UL vs UK this season

[The Public Enemy]

So maybe your run defense will not be as good next year and with us expecting an improved run game... you can see where we think we have a good shot next year?

We return 8 or 9 starters on D and 7 or 8 on O (badet would of started but was out last year). You lose all this otherworldly talent and your gonna just plug and play like osu or

14 put spread last year.. do you think that line moves up or down this year?

Actually not really worried about the Run Defense since the bulk of the Front Seven is returning including NT DeAngelo Brown and DE Sheldon Rankins along both Inside Linebackers in Keith Kelsey-(whom I thought was our Best LB last year including Lorenzo Mauldin the 3rd Round Pick of the NY Jets) and James Burgess with the addition of the 2012 Big XII Defensive Player of the Year/2014 Preseason Big XII Defensive Player of the Year in DeVonte Fields...the issue on Defense will be inexperienced Cornerback with the Biggest Question Mark Overall is replacing 3 OLinemen-(two of which were taken in the 3rd Round of the 2015 NFL Draft)...I am actually more concerned about replacing Jake Smith, Jamon Brown-(Now with the Rams) and John Miller-(now with the Buffalo Bills) then I am about DeVante Parker.

 

[hmt5000]

Actually not really worried about the Run Defense since the bulk of the Front Seven is returning including NT DeAngelo Brown and DE Sheldon Rankins along both Inside Linebackers in Keith Kelsey-(whom I thought was our Best LB last year including Lorenzo Mauldin the 3rd Round Pick of the NY Jets) and James Burgess with the addition of the 2012 Big XII Defensive Player of the Year/2014 Preseason Big XII Defensive Player of the Year in DeVonte Fields...the issue on Defense will be inexperienced Cornerback with the Biggest Question Mark Overall is replacing 3 OLinemen-(two of which were taken in the 3rd Round of the 2015 NFL Draft)...I am actually more concerned about replacing Jake Smith, Jamon Brown-(Now with the Rams) and John Miller-(now with the Buffalo Bills) then I am about DeVante Parker.

And the team that wins the running game has won this series 90% of the time. We feel good about 4 of our OL spots and you admit you have 3 ??? And I think you would agree u have depth issues at oline as well. Again. You can see were we like our chances

 

[CardFan1130]

We return 8 or 9 starters on D

Is that a good thing? They didn't exactly stop anyone last year.

 

[The Public Enemy]

OLine is a concern due to lack of experience working together and I will admit Coach Klenakis has his work cut out for him. UofL returns two Starters on that unit...the young guys have to grow up fast.

But really until we get to Kentucky for us it is Auburn, Houston and Clemson...we get through those three in good shape long term we will be fine.

 

[jauk11]

Against Georgia UL saw what playing with a 3rd string QB was really like.

Right, if I had worked all my life to get in a major bowl against an SEC opponent on national TV I would be disinterested also.

 

[The Public Enemy]

Right, if I had worked all my life to get in a major bowl against an SEC opponent on national TV I would be disinterested also.

Well the bulk of that team had already beaten Florida in a New Years Day Six Bowl...Beat Miami in a Bowl-(Which is big for many of the players who happen to be Florida Natives) and won at Notre Dame on Notre Dame Senior Day...plus wouldn't be surprised that players like Gaines, Samples and Holliman already had their eye set for the NFL Combine-(those 3 declared early)

But in the end UofL got "Good Georgia" the one that Crushed Missouri in Columbia, Missouri...not the "Bad Georgia" that got Boatraced by Florida...

 

[teamcanada]

Right, if I had worked all my life to get in a major bowl against an SEC opponent on national TV I would be disinterested also.

When did the Belk bowl become a major bowl?

 

[hmt5000]

Is that a good thing? They didn't exactly stop anyone last year.

i guess you'll find out nov! but to anyone else that is actually interested... our D's problems last year were more of a function of new guys in a new scheme without the depth to go through what was i believe a top 10 schedule. flannigan got to campus late so he was just starting to play fast at the end of the year. forrest just got moved to lb'er so he was playing better as the year went on. lewis and johnson were jucos and admitted that they were kinda shellshocked at how good sec o-line was and they got on their heels a little. Z is and was a beast but he was undersized for 3-4 end. he is prototypical 4-3 end and the quick change to 3-4 meant that he didnt have time to add weight and the guys playing that spot this year will weigh 15 to 30 pounds more.

it's one thing to be bad because you are simply not athletic or physically strong enough to play but it's another to rely on 5 jucos who just got to campus to compete against the schedule we played. all those jucos return and know whats up now. both ilb'ers should be playing much faster and outside of losing bud... we should be better and deeper at every position on that side of the ball.

now just to preempt the "well i hope we can score against so much talent" from my little guest.... i believe wildcard stated that we were 111 stoops first year in total D. we were in the 80's last year. i think it is realistic to think we should be at least top 50 this year and if a few of these guys improve the way we think they have... top 35 or 40 is certainly in reach. but the O can help the D out a lot this year and i expect that to happen as well.

 

[jauk11]

When did the Belk bowl become a major bowl?

LOL Got me there, I figure when they get to play a major long term power from the SEC it is a major bowl, didn't pay attention to what bowl it was in.

BUT I can assure you that if UL had beat Georgia it would have been a major major bowl according to Transfer U fans.

 

[CardHack]

I don't think there's any doubt that the Open Date benefitted UK last year; by comparison Louisville stretch of games before it was FSU on a Thursday night, at BC on a Friday and at Notre Dame. It looks like UK somehow goes all season without an Open Date if I'm reading it right until the UofL game in something of a scheduling anomoly (I don't know how thrilled coaches are to play eleven straight weeks without a break). Louisville's is in front of the trip to Tallahassee in Week Six.

