POLITICAL THREAD

[CastleRubric]

"it baffles me that folks think we have a revenue problem. Budgeting is based on income not wants/needs."

help me understand what you mean
I didn't catch the context --- sounds like you're saying the Fed-Govt brings in enough revenue (Taxes - not sure if fines or other fees are inc;used in government revenue? Seems like they should be) - to meet the "needs" of our citizenry?

Or are you going deeper with this?

I'm asking because I'm always interested in economic angles to things but it's not my strongest suit --

There are DEFINITELY what I would call "common sense" changes that could be made in terms of spending

the US *CAN* gracefully take a less prominent/interventionst stance in the world without becoming "isolationist" --- we should start looking at some defense cuts with that in mind in my opinion and let other countries take on more of a stake in their common defense

That's why I really LIKED our President calling out that Former Communist (kind of like a "Former Marine' though isn't it?) - Angela Merkel -- for not paying the agreed to rate of dues to NATO ---

Unless the data was just flat out wrong -- Trump had a good point and was right to confront the High Comrade of the Rhineland -- I think it's 2% of GDP for dues....Germany was skating along at 1.2% or something like that........not even sure WHY

I read where they JUST PAID their damn (unjust) World War ONE debt off in 2010 .......so maybe we should go a bit easy on them...

 

[Mashburned]

to get us to the coming notion of implanted technology and genetic manipulation ---

Oh man people are lined up right now at the Apple Store for this.

Today's lex news:

Private jet from Cali lands at bluegrass airport with 50 lbs of meth and 80 kilos of coke. Homeland security was tracking the plane. 3 passengers, one was illegal.

Also, had no clue, but downtown Lexington used to be pretty. Article about this "Italianate villa" mansion on an 11 acre plot that was demolished to build some ugly ass student apartments. This mansion was the most expensive home ever built by Lexington's most prolific 19th century architect and builder, John McMurty. This was just one of many historic buildings demolished for whatever reasons over the years. Unreal. Now lexington has a hole.

^ that craps going on in my stupid town. EKU is gobbling up property and replacing it with bs temporary structures that will fall apart in 30 years. It's interesting how powerful universities are.

2 front page articles about homeless. 1 about bath salts lmao, the other about getting them jobs to clean up the streets for $9/hr.

 

[Mashburned]

And I'm for rounding up liberals to live on Indian reservations and/or ship them to Canada. They should be pleased with either.

 

[CastleRubric]

its worse than that. Because the government is mandating that everyone have insurance, and subsidizing those who cannot afford it, its created a market where supply and demand no longer drive prices. its not easy to reign in.

Health care isn't my best topic -- I can't debate Obamacare very well

but I remember seeing a newspaper article while I was in New Mexico about 2 years ago
And two articles were side by side -

one talked about national coverage in the emerging government sponsored health care system,

and the other mentioned that there were an additional 6 million non citizens who are wanting some of that "Free" stuff too

The National Council of La Raza DEMANDS IT

that -- taken into consideration with other factors -- is a recipe for accelerate economic collapse ala' CLOWARD PIVEN STRATEGY
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloward–Piven_strategy

the only way someone can like that idea is though :

1) Abject ignorance
or
2) willful intention to destroy the economy and current form of govt we have (which, coincidentally --- is a stated goal of Team Marx.....FUNNY how I never hear them say what they're going to replace it with,.......a giant picture of Shelly Winters maybe?)

 

[CastleRubric]

Oh man people are lined up right now at the Apple Store for this.

Today's lex news:

Private jet from Cali lands at bluegrass airport with 50 lbs of meth and 80 kilos of coke. Homeland security was tracking the plane. 3 passengers, one was illegal.

Also, had no clue, but downtown Lexington used to be pretty. Article about this "Italianate villa" mansion on an 11 acre plot that was demolished to build some ugly ass student apartments. This mansion was the most expensive home ever built by Lexington's most prolific 19th century architect and builder, John McMurty. This was just one of many historic buildings demolished for whatever reasons over the years. Unreal. Now lexington has a hole.

^ that craps going on in my stupid town. EKU is gobbling up property and replacing it with bs temporary structures that will fall apart in 30 years. It's interesting how powerful universities are.

