But schools have limits on damages usually. So they need deeper pockets.
Without reading the rationale, I'm not sure it's a bad decision. It only lets the case move forward. Plaintiffs still have a long way to go before they prove these allegations.
POLITICAL THREAD
- Thread starter kybobcat
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But schools have limits on damages usually. So they need deeper pockets.
Without reading the rationale, I'm not sure it's a bad decision. It only lets the case move forward. Plaintiffs still have a long way to go before they prove these allegations.
What a crock of shit. It's always the govt's fault. If someone hasn't paid back a loan that is all the evidence Brandan Stroud needs: someone made a bad decision to offer the loan. Naturally what this means for all you people who have successfully paid off your debts, you deserve ZERO credit . . no, you did not make a good decision investing / taking your own risks, nor did you do a good job paying it off . . the credit goes to somebody ELSE . . a bank maybe, the govt. maybe, for carefully selecting YOU, not some dimwit down the road, to loan that money to. Weeping Jesus . . there is no quit in these liberals . . . this coming from someone who thinks he has the right to define conservatism to Ben Shapiro, and not the other way around . . . and the day is young . . . probably gonna holler back at me now about his . . . cough-cough . .. qualifications, and about all the really smart people he's talked to.
Yes and no and I don't disagree with the crux of those points or a lot of your points for that matter.
But there is something fundamental there that you are missing, namely above the American government is just that by definition, so what you propose to fix American culture is antithetical to it. We are founded by people willing to move and do what it takes to get better.
You are proposing blanket solutions, to turn the clock back to a different time when everything was different to stop things being different today, but it's too late. To actually achieve the results you look to achieve, it could only be through judicial application of local solutions to local problems. San Francisco solutions (lol) to their problems and Mississippi for theirs.
Which, incidentally is precisely what our system is ideally and to the extent we have these problems is typically from failure to live up to these American ideals, not failing to rewrite them wholesale to achieve a welfare state.
But there is something fundamental there that you are missing, namely above the American government is just that by definition, so what you propose to fix American culture is antithetical to it. We are founded by people willing to move and do what it takes to get better.
You are proposing blanket solutions, to turn the clock back to a different time when everything was different to stop things being different today, but it's too late. To actually achieve the results you look to achieve, it could only be through judicial application of local solutions to local problems. San Francisco solutions (lol) to their problems and Mississippi for theirs.
Which, incidentally is precisely what our system is ideally and to the extent we have these problems is typically from failure to live up to these American ideals, not failing to rewrite them wholesale to achieve a welfare state.
You type like an insane person. There is some cogent point in there, it just may take me a while to tease it out.
For the record, you think letting a 17 year old with no collateral take out $100k in loans is reasonable? I mean, it's obviously no one's fault but the 17 year old, right? A loan that wasn't backed by the government and made impossible to discharge via bankruptcy for the same amount would be handed out with no questions, correct? Just making sure this is what you actually believe and aren't just flying off the handle because someone dared to challenge the idea that US is not a free market economy and so it may require non dogmatic free market solutions to fix problems.
The student debt crisis is created by everyone involved, not just the government.
So consistent with my reasoning is that everyone involved should bare the cost of the solution, not just the government as the sole bad actor.
So consistent with my reasoning is that everyone involved should bare the cost of the solution, not just the government as the sole bad actor.
They aren't going after Remington for the gun. They are using the same tactic that took down the tobacco industry, Marketing.
So because certain groups of Americans throughout history made arduous choices and heroic decisions, every single citizen of the country is bound to the same standard? What about all of the tariffs and economic nationalism that existed in the country from the very beginning? How does that fit into the rugged individualist pulling themselves up by the bootstraps narrative? The economic liberalism of today bears no resemblance to the economy of our Founders, so tying the plight of an indebted, wage depressed, disenfranchised populace to a various small groups of people acting on their own accord throughout history is a total non-sequitur. It also ignores the fact that many of those adventurers and pioneers were acting in that manner because the government was giving them something (land) to do so. Not really an individualist scenario
Way to charge deep into the liberal example well. btw, it is more correct to say I text like a nut-job, actually very decent on the keyboard. Deflection is yours if you are just that backed up to a wall that easily. I am that good. But you and I both know the sympathetic lifeline you're talking about has nothing to do with age and has everything to do with accountability, and for which side. The borrower, or not. Again, if I've just backed you up so badly that you've got to resort to defending yourself with children then that just shows how much of a bad ass I am and how weak, chicken shit you libs' position on the subject has always been, always will be. Best for you to banter with someone besides me on here. I'm the early round knockout mo-fo. Thanks for the warm up.
to be fair the government bearing the cost is the same as everyone bearing the cost. Remove federally guaranteed loans, allow debt to be cancelled in bankruptcy. Those 2 things will slowly crush the cost of college. Something else should probably be done to partially alleviate the huge outstanding debt but not a blanket forgiveness. States can create their own programs like KY KEES to help out low income families and high performing students.