Unlike last season for UofL, our schedule this year is very frontloaded. Auburn and Clemson are two of our first three and we have two tough road tilts at NC State and Tallahassee for the fifth and sixth. The defense had better be packed; I just don't like the unsettled look of the offensive line against the caliber of teams we're playing into October.

 

[CardFan1130]

LOL Got me there, I figure when they get to play a major long term power from the SEC it is a major bowl, didn't pay attention to what bowl it was in.

BUT I can assure you that if UL had beat Georgia it would have been a major major bowl according to Transfer U fans.

Yep and had UL won you would've played the "Ga was disinterested card". So it's a no win situation.

 

[Dallas-Wild]

Yep and had UL won you would've played the "Ga was disinterested card". So it's a no win situation.

Fan speak means nothing...fact is ul got the chit kicked out of them

Kind of like the bye week we had was the only reason we were in the game with ul.....total BS it means nothing in a rivalry game

 

[The Public Enemy]

I don't think there's any doubt that the Open Date benefitted UK last year; by comparison Louisville stretch of games before it was FSU on a Thursday night, at BC on a Friday and at Notre Dame. It looks like UK somehow goes all season without an Open Date if I'm reading it right until the UofL game in something of a scheduling anomoly (I don't know how thrilled coaches are to play eleven straight weeks without a break). Louisville's is in front of the trip to Tallahassee in Week Six.

Unlike last season for UofL, our schedule this year is very frontloaded. Auburn and Clemson are two of our first three and we have two tough road tilts at NC State and Tallahassee for the fifth and sixth. The defense had better be packed; I just don't like the unsettled look of the offensive line against the caliber of teams we're playing into October.

Houston is no going to be easy either...not so much worried about the Defense or the Skilled Positions on Offense-(QB, RB, WR & TE) but the replacements for Jamon Brown, Jake Smith and John Miller on the Offensive Line. Especially early on the Big Uglies up front must gell as a unit.

 

[CardFan1130]

Fan speak means nothing...fact is ul got the chit kicked out of them

Kind of like the bye week we had was the only reason we were in the game with ul.....total BS it means nothing in a rivalry game

We sure did. Just like Florida got the chit kicked out of them in the Sugar Bowl.

 

[mwatson61]

Thank god the game is at the end of the year. Both teams will have worked out the bugs by that point. It will be a closely contested game either way.

 

[Dallas-Wild]

We sure did. Just like Florida got the chit kicked out of them in the Sugar Bowl.

Just like UK beat ul 63-0 in 1922.....see how stupid speak works?

Sorry, I know you do my bad.

 

[Steelers2012]

FWIW, as far as "home field advantage" goes, in the modern series UofL holds a 8-4 edge in games played in Lexington. Meaning 2/3's of the time the game is played in CWS, UofL has won. Conversely, in games played at PJCS, UofL only holds a 5-4 edge. "Homefield" has hardly been an "advantage" in this series.

 

[johnnyrockets]

FWIW, as far as home field "advantage" goes, in the modern series UofL holds a 8-4 edge in games played in Lexington. Meaning 2/3's of the time the game is played in CWS, UofL has won.

While that's true, not sure it disproves the existence of home field advantage. Helpful but not sufficient is probably accurate.

 

[ajgcardman]

I think one thing about the game last year has been overlooked. The second half of the season UK played like a tired team due to youth, lack of depth and a tough schedIle. The week off before the Card game restored some legs. UK has more experience and odepth this year. I believe UK will benefit more than some Card fans expect.

I agree with TDCat, but will also add that I was at the game, watched it again on DVR, and watched it again breaking it down play-by-play because I love this rivalry, always have. I know what happened. We can debate "why," which is the fun part, but I know the facts. Many fans don't pay close enough attention to the game to formulate a sound breakdown, and will see it with shaded glasses. And that's fine, it should be expected on message boards, on both sides. But here's how I assess that game:

UK was finishing up its typical tough SEC schedule, so what TDCat eluded to carries merit. Their backs were against the wall playing for bowl eligibility, and they were energized and well prepared. But Louisville was coming into that game at the end of a rugged schedule as well that probably left them leg weary and banged up, especially directly out of a grinder in South Bend a week before, which was an emotional win, the season's high point. Any major college football player will tell you that everybody is virtually banged up in the last month of the season, and a bye week at that point can be a blessing. It was a perfect recipe for the Cards to throw in a bit of a clunker, and not be as sharp. But I don't want to dismiss that game as a close one solely because UL didnt show up. UL made a lot of great plays in that game, and needed to in order to escape a spirited effort by UK, who made several big plays as well.

I also believe Bolin coming in for Bonnafon had less to do with the win than an in-game adjustment made by Petrino to attack the defensive game plan of Stoops & Elliot. Specifically, UL came out much like they did the week before in South Bend, in power running sets (2-back I and double TE), and was certainly set on pounding the rock and establishing the run game. UK, on the other hand, was obviously going to place emphasis on stopping the run, creating passing down-and-distance situations, and using its strong edge rushers to create pressure. Force the true freshman QB to beat them with his arm downfield. It was a sound plan that worked early on.

However, when Bolin entered, Petrino immediately switched to shotgun, empty backfield and 5-wide. It created an immediate timeout by Stoops. Although mixing in different formations, UL primarily stayed with the wide-open shotgun attack, and Bolin went on to throw for nearly 400 yds and 3 Tds, in only 3 qtrs.

