POLITICAL THREAD

[Phil_The_Music]

Great post Phil.

Justin Amash is a rockstar.

Thanks Willy. I follow him on facebook. I love how he goes into detail about why he votes a certain way on every vote. You can tell that our freedoms and rights is his number one priority. He's the kind of guy that could restore my faith a little in politicians.

 

[KingOfBBN]

Great post Phil.

Justin Amash is a rockstar.

You mentioned it to me last week, this is the type of guy needed for a VP candidate. You need that personality especially when you're going against some crotchety sack of shit like Hillary.

To be honest, I'm going to be disgusted with all of the so-called Republicans, conservatives and "Christians" if they take their ball and stay home in November, which will inevitably give us Hillary. That cannot happen. This country cannot survive that. I don't care if you don't necessarily like the Republican nom for this year, the consequences of a Trump/Rubio presidency are nowhere near as bad as what will happen with Hillary.

Basically the existence of the party is dependent upon this year's election. If the conservatives lose this- it's over for good. Supreme Court, a flooding of more illegals, the PC culture being even more out of control, bigger government- all will come with no end in sight.

 

[Willy4UK]

Thanks Willy. I follow him on facebook. I love how he goes into detail about why he votes a certain way on every vote. You can tell that our freedoms and rights is his number one priority. He's the kind of guy that could restore my faith a little in politicians.

Yeah, he doesn't hide how he votes. I respect the hell outta that.

Yeah, Heisman, Watch out for Amash in the future. He's a Christian guy but I don't think he's "in your face Christian".

 

[wkycatfan]

and Ted Cruz is a fake tea Party.

http://reason.com/blog/2016/02/23/rep-amash-endorses-ted-cruz

No malice intended here Willy, just messing with you, a little....

 

[Willy4UK]

http://reason.com/blog/2016/02/23/rep-amash-endorses-ted-cruz

No malice intended here Willy, just messing with you, a little....

Ouch. nice one Wkycat. Well, I can see that. I doubt Amash would support a Trump nomination.



But ouch.....

 

[ymmot31]

Yeah, he doesn't hide how he votes. I respect the hell outta that.

Yeah, Heisman, Watch out for Amash in the future. He's a Christian guy but I don't think he's "in your face Christian".

I think the hardcore ones are called Shiite Christians.

 

[wild mandu]

There are so many clear differences among the parties.

You have a ton of Republicans who are critical of Trump and say they won't vote for him and they use his character as the reason. Meanwhile Dems don't give an eff about Hillary Clinton's character and corruption and will still vote for her.

"Voter turnout in this year’s presidential primaries and caucuses are breaking records – but only on the Republican side.

GOP contests in Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina have drawn more than 1.2 million voters, up 24 percent over 2012.

“There’s no question about it: Donald Trump is the main cause of high Republican turnout,” said Larry Sabato, director of the Center for Politics at University of Virginia.

“Love him or hate him, he’s the center of attention. If Trump becomes the Republican nominee, I’d bet right now on a very large November turnout.”"

"In sharp contrast, the showdown between Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders has drawn just 510,000 voters, down 21 percent from the last contested Democratic primaries in 2008.

Democratic turnout has dropped in all three early voting states of Iowa, New Hampshire and Nevada, compared to 2008 when Barack Obama shattered records with his winning coalition of young people, first-time voters and minorities."

Yep, those dirty Democrats just keep voting in waves for Hillary without a conscience.

http://nypost.com/2016/02/23/reason-for-record-republican-voter-turnout-trump/

 

[ukalumni00]

I think Trump will bring on a very strong VP pick if he gets the nomination. Just think he is too smart not to. If its the right pick, I think it will energize the hard core conservatives to come out and vote for him. One thing is for sure, if Trump and Hilary are the final two, he is going to exposure her worse than anything she could have ever imagined.

 

[wkycatfan]

I think Trump will bring on a very strong VP pick if he gets the nomination. Just think he is too smart not to. If its the right pick, I think it will energize the hard core conservatives to come out and vote for him. One thing is for sure, if Trump and Hilary are the final two, he is going to exposure her worse than anything she could have ever imagined.

As you know, I'm not a fan of Trump.

However, exposing Hillary worse than anything she could have imagined intrigues me. Greatly.

 

[qwesley]

Not sure why Bevin wanted the Gov job....worst pension in the country that you have keep afloat, higher ed coming at you, and now medicaid's chickens are coming home to roost as many tried to warn would happen.

