CMS complaining about NIL publicly

[bballcat4]

People discussing Stoops’ salary are totally missing the point. (Salaries are ludicrous, but are the result of huge television contracts.)

The point of focus is, how does UK remain relevant and have a chance to climb the proverbial ladder into competing for a chance to get into 12 team CFP? (You can replace Stoops’ name with any future UK coach.)

We were told by people close to the program the NIL $ given to players over the last couple of years was a bandaid and not sustainable. Stoops seems to be confirming that assessment. He knows he has to have a constant pipeline of $ to Retain players and Recruit players. Who thought fundraising would ever be a coach’s top priority???

Ky will always be a a difficult place to raise funds as compared to many other SEC schools. ADs who are innovative with staffing (GM type role for both sports) and NIL will help their programs leap frog others. Schools who fall behind in this area will get jumped over by other programs.

I like both Stoops and Mitch. But, it sounds like Stoops is making his appeal public to put some pressure on MB. Coaching changes usually set programs back. The new transfer rules would cause UK to lose 40-50 players if Stoops left.

 

[3632]

People discussing Stoops’ salary are totally missing the point. (Salaries are ludicrous, but are the result of huge television contracts.)

The point of focus is, how does UK remain relevant and have a chance to climb the proverbial ladder into competing for a chance to get into 12 team CFP? (You can replace Stoops’ name with any future UK coach.)

We were told by people close to the program the NIL $ give to players over the last couple of years was a bandaid and not sustainable. Stoops seems to be confirming that assessment. He knows he has to have a constant pipe flow of $ to Retain players and Recruit players. Who thought fundraising would ever be a coach’s top priority???

Ky will always be a a difficult place to raise funds as compared to many other SEC schools. ADs who are innovative with staffing (GM type role for both sports) and NIL will help their programs leap frog others. Schools who fall behind in this area will get jumped over by other programs.

I like both Stoops and Mitch. But, it sounds like Stoops is making his appeal public to put some pressure on MB. Coaching changes usually set programs back. The new transfer rules would cause UK to lose 40-50 players if Stoops left.

Most of the time people have to choose one narrative or the other but often two things can be true. I believe Stoops is overpaid but it has nothing to do with fundraising and Barnhart has been terrible at fundraising. He's been content with managing increasing tv contracts he's had little to do with generating and has largely just left fundraising to whether coaches develop relationships themselves. That's not how it's done across the SEC or many places anywhere.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Well then I would supposed that those judging those comments don't understand the workload or the stress that comes along the job.

That is a tough sell to a parent who is working 2 jobs to just survive. That said, I would not want to be a college football coach. The hours seem ridiculous, especially if you have a family. But, that was known before NIL.

 

[ncaaky]

Coaches can and do donate to other programs NIL packages (Pitino to UK Football NIL), but not to their

It’s pretty easy solution for a guy making over $9 million a year. He donates $1 million to Oklahoma State basketball and the OSU coach donates $1 million to UK football.

 

[bballcat4]

Most of the time people have to choose one narrative or the other but often two things can be true.

I agree with most of what you write. The belief Stoops is overpaid is similar to saying several NFL QBs are overpaid. (Teams realize some of these non top 2-3 QBs are NOT overpaid when they find themselves drafting a new QB every 2-3 years.) Schools like Fla, Tn, Ark, Aub, MSU, etc... are all struggling because they don't have coaching stability. (One team out that group may have found a stable coach.) The other 3 will be starting the coaching cycle again in the next 1-2 years. You can probably add Beamer to the list. I don't mind paying extra for stability ... especailly when it's not my money and UK is reaping SEC television revenue.

However, we agree the point is the new NIL environment requires new methods. Sure, the HC will always be the front man and maybe even the closer on larger NIL gifts. However, he shouldn't be the point person for NIL. ADs need to build relationships and have some executive staff members who work exclusively with fundraising. No one likes the NIL environment, but it's now the way the game is played.

 

[UKfirst]

Wonder how UGA does it? I’m sure Kirby is involved but has a GM or somebody within the athletics department doing the fund raising for their top revenue sport.

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

If he fund raises well, coaching will be easier.

Exactly the problem. In major college sports, we are on the poor side of the tracks. That means he's effectively banging his head against the wall, in perpetude.

Since everyone wants access with their large donations, Stoops has to court them then play buddy, all the while losing ground against the richer programs.

It's an act of futility and would have to be demoralizing and exhausting. Someone needs to explain this to that idiot Aaron Torres who now thinks less of Stoops.