The UK defensive strategy seemed to focus mostly on double coverage shells on Parker (Yes, he was being doubled on most of those snaps, safety was just late getting there at times) with a lot of man coverage elsewhere and trying to bring pressure from those two great pass-rushers (Dupree & Smith), who were a total mismatch for the young Epps. UL burned UK on numerous occasions by the Cats not being able to stop Parker, and by LBs getting beat in man coverage by UL RBs, slot receivers & TEs when Bolin was able to get rid of ball in timely fashion and deliver some accurate passes. Conversely, UK also made some huge plays with pressure (primarily by whipping Epps & Hughley), and Bolin making a catastrophic bad read on that pick 6 just before the half after UL had seemingly taken control of the game. That was a HUGE play in the game, and resulted from Bolin reading either man-under or cover 3 and throwing a Parker slant, which wasn't there because Parker & Rogers knew the Cats were in cover 2 and ran the appropriate route.

Bottom line, Stoops is smart enough to know that to beat Petrino, you must first stop the run, beyond everything else. He also knew his biggest strength was rushing the passer in long down-and-distance situations, and he had to be able to create these situations as much as possible, to put pressure on the young QBs and turn them over. Conversely, Petrino countered that with an attempt to defeat them initially physically at the point of attack, and was unsuccessful doing it that 1st quarter, but eventually did win on numerous occasions going spread, many times empty, and forced the Cats to cover, which they didn't do very well.

Spreading it out and slinging it around, forcing the Cats to cover, was what won the game for the Cards, as well as keeping the Cats offense at bay most of the day. They were forced to do that by UK's defensive approach, which was smart due to the youth & inexperience UL had at QB. Although Bolin made some mistakes, he came through admirably with an awesome performance for a kid playing his first meaningful minutes in a cfb game.

UL made enough silly mistakes to lose that game (turnovers, missed blocks, esp. on the blocked punt when UK didn't even have punt block on, catching a 4th qtr kickoff on one knee at the three, etc), but UK couldn't score enough points with its offense despite getting awesome field position nearly every possession in the first half. Both teams dropped what would be critical ints (McWilson with 4 mins to play that "could" have secured the upset, and Gaines early on that basically resulted in a 10-point swing).

I tend to agree with Johnnyrockets....UL was clearly the better team last year, and the Vegas line confirmed that, but UK came in prepared, built an early lead, and made enough big plays to make it a virtual toss up at the end. UL survived a scare on a day when they were not at their best, and did so with big performances from both a very unexpected source (Bolin) and one that should have been expected (Parker vs challenged secondary).

Next year is a mystery because way too many questions exist, especially with the UL offense and UK defense. I call it a tepid toss up today, but check back with me in November and I'll be glad to offer a much more reasoned prediction.

 

[CardFan1130]

Just like UK beat ul 63-0 in 1922.....see how stupid speak works?

Sorry, I know you do my bad.

I think you miss the point bud. The point is, we beat an SEC power and the SEC power was "disinterested". We lose to an SEC power and it is "see, UL can't compete in the SEC either."

 

[hmt5000]

I agree with TDCat, but will also add that I was at the game, watched it again on DVR, and watched it again breaking it down play-by-play because I love this rivalry, always have. I know what happened. We can debate "why," which is the fun part, but I know the facts. Many fans don't pay close enough attention to the game to formulate a sound breakdown, and will see it with shaded glasses. And that's fine, it should be expected on message boards, on both sides. But here's how I assess that game:

UK was finishing up its typical tough SEC schedule, so what TDCat eluded to carries merit. Their backs were against the wall playing for bowl eligibility, and they were energized and well prepared. But Louisville was coming into that game at the end of a rugged schedule as well that probably left them leg weary and banged up, especially directly out of a grinder in South Bend a week before, which was an emotional win, the season's high point. Any major college football player will tell you that everybody is virtually banged up in the last month of the season, and a bye week at that point can be a blessing. It was a perfect recipe for the Cards to throw in a bit of a clunker, and not be as sharp. But I don't want to dismiss that game as a close one solely because UL didnt show up. UL made a lot of great plays in that game, and needed to in order to escape a spirited effort by UK, who made several big plays as well.

I also believe Bolin coming in for Bonnafon had less to do with the win than an in-game adjustment made by Petrino to attack the defensive game plan of Stoops & Elliot. Specifically, UL came out much like they did the week before in South Bend, in power running sets (2-back I and double TE), and was certainly set on pounding the rock and establishing the run game. UK, on the other hand, was obviously going to place emphasis on stopping the run, creating passing down-and-distance situations, and using its strong edge rushers to create pressure. Force the true freshman QB to beat them with his arm downfield. It was a sound plan that worked early on.

However, when Bolin entered, Petrino immediately switched to shotgun, empty backfield and 5-wide. It created an immediate timeout by Stoops. Although mixing in different formations, UL primarily stayed with the wide-open shotgun attack, and Bolin went on to throw for nearly 400 yds and 3 Tds, in only 3 qtrs.

The UK defensive strategy seemed to focus mostly on double coverage shells on Parker (Yes, he was being doubled on most of those snaps, safety was just late getting there at times) with a lot of man coverage elsewhere and trying to bring pressure from those two great pass-rushers (Dupree & Smith), who were a total mismatch for the young Epps. UL burned UK on numerous occasions by the Cats not being able to stop Parker, and by LBs getting beat in man coverage by UL RBs, slot receivers & TEs when Bolin was able to get rid of ball in timely fashion and deliver some accurate passes. Conversely, UK also made some huge plays with pressure (primarily by whipping Epps & Hughley), and Bolin making a catastrophic bad read on that pick 6 just before the half after UL had seemingly taken control of the game. That was a HUGE play in the game, and resulted from Bolin reading either man-under or cover 3 and throwing a Parker slant, which wasn't there because Parker & Rogers knew the Cats were in cover 2 and ran the appropriate route.

