The Ukraine war. (Yes, we'll mind our manners)

[bigblueinsanity]

Imo the wildest discussion yet involving or forgetting the past was "why would we ever need Russia on our side to fight china?" As if Russia was not crucial to winning world wars.

The coming ear with china, if we even decide to fight, will be one we will lose unless every single militarized nation joins with us. People dont realize we, and most others, are completely cut off from resources and materials needed to wage war including food. If china cuts off mexico this country could literally starve. We have no coal nor steel. Very little industrial base to make anything even if we had resources. On and on.

I say if because through use of "spies" (an art of war term) china operated so well the last few decades im not convinced it won't be just willing subjugation. Thats if they even desire something that open. The moves they made the last decade in western developed nations should scare people and they should be more scared by the lack of reporting combined with lack of concern from leaders.

But yes.....lets get the putin boogeyman.

I didn't even touch on money. Where would we get the money for a prolonged war? We owe china so much money its literally inconceivable. Yes i know we aksually owe the fed, but thats where the fed gets the money. Our interest only payments are so high the brain cant comprehend that amount of money and it increases by the second. Worse, china is positioned by owning all the resources for this green future. All conveniently acquired just before the green movement started.

If we think we are the global power, we better think again. We're a distant 2nd and thats only because Japan doesn't have much of an army.

So yes war is coming, if we even fight, and we will need every nation we can get.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

I just don’t get how some of you are pro-Putin.

Pro-Putin = paying for a war instead of forcing a resolution because you fear Putin can harm NATO

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Pot meet kettle.

In other words, you admit his premise. Agreement is good.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

The same way Ukraine is beating them….with American supplies and weapons.

And, yet, this administration clearly thought Russia would steamroll Ukraine and we did not offer support until the Ukrainians demonstrated a defense.

Despite the “Ukraine is winning” crowd, my prediction stands. This war will end in a manner of compromise that could have been achieved many deaths and many billions ago. And, the war crowd will pat their own backs and congratulate themselves.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

People are talking about the former USSR countries.

Putin cannot take Ukraine but is a threat to the former USSR countries in NATO?

That is what people think?

Correct me, because “people” cannot be seriously talking about that.

 

[JGCraw]

Imo the wildest discussion yet involving or forgetting the past was "why would we ever need Russia on our side to fight china?" As if Russia was not crucial to winning world wars.

The coming ear with china, if we even decide to fight, will be one we will lose unless every single militarized nation joins with us. People dont realize we, and most others, are completely cut off from resources and materials needed to wage war including food. If china cuts off mexico this country could literally starve. We have no coal nor steel. Very little industrial base to make anything even if we had resources. On and on.

I say if because through use of "spies" (an art of war term) china operated so well the last few decades im not convinced it won't be just willing subjugation. Thats if they even desire something that open. The moves they made the last decade in western developed nations should scare people and they should be more scared by the lack of reporting combined with lack of concern from leaders.

But yes.....lets get the putin boogeyman.

We have no coal or steel?

 

[bigblueinsanity]

We have no coal or steel?

I should've said a very reduced capacity to mine or produce either but the point was the same.

 

[JGCraw]

I should've said a very reduced capacity to mine or produce either but the point was the same.

i disagree with the point being the same.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

i disagree with the point being the same.

Im sure you do because the msm doesn't tell you this. Have any idea who buys the coal we actually mine? China and india.

Know who supplies the world nearly all its steel? China. Btw is sucks and fails all the time but thanks to our trade deals we cant sue them.

So lets say war broke out tomorrow, we'd have have to immediately hire and retool all the existing coal mines in America (that weren't closed completely), rehire and retool all these shuddered steel plants. If we somehow do that we're at least 4 months before production starts.

Then all simultaneously we have to retool all the manufacturing lines across the country, assuming they weren't just demolished and have them ready 4 months later while hoping we dont lose in the meantime.

While allllll that we have to hope china doesn't cut off or buy off mexico, because all our fruits and vegetables come from mexico.

We have no way to wage real war should it be needed. There is only one entity intent on that isnt Russia. Hint its the guy the who didn't want to name a covid strain after even though it was the next name in line

 

[hmt5000]

Putin cannot take Ukraine but is a threat to the former USSR countries in NATO?

That is what people think?

Correct me, because “people” cannot be seriously talking about that.

That is what they think and if you disagree they will call you a Putin puppet who is a traitor to this country. They literally don't care about protecting this country but will type to the last Ukrainian to prove they Love America.

 

[hmt5000]

We have no coal or steel?

Oh.. Did you miss out on the lefts war on coal and co2? We have shut down almost all our steel and aluminum production in this country. The reason we aren't sending more artillery shells to Ukraine is because we can't produce them any faster. The reason we don't send more air defense is because we can't produce it any faster. The rust belt is known as the "rust belt" for a reason.

 

[hmt5000]

Im sure you do because the msm doesn't tell you this. Have any idea who buys the coal we actually mine? China and india.

