our president say that?

Because...well, what the hell do you expect our president to say? "We have no chance of winning, we've wasted a decade and a half and 750 billion dollars, and now we are going to pull out. But before we do, we are going to make a big show of it and try to get leverage for peace talks." We know that as difficult as it is for us to have boots on the ground in Afghanistan, pulling out of Afghanistan and leaving the country in a power vacuum would be way worse. Many people would lose their lives in the aftermath, and the Taliban would likely take over again.

If you read between the lines and understand the complexities of the situation, you will come to understand that our government realizes that we can't win, and want to negotiate an end to the war. However, the official Afghan government has been losing substantial ground to the Taliban, so the Taliban has no reason to even come to the table to negotiate, they are taking and no giving is necessary.

If we push back, however, and turn the tide, we can force the Taliban back into negotiations and work out a pact. Indeed, we might not even be required to make that push. The threat of us throwing more troops and weapons at the Taliban could be sufficient to make them realize that they probably won't hold on to the land they have gained of recent, and their current position puts them in a position of power. The Taliban have an opportunity to quit while they are ahead, and they would be wise to take it.

We are also leaning on the powerful nations in the region, India and Pakistan, to contribute. It's their back yard, and they need to be involved in a regionally negotiated peace. Remember, the Taliban have been using the mountains of Pakistan as their safe haven. Will Pakistan continue to do that? Will we breach the border in pursuit of the Taliban as part of our push? Pakistan can exert some influence over the Taliban, maybe they threaten to allow our troops to cross the border to catch them?

Bringing in India, I think, is more of a threat to Pakistan. I'm sure we wouldn't turn away their economic assistance, but the subtext is that if Pakistan is not going to help, then we will form stronger bonds with Pakistan's nemesis, India. And who's to say that we don't unite with India and push the Taliban right along with the Pakistanis into the Arabian Sea?

We are going to have "victory." Victory is peace.

 

[Vandalayindustries]

Johnson has to be pro immigration to get any traction in New Mexico. The state is over half Hispanic and crossed the tipping point long ago. It is New Mexico.



at Vandalay.

A true libertarian wouldn't care how Willy identified.

Next he'll tell us a true fan would do this or do that.

You can't disagree with some of the basic tenets of the party and truly consider yourself a member of that party. And I don't care what affiliation Willy thinks he's in. People like to say they're libertarian as it separates themselves from the 2 major parties but don't truly know what they're talking about.

 

[Bill Cosby]

Conforming to party line no matter what screams libertarian imo.

 

[rudd1]

-mccarthy wasnt "good" per se... but he was correct about a great many things. There were reds entrenched in all levels of society/gubment. FDR had a fella named harry hopkins as his chief advisor...worth a look if you have never done so.

 

[WKBlu]

"I don't mean the Killing Fields..." haha. How does anyone take these people seriously?

 

[rudd1]

-while youre at it...look into walter duranty, nyt reporter who won a pulitzer for sucking off stalin.

 

[WKBlu]

 

[Willy4UK]

You can't disagree with some of the basic tenets of the party and truly consider yourself a member of that party. And I don't care what affiliation Willy thinks he's in. People like to say they're libertarian as it separates themselves from the 2 major parties but don't truly know what they're talking about.

Oh yeah, glad you set up that argument. Can pick or choose with that statement.

I don't just say it.. I am card holding Libertarian on the books.Proud of it. Ron Paul is more Libertarian than jary Gohnson and who does Paul support? Trump. But let's now rail on Ron Paul, right?

 

[fuzz77]

Not a libertarian but I think its safe to say left wingers have pretty much hijacked libertarianism. Still good ones around like Willy, but if they can't do any better than Gary Johnson as a party, that's pretty telling. Johnson is pretty close to a full blown liberal, hes no libertarian. Trump is more libertarian than he gets credit for, IMO. Populism has quite a few libertarian beliefs. Trump on the economy is pretty libertarian, so is he on social issues for the most part. Might even be missing something but those 2 issues popped in my head first.

Trump at his core may be more libertarian but he has surrounded himself with right-wing zealots and has adopted the right wing since those are the only ones giving him any traction.

Chuckling at your "Populism has quite a few libertarian beliefs" statement. Libertarianism has quite a few conservative and liberal beliefs. It is fiscally conservative, socially liberal, and isolationist with regard to foreign policy. How in the hell have "left wingers" hijacked it? Libertarianism is what it has always been, always held the same beliefs whereas the left and right have continuously moved their goal post.

Populism has no core beliefs,"Populism is a mode of political communication that is centred around contrasts between the "common man" or "the people" and a real or imagined group of "privileged elites", traditionally scapegoating or making a folk devil of the latter. Populists can fall anywhere on the traditional left–right political spectrum of politics, and can often be characterised as centrist where populists portray both bourgeois capitalists and socialist organizers as unfairly dominating the political sphere." . What populism is changes with the needs and attitudes of "common man".