Bottom line, Stoops is smart enough to know that to beat Petrino, you must first stop the run, beyond everything else. He also knew his biggest strength was rushing the passer in long down-and-distance situations, and he had to be able to create these situations as much as possible, to put pressure on the young QBs and turn them over. Conversely, Petrino countered that with an attempt to defeat them initially physically at the point of attack, and was unsuccessful doing it that 1st quarter, but eventually did win on numerous occasions going spread, many times empty, and forced the Cats to cover, which they didn't do very well.

Spreading it out and slinging it around, forcing the Cats to cover, was what won the game for the Cards, as well as keeping the Cats offense at bay most of the day. They were forced to do that by UK's defensive approach, which was smart due to the youth & inexperience UL had at QB. Although Bolin made some mistakes, he came through admirably with an awesome performance for a kid playing his first meaningful minutes in a cfb game.

UL made enough silly mistakes to lose that game (turnovers, missed blocks, esp. on the blocked punt when UK didn't even have punt block on, catching a 4th qtr kickoff on one knee at the three, etc), but UK couldn't score enough points with its offense despite getting awesome field position nearly every possession in the first half. Both teams dropped what would be critical ints (McWilson with 4 mins to play that "could" have secured the upset, and Gaines early on that basically resulted in a 10-point swing).

I tend to agree with Johnnyrockets....UL was clearly the better team last year, and the Vegas line confirmed that, but UK came in prepared, built an early lead, and made enough big plays to make it a virtual toss up at the end. UL survived a scare on a day when they were not at their best, and did so with big performances from both a very unexpected source (Bolin) and one that should have been expected (Parker vs challenged secondary).

Next year is a mystery because way too many questions exist, especially with the UL offense and UK defense. I call it a tepid toss up today, but check back with me in November and I'll be glad to offer a much more reasoned prediction.

i think UK fans would like to add that we felt the offensive play calling on our side got extremely conservative late into the game and took a lot of pressure off your D. we went away from some of the things that were working moreso than being stopped cold.

 

[ajgcardman]

While that's true, not sure it disproves the existence of home field advantage. Helpful but not sufficient is probably accurate.

What I've noticed in this series is that regardless of where the game is played, the best team that season wins the game. The one exception being in 1994.

The UK "upset" wins in 2002 & 2007, and the UL "upset" win in 2011, were far from upsets after the seasons played out. They were really bad lines early in the season. Louisville has won 8 of 12 at CWS, and UK nearly half those at PJCS, not because they play better on the road, or because home field doesnt matter, but because they were better teams in those years (again, with the primary exception of '94).

 

[CatsFanGG24]

I agree with TDCat, but will also add that I was at the game, watched it again on DVR, and watched it again breaking it down play-by-play because I love this rivalry, always have. I know what happened. We can debate "why," which is the fun part, but I know the facts. Many fans don't pay close enough attention to the game to formulate a sound breakdown, and will see it with shaded glasses. And that's fine, it should be expected on message boards, on both sides. But here's how I assess that game:

UK was finishing up its typical tough SEC schedule, so what TDCat eluded to carries merit. Their backs were against the wall playing for bowl eligibility, and they were energized and well prepared. But Louisville was coming into that game at the end of a rugged schedule as well that probably left them leg weary and banged up, especially directly out of a grinder in South Bend a week before, which was an emotional win, the season's high point. Any major college football player will tell you that everybody is virtually banged up in the last month of the season, and a bye week at that point can be a blessing. It was a perfect recipe for the Cards to throw in a bit of a clunker, and not be as sharp. But I don't want to dismiss that game as a close one solely because UL didnt show up. UL made a lot of great plays in that game, and needed to in order to escape a spirited effort by UK, who made several big plays as well.

I also believe Bolin coming in for Bonnafon had less to do with the win than an in-game adjustment made by Petrino to attack the defensive game plan of Stoops & Elliot. Specifically, UL came out much like they did the week before in South Bend, in power running sets (2-back I and double TE), and was certainly set on pounding the rock and establishing the run game. UK, on the other hand, was obviously going to place emphasis on stopping the run, creating passing down-and-distance situations, and using its strong edge rushers to create pressure. Force the true freshman QB to beat them with his arm downfield. It was a sound plan that worked early on.

However, when Bolin entered, Petrino immediately switched to shotgun, empty backfield and 5-wide. It created an immediate timeout by Stoops. Although mixing in different formations, UL primarily stayed with the wide-open shotgun attack, and Bolin went on to throw for nearly 400 yds and 3 Tds, in only 3 qtrs.

The UK defensive strategy seemed to focus mostly on double coverage shells on Parker (Yes, he was being doubled on most of those snaps, safety was just late getting there at times) with a lot of man coverage elsewhere and trying to bring pressure from those two great pass-rushers (Dupree & Smith), who were a total mismatch for the young Epps. UL burned UK on numerous occasions by the Cats not being able to stop Parker, and by LBs getting beat in man coverage by UL RBs, slot receivers & TEs when Bolin was able to get rid of ball in timely fashion and deliver some accurate passes. Conversely, UK also made some huge plays with pressure (primarily by whipping Epps & Hughley), and Bolin making a catastrophic bad read on that pick 6 just before the half after UL had seemingly taken control of the game. That was a HUGE play in the game, and resulted from Bolin reading either man-under or cover 3 and throwing a Parker slant, which wasn't there because Parker & Rogers knew the Cats were in cover 2 and ran the appropriate route.

Bottom line, Stoops is smart enough to know that to beat Petrino, you must first stop the run, beyond everything else. He also knew his biggest strength was rushing the passer in long down-and-distance situations, and he had to be able to create these situations as much as possible, to put pressure on the young QBs and turn them over. Conversely, Petrino countered that with an attempt to defeat them initially physically at the point of attack, and was unsuccessful doing it that 1st quarter, but eventually did win on numerous occasions going spread, many times empty, and forced the Cats to cover, which they didn't do very well.