Kentucky's Medicaid program is facing a $125 million deficit this year and a $611 million deficit over the next two years as it struggles to keep up with a flood of new enrollees and the end of 100 percent federal funding for its expanded eligibility requirements.

Kentucky Health and Family Services Cabinet Secretary Vickie Yates Brown Glisson told House budget writers on Wednesday she worries about the sustainability of the program that provides health insurance for more than a quarter of Kentucky's population.

Read more here: http://www.kentucky.com/latest-news/article62190607.html#storylink=cpy

 

[Bill Derington]

I would contend that has always been the case, you just don't have the historical perspective to see it. The Civil Rights movement was largely centered and played out on college campuses and there were people complaining about professors suggesting that blacks should be admitted to "white" colleges. Prior to that, that women should be given the right to vote...

Our sires' age was worse than our grandsires'. We, their sons, are more
worthless than they; so in our turn we shall give the world a progeny yet more
corrupt. <-- Book III of Odes, circa 20 BC

Picking out one example doesn't make a case. It's like me suggesting that the Oregon Militia folks are representative of most conservatives or that David Duke is representative of most Republicans. There are always nuts that are far beyond the mainstream of either side.
The bemoaning of the next generation by those older is as predicable as light and darkness.

I'll ask again what I'm sure that Qwesley will consider a "rathole question"...I know that because it is one that I'm sure he doesn't have an answer...but here it goes.
If you could turn back the hands of time to a period when you think everything was better, when would that be?

BTW: My wife is a school teacher and all of the wrangling over Halloween at least at her school has come from a few evangelical parents who object because their church has preached against it. They were successful in getting the Halloween parties at school replaced with an Autumn or Harvest Fest. No costumes allowed. Pretty sure those evangelicals line up on the right.

I don't want to go back to another time. I worry for the future, something we can actually control.

 

[jamo0001]

Not sure why Bevin wanted the Gov job....worst pension in the country that you have keep afloat, higher ed coming at you, and now medicaid's chickens are coming home to roost as many tried to warn would happen.

Kentucky's Medicaid program is facing a $125 million deficit this year and a $611 million deficit over the next two years as it struggles to keep up with a flood of new enrollees and the end of 100 percent federal funding for its expanded eligibility requirements.

Kentucky Health and Family Services Cabinet Secretary Vickie Yates Brown Glisson told House budget writers on Wednesday she worries about the sustainability of the program that provides health insurance for more than a quarter of Kentucky's population.

Read more here: http://www.kentucky.com/latest-news/article62190607.html#storylink=cpy

The best answer, assuredly, is for Kentuckians to stop being poor.

 

[KopiKat]

We're headed straight to a Wall-E future.

Interesting thought. Yet Wall-E longed for something more, he was incredibly brave (of tremendous virtue), he took his own risks, was rewarded, and he made the world a better place. Ironically, this came largely as a result of his timid, growing want to reject institutional assignment, and instead pursue a instinctive belief in self-fulfillment. Simply one of the most beautiful animated movie stories I know of. The country could use a lot of Wall-E minded young people right now.

Youngest nephew stayed with us for several weeks a few summers ago. Kid loved that movie. We watched it every night it seemed. Missed a lot of baseball.

 

[Big_Blue79]

If you don't know what is meant by establishment, you are a leftie because they have been duped for years and have no clue that their candidates are no different when it comes to helping the rich. BTW, your postings give you away.

Lol, oh, you got me good, you! I've been registered either Republican or independent my entire life, have called for the abolition of the income tax (to be replaced by a consumption tax of some kind), and would love nothing more than lower my taxes because I pay a metric ****ton. I am socially very liberal - end the war on drugs, allow abortion up to 20 weeks, complete separation of church and state (as a Christian, no less), and pro-gay marriage (really, pro no gov't involvement in any marriages), so maybe that makes me libertarian more than conservative or liberal (I don't really care). I've openly stated that I think Kasich or Christie were the best of this terrible crop (and O'Malley on the Democrat side, not that he had a chance) due to their lack of crazy and experience actually running states (and Romney in 2012 is another fine example). But, sure, please tell me more about me because apparently I don't know my own voting history (of which you are ignorant) and views on issues. Abhorrence of bumper sticker idiocy in politics that reduces complex issues to "liberals suck" or "conservatives suck" (which describes the vast majority of my posts here) does not a comprehensive view on politics make.

