I wonder if y'all would support French aid and support in 1778? After all, we need to put that money toward issues in the colonies...
The Ukraine war. (Yes, we'll mind our manners)
- Thread starter BigBlueFanGA
- Start date
So these are the times when I marvel at how few people understand actual history.
The facts are, the french sent actual troops, ammo, food, and naval support to the colonies. Much like how america is sending bullets, ammo, and weapons to Ukraine. Please enlighten us on your historical intellect.
Lol. When's that escalation coming? First it was don't send tanks, Putin will use nukes. Then it was don't send Long range missiles, they'll use nukes, then it was don't send cluster bombs, they'll use nukes.
Nearly 850,000 troops What a great historical example.
Nearly 850,000 troops in 4-5 weeks landed in Normandy (small area) to push back the Nazis. Great comparison. Ukraine maybe has 200 - 250K troops spread out over multiple fronts in Ukraine with many in Europe for training, in an area the size of Texas.
Try again.
What happened to France because of this, perfesser?
You have unwittingly (surprise!) made the precise point we’ve been making for months. Congrats.
Try again? That’s the point! How is Ukraine going to dislodge a superior enemy when it was a struggle for us to dislodge a weaker opponent? With massive destruction to boot?
Glad you understand the concept of escalation. It took many months in this thread but you seem to grasp it.
Now that you’ve explained to yourself where escalation leads, the obvious questions remain: how does Ukraine win? Why are we prolonging the inevitable, at tremendous cost?
Nobody here seems to be willing to answer.
Your historical war analogies are nonsensical. Again, as has been repeatedly pointed out, Ukraine has taken back over 50% of their territory that was occupied by the invaders since Feb 22’. You seem to either not know that or dismiss it for whatever reason. Do you really think Russian morale is high? Do you think Putin begging a fat third-world dictator for weapons (and maybe more) is a sign of battlefield success?
That 50% number means zilch. The other 50% is what this is about. You know that. Russia drove far enough into Ukraine to set up lines of defense that correspond with the territories they mean to annex.
I’m not alone in doubting Ukrainian success in taking that territory. Our own intelligence services have said as much. Again, you know this.
As for North Korea: I think it’s a bad sign. I’ve said since day one that it’s the unintended consequences of war that are as dangerous as war itself, perhaps moreso.
No, you said that they have no hope of advancing. And then when told of Ukraine battlefield successes you spin to ''well its about what Russia currently holds'' Like they held Kharkiv and Kherson? What about Avdiivka?
Ukraine wins by capturing Mariupol. Creating a land bridge splitting the Russians in two.
If don't know what you're talking about just say that.
That’s right, I said they have no hope. And I mean no hope of dislodging the Russians, taking all their territory back, however you’d like to phrase it. When you try to dispute that with tales of single towns being captured on the front lines, it makes me and anybody else with a brain wonder: how long do you think it will take at that rate? How long do you expect us to support a bloodbath that has no bearing on anything that matters to us?
Lol. Ukraine is proving that Russian aggression wont be tolerated. And is showing China that a war against Taiwan wont be so easy. But sure, no bearing.
False to R achieving control of the territories they want. Outside Crimea, they do not fully control the provinces/regions/whatever they bogusly annexed. Besides, why would they be attempting to control more territory if they already have what they wanted?
The unintended consequences of non-war are as dangerous, if not moreso, than war. See Crimea & Donbas control in 2014 that was not contested to a large degree. What happened after that?
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They already have what they need bro. Oh the 2022 winter offensive? uhhh, Putin was just trolling.
All well and good but again, what are the conditions for it ending?
You're hilarious. Why the F are they still attacking if they supposedly have what they need? Oh yea, what you think they think they need and what they want are far, far different. But keep deluding yourself.
I can personally vouch for story below. Thermal sights are a game-changer.
www.businessinsider.com
Ukrainian soldier says US-made Bradley fighting vehicles are 'priceless' in nighttime assaults, offering visibility better than in daylight
Kyiv's troops praised the Bradley infantry fighting vehicles for keeping them alive when faced with incoming Russian fire and minefields.
www.businessinsider.com
Fair enough. But you may be overestimating the effectiveness of those “lines of defense.” Problem is Russia doesn’t have the manpower to prevent a breakthrough on those vast lines that cover a massive area, and now the Russians don’t have an artillery advantage.
Until this article, I had understood that Musk had turned off Starlink across the board to Ukraine. Here I find out he's not authorized by Biden to turn it on- never was on - near Crimea and hasn't turned it off elsewhere.
"Sen. Elizabeth Warren is demanding an investigation of Elon Musk and SpaceX’s Starlink satellite network. She wants to know why he refused the Ukrainian military’s demand that he turn on Starlink over a blacked-out portion of the Black Sea near Russian-controlled Crimea to guide a submarine drone attack on Russian ships."
".... Mr. Musk said complying with the Ukrainian request would have violated American sanctions against Russia: “We’re not allowed to actually turn on connectivity to [Russian-controlled Crimea] without explicit government approval. So, we did not have the U.S. government . . . and then we basically figured out that this was kind of like a Pearl Harbor attack on the Russian fleet at Sevastopol. So what they’re really asking us for is to actually take part in a major act of war.”
He added: “And, you know, while we certainly have huge support for the Ukraine government, (good to know) the Ukrainian government is not in charge of U.S. people or companies. That’s not how it works.”
The old cliché about no good deed going unpunished applies. Starlink, a privately owned network, has provided $100 million in free service to Ukraine since the war began, letting the country defend itself and re-establish communications destroyed by hundreds of Russian missiles.
