Queen James is still whining...

[Mr_GG]

I applaud the troll attempts in your last 2 posts. 10/10

Lebron went to Miami to play with some guys who were actually all-stars (Wade and Bosh). Up to that point, the best players he had played with were Mo Williams and Zydrunas Ilgauskas. Miami was a good team with Lebron and Wade, but certainly nothing like the Warriors.

Mario Chalmers was the main point guard for most of Lebron's time in Miami. Udonis Haslem was the best big man option. The only player to ever have a PPG average in double digits besides the big 3 was 37 year old Ray Allen.

That team did have some nice role players and it certainly was a good team, but nobody will ever remember that team as "one of the greatest of all time". I think everyone saying Lebron being responsible for starting the super teams is mainly because of "The Decision" and the ceremony where he said they're going to win 15 straight championships (all of which was stupid).

Lebron left Cleveland after their front office proved that they were not going to get another legit allstar to play with him. Lebron went to a team that finished 7th in the East the year before he arrived to play with one of his good friends.

In comparison, Durant played with Westbrook, Harden, and Serge Ibaka but never won. Durant was up 3-1 in last year's Western Conference finals and went to the team that beat his. He went to a team that had the guy who won the last 2 MVPs, had 3 all stars and the best bench in the NBA, finished 1st in the West, and just set the NBA record for most wins in a season. That would have been the equivalent to Lebron going to Boston at the time.

 

[shutzhund]

This thread reveals more about the LBJ haters than it does about MJ.

 

[SemperFiCat]

I've always wondered if Jordan would still have this odd infallible ora about him if he'd played in a time with social media. People have made him god-like over the years.

 

[Big_Blue79]

, crying, complaining, and still not playing defense.

Now he's saying he's never played on a 'super team'. Uh, wasn't he the same loser that made 'The Decision' nonsense, so he could buy a title with the Heat?

Ahahaha! You said queen instead of his nickname king, implying that he is acting womanly! Oh, man, what a knee-slapper! Whew, my sides! Oh, please, do more!

 

[Blueaz]

This thread reveals more about the LBJ haters than it does about MJ.

IMO... it is the opposite...the lovers fight anyone who may disagree (if only slightly) AND THEN rule that poster a hater

 

[BlueBlood66]

IMO... it is the opposite...the lovers fight anyone who may disagree (if only slightly) AND THEN rule that poster a hater

IMO... it is the opposite... the haters fight anyone who may disagree (if only slightly) AND THEN rule that poster a lover

 

[Mr_GG]

IMO... it is the opposite... the haters fight anyone who may disagree (if only slightly) AND THEN rule that poster a lover

Most people who want to discount Lebron usually state somewhere in their post "I can't stand Lebron" or say something similar. I couldn't stand Kobe, but I give him credit where credit is due.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

@CottonNash44 Good stuff.

My question to super teams though is.. 1. Was Jordan on a "super team" during this time with Pippen, Rodman and others? and 2. does it really matter if it was purposely formed or not, in the context of strictly looking at strength of teams?

I don't like that Lebron and others recently are trying to create super teams. Point for MJ on that... but for debating strength of teams purely on who's around him, Jordan's teams were no slouches, whether he formed them or not.

 

[Bobcat94]

I never played on a super team...

This is supposed to take anything away from what I posted. All he does is win and he is a great role model. You never see negative press about him on or away from the court.

 

[MakinMusic]

It's largely a generational issue.....the whining. He's a millenial.

 

[Nubb16]

I bash him because he is a bitch and the East is a joke.

I also hate Cleveland and Ohio for that matter.

Cleveland sucks! And people from Ohio in general suck.

 

[Mr_GG]

He's certainly had more help.

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Not criticizing you, but I think that's a really stupid stat considering that most of those all-star appearances came from either over the hill players who used to be legit all-stars or players who were selected to be an all-star simply because the Cavs were the best in the East so the 2nd best player from the Cavs got in:

Shaq (15 all-star appearances) was fat and a few years from retirement, Ray Allen (10 all-star appearances) averaged 10 ppg his best year with Lebron, Shawn Marion (4) wasn't good, Rashard Lewis (2) wasn't good, Deron Williams (3) isn't good anymore, Ben Wallace (4) wasn't good, and Zydrunas Ilguaskas (2)/ Mo Williams (1) basically were all-stars because they played with Lebron. Lebron really has had Wade, Bosh, Irving, and Love who you could say were actually all-star level players while he played with him.

 

[BlueBlood66]

It's largely a generational issue.....the whining. He's a millenial.

Someone should have raised them better.

 

[Wildcat-in-STL]

Millennials don't hold a monopoly on complaining.... just saying.

