The Ukraine war. (Yes, we'll mind our manners)

[WayneDougan]

Such a good man. He would have been a great president. I think he would have stopped the polarization of America.

He sucked.

 

[RunninRichie]

Do dumb people really think Putin is going to take over Europe if we don't send a billion kajillion dollars to Ukraine? And we are handing out stacks of cash. We are literally funding their media, infrastructure, police, and institutions.

Do dumb people really think Putin is going to take over Ukraine if we don't send a billion kajillion dollars to crimea?-WayneDougan in 2014.

 

[Catemus]

Do dumb people really think Putin is going to take over Europe if we don't send a billion kajillion dollars to Ukraine? And we are handing out stacks of cash. We are literally funding their media, infrastructure, police, and institutions.

“There’s nothing that provokes Vladimir Putin more than weakness.” John McCain

 

[Bill Cosby]

Oh, my god. Do you actually think of Putin as the “head of a party?” One that keeps “winning” elections to keep him in power?

Who said anything about elections? And what does that have to do with political prisoners dying in captivity or while being persecuted?

 

[Catemus]

He sucked.

No, that was Tucker Carlson interviewing Putin.

 

[WayneDougan]

Putin has been in charge of Russia since 2000 and he's taken over a small part of Ukraine. So I guess by 2050 he'll get to Kiev, and by 2075 he'll maybe move into Moldova. We should spend a trillion to ensure this doesn't happen, because I don't want a 125 year old Putin becoming Hitler 2.0.

 

[RunninRichie]

No, that was Tucker Carlson interviewing Putin.

Guy said Poland started WW2. But in Russia if you say the Red Army invaded Poland alongside the Nazis and handed jews over to the SS, you get arrested.

 

[RunninRichie]

Putin has been in charge of Russia since 2000 and he's taken over a small part of Ukraine. So I guess by 2050 he'll get to Kiev, and by 2075 he'll maybe move into Moldova. We should spend a trillion to ensure this doesn't happen, because I don't want a 125 year old Putin becoming Hitler 2.0.

Why do you think he hasn't gotten to ''Kiev'' and Moldova yet?

 

[WayneDougan]

Guy said Poland started WW2. But in Russia if you say the Red Army invaded Poland alongside the Nazis and handed jews over to the SS, you get arrested.

Oh no! I should definitely want to go to war with Russia now!

 

[RunninRichie]

Oh no! I should definitely want to go to war with Russia now!

Are you retarded? (yes) I was just pointing out how stupid Putin's view on history is.

 

[Catemus]

Guy said Poland started WW2. But in Russia if you say the Red Army invaded Poland alongside the Nazis and handed jews over to the SS, you get arrested.

Well, Hitler did ask nicely for Poland to hand over Gdańsk and they refused.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Lol once again, hard for Ukraine to win when political infighting in the house prevents aid to get to them. They have no F-16s still, the tanks they begged for arrived months late, same for a multitude of systems.


“Ukraine needs to prepare for a long war,” Olga Oliker, a former rand analyst and Pentagon staffer who is now the head of the Europe and Central Asia program at the International Crisis Group, told me. Oliker believes that a long war could be won, but it may not look like the victory some maximalists have been promising. “You have to create the space for Ukraine to claim victory under less-than-ideal conditions,” she said. “Because, if you say the only thing that is victory is the Russians go home entirely from Crimea and Donbas, Ukraine is in nato, and Moscow somehow disappears off the face of the earth—that’s an unrealistic goal. To me, Ukrainian victory is a situation in which Russia can’t do this again or at least is going to have a very hard time doing it again.”

“There’s a certain amount of instability that’s built into the Russian system that the Russians worry about,” Oliker said. “At some point, if they’re worried enough, they might be willing to negotiate.”


A senior Biden Administration official who has helped develop sanctions against Russia expounded on this theory. He said that, for some time, the Administration’s view has been that Russia can continue its current level of war expenditures into the spring of 2025, at which point it will run into trouble. He pointed to the freezing of Russian assets abroad, the running down of its hard-currency reserves, and the increasingly complex supply lines that Russia needs to evade Western sanctions. “It’s like a top that’s slowing down,” the official said. “They’re going to have to start making harder and harder choices, faster and faster, as we get into 2025. That’s a far cry from whatever Putin’s aim was in this war—which was, you know, reinstating Catherine the Great’s empire or something.”