What’s more, Mr. Musk says he would have complied if President Biden ordered him to turn on his privately owned network for Ukraine: “While I’m not President Biden’s biggest fan, if I had received a presidential directive to turn it on, I would have done so. Because I do regard the president as the chief executive officer of the country. Whether I want that person to be president or not, I still respect the office.”
Net, Musk still provides Starlink service to Ukraine - never turned it off - but not to war areas controlled by Russia. True American Patriot.
www.wsj.com
"Sen. Elizabeth Warren is demanding an investigation of Elon Musk and SpaceX’s Starlink satellite network. She wants to know why he refused the Ukrainian military’s demand that he turn on Starlink over a blacked-out portion of the Black Sea near Russian-controlled Crimea to guide a submarine drone attack on Russian ships."
".... Mr. Musk said complying with the Ukrainian request would have violated American sanctions against Russia: “We’re not allowed to actually turn on connectivity to [Russian-controlled Crimea] without explicit government approval. So, we did not have the U.S. government . . . and then we basically figured out that this was kind of like a Pearl Harbor attack on the Russian fleet at Sevastopol. So what they’re really asking us for is to actually take part in a major act of war.”
He added: “And, you know, while we certainly have huge support for the Ukraine government, (good to know) the Ukrainian government is not in charge of U.S. people or companies. That’s not how it works.”
The old cliché about no good deed going unpunished applies. Starlink, a privately owned network, has provided $100 million in free service to Ukraine since the war began, letting the country defend itself and re-establish communications destroyed by hundreds of Russian missiles.
What’s more, Mr. Musk says he would have complied if President Biden ordered him to turn on his privately owned network for Ukraine: “While I’m not President Biden’s biggest fan, if I had received a presidential directive to turn it on, I would have done so. Because I do regard the president as the chief executive officer of the country. Whether I want that person to be president or not, I still respect the office.”
Net, Musk still provides Starlink service to Ukraine - never turned it off - but not to war areas controlled by Russia. True American Patriot.
Opinion | Elizabeth Warren Owes Musk an Apology
His denial of Starlink service in Crimea was consistent with U.S. sanctions on Russia.
www.wsj.com
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Yep, the hero of the left(Musk) is now the new Trump of the right, to Dems.Until this article, I had understood that Musk had turned off Starlink across the board to Ukraine. Here I find out he's not authroized by Biden to turn it on- never was on - near Crimea and hasn't turned it off elsewhere.
"Sen. Elizabeth Warren is demanding an investigation of Elon Musk and SpaceX’s Starlink satellite network. She wants to know why he refused the Ukrainian military’s demand that he turn on Starlink over a blacked-out portion of the Black Sea near Russian-controlled Crimea to guide a submarine drone attack on Russian ships."
".... Mr. Musk said complying with the Ukrainian request would have violated American sanctions against Russia: “We’re not allowed to actually turn on connectivity to [Russian-controlled Crimea] without explicit government approval. So, we did not have the U.S. government . . . and then we basically figured out that this was kind of like a Pearl Harbor attack on the Russian fleet at Sevastopol. So what they’re really asking us for is to actually take part in a major act of war.”
He added: “And, you know, while we certainly have huge support for the Ukraine government, (good to know) the Ukrainian government is not in charge of U.S. people or companies. That’s not how it works.”
The old cliché about no good deed going unpunished applies. Starlink, a privately owned network, has provided $100 million in free service to Ukraine since the war began, letting the country defend itself and re-establish communications destroyed by hundreds of Russian missiles.
What’s more, Mr. Musk says he would have complied if President Biden ordered him to turn on his privately owned network for Ukraine: “While I’m not President Biden’s biggest fan, if I had received a presidential directive to turn it on, I would have done so. Because I do regard the president as the chief executive officer of the country. Whether I want that person to be president or not, I still respect the office.”
Net, Musk still provides Starlink service to Ukriane - never turned it off - but not to war areas controlled by Russia. True American Patriot.
Opinion | Elizabeth Warren Owes Musk an Apology
His denial of Starlink service in Crimea was consistent with U.S. sanctions on Russia.
More like Poland doesn't have massive stocks of high dollar equipment sitting around like the US and other European countries. Poland is dying for Russia to try and invade them. They've made it clear they will end Russia.
If you don’t know how that turned out for the French then you need to go do your own homework. I’ll give you a hint: it ended with guillotines and Napoleon.
Folks, I've been doing something thinking and would like to update my stance. After tonight's traffic fustercluck on my evening commute due to Zelensky's state visit, screw Ukraine, and go Russia.
It's one thing to fight for your country's self-determination and to resist genocide, but it's quite another to inconvenience me personally.
It's one thing to fight for your country's self-determination and to resist genocide, but it's quite another to inconvenience me personally.
I'm eating bread and water for supper right now. Due to all the government's money going toward Ukraine. I have no money in my check left over for food.
You can’t get these gullible souls to comprehend that they are being being used for something that doesn’t impact them. You certainly can’t get them to admit they’re wrong.
Up to 150 billion or so (who really knows?) with no hope of victory in sight (as explained many months ago). While here at home, Rome burns: border out of control, crime out of control, deficits out of control.
Folks, sometimes the bad guys win.
Yep, the money laundry that is the Ukraine continues. People still think the Ukraine is actually winning. The only ones winning are the dems, some Rhinos, and Zelensky. Pocketbooks keep getting fatter. Thanks mean Joe!
Backing us was only part of the issues going on in France. At any rate, that isn't even the point.