OK, well people with student loan debt also pay federal taxes and would still be living in the US and have to deal with any negative impacts that affected the national economy*, so why are they not baring any brunt (in addition to filing bankruptcy, ruining their credit, etc.)? This is the problem with diffuse political authority. If everyone is in charge, then no one is.
*Just a reminder that I'm merely advocating for student loans to be dischargable in bankruptcy like virtually every other form of debt. This, of course, won't affect all student loan debt. Myself, for example. I'm not going to file bankruptcy to get rid of my remaining $5k of student loan debt. Probably a solid majority of people wouldn't. But for the hundreds of thousands of people who can't start a family because they have an eternal, unpayable debt anchored to them, it would certainly make sense.
Yeah, that's what I mean plat.
It's not an illogical conclusion at all z, life then was much harder than it is now. Life today is too easy.
Because you (general) have made your life harder than it might otherwise be, does not mean it is not on balance very easy. You weren't disenfranchised.
I am for helping people who need it, not rewarding bad behavior or making things easier on you (general) when they are already easy.
Judicious application of whatever you propose to help yourselves would be far better than pie in the sky Warren-esque solutions that can only ever do more harm than good.
I would be for dischargeable in Bankruptcy and I think that's something we could do and should do, but we really have to look closely at the numbers. Do they have an eternal debt anchored to them really, or are they like that ridiculous MarketWatch article and other Marxists I see making claims that you can't afford a middle class life on 300k a year anymore and you need to declare bankruptcy because you are so poor.
It's not an illogical conclusion at all z, life then was much harder than it is now. Life today is too easy.
Because you (general) have made your life harder than it might otherwise be, does not mean it is not on balance very easy. You weren't disenfranchised.
I am for helping people who need it, not rewarding bad behavior or making things easier on you (general) when they are already easy.
Judicious application of whatever you propose to help yourselves would be far better than pie in the sky Warren-esque solutions that can only ever do more harm than good.
I would be for dischargeable in Bankruptcy and I think that's something we could do and should do, but we really have to look closely at the numbers. Do they have an eternal debt anchored to them really, or are they like that ridiculous MarketWatch article and other Marxists I see making claims that you can't afford a middle class life on 300k a year anymore and you need to declare bankruptcy because you are so poor.
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Millennials could have lived in a time where they were drafted and sent to war. Instead, they live in a time where they can borrow hundreds of thousands of dollars to blow partying while they’re 18-23.
Allow easier discharge in bankruptcy. Problem will fix itself. Tuition prices will plummet. Maybe students won’t be living in on campus luxury villas.
For those that already borrowed the money and spent it, sorry. You can already get it discharged in bankruptcy if you prove undue hardship. If you aren’t suffering undue hardship, then pay it back.
Allow easier discharge in bankruptcy. Problem will fix itself. Tuition prices will plummet. Maybe students won’t be living in on campus luxury villas.
For those that already borrowed the money and spent it, sorry. You can already get it discharged in bankruptcy if you prove undue hardship. If you aren’t suffering undue hardship, then pay it back.
This is a good question. They should get a pass, btw. It's their money. Also, seems like whenever we implement sanctions on a country that is a form of "withholding aid". e.g. human rights violations. And in that theme, is a prosecutor being unjustly fired for the sake of Biden Jr's favor not a clear example of political persecution?
Except this is extremely rarely granted even in cases that a reasonable person would say is totally unreasonable, and not the standard for any other form of debt. just make it like any other form of debt and the problem will work itself out.
Doesn't matter. Big hill to climb. Same theory but very different facts. This is much more akin to the vcr copyright cases than the cigarette cases.
Cigarettes have one use and only one use. Guns and VCRs (along with most every other thing) are made for legal use. That someone may use them for an illegal purpose is not the company's fault. It's the user
Just to be absolutely clear, I’m far more conservative and right wing than you. Calling everyone who isn’t a Ben Shapiro follower a “lib” is a pretty good clue you have no idea what you’re talking about. The false bravado shtick usually only works when people can string together a coherent sentence.
I hear of families intent on not paying back student loans. Instructing their children to let the loans go into default. Manipulating their children into maintaining low income. Just sinister garbage so they can eventually get the debt wiped clean. Have no idea how it works out in the end, but bankruptcy is not a new thing and I scarcely see how any one debt is less considerable for restructuring than any other.
Another desperate tool: police the grammar. My goodness, I really have beat you down that bad. I'm sorry . . . that badly.
What in the hell are you even talking about? Who said anything about grammar?
Sentence structure, whatever. Be a weenie. Everyone is seeing it. Look, we're just going to have to disagree, and deviate from topic more if you need to. But anybody who seeks to shift responsibility away from the individual and to the institution (e.g. govt) is certainly not as right wing as I am. That promotes dependency . . to the left. I'm okay if you do not understand this.