He estimated that, with the help of Western air-defense systems, Ukrainian forces could shoot down as many as ninety per cent of Russian air-attack assets. “Without it, that number will be zero soon.”



From their point of view, they will feel that they have won a proxy war with nato. And they’re going to be angry, they’re going to want revenge, and now they think we’re weaker than we are. That’s a dangerous situation.”

Well, you don’t just jump into an F-16 and get flying. You need to be trained and that takes a minute.

Let’s hear a prediction. When do the “many” generals think Ukraine will start winning this war?

 

[Catemus]

Oh no! I should definitely want to go to war with Russia now!

I really don’t understand why you Putinists aren’t in the trenches serving your leader. He could use your help.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

An example is Len Blavatnik, a dual U.S.-U.K. citizen and one of the largest donors to GOP political action committees in the 2015-16 election cycle. Blavatnik's family emigrated to the U.S. in the late '70s from the U.S.S.R. and he returned to Russia when the Soviet Union began to collapse in the late '80s.

Data from the Federal Election Commission show that Blavatnik's campaign contributions dating back to 2009-10 were fairly balanced across party lines and relatively modest for a billionaire. During that season he contributed $53,400. His contributions increased to $135,552 in 2011-12 and to $273,600 in 2013-14, still bipartisan.

In 2015-16, everything changed. Blavatnik's political contributions soared and made a hard right turn as he pumped $6.35 million into GOP political action committees, with millions of dollars going to top Republican leaders including Sens. Mitch McConnell, Marco Rubio and Lindsey Graham.

In 2017, donations continued, with $41,000 going to both Republican and Democrat candidates, along with $1 million to McConnell's Senate Leadership Fund.

You’re doing great, James!

 

[RunninRichie]

Well, you don’t just jump into an F-16 and get flying. You need to be trained and that takes a minute.

Let’s hear a prediction. When do the “many” generals think Ukraine will start winning this war?

The training could have started back in 2022. But it didn't. Tanks could've been delivered months earlier, they didn't.

Is russia winning the war? They just took a town of 40,000 with massive losses. Estimates of vehicle losses are 30:1. Infantry? 13:1.

 

[Bill Cosby]

Do dumb people really think Putin is going to take over Ukraine if we don't send a billion kajillion dollars to crimea?-WayneDougan in 2014.

That’s actually the opposite of what everyone was saying in 2014. Trying to keep Putin distracted while luring Ukraine westward because it would be a provocation.

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[RunninRichie]

That’s actually the opposite of what everyone was saying in 2014. Trying to keep Putin distracted while luring Ukraine westward because it would be a provocation.

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The point is, weakness emboldens Putin. Hell, you idiots just saw what happened with Biden. He pulled out of Afghanistan in embarrasing fashion. Putin invades basically right after that. Now you morons want to do the same thing. CUT AID AND SEND IT TO OUR BORDER!! How is that going to look to Putin? He just won a proxy war against the weak west and NATO. Lets re-gear and take Poland. Our border has sucked for decades. Why do you think it's gonna suddenly be fixed? It sucked in 1950. 1960. 1970. 1980. 1990. 2000. 2010.


Aren't you the same people who shoot down american programs for americans. Because its ''socialism''. Lol, what a joke. You don't want the money to help americans. You just wanna own the libs.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Sadly, unserious requests do not generate a response. So, you'll have to figure this one out yourself.

Take time to learn about rhetorical questions. Anyone who has negotiated deals knows there is no difference. lol

Completely hyperbolic statement in your first sentence. As to your second, I think it's rather incumbent upon those, such as yourself, demanding that Ukraine immediately sue for peace, to explain how that creates anything resembling a stable framework for security in the region and how it would not have negative reverberations globally. Also, explain how foisting a completely unfavorable settlement at an inopportune time with Ukraine currently on the back foot would not be a geopolitical "own goal."

Anyway, I'm no fan of Biden and his administration, including the way they've gone about giving Ukraine aid. I think aid should have been much more front-loaded, and the U.S., together with Europe and other partners, could have been much more creative in financing (e.g., using some portion of seized Russian assets to pay for things) that frankly could have forestalled the current funding dispute.

Not hyperbolic, boss. Not at all.