Or here's a thought - quit trying to reduce everything to us/them and engage people on what they actually say without always insinuating something ("duped for years," "postings give you away"). I had an honest question - what does establishment mean in that context? Wasn't at all clear to me.

You seem like an all right guy (other than the above), and I'd happily buy you a beer and watch a UK game and swap military stories.

Nice try Willy but you really missed the mark. You think UK should inherit a 20pt lead to start the game because of our history of winning? Or if we're playing football, Bama gets 21 on the board before kickoff?

In sport it doesn't matter what you've done in the past, the game always starts 0-0...of course unless we're playing golf and using handicaps...I think there are handicaps in bowling as well.

In the 0-0 game, Alabama starts out with better players and coaches. Isn't that analogous to the systematic advantages of wealth and privilege you're trying to address? We're all born babies, after all. This is why analogies suck - rarely are things truly analogous.

http://news.yahoo.com/want-limit-justices-18-years-supreme-court-183813692--politics.html Limit terms for Supreme Court Justices?

I see the upside, but if there was one thing that could make the election cycle worse...

 

[WettCat]

Trump is a carnival barker. And you are either blind, stupid or in denial if you think anything otherwise.

• There is absolutely no depth to his statements, no reasonable explanation of how he will actually accomplish any of his claims. And it doesn't even sound like he's even bothered to learn position points beyond a 5 second answer.
• He has flip-flopped on virtually everyone one of his position points in the past 18-24 months as he positioned himself to run. How do we know what he really believes in?
• If you think he'll expose Hillary, wait until the liberal press unloads on him within 24 hours of the Republican National Convention ends. Not closets, but warehouses of skeletons waiting to be exposed.
• If we aren't already, the US will be the laughingstock of the rest of the World. Who cares? We should--because no one will take us seriously.

Be careful what you ask for.

 

[wkycatfan]

Does Trump get the amount of delegates needed for the nomination during the primaries?

If so, will those delegates honor their commitment to him at the convention, while the GOP establishment watches on in horror?

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Interesting thought. Yet Wall-E longed for something more, he was incredibly brave (of tremendous virtue), he took his own risks, was rewarded, and he made the world a better place. Ironically, this came largely as a result of his timid, growing want to reject institutional assignment, and instead pursue a instinctive belief in self-fulfillment. Simply one of the most beautiful animated movie stories I know of. The country could use a lot of Wall-E minded young people right now.

Youngest nephew stayed with us for several weeks a few summers ago. Kid loved that movie. We watched it every night it seemed. Missed a lot of baseball.

Youre exactly Right. I was referring to the fat, lazy, helpless, humans that were floating around in hover chairs. I shouldve made that more clear.

 

[Willy4UK]

Trump is a carnival barker. And you are either blind, stupid or in denial if you think anything otherwise.

• There is absolutely no depth to his statements, no reasonable explanation of how he will actually accomplish any of his claims. And it doesn't even sound like he's even bothered to learn position points beyond a 5 second answer.
• He has flip-flopped on virtually everyone one of his position points in the past 18-24 months as he positioned himself to run. How do we know what he really believes in?
• If you think he'll expose Hillary, wait until the liberal press unloads on him within 24 hours of the Republican National Convention ends. Not closets, but warehouses of skeletons waiting to be exposed.
• If we aren't already, the US will be the laughingstock of the rest of the World. Who cares? We should--because no one will take us seriously.

Be careful what you ask for.

But as opposed to who then? If the Repubs aren't gonna budge from Rubio and Cruz. Then who? People are going with trump because the other two flaming bags of shit being offered are worse choices. Yeah, every point you made is correct and yet Trump is pulling it. You can apply all of those points to Rubio except for your 3rd one. Rubio is prolly clean unless he is gay and that comes out.

Look, no one is to blame but the Repubs for this election. Crazy that this is the most important election that I can remember in my lifetime and they'd risk it by proppin awfull ass rubio and unlikeable Cruz. That is frustrating.

 

[WettCat]

Does Trump get the amount of delegates needed for the nomination during the primaries?

If so, will those delegates honor their commitment to him at the convention, while the GOP establishment watches on in horror?