 

[Grumpyolddawg]

Lots of things being said here and oddly enough almost everyone is correct. Saban retired, several coaches have went to the NFL, Crazy money being offered to HS kids who may not every even start a game, one kid in particular was demanding 10k just for a visit. No coach wants to have to deal with kids like that, but when he is the top recruit at his position he demands it and enough pay that he can visit somewhere every weekend. Lots demand between 1 and 5k just to visit. Then there is the kids who can't wait to see their worth when they have a good season and hit the portal, and can do that multiple times it seems. And yuo have other teams tampering with your team. Coach's will admit it's going on, but they won't name a coach who is tampering, most likely because he is too. Just part of the game it has become. The AD is a fundraiser, but he has other duties that require fundraising, the new IDPF at UK cost money, all the minor non profit sports require funds. No matter how minor the sport, not one here wants a UK athletic team to show up in an old smoking bus and playing their sport in uniforms that should have been donated to the homeless. In a major program like most SEC programs with multiple non profit sports they have to be taken care of too. And I know first hand coaches don't like to be fundraisers, but sometimes you have to do it or you end up doing without, I can't speak for all SEC programs, but Kirby, who makes 13m isn't slacking when it comes to asking fans to donate to NIL.

 

[RunninRichie]

Stoops will be gone in 2 or 3 years. Barnhart better start vetting replacements. I'd take Sumrall from Troy in a heartbeat.

 

[jnewc2]

Stoops just doesn’t feel like he has the energy for the job anymore. If he’s expecting to just coach some kind of big traditional school with a ton of donors already in place then he’s dreaming. He’s going to have to do the legwork. This isn’t Alabama, Ohio State etc with a bunch of donor infrastructure already in place. If you don’t have the energy to deal with a job like Kentucky then you don’t need to be here. You’re the 8th highest paid coach in the country, come on. There are coaches with far less doing more because they choose to run creative offenses and be aggressive. You’re not going to out-Alabama, Alabama with athletes at Kentucky. It seems like Kiffin and Drinkwitz have realized that. Stoops, not so much.

I mean, he should dang well know that at Kentucky you’re going to have to be creative and innovative. Look at programs that punch above their weight, that’s how they do it. If he can’t win without a blue blood NIL budget then he’s not the coach for Kentucky because we’re never going to have that money. That doesn’t mean we can’t have a top 25 program on a yearly basis though. We can absolutely have a program like Ole Miss or what Mizzou is looking like it’s turning into. There’s absolutely no reason why Kentucky can’t do that, but we need a coach that has some energy and creativity and doesn’t point the finger at someone else every time he fails.

 

[mrschwump]

Stoops will be gone in 2 or 3 years. Barnhart better start vetting replacements. I'd take Sumrall from Troy in a heartbeat.

Jon Sumrall is HC at Tulane.

On face value I might agree re Stoops but he's recruiting defensive players like he has plans to go nowhere.

 

[The-Hack]

Jon Sumrall is HC at Tulane.

On face value I might agree re Stoops but he's recruiting defensive players like he has plans to go nowhere.

Yes.

Stoops’ complaints and this thread seem a tad out of place, given we are bringing in a 5 Star QB from UGA, a collegiate All-American linebacker from UGA, and the recruiting class looks pretty solid.

 

[RunninRichie]

Jon Sumrall is HC at Tulane.

On face value I might agree re Stoops but he's recruiting defensive players like he has plans to go nowhere.

Brain slip lol.

 

[Grumpyolddawg]

Stoops just doesn’t feel like he has the energy for the job anymore. If he’s expecting to just coach some kind of big traditional school with a ton of donors already in place then he’s dreaming. He’s going to have to do the legwork. This isn’t Alabama, Ohio State etc with a bunch of donor infrastructure already in place. If you don’t have the energy to deal with a job like Kentucky then you don’t need to be here. You’re the 8th highest paid coach in the country, come on. There are coaches with far less doing more because they choose to run creative offenses and be aggressive. You’re not going to out-Alabama, Alabama with athletes at Kentucky. It seems like Kiffin and Drinkwitz have realized that. Stoops, not so much.

I mean, he should dang well know that at Kentucky you’re going to have to be creative and innovative. Look at programs that punch above their weight, that’s how they do it. If he can’t win without a blue blood NIL budget then he’s not the coach for Kentucky because we’re never going to have that money. That doesn’t mean we can’t have a top 25 program on a yearly basis though. We can absolutely have a program like Ole Miss or what Mizzou is looking like it’s turning into. There’s absolutely no reason why Kentucky can’t do that, but we need a coach that has some energy and creativity and doesn’t point the finger at someone else every time he fails.