Spreading it out and slinging it around, forcing the Cats to cover, was what won the game for the Cards, as well as keeping the Cats offense at bay most of the day. They were forced to do that by UK's defensive approach, which was smart due to the youth & inexperience UL had at QB. Although Bolin made some mistakes, he came through admirably with an awesome performance for a kid playing his first meaningful minutes in a cfb game.

UL made enough silly mistakes to lose that game (turnovers, missed blocks, esp. on the blocked punt when UK didn't even have punt block on, catching a 4th qtr kickoff on one knee at the three, etc), but UK couldn't score enough points with its offense despite getting awesome field position nearly every possession in the first half. Both teams dropped what would be critical ints (McWilson with 4 mins to play that "could" have secured the upset, and Gaines early on that basically resulted in a 10-point swing).

I tend to agree with Johnnyrockets....UL was clearly the better team last year, and the Vegas line confirmed that, but UK came in prepared, built an early lead, and made enough big plays to make it a virtual toss up at the end. UL survived a scare on a day when they were not at their best, and did so with big performances from both a very unexpected source (Bolin) and one that should have been expected (Parker vs challenged secondary).

Next year is a mystery because way too many questions exist, especially with the UL offense and UK defense. I call it a tepid toss up today, but check back with me in November and I'll be glad to offer a much more reasoned prediction.

I agree with a bunch, except for the UL not at their best part....basically in that game we saw the same UL team that you did all year...a struggling offense with big play potential and a solid defense...with UK, you also saw the same UK team you did all year...defense with the ability to force turnovers but really struggles in the secondary and a struggling offense with one or 2 guys who can makes plays by themselves.

The single largest play in the game was the 40 or so yard pass to Quick from Bolin (in the EZ on 3rd and long)...UL simply made the plays they had to to win, chuck it up to one of the best WRs in college football.

Next season, UL doesn't have that luxury. They also lose a ton of huge playmaking ability from Mauldin, Holliman, Gaines and the guy who I think was the best all around player in the secondary in Samples.

UK will have to make up for huge losses from Dupree and Smith.

Both teams (IMO) have huge question marks still at QB - and I think this games spread will be smaller than a TD and I think either team could end up being favored in NOV.

 

[The Public Enemy]

What I've noticed in this series is that regardless of where the game is played, the best team that season wins the game. The one exception being in 1994.

The UK "upset" wins in 2002 & 2007, and the UL "upset" win in 2011, were far from upsets after the seasons played out. They were really bad lines early in the season. Louisville has won 8 of 12 at CWS, and UK nearly half those at PJCS, not because they play better on the road, or because home field doesnt matter, but because they were better teams in those years (again, with the primary exception of '94).

Very valid points especially in Kentucky case in 2002 with Ragone getting destroyed in Papa John's and in 2011 with the Teddy Bridgewater/DeVante Parker coming out Party.

 

[The Public Enemy]

I agree with a bunch, except for the UL not at their best part....basically in that game we saw the same UL team that you did all year...a struggling offense with big play potential and a solid defense...with UK, you also saw the same UK team you did all year...defense with the ability to force turnovers but really struggles in the secondary and a struggling offense with one or 2 guys who can makes plays by themselves.

The single largest play in the game was the 40 or so yard pass to Quick from Bolin (in the EZ on 3rd and long)...UL simply made the plays they had to to win, chuck it up to one of the best WRs in college football.

Next season, UL doesn't have that luxury. They also lose a ton of huge playmaking ability from Mauldin, Holliman, Gaines and the guy who I think was the best all around player in the secondary in Samples.

UK will have to make up for huge losses from Dupree and Smith.

Both teams (IMO) have huge question marks still at QB - and I think this games spread will be smaller than a TD and I think either team could end up being favored in NOV.

Well to be fair it does appear Louisville has the replacement for Mauldin in Former TCU Star DeVonte Fields-(Big XII 2012 DPOY/2014 Preseason DPOY) and for Sample in Josh Harvey-Clemons and I like Jermaine Reves & Chucky Williams at Safety..for the Defense it is replacing Gaines and Terrell Floyd on the Corner...it will likely be a pair of Freshmen/Sophomores in Trumaine Washington, Jaire Alexander, Cornelius Sturghill and Shaq Wiggins.

 

[CatsFanGG24]

Well to be fair it does appear Louisville has the replacement for Mauldin in DeVonte Fields-(Big XII 2012 DPOY/2014 Preseason DPOY) and for Sample in Josh Harvey-Clemons and I like Jermaine Reves & Chucky Williams at Safety..for the Defense it is replacing Gaines and Terrell Floyd on the Corner...it will likely be a pair of Freshmen/Sophomores in Trumaine Washington, Jaire Alexander, Cornelius Sturghill and Shaq Wiggins.

Players transfer for a reason...either weren't where they'd like to be on the depth chart or are trouble/character issues. I will rely on a transfer for possible depth until they prove their worth again.

Here is the last thing I read about Fields:
“On Saturday, Fields hardly looked like a potential first-rounder, let alone a college star,” the story said. “He jogged on many plays, stood and watched passes downfield, and even got pancaked by an undersized left tackle. Fields spent most of halftime standing outside the locker room, briefly killing ants climbing on his cleats. He stood a few feet away from a tented concession stand in the stadium’s south end zone where conies, sausage-on-a-stick and Frito pies were in high demand.

“Fields’ play didn’t get any better after halftime and he admitted it was ‘somewhat’ hard to remain motivated. ‘That’s not really an excuse,’ Fields said. ‘Just being lazy.’”