Know who supplies the world nearly all its steel? China. Btw is sucks and fails all the time but thanks to our trade deals we cant sue them.

So lets say war broke out tomorrow, we'd have have to immediately hire and retool all the existing coal mines in America (that weren't closed completely), rehire and retool all these shuddered steel plants. If we somehow do that we're at least 4 months before production starts.

Then all simultaneously we have to retool all the manufacturing lines across the country, assuming they weren't just demolished and have them ready 4 months later while hoping we dont lose in the meantime.

While allllll that we have to hope china doesn't cut off or buy off mexico, because all our fruits and vegetables come from mexico.

We have no way to wage real war should it be needed. There is only one entity intent on that isnt Russia. Hint its the guy the who didn't want to name a covid strain after even though it was the next name in line

Don't tell him where most of our microchips and medicine are produced... He'll have a hissy fit.

 

[hmt5000]

And then think about the manpower shortage in the military and what the politics of a draft would look right now. It'd be a shit show.

 

[JGCraw]

Im sure you do because the msm doesn't tell you this. Have any idea who buys the coal we actually mine? China and india.

Know who supplies the world nearly all its steel? China. Btw is sucks and fails all the time but thanks to our trade deals we cant sue them.

So lets say war broke out tomorrow, we'd have have to immediately hire and retool all the existing coal mines in America (that weren't closed completely), rehire and retool all these shuddered steel plants. If we somehow do that we're at least 4 months before production starts.

Then all simultaneously we have to retool all the manufacturing lines across the country, assuming they weren't just demolished and have them ready 4 months later while hoping we dont lose in the meantime.

While allllll that we have to hope china doesn't cut off or buy off mexico, because all our fruits and vegetables come from mexico.

We have no way to wage real war should it be needed. There is only one entity intent on that isnt Russia. Hint its the guy the who didn't want to name a covid strain after even though it was the next name in line

I actually knew both your points> it is pretty arrogant of you to think you are so much smarter than everyone else and that information hard to find. You make good points fairly often but don't just assume everyone else is ignorant.

 

[JGCraw]

Don't tell him where most of our microchips and medicine are produced... He'll have a hissy fit.

I know where those are produced as well. I promise I don't have hissy fits. I'm fairly mature. Why do you think this information is so unknown to people?

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

Imo the wildest discussion yet involving or forgetting the past was "why would we ever need Russia on our side to fight china?" As if Russia was not crucial to winning world wars.

The coming ear with china, if we even decide to fight, will be one we will lose unless every single militarized nation joins with us. People dont realize we, and most others, are completely cut off from resources and materials needed to wage war including food. If china cuts off mexico this country could literally starve. We have no coal nor steel. Very little industrial base to make anything even if we had resources. On and on.

I say if because through use of "spies" (an art of war term) china operated so well the last few decades im not convinced it won't be just willing subjugation. Thats if they even desire something that open. The moves they made the last decade in western developed nations should scare people and they should be more scared by the lack of reporting combined with lack of concern from leaders.

But yes.....lets get the putin boogeyman.

You obviously don't know what you're talking about. We don't need most of our imports, we choose to buy them and their value has risen sharply. Try digging a bit deeper.

The same goes for steel. Dig deeper. We are only using around 35% of our steel manufacturing capacity. You like being smug but you just demonstrated how little you actually know.

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

I know where those are produced as well. I promise I don't have hissy fits. I'm fairly mature. Why do you think this information is so unknown to people?

It helps them feel superior when their actual posts contain a lack of facts.

 

[vhcat70]

We are only using around 35% of our steel manufacturing capacity. You like being smug but you just demonstrated how little you actually know.

Sure. because imports are way cheaper.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

We are way behind on artillery production and have not advanced most of our production lines. This has been an issue for years.

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

Sure. because imports are way cheaper.

Yes but we can grow that industry if needed which bbinsanity assures us we cannot.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Yes but we can grow that industry if needed which bbinsanity assures us we cannot.

You think all those people, property, and equipment are just sitting around waiting on their day to come back around?

No. People moved on, equipment was sold or rusted up, and mines/steel plants were repurposed or closed altogether.

This stuff isnt like some light switch you can just flip on. Ultimately yes we can ramp up but in a major conflict we don't have that kind of time.

 

[hmt5000]

I know where those are produced as well. I promise I don't have hissy fits. I'm fairly mature. Why do you think this information is so unknown to people?

Because your opinion on the other stuff would bring tons of stuff into question if you did know all that stuff.

 

[hmt5000]

Yes but we can grow that industry if needed which bbinsanity assures us we cannot.

So you think when a plant closes they leave all the equipment in there in near pristine condition and just keep the site on hold until we need it?

Do you think the Naval Ordnance in Louisville is just sitting there waiting for a big war to go back to producing ammo and guns?

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

You think all those people, property, and equipment are just sitting around waiting on their day to come back around?

No. People moved on, equipment was sold or rusted up, and mines/steel plants were repurposed or closed altogether.