Missouri's state legislature passed a law that gives Missouri a monopoly of any instate kids they want. Only instate groups can give NIL deals to HS kids, its against Missouri law for an out of state program to offer a HS kid an NIL deal. Plus they have a couple of boosters that are willing to buy 2-3 kids for Drink a year. The entire state is all in on Missouri winning big. So it isn't like they are playing on a level field with everyone else.

As for CMS leaving, his flirting with ATM surprised me, and for whatever reason that was all it ended up being. But with his family history, I don't think he coaches much past 60, this NIL deal is definitely not helping.

 

[Cat_Man_Blue]

I would be very interested in seeing a list of players that UK could have got if the NIL money had been what it needed to be. An example for me is Tyler Barron. From what I gather we finished second when he was coming out of high-school. I would like to think he would be at UK right now instead of UL, if UK could have offered him a top NIL deal.

 

[mrschwump]

I would be very interested in seeing a list of players that UK could have got if the NIL money had been what it needed to be. An example for me is Tyler Barron. From what I gather we finished second when he was coming out of high-school. I would like to think he would be at UK right now instead of UL, if UK could have offered him a top NIL deal.

Baron is not at U6, Miami I think.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Baron is not at U6, Miami I think.

If we had offered more, maybe he would be at UL!

 

[Cat_Man_Blue]

Baron is not at U6, Miami I think.

I remember him committing to Ole Miss when he entered the portal then changing to UL, the last I saw.

 

[bballcat4]

I remember him committing to Ole Miss when he entered the portal then changing to UL, the last I saw.

From UT to Ole Miss, UL, then Miami. 3 transfers since Christmas!!! You think he may be going to the highest bidder ;- ) Word is that the UL $ never came through causing the latest transfer to Miami.

 

[BGWentworth]

Have you ever run a business? Honest answer please, I'm not playing gotcha.

Yes, several

 

[Boz]

We need a GM to deal with all this stuff. With all coaches have to do, you can’t expect them to learn all the NIL responsibilities on the fly. He’ll still have to appear at events, sure, but that’s easily part of his job.

We have a GM in Eddie Gran.

 

[BlueTick2]

He makes $9M/yr and he’s complaining about the stress of NIL. You can’t make this stuff up.

Every college coach in America is complaining something about NIL.
So, what's your point?

 

[Grumpyolddawg]

We have a GM in Eddie Gran.

I don't think a true GM is what the coaches would want because they would technically also have control over players. I think what they all really want is someone who's sole responsibility is raising NIL funding. But the issue of that is who will be as effective as the face of the program, the head coach? Even if an effective person is found, I think the head coach would still have to be involved.

 

[jlkirk]

where are the assistant coaches in all of this?

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Who is fundraising for other schools? What booster wants to meet with Eddie Gran? Seems having a meal and an ask from the HC is the best way to make the money. Maybe have a scheduler who does the background on the boosters and arranges the schedule, but I think the HC in this state needs to make the ask. Unless some celebrity wants the job? Wesley Woodward?

 

[BGWentworth]

Every college coach in America is complaining something about NIL.
So, what's your point?

I made my point, stop being dense. If you actually took the time to read his quotes, you would know that his comments weren’t normal for a coach. I have no problem with him mentioning the challenges, but don’t tell me it’s causing you to be sad and lonely…you get paid $9m per year…suck it up buttercup and work with your administration to figure it out. Nobody wants to be a shoulder for him to cry on.

 

[Boz]

Mark needs a full time marketer. Sometime that wine and dine donators and future ones.

 

[The-Hack]

Only instate groups can give NIL deals to HS kids, its against Missouri law for an out of state program to offer a HS kid an NIL deal.

That will not pass muster when challenged under the Interstate Commerce Clause!

 

[Grumpyolddawg]

That will not pass muster when challenged under the Interstate Commerce Clause!

That may be true, but as of today it hasn't been challenged and is it worth the effort for 1 or 2 kids a year? I don't know about other states but the negative PR it would cause in Missouri would effectively end your recruiting in that state. But there was a kid in 24 class and will be one in 26, may be 27 class that everyone wants. But the younger one's parents were both Missouri athletes and he would likely go there without NIL.

 

[UKWildcats1987]

NIL is the new normal so coaches are going to have to adapt or quit coaching in college and go NFL coordinator route.

I imagine it is definitely a pain to deal with on top of normal coaching responsibilities.