2 front page articles about homeless. 1 about bath salts lmao, the other about getting them jobs to clean up the streets for $9/hr.

there are like three different things in there that I want to talk about or ask questions about

but I'm frozen ..... it's like you waved a green flag in my face, sang two lines of an Arcade Fire song - and then farted


I'm kind of amazed and taken aback and REALLY entertained.........but I have no idea what to say yet.......

I need coffee.....

 

[TankedCat]

what I believe is that the Obama administration had very little concern if the affordable care act really resulted in affordable care.

Whether the plan was to roll the dice and hope for the best or to pave the way for single payer system, I don't know nor care. What I know is you can't put the genie back in the bottle. There is no solution that involves allowing the sickest to enroll with no insurance spending caps, no mandate and keeping young adults on the parents program until they are 26...AND... reduce costs.

Its not possible. Any politician that tries to tell us otherwise is just buying votes.

My hope is Obamacare will become the "New Coke" of Government mistakes and his name will be forever linked with government hubris, ego and incompetence.

 

[Bill Cosby]

Had a client who made a tax payment under an incorrect EIN. Get POA back in August, talk to the IRS, get the payment applied to the correct EIN as of the date it was made. All good, so it seems.

That client gets a notice that the money hadn't been deposited when they file the return in March. 10% penalty based on the total tax that was shown on the return. I call the IRS, the guy I talk with says the system shows the payments on the correct EIN as of the correct dates, but that system doesn't communicate with the other system that generated the notice. He tries to waive the penalty while we're on the phone, but no, that would be to easy, the system won't let him do that. Now we have to make a written request to abate the penalty.

The IRS' budget was between $11 and 12 billion last year. I would love to see if a private sector company that was spending $11 billion a year could break out a little bit of its budget to implement computer processes that cross communicate.

 

[Bill Derington]

-it baffles me that folks think we have a revenue problem. Budgeting is based on income not wants/needs.

-i have had much experience in capital projects for local/state/federal over the last 25 years. The waste is staggering. "It is in our budget so we may as well spend it"...gild the lily in lieu of allocation of exess funds for other projects (or...gasp! Return the cash to taxpayers). The gov. pm's/purchasers arent terrible people...most are pretty neat folks...the system is just f'ed and needs to be completely overhauled. This is just one tiny area of state waste.

I'll add that at the end of the fiscal year Govt agencies spend like drunk sailors to make sure they use all the money they were budgeted. They buy all kinds of unnecessary things in order to use all they were budgeted.

This happens so that the next year their budget isn't cut, I've seen this happen over and over. Christmas time in September.

 

[Bill Derington]

what I believe is that the Obama administration had very little concern if the affordable care act really resulted in affordable care.

Whether the plan was to roll the dice and hope for the best or to pave the way for single payer system, I don't know nor care. What I know is you can't put the genie back in the bottle. There is no solution that involves allowing the sickest to enroll with no insurance spending caps, no mandate and keeping young adults on the parents program until they are 26...AND... reduce costs.

Its not possible. Any politician that tries to tell us otherwise is just buying votes.

My hope is Obamacare will become the "New Coke" of Government mistakes and his name will be forever linked with government hubris, ego and incompetence.

They knew the pitfalls, they didn't care as long as it passed. Once it was put in place it was never going back to the way it was before.

 

[fuzz77]

I get the logic behind this, but when an audit finds 500 million in wasteful spending for HUD, and seemingly everything we buy ie Air Force one and several other military assets, you begin to also realize we don't tax enough to cover wasteful spending.

Personally I'd throw welfare and Obamacare in with wasteful spending.

Not to say that would make or break the budget overall, but you get the point when 100's of millions of dollars are wasted our budget is garbage.

Wasteful spending should be curtailed regardless of tax rates and has nothing to do with rates.
The wastefulness of much of that spending is like beauty, in the eye of the beholder. We can agree to that waste that is due to fraud and abuse. Then there is spending that is politically motivated. The Pentagon wants to cut the number of tanks, the Armed Services Committee members from states where they build those tanks insist that the Pentagon buy more tanks.
Expensive items for Air Force One... often that is because items are spec, one of a kind items that have to be special made. Anyone who has owned an exotic car knows that sometimes items you might think would be relatively cheap...filters, brake pads, etc can be outrageously expensive. They are low production items from which you usually only have one source. Air Force One is an exotic aircraft.