Harvey Clemons has potential for sure, but also heard he may be a step slow at S to be a total stud. I think it is pretty unfair to Mauldin and Holliman/Samples to say you already have their replacements like they wont miss a beat...Fields will not be as smart or the leader that Mauldin was, and Harvey Clemons will have to be fantastic to come close to the production of either Holliman or Samples.

 

[ajgcardman]

i think UK fans would like to add that we felt the offensive play calling on our side got extremely conservative late into the game and took a lot of pressure off your D. we went away from some of the things that were working moreso than being stopped cold.

I want to be clear....I never said anything about "being stopped cold," those are your words. I said your offense didn't score enough to win, despite some very favorable field position in the first half. A good offense would have had UL down 17 or 21 to nothing in that 1st qtr, instead of 6-0. JMO.

The Cats executed some really nice plays, mostly in the 2nd half, including three in a row on that last touchdown drive. But prior to that drive, they did very little all afternoon, except for two well-blocked rushes by Boom on the edge, and a well-thrown long down-field pass to Herrick who beat man coverage from a LB. They did virtually nothing on 80-85% of their offensive snaps. Had they, the Cards would not have won.

On that last drive, the Cats ran a quick screen and a few QB runs because the Cards were in obvious 2 and 3-deep coverages that Pat could clearly see. They weren't going to let Towles beat them deep, and throwing deep into it probably ends the game. That last int to Holiman that sealed it was not an inaccurate throw like many think, it was a bad read by your QB. Herrick correctly broke his route into a post against a 2 deep coverage, but Pat threw the seam route there not picking up Holiman's drop into 2-deep coverage. Holiman showed something else there pre-snap, and fooled the young QB into making a crucial mistake.

But in defense of Pat, it was 4th and long at that point and he was just trying to make a play.

 

[The Public Enemy]

Loved Samples game...and he was the Best DB last year...but luckily for Louisville Clemons was there all last year and by most accounts was one of the most talented players on the roster...but you are correct time will tell starting against Auburn.

As for Fields...his production at TCU speaks for itself..didn't see him at his JuCo but he was a Beast for Gary Patterson and the Horned Frogs...not going to speak on the Off Field issues but as of right now he is cleared of them. But when you're a All League Caliber player at a Strong P5 League and one of the best pass rushers in College Football that does speak volumns...really right now he is the College Version of Greg Hardy...if he doesn't perform then Keith Brown-(Former Starter and Former Army All American), Nick Dawson-(Former Army All American), Stacy Thomas-(Former 4* Player) and Trevon Young will need to play to their HS Rep...it took Holliman 3 years to play to his HS rep as well...Remember Holliman could not beat out Calvin Pryor/Terrell Floyd and only started one year...but it was a spectacular season.

 

[CatsFanGG24]

Pryor was a 1st round pick and early NFL starter...Holliman was a 7th rounder (but had 14 picks - hard to duplicate that production)

 

[ajgcardman]

Players transfer for a reason...either weren't where they'd like to be on the depth chart or are trouble/character issues. I will rely on a transfer for possible depth until they prove their worth again.

Here is the last thing I read about Fields:
“On Saturday, Fields hardly looked like a potential first-rounder, let alone a college star,” the story said. “He jogged on many plays, stood and watched passes downfield, and even got pancaked by an undersized left tackle. Fields spent most of halftime standing outside the locker room, briefly killing ants climbing on his cleats. He stood a few feet away from a tented concession stand in the stadium’s south end zone where conies, sausage-on-a-stick and Frito pies were in high demand.

“Fields’ play didn’t get any better after halftime and he admitted it was ‘somewhat’ hard to remain motivated. ‘That’s not really an excuse,’ Fields said. ‘Just being lazy.’”

Harvey Clemons has potential for sure, but also heard he may be a step slow at S to be a total stud. I think it is pretty unfair to Mauldin and Holliman/Samples to say you already have their replacements like they wont miss a beat...Fields will not be as smart or the leader that Mauldin was, and Harvey Clemons will have to be fantastic to come close to the production of either Holliman or Samples.

GG,

I agree with you that it is probably unfair for PE to say those players have already been replaced. Fields has some alleged issues in his past, and isn't even on campus yet. I disagree with all of Grumpy's assessment of the ex-Dawgs. JHC is a legitimate talent, and I'm sure he knows it. He will likely be a high-end draft pick if he stays off the weed....which is what worries me. He would be 1st class stupid to go back there with his future at stake, but that seems to happen more often than not with kids these days.

And re: Fields and that article about his juco game, consider the source, consider the time (right after his TCU dismissal), and consider the kid's freshman season in the B12. His talent isn't in question, but whether he can come in, go to class, and stay out of trouble is. And like JHC, if he can, he has a future in football. But I agree with you, way too early to say that those two spots have been filled.

 

[The Public Enemy]

GG,

I agree with you that it is probably unfair for PE to say those players have already been replaced. Fields has some alleged issues in his past, and isn't even on campus yet. I disagree with all of Grumpy's assessment of the ex-Dawgs. JHC is a legitimate talent, and I'm sure he knows it. He will likely be a high-end draft pick if he stays off the weed....which is what worries me. He would be 1st class stupid to go back there with his future at stake, but that seems to happen more often than not with kids these days.

And re: Fields and that article about his juco game, consider the source, consider the time (right after his TCU dismissal), and consider the kid's freshman season in the B12. His talent isn't in question, but whether he can come in, go to class, and stay out of trouble is. And like JHC, if he can, he has a future in football. But I agree with you, way too early to say that those two spots have been filled.