 

[uky8unc5]

This thread reveals more about the LBJ haters than it does about MJ.

It's OK to be an LBJ hater.
It's chicken crap to refuse to own up to it.

 

[uky8unc5]

Millennials don't hold a monopoly on complaining.... just saying.

Amen! And I'm a Granddad to a Millennial!! They're not half as 'messed up' as the last half of us Boomers were/are.

 

[Adolph B. Calipari]

Not gonna debate the super team thing. Even my personal favorite Jordan had a few key pieces added for some of his runs. Harper (a 20 ppg guy for LAC) and Rodman come to mind.

LeBron is easily one of the greatest to ever play. Not even a debate guys. He has taken some garbage teams to the finals. Take any team in the league except Brooklyn and add LeBron and that team is a contender. What other player can you say that about?

 

[Blueaz]

IMO... it is the opposite... the haters fight anyone who may disagree (if only slightly) AND THEN rule that poster a lover

I see what you did there...

 

[DevilFan1989]

LBJ is the GOAT. Jordan only went to 6 NBA Finals. Longevity matters and LBJ will probably end up with 12-15 NBA Finals appearances before his career wraps up.

LeBron will probably take the Iguodala role on another title contender towards the end of his career and win a few more rings so he definitely surpasses Jordan.

 

[GLR5555]

Not gonna debate the super team thing. Even my personal favorite Jordan had a few key pieces added for some of his runs. Harper (a 20 ppg guy for LAC) and Rodman come to mind.

LeBron is easily one of the greatest to ever play. Not even a debate guys. He has taken some garbage teams to the finals. Take any team in the league except Brooklyn and add LeBron and that team is a contender. What other player can you say that about?

Larry Bird maybe. He had the greatest turnaround in history with a 29 win team to a 61 win team his rookie year. No other superstars were added. Just sayin.

 

[Mike-D]

Lebron went to Miami to play with some guys who were actually all-stars (Wade and Bosh). Up to that point, the best players he had played with were Mo Williams and Zydrunas Ilgauskas. Miami was a good team with Lebron and Wade, but certainly nothing like the Warriors.

Mario Chalmers was the main point guard for most of Lebron's time in Miami. Udonis Haslem was the best big man option. The only player to ever have a PPG average in double digits besides the big 3 was 37 year old Ray Allen.

That team did have some nice role players and it certainly was a good team, but nobody will ever remember that team as "one of the greatest of all time". I think everyone saying Lebron being responsible for starting the super teams is mainly because of "The Decision" and the ceremony where he said they're going to win 15 straight championships (all of which was stupid).

Lebron left Cleveland after their front office proved that they were not going to get another legit allstar to play with him. Lebron went to a team that finished 7th in the East the year before he arrived to play with one of his good friends.

In comparison, Durant played with Westbrook, Harden, and Serge Ibaka but never won. Durant was up 3-1 in last year's Western Conference finals and went to the team that beat his. He went to a team that had the guy who won the last 2 MVPs, had 3 all stars and the best bench in the NBA, finished 1st in the West, and just set the NBA record for most wins in a season. That would have been the equivalent to Lebron going to Boston at the time.

I love when people bring hard facts to the table. Refreshing

 

[tycornett9]

How many of you just bash Lebron because you want Jordan to remain the best ever?

approximately 99% of them

 

[catntn]

I heard he is pulling a Durant and going to the Warriors.

 

[Fox2monk]

Who said Jordan was best ever? Not me. Jordan might be in the top ten.

If you don't have Jordan in the top three you are nuts. You may not like him, you may value overall titles, but to say maybe top ten is a ridiculous statement.

 

[Ron Mehico]

If you actually watched Jordan play live then its hard for me to believe you would put LeBron ahead of him. Jordan was vastly more skilled and aggressive. LeBron is absolutely way more athletic and a better passer and overall athlete, but when it comes to scoring or taking a game over or getting his teammates to compete its not really comparable IMO.

 

[tycornett9]

i can handle the Jordan/LBJ arguments all day, but you've got to be out of your mind if you actually believe Kobe is anywhere close to either of them

 

[JohnBlue_]

 

[Untouchables96]

I can't stand LeBron but I never liked Jordan or Kobe either.

 

[SemperFiCat]

I can't stand LeBron but I never liked Jordan or Kobe either.

Do you like basketball in general?

 

[Untouchables96]

Yes but all three of them are either egomaniacs or terrible people. Plus I'm a Pacers fan.

 

[Ryan Lemonds Diary]

Did anyone hear the caller on KSR's show from Monday say that the Jordan led Bulls wouldn't stay within 30 of either team in this years finals? and Matt agreed with him.