Of course we have a $4.1T budget ...that's $4,100,000,000,000. So even if waste was only 1% that would equate to $41 billion. I'd challenge you to find any organization on the planet that is 99% efficient in it's spending. We (my employer) are a Fortune 200 company and we know that about 2% of our claims are fraudulent. Problem is, it would costs us twice what we would recover to find those claims.

 

[fuzz77]

I find it more telling that you never question anything Obama and the left ever did. Your Hypocrisy knows no limits.

And your inability to ever discuss merits of any idea are also telling. You could can your responses to any subject matter in a tiny jar...which fits the tiny brain from which they come.

 

[Bill Cosby]

It is amazing to me that we have people arguing we can't let American citizens keep their own money, because it would be too hard and politically untenable for the federal government to cut spending or even just eliminate fraud and waste.

 

[ukalumni00]

Had a client who made a tax payment under an incorrect EIN. Get POA back in August, talk to the IRS, get the payment applied to the correct EIN as of the date it was made. All good, so it seems.

That client gets a notice that the money hadn't been deposited when they file the return in March. 10% penalty based on the total tax that was shown on the return. I call the IRS, the guy I talk with says the system shows the payments on the correct EIN as of the correct dates, but that system doesn't communicate with the other system that generated the notice. He tries to waive the penalty while we're on the phone, but no, that would be to easy, the system won't let him do that. Now we have to make a written request to abate the penalty.

The IRS' budget was between $11 and 12 billion last year. I would love to see if a private sector company that was spending $11 billion a year could break out a little bit of its budget to implement computer processes that cross communicate.

That is asking too much from the same government that spent billions on a crappy website for Obamacare that in the right hands could have been done for who knows how much less and much quicker.

Its all fraud anyway. These contractors are owed favors or are friends with politicians and they know they can screw the taxpayers over with over inflated budgets and timelines for crappy products and just line their pockets because they know they will not be held accountable for it.

 

[fuzz77]

That's the point I'm making. Cut spending. Tons of wasted in fed spending starting with entitlements.

Ok, can we start with your social security and medicare?

 

[Bill Cosby]

ALSO,

I don't give a shit if Google, Amazon, etc. lose 50% of their money to waste and fraudulent claims. The companies and investors EARN it and are free to do with it as they please. If investors are unhappy, they can make changes.

The federal government tells you they can spend your money better than you, takes it from you at gun point, then blows it on worthless shit. They don't EARN a goddamn thing.

 

[Bill Cosby]

Ok, can we start with your social security and medicare?

You can start with mine (so long as it applies to everyone my age and younger). I'll even continue paying in to the system to fund your Ponzi scheme.

 

[mdlUK.1]

Ok, can we start with your social security and medicare?

Yeah , you can change SS and Medicare but not for people already on it. Or even those too close to getting it that they can't make necessary changes to compensate.

 

[FusterCluck]

It's cute that Fuzz thinks we'll actually ever see our SS... so much so that he uses it as a leveraging tool.

I wrote that shit off YEARS ago.

 

[Bill Cosby]

I am 100% confident I will never see a dime of SS.

One other point I forgot to mention, I'd be willing to continue paying into the Ponzi scheme to keep funding it, so long as that money was segregated, and any attempt to borrow against it as collateral or take from the fund for other uses was punishable by death.

 

[CastleRubric]

I've thought about that but don't know how to really analyze it right

(social security) it SOUNDS correct - in fact we could see 'negative interest rates' at some point to offset costs to banks somehow?

I want to say that's already occurred in some place like France -- or possibly Alabama

I have a good friend who has a PhD in Economics and I LOVE to ask him stuff all the time
But I'm always good at remembering / applying / factoring things in / keeping a linear conversation or anything mechanical


now I'm depressed -- SCREW YOU COOKIE PANTS IM GOING TO WATCH BOBBY ROSS MAINT A SUNSET

 

[rudd1]

-fraud would be hard to curtail fer shern. Needs to be done regardless of cost/pain. Entitlement programs are required of a civilized society...but helping people (truly) in need and being efficient are not mutually exclusive.

