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The Ukraine war. (Yes, we'll mind our manners)

The Republican shills for Putin in here turn my stomach.

Can someone point to one time in history where being afraid of war and appeasing an aggressive foe paid off?

We must stop Putin in Ukraine, period. History demands it. If Putin succeeds in Ukraine then China takes Taiwan. Stop Putin and make a lesson of him in that the world will not tolerate this as China is watching very closely and must be thrilled at the Republican enablers that have joined Russia, China, and Iran as full partners in The Axis.

If you're afraid of Russia in Ukraine then what in the bleep are you going to say about a much, much more powerful China with imminent designs on Taiwan?

Doesn’t really matter what anyones positions on here is. We’re not calling the shots.

We will see if Joe and the left bring that same energy against China when they invade Taiwan. We both know he won’t and the media and his followers will give us a million bs reasons why.
 
So you think those people in SE Turkey are somehow flooding into Europe? I highly doubt it.
The 4-5 million Syrian refugees in turkey plus the Syrians directly affected potentially more so than the Turkish side will need a place to go. There was already a flood of Syrians living in that region of turkey now with no access to food water or shelter. And it’s not like a quake stops at the border some of the worst of it happened in Syria where the countries infrastructure was already severely damaged due to war. Idk how you can make a statement that stops with turkey and not include Syria into the equation. Turks have a place to go. Syrians in refugee camps do not
 
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The 4-5 million Syrian refugees in turkey plus the Syrians directly affected potentially more so than the Turkish side will need a place to go. There was already a flood of Syrians living in that region of turkey now with no access to food water or shelter. And it’s not like a quake stops at the border some of the worst of it happened in Syria where the countries infrastructure was already severely damaged due to war. Idk how you can make a statement that stops with turkey and not include Syria into the equation. Turks have a place to go. Syrians in refugee camps do not
I didn't say they wouldn't move but going to Europe from there is a tall order.
 
Doesn’t really matter what anyones positions on here is. We’re not calling the shots.

We will see if Joe and the left bring that same energy against China when they invade Taiwan. We both know he won’t and the media and his followers will give us a million bs reasons why.
The situations are different. The US has a treaty with Ukraine but according to ChatGPT:

“The United States does not have formal diplomatic relations with Taiwan, as the US recognizes the People's Republic of China as the sole legal government of China, including Taiwan. However, the US has informal relations with Taiwan, through the Taiwan Relations Act, which provides the legal framework for unofficial ties between the two countries. The Act calls for the continuation of commercial, cultural, and other relations between the people of the US and the people on Taiwan and the preservation of human rights on Taiwan.”

Still, I can’t see the US and many other countries not assisting Taiwan in the event of a Chinese invasion.

ETA: Here’s ChatGPT’s response when asked if the US has any treaties with Ukraine.

“Yes, the United States has a number of treaties and agreements with Ukraine. Some of the most significant ones include:

  1. Partnership for Peace Framework Document: signed in 1994, it established a framework for military cooperation and provided the basis for Ukraine's participation in NATO's Partnership for Peace program.
  2. Open Skies Treaty: signed in 1992, it provides for unarmed aerial observation flights over the territories of its signatories to promote transparency and confidence-building in military activities.
  3. Agreement on Peaceful Uses of Nuclear Energy: signed in 1998, it promotes cooperation in the peaceful use of nuclear energy and technology.
  4. Memorandum of Understanding on Defense Cooperation: signed in 1997, it outlines the framework for cooperation in defense and military areas.”
 
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I didn't say they wouldn't move but going to Europe from there is a tall order.
Why? They’ve been doing it since the beginning of the civil war and frankly it’s the only area that will absorb them. They would be in Syria if they could and turkey has kept them in that small region. They don’t want a hodgepodge of ethnicities blending in turkey.
 
Why? They’ve been doing it since the beginning of the civil war and frankly it’s the only area that will absorb them. They would be in Syria if they could and turkey has kept them in that small region. They don’t want a hodgepodge of ethnicities blending in turkey.
Its a long journey through an easily controlled bottleneck.
 
Yep, it's always just been about giving away a few eastern Ukraine provinces & we can have peace with Putin. LOL.

"Ramzan Kadyrov, (Chechen warlord), a key ally of Russian President Vladimir Putin, has begun rattling off threats about attacking Poland after Ukraine.

