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Adou Thiero and Chris Livingston

Montana81

Montana81

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I don’t know why i thought of this but we really should have been investing Livingston’s minutes into Thiero last season.

Statistically livingston ended up as the worst forward in the Cal era to play as many minutes as he did.

I guess at the time no one thought Thiero was ready but he’s ahead of schedule now imo and he couldn’t have been much worse than Livingston. Plus Cal had to have a pretty good idea Livingston wasn’t coming back. He basically recruited Edward’s to take his place. Would have been better to start developing Thiero given he’s turned out to be such an important piece this season and possibly next as well.
 
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It was easy for Cal do get away with it because Livingston was the more heralded player and Adou was looked at as a project. To anyone that watched the games though Adou clearly impacted them more than Chris. There are many factors that go into how easy or difficult it is for a guy to bust through Cal's bias he has for certain guys.
 
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Not a criticism in anyone in this thread, but I am consistently surprised by how many people seem to forget that at the beginning of last year Adou was considered a tweener project 3* who was a legacy that might play some in year 3 or 4.

Thanks to the promise he showed and his hard work it is amazing that we are in a position to be asking for Cal to utilize him even more. Whether Cal saw the potential or just lucked into the legacy recruit, it is definitely a feather in his cap if Adou eventually becomes a rotational NBA player in the next few years.
 
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PersianCat387 said:
Not a criticism in anyone in this thread, but I am consistently surprised by how many people seem to forget that at the beginning of last year Adou was considered a tweener project 3* who was a legacy that might play some in year 3 or 4.

Thanks to the promise he showed and his hard work it is amazing that we are in a position to be asking for Cal to utilize him even more. Whether Cal saw the potential or just lucked into the legacy recruit, it is definitely a feather in his cap if Adou eventually becomes a rotational NBA player in the next few years.
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Every coach in America is rolling with Livingston. I understand the frustration with not starting Shep, but not every roster choice is some awful move by Cal. Thiero was a super raw, 3* player and Livingston was a 5*. Maybe thiero is a better player but that wasn't the case last year, and you have to see what you have in these 1AD five star recruits. Every coach is playing CL for quite a while at the chance he's as good as billed. A 5* wing, if as good as billed, is a player that can help your team to a final4 or beyond.
 
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Jamal Mercer said:
I’m not even kidding when I say this, I do not remember a Chris Livingston on our basketball team. Looked him up, apparently he is with the Bucks?

I’m getting old 🤦🏻‍♂️
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I forgot all about him as well. 🤣
 
rob_47 said:
It was easy for Cal do get away with it because Livingston was the more heralded player and Adou was looked at as a project. To anyone that watched the games though Adou clearly impacted them more than Chris. There are many factors that go into how easy or difficult it is for a guy to bust through Cal's bias he has for certain guys.
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There has never once been any bias towards Cal in his tenure here. It's just a fabricated story.

There's never been even one player to make those claims. Only the RR experts.

Theiro was nowhere near the player he is now last year. He is constantly improving as does every player under Cal.

You can make up all the stories, bogeymen and conspiracies you want. But in the end they are still just made up stories.
 
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So from the stats, it doesn't look like Livingston's doing so hot although it's pretty early to declare anything.

Anyone who follows the NBA closer than I do have any insight on if he makes it?
 
Zissou87 said:
Keep in mind, Adou was forced to play point guard at times last season. God, I don't miss that lack of of backcourt depth.
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Cason doesn't catch as much flak as he should. He was really kind of a letdown imo. He was 4 for 29 from 3 to finish out the final 8 or so games. Never seemed to show much emotion. Not a lot of positive vibes from him like we see with so many guys on this years team. Not a bad player, not a bad person or anything. But I feel like I'm gonna look back on this era and totally forget about him.
 
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LineSkiCat14 said:
Cason doesn't catch as much flak as he should. He was really kind of a letdown imo. He was 4 for 29 from 3 to finish out the final 8 or so games. Never seemed to show much emotion. Not a lot of positive vibes from him like we see with so many guys on this years team. Not a bad player, not a bad person or anything. But I feel like I'm gonna look back on this era and totally forget about him.
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Cason was a tough kid, but I think we see more emotion and celebrating with this team maybe because Oscar ain’t there telling them pride is one of the seven deadly sins. It’s young guys encouraging each other to have fun, with a Sr. like Tre Mitchell who is fun loving and partakes in and even leads some of the hijinks. It was an older team that didn’t really get along and didn’t have leaders, plus Wallace took the job of one of the Seniors who then quit the team. I agree completely though that he’s forgettable compared to basically all our first round guards. I was surprised he stepped into the league and immediately started tearing it up. Not sure how the 2nd half of his season is going, I’d guess he’s regressed to the mean somewhat, but he seems to be a heck of a prospect.
 
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Wallace was great, he should have been paired with a combo out of the portal with Reeves playing the three. It was a really bad offseason by Cal. Once Oscar came back, the Wheeler experiment needed to end. That combo was done.

As for Livingston, you could see 90 seconds into his clips that his handle was not good enough to play the perimeter on a high level team (not to mention his shooting %s). He was a college 4.
 
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I don’t love Cal, but Livingston>>>than Thiero last year. Livingston is another recruiting disappointment for sure though.
 