And, what does “sue for peace” mean? LOL. Just make up knew phrases, much? Not going to defend a concept you just made up and no one else here mentioned.

Again, yet again, tell us when and how you expect this war to end. Thanks.

 

[RunninRichie]

Take time to learn about rhetorical questions. Anyone who has negotiated deals knows there is no difference. lol



Not hyperbolic, boss. Not at all.

And, what does “sue for peace” mean? LOL. Just make up knew phrases, much? Not going to defend a concept you just made up and no one else here mentioned.

Again, yet again, tell us when and how you expect this war to end. Thanks.

Lol

 

[Bill Cosby]

The point is, weakness emboldens Putin. Hell, you idiots just saw what happened with Biden. He pulled out of Afghanistan in embarrasing fashion. Putin invades basically right after that. Now you morons want to do the same thing. CUT AID AND SEND IT TO OUR BORDER!! How is that going to look to Putin? He just won a proxy war against the weak west and NATO. Lets re-gear and take Poland. Our border has sucked for decades. Why do you think it's gonna suddenly be fixed? It sucked in 1950. 1960. 1970. 1980. 1990. 2000. 2010.


Aren't you the same people who shoot down american programs for americans. Because its ''socialism''. Lol, what a joke. You don't want the money to help americans. You just wanna own the libs.

So let’s save the additional aide, let him rebuild Ukraine at his expense and elect a president who projects strength of the concern is Putin marching west.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

And yet, Trump still won’t say Putin is a bad man for murdering Navalny. LOL

And, you guys KEEP bringing up Trump. It’s the only thing the Biden wing for the GOP knows to do.

 

[RunninRichie]

And, you guys KEEP bringing up Trump. It’s the only thing the Biden wing for the GOP knows to do.

I hope Im never this ate up with politics.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

I hope Im never this ate up with politics.

Then stop bringing MAGA and Trump into the discussion as an attempt to dodge actually supporting your position, James.

 

[WayneDougan]

I really don’t understand why you Putinists aren’t in the trenches serving your leader. He could use your help.

People who want to fund Ukraine's logic:

1. Russia helped Trump win and must pay dearly
2. Give a zillion dollars to Ukraine
3. Say that anyone who disagrees is pro-Putin and should go fight against Ukraine
4. Willing to risk hundreds of thousands of lives plus a nuclear holocaust because of #1

Here's my logic:

1. Russia is a nuclear-armed former superpower who has a sphere of influence over parts of Ukraine - who, by the way, they've been warring with through separatists for a long time before the invasion.
2. We basically promised we wouldn't expand NATO; we did anyway.
3. Ukraine was poking the bear in regards to positioning itself to join NATO; Russia attacked.
4. I don't agree with Russia attacking Ukraine, but at the same time it's not my fight
5. I don't believe Ukraine is of strategic importance to the US
6. I don't believe Russia has the demographics or wealth to expand their "empire" again
7. I don't want to spend a dime on this
8. I can change my opinion if the threat level changes.

 

[RunninRichie]

Then stop bringing MAGA and Trump into the discussion as an attempt to dodge actually supporting your position, James.

It's not divisive to say the MAGA wing of the GOP is causing the disruption in getting Ukraine aid. That is just facts. But, you're not very intelligent.

 

[RunninRichie]

People who want to fund Ukraine's logic:

1. Russia helped Trump win and must pay dearly
2. Give a zillion dollars to Ukraine
3. Say that anyone who disagrees is pro-Putin and should go fight against Ukraine
4. Willing to risk hundreds of thousands of lives plus a nuclear holocaust because of #1

Here's my logic:

1. Russia is a nuclear-armed former superpower who has a sphere of influence over parts of Ukraine - who, by the way, they've been warring with through separatists for a long time before the invasion.
2. We basically promised we wouldn't expand NATO; we did anyway.
3. Ukraine was poking the bear in regards to positioning itself to join NATO; Russia attacked.
4. I don't agree with Russia attacking Ukraine, but at the same time it's not my fight
5. I don't believe Ukraine is of strategic importance to the US
6. I don't believe Russia has the demographics or wealth to expand their "empire" again
7. I don't want to spend a dime on this
8. I can change my opinion if the threat level changes.

Your 1st bullet point is hilarious. Shows how kooky you are.

 

[WayneDougan]

Your 1st bullet point is hilarious. Shows how kooky you are.