- starve the bureaucracy. Pivate sector figures out how to perform after massive budget cuts. Eliminate all but truly *essential * agencies/depts (dept of energy and ed come to mind) these leviathans didnt exist til 77 and 79 respectively and have fone more harm than good in their respective fields.Get the epa(also didn't exist til the 70's) out of politics...stick to clean air/water. Dept of Defense held accountable as well. Yada yada yada...the list is sadly never-ending.

Wyvern,
The feds take in more than enough cash to meet the needs of the citizenry...gotta stop spending on stupid shit. Ultimately taxation is theft...while necessary for basic services. However the ultimate goal of the statists on both the left and right is control of the populace...and taxation is the most palatable way to lead sheep to the slaughter.

 

[CastleRubric]

So -- if we are ever TOLD that we won't get SS
Then we should stop paying in at some point?

Otherwise -- it really is just jecklegged thievery

DAMNIT

 

[CastleRubric]

Wyvern,
The feds take in more than enough cash to meet the needs of the citizenry...gotta stop spending on stupid shit. Ultimately taxation is theft...while necessary for basic services. However the ultimate goal of the statists on both the left and right is control of the populace...and taxation is the most palatable way to lead sheep to the slaughter.


All makes logical sense and I agree completely

I'd add that the 'control' mechanic is multi-tiered thought / psychological / low-tech / high tech

Aldous Huxley meets Eric Blair's Big Brother and they have a baby that admires Marx and Stalin

But they're still GROWING UP

Soon the mask comes off because the STATE can't continue to pretend they CARE about you (you TOO, Traditional Leftist friends)

thank you Rudd



....any kin to Ricky Rudd?

 

[CastleRubric]

Some of you people need to learn what the term Nazi means and why it doesn't apply in the context you all are using it.

Jews should be speaking up more than they are

It sure does seem to cheapen something they ALWAYS SEEM TO CARE ABOUT

hell - these aren't even GOOD street anarchists......I watched highlights of the "battle" in Berkeley last week and saw informed voters on BOTH sides pushing a trash can back and forth to each other while two strategic thinkers tossed an orange road cone back and forth

it looked like an olympic sport for 3rd world march of dimes children

bless their hearts

then the commentator cuts in to EMPHASIZE that at some point people started throwing FOOD teach other ---

then she stops for effect and says

EVEN BAGLES!!!!

oyyyyvey!!!

what next ? A bolshevik Pillow fight????

NO ONE IS WINNING WITH THESE IDIOTS

can you trade them in for foreign anarchists like the Russians kinda did?

then I hear that 3 f'ing ISIS "WARRIORS got killed by 3 stampeding PIGS

this is the same organization that we couldn't see coming nor stop for years

how ironic that those UNCLEAN PIGS just flat ran their ass-wiping hands right over......no virgins for you -- instead you get "BAKLAVA ROOM"

 

[Bill Cosby]

All this talk about not allowing American citizens to keep their own money, because fraud and abuse are too hard to cut, on a day when Congress is meeting at the White House because we're likely going to enter into a war to oust a dictator that will never have the ability to impact a single American citizen that doesn't willingly travel to that shit hole.

By all means, keep taking my money, because it's too hard to stop wasting trillions of dollars defending the world.

 

[rudd1]

If you havent read homage to catalonia by your boy e.b you must....throw in scum of the earth by koestler for good measure.

-in general the Spanish Civil War is fascinating a: because it was the first "world" battle between Marxists(commies, socialists and a few different breeds of anarchists) and the "right". b: there were real writers of all stripes on/near the front lines...Orwell, Koestler, Dos Passos, hemmingway (pawn of stalin), Malraux et al.

After all the history of the failings/brutality/murder implicit to marxism...millions of ignorant children and old hippies(shoyld be well read enoug to know better) voted for a socialist right here in the good old USofA. Mortifying.

 

[Mashburned]

Jews should be speaking up more than they are

It sure does seem to cheapen something they ALWAYS SEEM TO CARE ABOUT

hell - these aren't even GOOD street anarchists......I watched highlights of the "battle" in Berkeley last week and saw informed voters on BOTH sides pushing a trash can back and forth to each other while two strategic thinkers tossed an orange road cone back and forth

it looked like an olympic sport for 3rd world march of dimes children

bless their hearts

then the commentator cuts in to EMPHASIZE that at some point people started throwing FOOD teach other ---

then she stops for effect and says

EVEN BAGLES!!!!

oyyyyvey!!!

what next ? A bolshevik Pillow fight????