In regards to Mauldin was talking more about Fields On Field Production at TCU...If he does half of what he did at TCU his Freshmen year UofL will have a heck of a player coming off the edge..but you both are correct and I misspoke as Mauldin leadership will be tough to replace...if Fields wants to play on Sunday's he know what he needs to do and that is stay clean. If Fields can't do it then the Former USA Army All Americans-(Dawson/Brown) and Former 4* Stacy Thomas along with Trevon Young would need to step up much like Deiontrez Mount did this past year and it paid off for the now Tennessee Titan.

To be Fair to Grumpy he always spoke high of JHC...it is Shaq Wiggins that he questions the Talent Level/Game Speed.

 

[The Public Enemy]

Pryor was a 1st round pick and early NFL starter...Holliman was a 7th rounder (but had 14 picks - hard to duplicate that production)

Sample was Pryor replacement...they moved Holliman to Terrell Floyd 2013 Spot and put Andrew Johnson at the Nickle with Floyd going to the opposite Corner to Gaines...what really secured Holliman starting this past year was Reves injury.

 

[ajgcardman]

I agree with a bunch, except for the UL not at their best part....basically in that game we saw the same UL team that you did all year...a struggling offense with big play potential and a solid defense...with UK, you also saw the same UK team you did all year...defense with the ability to force turnovers but really struggles in the secondary and a struggling offense with one or 2 guys who can makes plays by themselves.

The single largest play in the game was the 40 or so yard pass to Quick from Bolin (in the EZ on 3rd and long)...UL simply made the plays they had to to win, chuck it up to one of the best WRs in college football.

Next season, UL doesn't have that luxury. They also lose a ton of huge playmaking ability from Mauldin, Holliman, Gaines and the guy who I think was the best all around player in the secondary in Samples.

UK will have to make up for huge losses from Dupree and Smith.

Both teams (IMO) have huge question marks still at QB - and I think this games spread will be smaller than a TD and I think either team could end up being favored in NOV.

Agree with this post, GG. But remember, what made Quick's play so big was that UL was pinned inside its 5.....because of a stupid mistake by a true freshman who caught the kickoff on one knee. That series was the epitome of the afternoon....UL mistake creates big opportunity for UK, but bails itself out with a clutch play. Your secondary was ate up in that cover 2 all day because your corners had trouble keeping up, and the safeties were slow to rotate. And Bolin did an excellent job standing tall and getting rid of the ball, although Dupree & Smith got to him a couple times.

The fact Bolin was able to execute like he did in what was his first meaningful game action, says volumes about him and his future. Watching him struggle to replicate that in the bowl game against a good secondary doesn't say much about "your" secondary. That has to be fixed. But everybody that follows UK knows that.

 

[Grumpyolddawg]

GG,

I agree with you that it is probably unfair for PE to say those players have already been replaced. Fields has some alleged issues in his past, and isn't even on campus yet. I disagree with all of Grumpy's assessment of the ex-Dawgs. JHC is a legitimate talent, and I'm sure he knows it. He will likely be a high-end draft pick if he stays off the weed....which is what worries me. He would be 1st class stupid to go back there with his future at stake, but that seems to happen more often than not with kids these days.

And re: Fields and that article about his juco game, consider the source, consider the time (right after his TCU dismissal), and consider the kid's freshman season in the B12. His talent isn't in question, but whether he can come in, go to class, and stay out of trouble is. And like JHC, if he can, he has a future in football. But I agree with you, way too early to say that those two spots have been filled.

You are not reading my post, I have said multiple times JHC was a good player and I hated to see him leave I did say he was a bit of a tweener at UGA because he was too light to play OLB and a tad slow at S, but he was very good at the nickle position and better than serviceable at the S position. As best I can remember he was never arrested for anything in Athens, he isn't a bad guy, he just couldn't stay away from certain things, failed too many drug test and was sent packing. But Wiggins on the other hand, before he signed with us, after watching him play a couple of games in HS, I was hoping he would flip to somebody, anybody but he didn't. Yes, he started some, after a couple of injuries and a couple more getting in the doghouse. His play at corner was what I expected it to be, bad. He did have a pick 6 on a WR screen when both WR thought the other was catching the ball and he ran about 25 yards for a TD. He isn't a bad kid either, arrested once for driving without a license I think it was. Apparently Pruitt saw him like I did, told him he would never play another snap at CB at UGA and he left. Little guys like Shaq better be lightening quick and fast, he isn't either. So I think you will be glad to have JHC and be wondering why you took Wiggins before season ends.

 

[hmt5000]

GG,

I agree with you that it is probably unfair for PE to say those players have already been replaced. Fields has some alleged issues in his past, and isn't even on campus yet. I disagree with all of Grumpy's assessment of the ex-Dawgs. JHC is a legitimate talent, and I'm sure he knows it. He will likely be a high-end draft pick if he stays off the weed....which is what worries me. He would be 1st class stupid to go back there with his future at stake, but that seems to happen more often than not with kids these days.

And re: Fields and that article about his juco game, consider the source, consider the time (right after his TCU dismissal), and consider the kid's freshman season in the B12. His talent isn't in question, but whether he can come in, go to class, and stay out of trouble is. And like JHC, if he can, he has a future in football. But I agree with you, way too early to say that those two spots have been filled.

i dont believe they are "alleged" issues. im pretty sure he admitted to beating his girlfriend and im pretty sure that the whole tcu coaching staff was trying to figure out why the 2012 dpoy didn't play up to snuff in '13 (realize he had injuries but leading up to that the staff seemed perplexed by his attitude). so im not sure it's just one thing... the tcu staff was kinda quick to dismiss him for some reason and i would agree that i would wait until midseason before i counted him as "has arrived" or "bust".

 

[WildCard]

What I've noticed in this series is that regardless of where the game is played, the best team that season wins the game. The one exception being in 1994.