Since we are being reasonable here...I assume you are also in favor of paying back the money to all of the people who, as 17 year olds, borrowed money for college (without collateral) and then responsibly made sacrifices and worked their ass off to pay off their student loans. Correct? What about the interest they could have been earning on that money over all these years? They get that back too...right?
Just making sure that’s what you mean by non dogmatic free market problem solving since I’m sure your bleeding heart is attached to an individual with a fair mind. I mean it obviously wasn’t their fault that as a 17 year old (without collateral) they chose to act responsibly and were unable to predict a future insane world where all student loans shall be forgiven.
Oh yeah, since we are sitting here outside the box with our non dogmatic thinking caps on...kick in 6-8 years of keg party & spring break reparations. I’m sure some of those responsible 17 year olds still partied on a budget but I’m rather enjoying this free giveaway fantasy world stuff. It’s fun.
Wait. Who’s gonna pay for all of that? Uh oh. Time to put our reality thinking caps back on and get back to work...
Why the hell would I care if someone gets to file bankruptcy, ruin their credit, etc. to get out of student loan debt? I'm on the verge of paying mine off, but I have no ill will towards someone being able to file bankruptcy on their student loans. Do you get this angry when people file for bankruptcy on their credit card debt even though you pay your statement off on time? Or did you just get irrationally upset and think I was promoting the government literally write a check to student loan servicers to pay off outstanding debt?
And, yet again, it never ceases to amaze me how people think anything that isn't something you would read on Daily Wire is bleeding heart liberalism. I promise, for the last time, I am more right wing than you. I am not a liberal either in the American or classical sense. I am a right wing conservative. Someone like Pat Buchanan is closer to my ideology than whatever Democrat de jure you think I am.
I wasn't talking about sentence structure, grammar, or anything related to that. I was honestly confused because you called me a "lib" then would go from one sentence to another talking about different things, that didn't reflect what I had written. You literally weren't making sense.
I'm sorry you're so terribly misinformed about what constitutes left and right.
Stephen Miller’s leaked emails echo the extreme-right viewpoints celebrated in this thread. Pretty amazing.
That dude is a scared little bitch of a man. Holy hell. Look in the mirror, fellas. Take a deep breath and exhale in relief. White Americans are not being persecuted. Repeat it out loud - “White Americans are not being persecuted.”
That dude is a scared little bitch of a man. Holy hell. Look in the mirror, fellas. Take a deep breath and exhale in relief. White Americans are not being persecuted. Repeat it out loud - “White Americans are not being persecuted.”
You were doing pretty good up to this point.
I enjoyed that back and forth with somedude. Thought provoking. I am going to have to give the win to dude though. All his arguments are based in reality.
If I leave my front door unlocked and someone comes in and steals my tv, is that my fault? How about if I leave my car running in my driveway and someone steals it, is that my fault?
It's as free a market as can be found in the world. Don't go platindumb on me and say it's not free because of taxes.
Bravo!
You would be responsible, yes. But what what if the police refused to pursue your case because you bought a particular house? Every other house that was robbed, even ones that people left their doors open to, was under investigation by the police. But yours, only because it was a specific house, was not under that same protection. Does that seem reasonable?
Again, to be totally clear. I am advocating that people be able to discharge student loan debt in bankruptcy. They are not getting away scot-free. Their credit will be devastated, unlikely to be able to get a home loan for years, etc. Why everyone in this thread seems to be immediately going into I PAY MY LOAN THEM LITTLE BASTARDS HAVE TO PAY THEIR LOAN AINT GETTING SHIT FREE FROM MY TAXES! mode is baffling. That is not what is being proposed. So stop arguing against that.
Can you elaborate? What about the idea of having an un-elected government (or a government with minimal voter participation and no partisan elections, per se) is unrealistic? It's happened in the West to varying degrees of success within the past 50 years, but it's certainly not unheard of. If we're talking about specifically the United States in 2019, OK, I'm under no pretense that we are going to radically reform our government, but that's not what I was trying to claim.
EDIT: Also, allowing student loan debt to be discharged would immediately collapse the student loan scam. College prices would go down, luxury dorms would stop being built, useless programs like gender studies and Afro-tinx Homosexual theater would be first on the chopping block, it would be easier to get white collar jobs without a degree, students who have no business being in college wouldn't be able to afford being out of the job market for 4-6 years. All of these should be things that conservatives want, but the price of letting people file bankruptcy seems to be too high????
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No, it's true, dumbass. But believe what you want. I DGAF.
Whatever maintains your fragile little superiority complex, you a pompous, blathering idiot.
But it's still the fault of the police for not pursuing your case. There can be multiple levels of fault in a given scenario
That's beautiful . . you were confused because you needed my reply to concentrate on YOU, yet it did not. How old are you? Did you get bad jealous when mommy spent that extra 20 minutes before bedtime combing baby sister's hair? I am so thoroughly entertained.