Kadyrov, the head of Chechnya, suggested Monday that Russia should “denazify and demilitarize” Poland next.

“What if, after the successful completion of the NMD, Russia begins to denazify and demilitarize the next country? After all, after Ukraine, Poland is on the map! I will not hide that I personally have such an intention,” Kadyrov said on Telegram. “I personally have such an intention, and I have repeatedly stated that the fight against Satanism should continue throughout Europe and, first of all, on the territory of Poland.”

Kadyrov warned Tuesday that the time has come for the West to fall to its knees before Russia, predicting that the so-called “special military operation” in Ukraine, would be over by the end of 2023.

“The special [military] operation will be over before the end of this year. European countries will admit they have been wrong, the West will fall to its knees, and, as usual, European countries will have to cooperate with the Russian Federation in all spheres,” Kadyrov said, according to TASS. “There should not and will never be an alternative to that.”
 
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This hasn’t driven Russia to China’s camp. It’s made them China’s bitch. China and India have been able to dictate their own prices for gas as a result of the sanctions.
Another negative consequence for us. Nevertheless, we don’t want Russia and China on the same team when the inevitable happens.
 
Another negative consequence for us. Nevertheless, we don’t want Russia and China on the same team when the inevitable happens.
Putin and Xi announced a supposed "no limits" partnership shortly before the invasion. Xi obviously has buyer's remorse now.

In some respects, their interests align; in others, they don't.
 
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Yep, it's always just been about giving away a few eastern Ukraine provinces & we can have peace with Putin. LOL.

"Ramzan Kadyrov, (Chechen warlord), a key ally of Russian President Vladimir Putin, has begun rattling off threats about attacking Poland after Ukraine.

Kadyrov, the head of Chechnya, suggested Monday that Russia should “denazify and demilitarize” Poland next.

“What if, after the successful completion of the NMD, Russia begins to denazify and demilitarize the next country? After all, after Ukraine, Poland is on the map! I will not hide that I personally have such an intention,” Kadyrov said on Telegram. “I personally have such an intention, and I have repeatedly stated that the fight against Satanism should continue throughout Europe and, first of all, on the territory of Poland.”

Kadyrov warned Tuesday that the time has come for the West to fall to its knees before Russia, predicting that the so-called “special military operation” in Ukraine, would be over by the end of 2023.

“The special [military] operation will be over before the end of this year. European countries will admit they have been wrong, the West will fall to its knees, and, as usual, European countries will have to cooperate with the Russian Federation in all spheres,” Kadyrov said, according to TASS. “There should not and will never be an alternative to that.”
If we fell to our knees we’d still be at eye level with Kadyrov. He’s a feisty little dwarf.

It’s amazing how little men come to power in Russia. I wonder what advantage being midgets gives them!

Oh, I think I’ve got it. “Hey, Kadyrov, while you’re down there…”
 
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Written like a true Russian shill. Propaganda is a sacred part of the Putin sound machine. Hope you’re getting your rubbles by direct deposit. There are so many to a dollar now that you’ll be getting them in a trash bag otherwise.
There it is again. Blame people who don't want death and destruction and the loss of billions of dollars of being Putin puppets. You still believe in the Russian collusion hoax? LOL. How many Ukrainians are you willing to sacrifice to get your war boner on?
 
No it wouldn’t have been over. You got that part wrong. “We” don’t decide anything other than if and how much to help. Ukraine fights because they feel they have no choice, as an imperial neighbor wants to erase their homeland. It really is as simple as that.
They had a peace agreement that set Minsk 2 as the law but Boris Johnson showed up and blew up the deal because he said that nato wouldn't help rebuild if Ukraine signed a peace deal. This is a war to collapse Russia financially and the warhawks are willing to lose 1 million Ukrainians if they'll fight that long.
 
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The Republican shills for Putin in here turn my stomach.

Can someone point to one time in history where being afraid of war and appeasing an aggressive foe paid off?

We must stop Putin in Ukraine, period. History demands it. If Putin succeeds in Ukraine then China takes Taiwan. Stop Putin and make a lesson of him in that the world will not tolerate this as China is watching very closely and must be thrilled at the Republican enablers that have joined Russia, China, and Iran as full partners in The Axis.

If you're afraid of Russia in Ukraine then what in the bleep are you going to say about a much, much more powerful China with imminent designs on Taiwan?
So you are going to volunteer to go over I assume...
 