NO ONE IS WINNING WITH THESE IDIOTS

can you trade them in for foreign anarchists like the Russians kinda did?

then I hear that 3 f'ing ISIS "WARRIORS got killed by 3 stampeding PIGS

this is the same organization that we couldn't see coming nor stop for years

how ironic that those UNCLEAN PIGS just flat ran their ass-wiping hands right over......no virgins for you -- instead you get "BAKLAVA ROOM"

 

[warrior-cat]

And your inability to ever discuss merits of any idea are also telling. You could can your responses to any subject matter in a tiny jar...which fits the tiny brain from which they come.

You could never understand any responses that I would come up with simply because you don't have the capacity to understand nor the will. You simply follow your leaders blindly and spout out left talking points without actually knowing what they mean. It would be pointless to point anything out to you.

 

[warrior-cat]

I am 100% confident I will never see a dime of SS.

One other point I forgot to mention, I'd be willing to continue paying into the Ponzi scheme to keep funding it, so long as that money was segregated, and any attempt to borrow against it as collateral or take from the fund for other uses was punishable by death.

Which had already been done by previous administrations including Clintons to cook the books.

 

[krazykats]

Wasteful spending should be curtailed regardless of tax rates and has nothing to do with spending.

Wait, what? How do you think tax rates are contrived? Just some random number pulled out of the sky?

Ok, can we start with your social security and medicare?

Absolutely you can start with mine, but quit taking it out of my check too, right?

I'll figure it out when I get there or finish the plan I had in my 20's. Either way stop taxing me bro!

 

[warrior-cat]

So -- if we are ever TOLD that we won't get SS
Then we should stop paying in at some point?

Otherwise -- it really is just jecklegged thievery

DAMNIT

There would have to be a cut off point for paying and receiving with monies set aside to pay the remaining people who are receiving or are close to receiving the benefits without screwing a large group of people. I am afraid some would get screwed either way.

 

[qwesley]

Ok, can we start with your social security and medicare?

The party, to which you have whored yourself, opposes any and all entitlement discussions using offensive granny-over-cliff type propaganda. Heal thyself ho..

 

[warrior-cat]

Wait, what? How do you think tax rates are contrived? Just some random number pulled out of the sky?



Absolutely you can start with mine, but quit taking it out of my check too, right?

I'll figure it out when I get there or finish the plan I had in my 20's. Either way stop taxing me bro!

It would be nice if there was a way to give back to you what you have put in to this point. If you were willing, and a savvy enough investor, you could probably make much more than what you would have gotten off of SS. Unfortunately, I myself am not that savvy and am too close to my target date to make anything like that happen.

 

[Willy4UK]

The party, to which you have whored yourself, opposes any and all entitlement discussions using offensive granny-over-cliff type propaganda. Heal thyself ho..

Mitt Romney killed 35 grannies in 2008

 

[USSLair]

points for the pic of Tesla

a man otherwise SHOCKINGLY neglected by media and history

((did you see what I did there?))



or maybe it's Edgar Allen Poe.......is that Aunt Bea bringing up the rear or Madam Curie?

It's so hard to tell these days

The Tesla Modern Marvels episode is outstanding. A great insight to an unbelievable strange but brilliant man.

 

[krazykats]

It would be nice if there was a way to give back to you what you have put in to this point. If you were willing, and a savvy enough investor, you could probably make much more than what you would have gotten off of SS. Unfortunately, I myself am not that savvy and am too close to my target date to make anything like that happen.

Dude, surely you could roll that into your 401K or something. Pay off your house whatever! It's better than the govt just taking it.

Also SS should be something we elect as to be included, not just outright taxed upon us. Sure I get my annual statements and sure my thousands of dollars are sitting there for me one day, but I never gave any ok about being included in SS.

I'd be willing to bet there is fraud out the ass in that program. And if you haven't paid in the F your claims to it because your retarded and clinically can't work.(Edit my brother in law takes advantage of this loop hole and is very capable of working)

I'm republican but I'm starting to believe in abortions too!