The UK "upset" wins in 2002 & 2007, and the UL "upset" win in 2011, were far from upsets after the seasons played out. They were really bad lines early in the season. Louisville has won 8 of 12 at CWS, and UK nearly half those at PJCS, not because they play better on the road, or because home field doesnt matter, but because they were better teams in those years (again, with the primary exception of '94).

Totally agree with this. Game spreads are a "snapshot" of how things stand between two opponents on that particular weekend of the season (and until this year, it was always an early game). However, end of season results sometimes paint a different picture of "which team was really better".

FWIW, over the past 15 games (as far back as I could easily check) UofL has been the favorite 10 times and has a 10-5 record. However they are only 7-8 ATS. Cards are 73 as the FAV and 3-2 as the 'Dawg.

While I have watched the replay only once I will add that ajg's game synopsis seems pretty accurate to me. I am still a bit stunned that there are some who fail to acknowledge the impact of UofL's 5 MAJOR miscues (2 picks, 2 fumble and a blocked punt) in determining the final score. As I have said many times the Cards were lucky to pull it out with that degree of offensive ineptitude. Two of those mistakes directly put 14 points on the board for the Cats and two others set up short field scores.

Those were opportunistic, but randomly fortuitous plays, that can change the course and often the outcome of a game. I am reminded of UK's 27-2 drubbing of UofL in 2008 (interesting the Cards were a 3 point FAV that game). The Cats had 2 fumble return TDs plus a 7 yard scoring "drive" after a pick, one of 5 Louisville TOs in that game. The Cats won by 25 points while out gaining the Cards by 5 yards, 210 yards total offense to 205 yards. Cats were the better team that year but that game illustrates how TOs usually destroy a spread, one way or the other. Same thing sorta happened this year but the Cards were just good enough to survive.

More importantly, what happened last year has little to do with what happens this year. As I have said before I think the Cards take a step back and the Cats take a step forward but I'm certainly not making any outcome predictions this early. the only thing I am "sure" of is that both fan bases are underestimating their rival.

Peace

 

[CatsFanGG24]

Will never for the life of me understand UL fans talking about these turnovers like UK didn't have a defense on the field...

2 INTs from targeting 1 WR probably 80% of the time...sorry, that's not a fluke, that's the gamble you all took dropping deep and targeting Parker over and over. That's like me saying all the TD passes we gave up to Parker were major miscues, and without those man UL would've gotten blown out. DUMB

2 Fumbles - both from our DE Dupree who had UL OL outmatched all day...leave a TE in, double him, don't go 5 wide etc...another gamble you took...paid off on some of the passing plays, on the fumbles obviously not.

The punt block...1st, your punter is awful...he wouldn't have flipped the field anyways...2nd, you were punting - so we were getting the ball anyways since we held you to 4 yards on the first 3 plays...3rd, it was returned to the 33 yard line...if your defense holds UK to nothing, you have a 50 yard FG attempt...anything but automatic.


I am still a bit stunned that there are some who fail to acknowledge the impact of UKs 3 MAJOR miscues covering Parker(3 30+ yard TDs) in determining the final score.

See How STUPID that sounds?

OH, and for the record - Towles had TWO (2) fourth quarter INTs...one returned to the UK 27, the other the seal the game and returned to the UK 2 (where Petrino tried to score again but was shut down).

Quit crying over a minus 2 turnover margin and learn ball security.

 

[Steelers2012]

Will never for the life of me understand UL fans talking about these turnovers like UK didn't have a defense on the field...

2 INTs from targeting 1 WR probably 80% of the time...sorry, that's not a fluke, that's the gamble you all took dropping deep and targeting Parker over and over. That's like me saying all the TD passes we gave up to Parker were major miscues, and without those man UL would've gotten blown out. DUMB.

16 of UofL's 22 total pass completions went to receivers other than Parker. That 73% of our pass completions targeted someone OTHER THAN PARKER. Just so happens Parker turned those 6 completions into 180 yards and 3 TDs. Yeah...I know you said "targeting" Parker 80% of the time. Even "IF" ALL the other 13 incompletes thrown in the game were "targeting" Parker (not even close, but "if"), that would only be 54% of passes targeting Parker. That statement was nowhere near smart or accurate.

 

[CatsFanGG24]

And look deeper into the season turnovers/turnovers forced and things played out predictably.

UK forced 25 fumbles and recovered 8 on the year (2 vs UL)
UK was forced into 20 fumbles but only lost 4 on the year (0 vs UL)

UL only had 4 fumble recoveries on the year (0 vs UK)
UL was forced into 25 fumbles, losing 16 ( 2vs UK)

UKs defense had a decent 15 INTs on the year (2 vs UL)
UL threw a limited 10 INTs on the year (2 vs UK)

ULs defense had a great 25 INTs on the year (2 vs UK)
UK limited the INTs to 11 on the year (2 vs UL)

And these numbers are 12 games vs 13 games.

 

[CatsFanGG24]

16 of UofL's 22 total pass completions went to receivers other than Parker. That 73% of our pass completions targeted someone OTHER THAN PARKER. Just so happens Parker turned those 6 completions into 180 yards and 3 TDs. Yeah...I know you said "targeting" Parker 80% of the time. Even "IF" ALL the other 13 incompletes thrown in the game were "targeting" Parker (not even close, but "if"), that would only be 54% of passes targeting Parker. That statement was nowhere near smart or accurate.

Looking deep and getting sacked wouldn't count in those numbers would it? Check downs wouldn't count, would they?

Maybe I should've left it to 80% of deep balls and go routes...but the point is the same, he was the option that Bolin and Bonnafon wanted to go to in 3 turnovers and likely multiple sacks and check downs. He was also the difference in the game because they kept going to him.

Great rebuttal though. You really showed me