For four years all you losers talked about was Russian collusion (which was fake). Of course your hatred for Russia grew. Russia took Crimea when Obama was president and y'all didn't do shit (rightfully). The difference now is that you had six years of hating Trump under your belt.

 

[RunninRichie]

For four years all you losers talked about was Russian collusion (which was fake). Of course your hatred for Russia grew. Russia took Crimea when Obama was president and y'all didn't do shit (rightfully). The difference now is that you had six years of hating Trump under your belt.

I don't dislike Trump. He's right on alot of issues. I think he's a bit better than Biden. I just don't agree with his supporters on Ukraine. Who most of the time are morons. You're exhibit A. Everyone who isn't lockstep 100 percent on every view point. Is a ''lib''. Or a ''leftie''. You're so polazirzed by politics it's sad.

 

[WayneDougan]

I don't dislike Trump. He's right on alot of issues. I think he's a bit better than Biden. I just don't agree with his supporters on Ukraine. Who most of the time are morons. You're exhibit A. Everyone who isn't lockstep 100 percent on every view point. Is a ''lib''. Or a ''leftie''. You're so polazirzed by politics it's sad.

I have been consistent on these two issues since high school:

1. Enforce borders
2. Be protectionist in terms of trade
3. Balance the budget
4. Limit foreign aid

MAGA is the only party right now who at least partially believes in the first two. And they are only holding up Ukraine and Israel aid because of #1. So I actually disagree with most of MAGA in terms of aid packages.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

It's not divisive to say the MAGA wing of the GOP is causing the disruption in getting Ukraine aid. That is just facts. But, you're not very intelligent.

Yeah, you are a sock account and I am the one who is not very smart. Gotcha!

You are a political jackleg who cannot answer simple questions, but would prefer to claim people are MAGAs and pro-Putin for going against the war hawks and Biden. If you could accurately describe those with opposing views, it would be a good start to sounding credible.

But, no one expects you to sound credible, James.

 

[RunninRichie]

Yeah, you are a sock account and I am the one who is not very smart. Gotcha!

You are a political jackleg who cannot answer simple questions, but would prefer to claim people are MAGAs and pro-Putin for going against the war hawks and Biden. If you could accurately describe those with opposing views, it would be a good start to sounding credible.

But, no one expects you to sound credible, James.

Now, im a jameslee32 sock account. Looks like I hit a nerve. Am I making you sweat in your lazy boy while you watch fox news? You are MAGAs. Look in the political thread. Y'all go in there and call for civil war all the time. Then drop a bible verse.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Now, im a jameslee32 sock account. Lol, get help. Am I making you sweat in your lazy boy while you watch fox news? You are MAGAs. Look in the political thread. Y'all go in there and call for civil war all the time. Then drop a bible verse.

Oh my! The James cliches are rolling again. Fox. Lazy boy. MAGAs.

Geez, find an original thought, James.

 

[Catemus]

People who want to fund Ukraine's logic:

1. Russia helped Trump win and must pay dearly
2. Give a zillion dollars to Ukraine
3. Say that anyone who disagrees is pro-Putin and should go fight against Ukraine
4. Willing to risk hundreds of thousands of lives plus a nuclear holocaust because of #1

5. People who want to fund Ukraine's logic:
   

   1. Russia helped Trump win and must pay dearly
   2. Give a zillion dollars to Ukraine
   3. Say that anyone who disagrees is pro-Putin and should go fight against Ukraine
   4. Willing to risk hundreds of thousands of lives plus a nuclear holocaust because of #1

   Here's my logic:
   

   1. Russia is a nuclear-armed former superpower who has a sphere of influence over parts of Ukraine - who, by the way, they've been warring with through separatists for a long time before the invasion.
   2. We basically promised we wouldn't expand NATO; we did anyway.
   3. Ukraine was poking the bear in regards to positioning itself to join NATO; Russia attacked.
   4. I don't agree with Russia attacking Ukraine, but at the same time it's not my fight
   5. I don't believe Ukraine is of strategic importance to the US
   6. I don't believe Russia has the demographics or wealth to expand their "empire" again
   7. I don't want to spend a dime on this
   8. I can change my opinion if the threat level changes.