 

[bballcat4]

NIL is the new normal so coaches are going to have to adapt or quit coaching in college and go NFL coordinator route.

I imagine it is definitely a pain to deal with on top of normal coaching responsibilities.

… or had ADs that are passionate and energetic about NIL.

I think MB has done a great job at UK. However, everyone knows he’s not a fan of NIL. There’s a difference between finally getting on board with NIL and leading the charge with NIL.

Stoops needs to do his part, but he needs more help with NIL.

 

[southindycat]

Missouri's state legislature passed a law that gives Missouri a monopoly of any instate kids they want. Only instate groups can give NIL deals to HS kids, its against Missouri law for an out of state program to offer a HS kid an NIL deal. Plus they have a couple of boosters that are willing to buy 2-3 kids for Drink a year. The entire state is all in on Missouri winning big. So it isn't like they are playing on a level field with everyone else.

As for CMS leaving, his flirting with ATM surprised me, and for whatever reason that was all it ended up being. But with his family history, I don't think he coaches much past 60, this NIL deal is definitely not helping.

That's what they did??? That's headed to court. It's unconstitutional.

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

Yes, several

Ok, then you should understand that there are times when the job you're supposed to be doing takes a back seat to new issues you never expected or wanted. Even worse when those things dominate your time and endanger your performance on core duties.

As I stated earlier, it can be exhausting and demoralizing. Money isn't the issue, job satisfaction is. People going through that don't last long. Either something changes or we'll be saying goodbye to the winningest coach we've ever had, over nonsense. Barney better get off his ass and find a way to get some of the pressure off Stoops.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Mark needs a full time marketer. Sometime that wine and dine donators and future ones.

When an ask is made, it has to be made by the right person who knows the right amount to ask. That is often not going to be some hired gun, but may be a friend or someone the donor admires or respects. Now, if big spenders wine and dine big spenders, that could work.

 

[UKWildcats1987]

… or had ADs that are passionate and energetic about NIL.

I think MB has done a great job at UK. However, everyone knows he’s not a fan of NIL. There’s a difference between finally getting on board with NIL and leading the charge with NIL.

Stoops needs to do his part, but he needs more help with NIL.

Doesn't seems like Stoops is passionate about NIL either. Barnie and him are definitely dinosaurs there.

I'm sure it's harder to sale NIL at a place like UK than Alabama or UGA as well.

 

[Basil Cat]

Does Stoops whine too much at times ? Yes

Is MB incompetent as it relates to the “new age” of college athletic$. Yes

 

[bballcat4]

Doesn't seems like Stoops is passionate about NIL either.

Recruiting classes and major wins in the transfer portal indicate Stoops (and football staff) have excelled with NIL!!!

I don’t pretend to be an insider. However, I want to think I’m above average with reading the tea leaves. It appears to me that Stoops and his staff have spent ALOT of time and energy with NIL the last couple of years. By all accounts, the NIL $ has come from a small group of people. He knows this isn’t sustainable. I’m guessing he has been told by the athletic department “We’ll figure it out and get you some help.” That help seems to be slow in coming.

Stoops wants to know his current and returning players are taken care of with NIL so they can focus on recruiting and improving the roster. As of now, he’s trying to recruit 20-25 new players every year, plus having to scrounge up money to keep an existing 30-40 players happy. There will always be 10-15 current players that they can live with them leaving.

Again, I don’t pretend to be an insider. But, it appears that he keeps hearing “We’re going to fix it, but no one is fixing it.”

Who thought fundraising would be the top skill set needed to be a successful football coach! Stoops and Marrow have successfully navigated NIL, but they want some help.

 

[3632]

The new NCAA settlement details released today with scholarship changes etc addresses NIL. There will still be NIL but no more collective stuff that isn't legit and deal contracts will be reviewed above six hundred bucks for acceptance by some new third party clearinghouse that can penalize. There will still be buying of players but the hurdles just got higher which will at least slow things down some.

 

[USMC Cat]

Imagine having to deal with a bunch of 17-22 year olds...

Now imagine giving them loads of money...

Now tell them that they're never wrong because they are the product, after all...

Sounds like an awful job, TBH. $9M is $9M, but that doesn't mean you can't be honest about how much it sucks balls.

 

[bballcat4]

Imagine having to deal with a bunch of 17-22 year olds...

Now imagine giving them loads of money...

Now tell them that they're never wrong because they are the product, after all...

Sounds like an awful job, TBH. $9M is $9M, but that doesn't mean you can't be honest about how much it sucks balls.

Now, also imagine teams from your own conference offering your best players more $ every year to come play for them.