I've certainly been wrong before, (One. Term. President.), but......if it gets to this point I fully expect some nuclear revelation about Trump that would give those delegates at least a semi-legitimate reason to change their votes. The Lib Press aren't the only ones with a few Trump skeletons hidden away. But none of the current candidates want to expose them for fear of losing the die-hard Trump voters.

Maybe wishful thinking, but it's all I got at this point....

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jeremy-nix/an-open-letter-to-my-frie_2_b_9293694.html

From the linked article:

"[I am] calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on" -- Donald Trump. That's religious discrimination.

"An 'extremely credible source' has called my office and told me that Barack Obama's birth certificate is a fraud" -- Donald Trump. That's an outright lie.

"Ariana Huffington is unattractive, both inside and out. I fully understand why her former husband left her for a man - he made a good decision." -- Donald Trump. This is sexism, and just plain rude.

"You know, it really doesn't matter what the media write as long as you've got a young, and beautiful, piece of @!$%#." - Donald Trump. This is misogyny at its finest.

"I will build a great wall -- and nobody builds walls better than me, believe me -- and I'll build them very inexpensively. I will build a great, great wall on our southern border, and I will make Mexico pay for that wall. Mark my words." - Donald Trump. The words of an arrogant hate monger.

"When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending the best. They're not sending you, they're sending people that have lots of problems and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists... And some, I assume, are good people." -- Donald Trump. Racist.

"Our great African-American President hasn't exactly had a positive impact on the thugs who are so happily and openly destroying Baltimore." -- Donald Trump. Racist.

"If I were running 'The View', I'd fire Rosie O'Donnell. I mean, I'd look at her right in that fat, ugly face of hers, I'd say 'Rosie, you're fired." -- Donald Trump. The words of an @!$%#.

"The beauty of me is that I'm very rich." - Donald Trump. So Vain.

"It's freezing and snowing in New York - we need global warming!" - Donald Trump. Ignorant.

"My fingers are long and beautiful, as, it has been well documented, are various other parts of my body." - Donald Trump. Gross.

"I think the only difference between me and the other candidates is that I'm more honest and my women are beautiful." - Donald Trump. Sexist. As if women are possessions rather than people. And also a lie. A lie about how honest he is.

 

[WettCat]

Willy, they may not be everyone's favorite, but I don't think most others see Cruz and Rubio as flaming bags of shit. They certainly aren't perfect, but they are way more reasonable than Trump, Hillary or Bernie. JMO. (At least Rubio....Cruz does kind of creep me out. But have read a few articles on both and they both are growing on me.)

 

[Supreme Lord Z]

http://news.yahoo.com/want-limit-justices-18-years-supreme-court-183813692--politics.html Limit terms for Supreme Court Justices?

This is for stupid people that do not understand the concept of the judiciary and why the appointments were conceived as permanent in the first place.

 

[fuzz77]

Does Trump get the amount of delegates needed for the nomination during the primaries?

If so, will those delegates honor their commitment to him at the convention, while the GOP establishment watches on in horror?

Likewise, if Trump is just short of what is needed going into the convention but is then outcast in favor of who the GOP establishment wants...do they suffer an extreme backlash against the GOP for going against who the majority had voted and his supporters either stay at home, vote 3rd party or gasp!...vote Democratic?

 

[Supreme Lord Z]

If Hillary picks Julian Castro for her VP then I am going to puke.

 

[wkycatfan]

Likewise, if Trump is just short of what is needed going into the convention but is then outcast in favor of who the GOP establishment wants...do they suffer an extreme backlash against the GOP for going against who the majority had voted and his supporters either stay at home, vote 3rd party or gasp!...vote Democratic?

I may not vote Trump, but you can rest assured I won't vote Socialist (democratic). I'll write somebody in.

 

[Willy4UK]

Willy, they may not be everyone's favorite, but I don't think most others see Cruz and Rubio as flaming bags of shit. They certainly aren't perfect, but they are way more reasonable than Trump, Hillary or Bernie. JMO. (At least Rubio....Cruz does kind of creep me out. But have read a few articles on both and they both are growing on me.)

But a lot do. Or they would be polling better.

Maybe flaming bags of shit is a little much. But it's straight cognitive dissonance to think that Rubio or Cruz are good candidates. You were already gonna vote any Republican non-Trump regardless. You've got a bias. You want more votes to beat the Dems. Those votes are going to have to come from us Libertarians and Independents. Rubio or Cruz do not have the power to pull the votes. It's delusional to think they will.