This stuff isnt like some light switch you can just flip on. Ultimately yes we can ramp up but in a major conflict we don't have that kind of time.

It takes no time to scale up to capacity. Nice try but you're still grasping at straws.

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

So you think when a plant closes they leave all the equipment in there in near pristine condition and just keep the site on hold until we need it?

Do you think the Naval Ordnance in Louisville is just sitting there waiting for a big war to go back to producing ammo and guns?

I'm telling you what is officially known. Whine about it if you wish.

 

[JGCraw]

Because your opinion on the other stuff would bring tons of stuff into question if you did know all that stuff.

What opinion would that be? I think you're delusional if you think I gave an opinion on anything.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

It takes no time to scale up to capacity. Nice try but you're still grasping at straws.

No time? You literally have no idea what it takes to perform these dangerous jobs. It isnt some office job where you onboard someone and hand them a laptop. This stuff takes weeks. Weeks we don't have in a war.

But make sure to check your closet to see if Putin is hiding there.

 

[hmt5000]

I'm telling you what is officially known. Whine about it if you wish.

Ok... So when we promised a certain number of artillery shells to Ukraine why did we constantly miss those targets? Why have we failed to reach that surge capacity after 2 years?

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

No time? You literally have no idea what it takes to perform these dangerous jobs. It isnt some office job where you onboard someone and hand them a laptop. This stuff takes weeks. Weeks we don't have in a war.

But make sure to check your closet to see if Putin is hiding there.

Keep on gaslighting.

So, I guess you're backtracking your absurd claim that we can't manufacture our war time needs. We can't do it or it'll take weeks, which one is it?

I didn't say much about Putin.

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

Ok... So when we promised a certain number of artillery shells to Ukraine why did we constantly miss those targets? Why have we failed to reach that surge capacity after 2 years?

Because we aren't at war. We're simply trying to help. Surely you know this.

 

[hmt5000]

Because we aren't at war. We're simply trying to help. Surely you know this.

But... we have promised this and set aside money for this yet still aren't doing it. Surely you get the implication... I hope you aren't this dense.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Keep on gaslighting.

So, I guess you're backtracking your absurd claim that we can't manufacture our war time needs. We can't do it or it'll take weeks, which one is it?

I didn't say much about Putin.

Backtracking? Lol hardly. Unfortunately modern day buzzwords dont plug the hole left by the more or less extinction of these industries. I know to the current day keyboard warrior they seem easy enough for any stupid person, but those industries require sweat of your brow skilled labor. If things aren't done exactly right - people die.

I brought up Putin mainly to tie it back to the thread but its definitely applicable. We have all this focus on someone who apparently cant defeat the Ukraine meanwhile china essentially subjugated Taiwan already along with Australia and probably india.

No it wasnt through physical force, but force isnt a requirement to be concerned. In fact achieving this much progress without force should alarm people but the putin boogeyman is still the msm focus.

 

[Spica Orbit]

"Very insolent performance" – Ukrainian foreign minister's comments over WWII Volhynia Massacre spark outrage in Poland

During a visit to Poland, Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba participated in the Campus Poland of the Future event in Olsztyn, hosted by Warsaw’s liberal mayor, Rafał Trzaskowski. When asked by an audience member about when Poland would finally be allowed to exhume the victims of the...

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[Spica Orbit]

Globalists Are Trying To Escalate The Ukraine War Into WWIII Before The US Election - Alt-Market.us

By Brandon Smith The purpose of NATO involvement in the Ukraine War has, to me, always appeared obvious. Ukraine has...

alt-market.us

 

[vhcat70]

Russia didn't need those power plants or oil refinery anyway.

 

[JumperJack]

Can that soviet tech take over all of Europe if he gets passed Ukraine?

Home run.

 

[hmt5000]

Globalists Are Trying To Escalate The Ukraine War Into WWIII Before The US Election - Alt-Market.us

By Brandon Smith The purpose of NATO involvement in the Ukraine War has, to me, always appeared obvious. Ukraine has...

alt-market.us

This... Ukraine has been pressuring NATO to do more to help. They want to attack further into Russia and hit more sensitive targets... with us doing the targeting and supplying the missiles. It's getting harder and harder to say we aren't involved in this war.

 

[vhcat70]

This... Ukraine has been pressuring NATO to do more to help. They want to attack further into Russia and hit more sensitive targets... with us doing the targeting and supplying the missiles. It's getting harder and harder to say we aren't involved in this war.

If involved means providing weapons and intelligence, we've been involved since early on. Beyond that, it's you making sh!t up once more.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Beyond that, it's you making sh!t up once more.

Calm down.

 

[Spica Orbit]

So much for sanctions: Russia surpasses US for gas exports to EU

From April to June, the European Union bought more than 12.7 billion cubic meters from Russia and 12.3 billion cubic meters from the United States. Director of the Russian Department of Economic Cooperation of the Foreign Ministry, Dmitri Birichevski, says Russia now supplies 15 percent of the...

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