The Republican shills for Putin in here turn my stomach.

Can someone point to one time in history where being afraid of war and appeasing an aggressive foe paid off?

We must stop Putin in Ukraine, period. History demands it. If Putin succeeds in Ukraine then China takes Taiwan. Stop Putin and make a lesson of him in that the world will not tolerate this as China is watching very closely and must be thrilled at the Republican enablers that have joined Russia, China, and Iran as full partners in The Axis.

If you're afraid of Russia in Ukraine then what in the bleep are you going to say about a much, much more powerful China with imminent designs on Taiwan?
Just curious... If we fight China over Taiwan will they still send us cheap stuff to buy and phones and microchips? There was a guy that wanted to move tons of production away from China and he was called a racist. Without doing anything about that fact people seem to want to go to war with China. Do you realize how dependent we have become on China? If we plan to go to war with them then shouldn't we decouple first?
 
Are the pro war people aware that Ukraine is on their 7th mobilization and are drafting kids of 16 and men as old as 60? If Ukraine isn't losing tons of men on the frontlines, then why are they taking such steps to recruit warm bodies?
 
Are the pro war people aware that Ukraine is on their 7th mobilization and are drafting kids of 16 and men as old as 60? If Ukraine isn't losing tons of men on the frontlines, then why are they taking such steps to recruit warm bodies?
I don’t think people understand how thin the ranks are becoming in the Ukrainian military. I expect Russia to eventually make the dnipro river and then fall into a defensive posture. Zelensky knows Russia is gonna take that territory but he’s banking on nato weapons to make another offensive push. That prior counter offensive was early when Russia was in attack mode. once they conquer those territories and sit back it would be the equivalent of Ukraine attacking Russia proper. They won’t have enough troops to get through the frontlines. Russia is already calling up more conscripts and once they make to dnipro river they will end up with 1/2 million soldiers on that border.

If zelensky plans are to attack Crimea and Russian cities as has been proposed he will run the risk of losing his entire nation.

Two things that should have happened that doom Ukraine. First they waited until Russia attacked before procuring the weapons and man power necessary to fight any war. Ukraine should have built that military before the war in order to deter but half the money was wasted, lost to corruption. The other thing is this. Ukraine should have made a deal over Crimea and allowed for internationally monitored elections to take place in Donbas. Countries do still allow for referendums for independence. That isn’t some one off as some suggest. Quebec for instance has had two votes to declare independence from Canada. If it ever passes Canada won’t use force to keep Quebec. I just had a couple nordiques stay with me and the thing they take pride in is how Quebec is culturally completely different than canada. The Donbas and Crimea are prime examples of the same thing.
 
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There it is again. Blame people who don't want death and destruction and the loss of billions of dollars of being Putin puppets. You still believe in the Russian collusion hoax? LOL. How many Ukrainians are you willing to sacrifice to get your war boner on?
Ahh, the Great Shill speaks. Maybe blathers is the better word.

Are you here for a moment to catch up? Too many sites to cover with your propaganda?

You’re easy to spot, you know. What are some handles you’re using on other sites? I’ll bet I’ve alerted others to your presence on them.

Earn those rubbles, Igor. They’re devaluing fast.
 
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Don’t see it. We’re actually in a good position to export more as a result. Make up something else though. We can keep going.
“We” in the West comprise more than the United States. This has been discussed at length.
 
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None have yet. Consistent in their armchair courage. So there’s that.
We’re satisfied with what our tax dollars are doing, Jack. I’d encourage you to visit Moscow, though.

You might wind up in a trench with Russian convicts, though. Putin is throwing Russia’s rabble on the front lines first. He needs the cannon fodder gone before he sends his pretty boys in.
 
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You’re easy to spot, you know. What are some handles you’re using on other sites? I’ll bet I’ve alerted others to your presence on them.
You’ve done it. You’ve sniffed out a Russki.

Maybe you use your powers of investigation to explain why we’re funding foreign war when we can’t fund our own debt. It would be refreshing.
 
We’re satisfied with what our tax dollars are doing, Jack. I’d encourage you to visit Moscow, though.

You might wind up in a trench with Russian convicts, though. Putin is throwing Russia’s rabble on the front lines first. He needs the cannon fodder gone before he sends his pretty boys in.
Wait, so he’s not committed his best troops? And here I thought Ivan was already whipped.