Put it this way Wett. This is the most serious election in decades and the GOP is going to risk it on Trump, Rubio, and Cruz? Who is going to be held responsible if the Republicans don't regain the presidency?

 

[Supreme Lord Z]

The sooner the Republicans wrap their heads around Trump being their nominee the better off they will be. Then they need to ask themselves how it is possible for one major political party to produce Sarah Palin and Donald Trump within a decade of each other. Once they discover they are essentially stupid, then the healing can begin.

The Republican Party is broken. They have stoked the fires of hate for so long that they are capable of nominating a monster. They only need look in the mirror if they want to know why. Trump and Palin are mirror images of your modern day Republican that favors religion instead of science and demagoguery instead of debate. Trump is not the problem. Republicans are the problem.

Every American should ask themselves why they would trust these people to check parking meters, let alone choose a President.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Of course the dummy GOP would botch this confirmation, as we assumed they would. Why sign a statement saying you wont even have a hearing? Congrats on giving Obama a few months worth of crying points, because he has a legitimate gripe.

All they had to do was let him appoint, then refuse to confirm. Thats it. Why not just follow the process?

Trump is a carnival barker. And you are either blind, stupid or in denial if you think anything otherwise.

• There is absolutely no depth to his statements, no reasonable explanation of how he will actually accomplish any of his claims. And it doesn't even sound like he's even bothered to learn position points beyond a 5 second answer.
• He has flip-flopped on virtually everyone one of his position points in the past 18-24 months as he positioned himself to run. How do we know what he really believes in?
• If you think he'll expose Hillary, wait until the liberal press unloads on him within 24 hours of the Republican National Convention ends. Not closets, but warehouses of skeletons waiting to be exposed.
• If we aren't already, the US will be the laughingstock of the rest of the World. Who cares? We should--because no one will take us seriously.

Be careful what you ask for.

You make good points. But you can also replace Trump with any candidate not named Sanders, and it all holds just as true. Sanders sucks, but he is the only one with years worth of consistency.

In fact, you can basically plug most candidates in the last 6-7 elections into any of those, and its still true; except Sanders and Perot. I didnt include Rand or Ron because they were never major players. Serious candidates are basically just frauds for the most part. Thats not ok. But its just how it is.

If you cant believe what they say, then you have to look at what theyll do. To know what theyll do, its best to look at what theyve done. Sanders will be a socialist. Clinton will be a crook. Cruz will have us fighting crusades. Rubio will be Obama 2.0 with an R next to his name; waiting for his programmers/handlers to give him further instruction.

Trump is the only one with a real world track record of success; major success. He wont be owned by any special interest groups. Hes not a career politician and doesnt really care about being cool or popular, so hes willing to make the tough decisions that noone else will. Hes not oppressively religious. Hes a very tough negotiator who nearly always comes out on top.

His ego is the only thing that concerns me. But...I do THINK he can reign it in when needed. Will there be skeletons in his closet? Im not sure. Hes led a pretty public life since the 80's. Hes been out there, not like most candidates who prep their whole life for this shot. Plus skeletons only hurt when someone tries to hide them, which I dont think Trump does. Its pretty fascinating.

I still liked Rand then Kasich best. Plus I still think Rubio/Kasich is the best bet in the general. But I wouldnt have dreamed Trump would be rolling like he is; especially with minority vote. He alone obliterated Bush. Then started crushing Cruz. This all after most everyone guffawed at his chances when he announced. So with him, it seems like anything is possible.

If he gets the nomination....IF....the debates with Hillary will be the greatest in the history of politics. Theyll break every viewership record known.

 

[JHB4UK]

"the republicans" arent responsible for this situation IMO. personally I put the blame on Hannity, Limbaugh, Levin, Ingraham, Fox News, & CNN. since last June those places gave Trump 99% of all 2016 primary race coverage time. all the air was sucked out of the room leaving quality candidates like Walker, Perry, Rand to wither & die away.

 

[wkycatfan]

At the end of day, presidents are just people. Flawed individuals. Great presidents are usually made by events, good judgement, character.

My hope is in the fact, that 60% of people in 1860 probably thought Abraham Lincoln was a 'flaming bag of shit'.

He wasn't.

 

[Willy4UK]

At the end of day, presidents are just people. Flawed individuals. Great presidents are usually made by events, good judgement, character.