Montana81 said:
I don’t know why i thought of this but we really should have been investing Livingston’s minutes into Thiero last season.

Statistically livingston ended up as the worst forward in the Cal era to play as many minutes as he did.

I guess at the time no one thought Thiero was ready but he’s ahead of schedule now imo and he couldn’t have been much worse than Livingston. Plus Cal had to have a pretty good idea Livingston wasn’t coming back. He basically recruited Edward’s to take his place. Would have been better to start developing Thiero given he’s turned out to be such an important piece this season and possibly next as well.
Click to expand...
If I was on here last year you would have seen me blasting that on every thread man
 
Montana81 said:
I don’t know why i thought of this but we really should have been investing Livingston’s minutes into Thiero last season.

Statistically livingston ended up as the worst forward in the Cal era to play as many minutes as he did.

I guess at the time no one thought Thiero was ready but he’s ahead of schedule now imo and he couldn’t have been much worse than Livingston. Plus Cal had to have a pretty good idea Livingston wasn’t coming back. He basically recruited Edward’s to take his place. Would have been better to start developing Thiero given he’s turned out to be such an important piece this season and possibly next as well.
Click to expand...
Yeah well in order to keep the five star train rolling Cal has to make those sacrifices and it ends up hurting us the next season a lot of the time. It’s rare we get a guy like Theiro who is good enough to produce but not good enough or coveted by the pros.
 
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Thiero is better this year than he was last, but he should have gotten more minutes last year as well. And this isn't hindsight talking. I was saying the same thing last season
 
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Our depth was shit last year. If we had backcourt depth, could've put Livingston at 4. Except we didn't, which forced Livingston to 3. Our frontcourt depth really wasn't much better...

But we had Tshiebwe and Wallace.
 
Montana81 said:
I don’t know why i thought of this but we really should have been investing Livingston’s minutes into Thiero last season.

Statistically livingston ended up as the worst forward in the Cal era to play as many minutes as he did.

I guess at the time no one thought Thiero was ready but he’s ahead of schedule now imo and he couldn’t have been much worse than Livingston. Plus Cal had to have a pretty good idea Livingston wasn’t coming back. He basically recruited Edward’s to take his place. Would have been better to start developing Thiero given he’s turned out to be such an important piece this season and possibly next as well.
Click to expand...
“At the time no one thought Thiero was ready…”


Ummmm. It was plain in the blue white game and scrimmages that Adou was the stronger player. I, along with a few others on this board, knew that we should’ve given him a lot more minutes and advocated for it. If he played 20 minutes per game last year and closer to 30 minutes per game this year, he’d be a first round pick. The only thing holding this guy back is literally not getting enough time on the court.

And this is also why I laugh when several posters here project lineups for next season in which they still don’t have him starting. It’s like they don’t realize that he has started most of the games he has played in this year and is projected to be a first round pick.
 
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Would have been nice to found Thiero some more minutes throughout last season. For playing sparingly, he had a decent game at Arkansas last year when the Cats were shorthanded with 7 points & 5 rebounds. Another one who should have played more was Ugo when Oscar was out and received Lance Ware's minutes. We have seen some glimpses this year defensively of what Ugo could do.
 
This is one I don’t fault Cal for. Livingston came in looking like a grown man. The previous season Cal had pissed away Bryce Hopkins’ usefulness by trying to make him into a swingman that he just couldn’t be. And we’d been hunting in the paint for years because Cal’s inability to land real forwards had become almost Tubby-like. Thiero at that point was still looking like a combo guard physically. Cal was wise enough to use Chris like that, considering. The man just can’t catch a break even when he makes the right decision.
 
BlueSince92 said:
This is one I don’t fault Cal for. Livingston came in looking like a grown man. The previous season Cal had pissed away Bryce Hopkins’ usefulness by trying to make him into a swingman that he just couldn’t be. And we’d been hunting in the paint for years because Cal’s inability to land real forwards had become almost Tubby-like. Thiero at that point was still looking like a combo guard physically. Cal was wise enough to use Chris like that, considering. The man just can’t catch a break even when he makes the right decision.
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A swing man that he couldn't be? The kid never played. How would you know that?
 
PersianCat387 said:
Not a criticism in anyone in this thread, but I am consistently surprised by how many people seem to forget that at the beginning of last year Adou was considered a tweener project 3* who was a legacy that might play some in year 3 or 4.

Thanks to the promise he showed and his hard work it is amazing that we are in a position to be asking for Cal to utilize him even more. Whether Cal saw the potential or just lucked into the legacy recruit, it is definitely a feather in his cap if Adou eventually becomes a rotational NBA player in the next few years.
Click to expand...
We have some talented coaching minds here
 
Montana81 said:
I don’t know why i thought of this but we really should have been investing Livingston’s minutes into Thiero last season.

Statistically livingston ended up as the worst forward in the Cal era to play as many minutes as he did.

I guess at the time no one thought Thiero was ready but he’s ahead of schedule now imo and he couldn’t have been much worse than Livingston. Plus Cal had to have a pretty good idea Livingston wasn’t coming back. He basically recruited Edward’s to take his place. Would have been better to start developing Thiero given he’s turned out to be such an important piece this season and possibly next as well.
Click to expand...
Some of us were pleading last year for Adou (and Ugo, as well) to get more clock. We'd have been better this year and LAST year if they had
 
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