Here's my logic:

1. Russia is a nuclear-armed former superpower who has a sphere of influence over parts of Ukraine - who, by the way, they've been warring with through separatists for a long time before the invasion.
2. We basically promised we wouldn't expand NATO; we did anyway.
3. Ukraine was poking the bear in regards to positioning itself to join NATO; Russia attacked.
4. I don't agree with Russia attacking Ukraine, but at the same time it's not my fight
5. I don't believe Ukraine is of strategic importance to the US
6. I don't believe Russia has the demographics or wealth to expand their "empire" again
7. I don't want to spend a dime on this
8. I can change my opinion if the threat level changes.

I get it, man. You’re okay with Putin taking Ukraine. Most of us are not, however, because we respect Ukraine as a sovereign nation that can decide its future for itself, minus Putin.

 

[RunninRichie]

Oh my! The James cliches are rolling again. Fox. Lazy boy. MAGAs.

Geez, find an original thought, James.

Find some meds, Grandpa.

 

[Catemus]

I have been consistent on these two issues since high school:

1. Enforce borders
2. Be protectionist in terms of trade
3. Balance the budget
4. Limit foreign aid

MAGA is the only party right now who at least partially believes in the first two. And they are only holding up Ukraine and Israel aid because of #1. So I actually disagree with most of MAGA in terms of aid packages.

5. End federal welfare programs.

That would provide enough money to solve #3.

 

[RunninRichie]

I'm a Jeffersonian. I look at it like this

"Countries... have a right to be free, and we a right to aid them, as a strong man has a right to assist a weak one assailed by a robber or murderer." --Thomas Jefferson to J. Monroe, 1816.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

I get it, man. You’re okay with Putin taking Ukraine. Most of us are not, however, because we respect Ukraine as a sovereign nation that can decide its future for itself, minus Putin.

Wow. “We respect Ukraine as a sovereign nation.” Congratulations! That is one high brow irrelevant thought. You go with that.

Now, predict when and how this ends. At least attempt some common sense.

If you think Ukraine will win this war, at least give us a time frame to judge your prediction. Should we see Ukraine success in 6 months? A year?

Come on. You can read my comments in this thread. I was not against early support for Ukraine, but wanted it to be for an end to the war. Ukrainian victory would be the ideal. But, from early it was obvious that was a pipe dream for the uninformed. So, I supported Ukraine so that we could keep the leverage on Russia to get a compromised resolution.

But, you war squirts don’t have an end game and don’t care about the deaths and destruction. Ukraine will be crushed under your plan. That is not support for the sovereignty of Ukraine.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Find some meds, Grandpa.

Between the two of us, my guess is you are on the meds.

 

[RunninRichie]

Wow. “We respect Ukraine as a sovereign nation.” Congratulations! That is one high brow irrelevant thought. You go with that.

Now, predict when and how this ends. At least attempt some common sense.

If you think Ukraine will win this war, at least give us a time frame to judge your prediction. Should we see Ukraine success in 6 months? A year?

Come on. You can read my comments in this thread. I was not against early support for Ukraine, but wanted it to be for an end to the war. Ukrainian victory would be the ideal. But, from early it was obvious that was a pipe dream for the uninformed. So, I supported Ukraine so that we could keep the leverage on Russia to get a compromised resolution.

But, you war squirts don’t have an end game and don’t care about the deaths and destruction. Ukraine will be crushed under your plan. That is not support for the sovereignty of Ukraine.

What don't you get? Ukraine isn't getting enough aid and it's not fast enough. Sorry, you think the ukrainian's aren't moving fast enough. In your comfortable home. You keep saying you care about the death's of ''young men'' in ukraine. But repeatedly oppose live saving aid to Ukraine. A pentagon staffer said that Russia can continue this war until spring 2025.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

What don't you get? Ukraine isn't getting enough aid and it's not fast enough. Sorry, you think the ukrainian's aren't moving fast enough. In your comfortable home. You keep saying you care about the death's of ''young men'' in ukraine. But repeatedly oppose live saving aid to Ukraine. A pentagon staffer said that Russia can continue this war until spring 2025.

You’re the one in the Lazy Boy spouting irrelevant ad hominems supporting a war and death that has NO impact on your family or your wellbeing.

Life saving aid would be for world leadership to step up and attempt to put an end to this war. Financing a war that kills Ukrainians is not life saving. Get a new schtick, James, because you lack logic.