You are a treasure of contradiction. A perfect spokesman for this war, actually.
 
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Wait, so he’s not committed his best troops? And here I thought Ivan was already whipped.

You are a treasure of contradiction. A perfect spokesman for this war, actually.
Putting words together is not your strong suit. I recommend that you use ChatGPT to proofread your quips. It can make them much more coherent.
 
Putting words together is not your strong suit. I recommend that you use ChatGPT to proofread your quips. It can make them much more coherent.
ChatGPT. Intelligence programmed by someone else. Damn, the irony.

If you can’t comprehend the written word, then your inability to explain why we should support this war is completely understandable.
 
ChatGPT. Intelligence programmed by someone else. Damn, the irony.

If you can’t comprehend the written word, then your inability to explain why we should support this war is completely understandable.
It isn’t programmed. It’s trained. Dang, how old are you? Try it, you might like it.
 
It isn’t programmed. It’s trained. Dang, how old are you? Try it, you might like it.
Old enough to not rely on others to think for me.

Try it, you might like it. Start with your reasoning for our support of this war.
 
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Yeah us exporting energy to Europe is a loss for us all. Hang it up bro.
So, as I’ve implied about three different times now, the drag on the western economy affects more than us. Per CNN, who, I suppose, needs to also “hang it up.”

It’s not AI, so not everyone here will be able to furrow their brows and comprehend it, but perhaps you might.

About 40% of German companies expect business to decline in 2023, and another 35% think it will stagnate, according to a November survey of 2,500 firms conducted by the German Economic Institute.

Companies cited elevated energy costs, the price of raw materials and inflation among the reasons for their pessimism.


Frederick Persson, chief executive for Central and Eastern Europe at Prysmian Group, an Italian-owned cables manufacturer, told CNN in October that eye-watering energy bills had the potential to shut the business down.

Three months later, the situation is still “shaky,” he said, even though Prysmian has managed to cut its consumption of gas by close to a third in the region by lowering the heat in its offices and plants.


A big push by households and businesses to use less gas — encouraged by a voluntary 15% reduction target set by the European Union — has helped keep stores full, and bring prices down.

German industry is no longer worried that a severe shortage of gas could lead to mandatory rationing, or even blackouts.


But, for Prysmian, much of the damage has already been done. Since September, the company has cut about 15% of its workforce in the region. It has started buying cheaper machinery from Turkey which, Persson said, experiences fewer “electrical cost spikes” compared to Germany.

“[Energy prices] will mean that we will invest less in Germany, for sure,” he added.
 
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If we were producing more of it you’d be correct but we re not and fuel prices are on their way back up. China gave everyone a reprieve with their lockdowns.
Oil price dropped to a 20+ years low in 2020 due to pandemic & no one driving. It's still lower than 15 years ago. Byt yes, you're correct that it's rising - a 50/50 chance.
 
So, as I’ve implied about three different times now, the drag on the western economy affects more than us. Per CNN, who, I suppose, needs to also “hang it up.”

It’s not AI, so not everyone here will be able to furrow their brows and comprehend it, but perhaps you might.

About 40% of German companies expect business to decline in 2023, and another 35% think it will stagnate, according to a November survey of 2,500 firms conducted by the German Economic Institute.

Companies cited elevated energy costs, the price of raw materials and inflation among the reasons for their pessimism.


Frederick Persson, chief executive for Central and Eastern Europe at Prysmian Group, an Italian-owned cables manufacturer, told CNN in October that eye-watering energy bills had the potential to shut the business down.

Three months later, the situation is still “shaky,” he said, even though Prysmian has managed to cut its consumption of gas by close to a third in the region by lowering the heat in its offices and plants.


A big push by households and businesses to use less gas — encouraged by a voluntary 15% reduction target set by the European Union — has helped keep stores full, and bring prices down.

German industry is no longer worried that a severe shortage of gas could lead to mandatory rationing, or even blackouts.


But, for Prysmian, much of the damage has already been done. Since September, the company has cut about 15% of its workforce in the region. It has started buying cheaper machinery from Turkey which, Persson said, experiences fewer “electrical cost spikes” compared to Germany.

“[Energy prices] will mean that we will invest less in Germany, for sure,” he added.

It’s interesting stuff but the German energy sector can not be considered objective voices. Many of them are in Putin’s pocket. If they weren’t we wouldn’t be in this position in the first place.
 
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