 

[CastleRubric]

There would have to be a cut off point for paying and receiving with monies set aside to pay the remaining people who are receiving or are close to receiving the benefits without screwing a large group of people. I am afraid some would get screwed either way.

then factor in reparations

.... and the coming climate "change it back to normal tax"

and -- ahh hell.....I'm have some cake here --- I'm just going to go eat it now

 

[fuzz77]

It is amazing to me that we have people arguing we can't let American citizens keep their own money, because it would be too hard and politically untenable for the federal government to cut spending or even just eliminate fraud and waste.

It's easy to talk about eliminating fraud and waste... hell, everybody is for that.
Got a great business idea for you... you get to identify fraud and waste and get to keep everything you recover. BUT, you have to spend the money it takes to identify and recover it. The waste part will require that you get congress to approve what you consider waste.

All this talk about not allowing American citizens to keep their own money, because fraud and abuse are too hard to cut, on a day when Congress is meeting at the White House because we're likely going to enter into a war to oust a dictator that will never have the ability to impact a single American citizen that doesn't willingly travel to that shit hole.

By all means, keep taking my money, because it's too hard to stop wasting trillions of dollars defending the world.

Something we agree about 100%

 

[CastleRubric]

If you havent read homage to catalonia by your boy e.b you must....throw in scum of the earth by koestler for good measure.

-in general the Spanish Civil War is fascinating a: because it was the first "world" battle between Marxists(commies, socialists and a few different breeds of anarchists) and the "right". b: there were real writers of all stripes on/near the front lines...Orwell, Koestler, Dos Passos, hemmingway (pawn of stalin), Malraux et al.

After all the history of the failings/brutality/murder implicit to marxism...millions of ignorant children and old hippies(shoyld be well read enoug to know better) voted for a socialist right here in the good old USofA. Mortifying.

I don't really know you - I mean I FEEL like we have a connection and all - but that first sentence made me want to hug you and perhaps gift you with some fine $10 merlot from my kitchen

I LOVE the Spanish Civil War topic -- I have a book on it written from the perspective of the Quakers of all people - they were documenting their challenges in getting to ports to provide food donations from the USA and other places like Ohio -- there's also an OUTSTANDING 6-7 part documentary on YT

Having Marxists and Fascists fight is like trying to choose between Duke or NC
So I always pull for "mutual destruction" and "widespread outbreaks of VD"

I knew Orwell went to fight (Hemingway and maybe Bertrand Russel as well) BUT he learned that the Socialism he thought was desirable -- didn't quite match Jo Jo Stalins big plans -- I don't know HOW jaded he became from it but we know that "1984" was based on the USSR's oppressive tactics and he didn't suffer fools on either side..that's something I'd like to study more......AND you know his real name!!!
I''m SO HAPPY RIGGHT NOW

I haven't read that one but WILL -- I have read "All Art is Propaganda" -- series if Essays (EHHH ESSAY - VAMONAS!) -- two are on political language and are even more relevant now than they were in the 1940's

and your last paragraph --- YES - THANK YOU -- I SWEAR YOU'VE MADE MY DAY!

THATS NOT "liberalism" -- it's not ANYTHING other than the singly most corrupt / centralized / mistaken prone / abusive / self gratifying / ASAINE HYPOCRITICAL ASS-HETT-ERY -- they introduced the world to concentration camps

and yet -- NO talk of it
everyone calls everyone a damn nazi when NO ONE is a real f'ing NAZI
and yet the MARXISTS are marching around berkley and throwing the damn bagels and other breakfast foods at others......Molotov and Trotsky must be proud right about now --- assuming they can get their minds off THE BURNING FLAMES OF HELLLLLLLL

I could go on and on.....(and you're saying......yeaaah.....we know)

....I had 4 other paragraphs but removed them
I'm trying to think more linearly


one last thing -- are you being called a "liberal" on here, Rudd?
(another meaningless word that Orwell would SMIRK at --- and his SMIRK would be more intelligent political discourse than the ninnies in our propaganda depths who sit and READ WHAT THEYRE TOLD TO READ

ok I'm done

NO MORe political talk for me today
unless you ask a question - it'd be rude NOT to respond

 

[CastleRubric]

damn - I just looked at that post and I sound / read like "HORT"




great