My hope is in the fact, that 60% of people in 1860 probably thought Abraham Lincoln was a 'flaming bag of shit'.

He wasn't.

So Rubio or Cruz is the next Lincoln? Gotcha.

 

[Supreme Lord Z]

Trump, Trump, Trump... I want Trump rammed down Republican's throats. A poison pill of their own design. Then, in the end, when they know they are done, then it will be at the hands of a guy that played them like rubes because he actually is a bigger liberal than Hillary ever dreamed of being.

I like knowing that. Knowing that not only my greatest mortal enemies have not only been defeated, but humiliated. Reduced to confused flailing inept loud mouths. Shouting at the wind and the clouds because they have no idea they've been had until the last possible second.. like Henry Fonda at the end of Once Upon a Time in the West.

 

[wkycatfan]

You know that's not what I'm saying Willy. Sometimes great presidents happen, when you aren't expecting it. We need one right now. I think Trump stinks. You think Rubio stinks. We just make our best judgement, and vote, hoping it works out.

 

[Willy4UK]

You know that's not what I'm saying Willy. Sometimes great presidents happen, when you aren't expecting it. We need one right now. I think Trump stinks. You think Rubio stinks. We just make our best judgement, and vote, hoping it works out.

Just to clarify that I am not rooting for Trump, I'm trying to vote for a decent Republican candidate and yet I find myself rationalizing between Trump and Libertarian Gary Johnson. Only because I know Johnson won't get a serious look, but I will stick with him if I have to. I am just appalled that with everything on the line that a candidate like Trump is actually getting serious looks. It really shows that Rubio/Cruz supporters are literally no different than Hillary supporters.

 

[JHB4UK]

bwahahahaha!

Romney's best plan of attack against Trump is to do what Dingy Harry Reid did to him 4 years ago?

 

[fuzz77]

bwahahahaha!

View embedded media

Romney's best plan of attack against Trump is to do what Dingy Harry Reid did to him 4 years ago?

How are you going to top this?

 

[Bill Cosby]

Ha so Trump and Romney probably talked about how they both used the 2009 amnesty and now Romney's ratting him out at the behest of the establishment.

Total bitch move from Romney. What a clown.

 

[jamo0001]

i'd assume Romney is betting that Trump has given plenty of money to groups that the Republican base wouldn't be too thrilled about.

 

[fuzz77]

i'd assume Romney is betting that Trump has given plenty of money to groups that the Republican base wouldn't be too thrilled about.

He's already admitted to that hasn't he?

 

[Supreme Lord Z]

He has Teflon for who he has donated to. He openly admits it was because he wanted something in return. For example, he gave to Hillary because he wanted her to come to a birthday party, and apparently she did.

 

[warrior-cat]

"Lol, oh, you got me good, you! I've been registered either Republican or independent my entire life, have called for the abolition of the income tax (to be replaced by a consumption tax of some kind), and would love nothing more than lower my taxes because I pay a metric ****ton. I am socially very liberal - end the war on drugs, allow abortion up to 20 weeks, complete separation of church and state (as a Christian, no less), and pro-gay marriage (really, pro no gov't involvement in any marriages), so maybe that makes me libertarian more than conservative or liberal (I don't really care). I've openly stated that I think Kasich or Christie were the best of this terrible crop (and O'Malley on the Democrat side, not that he had a chance) due to their lack of crazy and experience actually running states (and Romney in 2012 is another fine example). But, sure, please tell me more about me because apparently I don't know my own voting history (of which you are ignorant) and views on issues. Abhorrence of bumper sticker idiocy in politics that reduces complex issues to "liberals suck" or "conservatives suck" (which describes the vast majority of my posts here) does not a comprehensive view on politics make.

Or here's a thought - quit trying to reduce everything to us/them and engage people on what they actually say without always insinuating something ("duped for years," "postings give you away"). I had an honest question - what does establishment mean in that context? Wasn't at all clear to me.

You seem like an all right guy (other than the above), and I'd happily buy you a beer and watch a UK game and swap military stories"


Ok, I will buy you could be independent or even "registered republican" in the past but, your leanings are mainly left by most of your postings that I have read. And by left I mean left of me moreover.

It is us and them because the current admin made sure of that. By establishment I mean bought and paid for by special interest groups like most of the other politicians. No different than the others.

I would have to buy the first beer since you threw out the first offer.