Are you freaking kidding me? Can you imagine the whining LeBron would do playing in the 90's? Let Laimbeer, Rodman, Charles Oakley or anyone of the other guys that played back then put him on the floor and he would have to run to the locker room to change his diaper. LeBron is only as good as he is because of his athletic/physical attributes. He is not a player with the most overall skill.

 

[GLR5555]

Did anyone hear the caller on KSR's show from Monday say that the Jordan led Bulls wouldn't stay within 30 of either team in this years finals? and Matt agreed with him.

Are you freaking kidding me? Can you imagine the whining LeBron would do playing in the 90's? Let Laimbeer, Rodman, Charles Oakley or anyone of the other guys that played back then put him on the floor and he would have to run to the locker room to change his diaper. LeBron is only as good as he is because of his athletic/physical attributes. He is not a player with the most overall skill.

I'm not sure he would have been the difference maker that he is today on either the Celtics/Lakers from the 80's. McHale would have given him the Rambis treatment.

 

[Blueaz]

If you actually watched Jordan play live then its hard for me to believe you would put LeBron ahead of him. Jordan was vastly more skilled and aggressive. LeBron is absolutely way more athletic and a better passer and overall athlete, but when it comes to scoring or taking a game over or getting his teammates to compete its not really comparable IMO.

careful...you will be labeled a hater

 

[jgraf_1]

Did anyone hear the caller on KSR's show from Monday say that the Jordan led Bulls wouldn't stay within 30 of either team in this years finals? and Matt agreed with him.

That's crap...people forget who good defensively those teams were. Jordan had 9 all-defensive teams and Pippen had 8. Rodman and Harper were good defenders as well. Pippen wouldn't stop LeBron but would slow him down and that puts Jordan on Kyrie.

And with GSW and you have Pippen on Durant, Jordan on Klay and Harper on Steph. Not saying who is better or who would win, but to say the Bulls get trounced by 30 is idiotic.

 

[CatCall]

Cleveland sucks! And people from Ohio in general suck.

In general, now as an Ohioan, I'm offended.

 

[Bluemoon725]

I don't understand people who are obsessed with comparing players who are currently playing, to guys who have long been retired.

My personal stance on the MJ vs. LeBron debate is that I think the conversation should be shelved until after LBJ retires. Then you can compare legacies and careers because things like stats and number of rings won can be evaluated to their fullest.

Sure it makes a fun conversation in the meantime, but the debate shouldn't be held seriously until both players are done. It's like the reactionists who said after last year Warriors would never beat the Cavs again, and after game 3 in this past series who said KD is now the greatest! It's all reactive.

 

[Nubb16]

In general, now as an Ohioan, I'm offended.

Maybe you're one of the good ones xD

 

[SemperFiCat]

So, instead of starting a new thread, I'll just drop this here and see if anyone wants to switch gears a bit. So, if you're LeBron, what do you do now? Deal Love and try to rent Paul George for a year? Jimmy Butler? Does he stick it out for a wasted year and then head San Antonio or LA with Chris Paul? It's pretty clear that he can't currently even reallly challenge Golden State right now. So, anybody got that hot take?

 

[Mr_GG]

So, instead of starting a new thread, I'll just drop this here and see if anyone wants to switch gears a bit. So, if you're LeBron, what do you do now? Deal Love and try to rent Paul George for a year? Jimmy Butler? Does he stick it out for a wasted year and then head San Antonio or LA with Chris Paul? It's pretty clear that he can't currently even reallly challenge Golden State right now. So, anybody got that hot take?

Trade Kyrie, Mo Williams, and Deron Williams for Wall
Trade JR Smith, Shumpert, and Korver for Booker
Trade Love, Derrick Williams, and Richard Jefferson for Davis
Trade Tristan Thompson, Frye, and the rest for Cousins
Sign: Josh Harrelson, Darius Miller, Doron Lamb, Marquis Teague, Aaron Harrison, Deandre Liggins, Isaiah Briscoe, and Isaac Humphries

 

[Mojocat]

It's interesting to me the number of folks who can't separate whether they like or dislike someone from an assessment of how good they are at whatever they do. "I don't like him" doesn't mean "he's worse than you think".

Also, I can listen to opinions about MJ and LJ without caring much - but there's some serious overrating of Kobe peppering this thread. He's top 10 or so, but best ever? I don't think anyone with any credibility has ever said that (which is noteworthy, since we live in an age of hype).......He's great, but a poor man's MJ - same player, just not as good. And mostly, because he was Robin to Shaq's Batman for 3 of his 5 titles.....