POLITICAL THREAD

[fuzz77]

Is this supposed to carry any weight?

Sorry, I don't know how any intelligent person can look at healthcare today, look at the different working models and outcomes and come to the conclusion that universal care isn't a better model.
Perhaps if the insurance industry had never gotten into the market and it had always been paid out-of-pocket things would be different. As they say...if my aunt had balls she would be my uncle.

 

[Bill Cosby]

For a perfect case study, look at East Berlin vs West Berlin. Both shared the same characteristics, with one exception: one was capitalistic and the other was not. One flourished, the other suffered. So much so, that armed guards had to be placed atop the wall to keep people from crossing over into the capitalistic economy.

You may want to check with fuzz before you go lecturing people on the Berlin wall. It appears you don't know this, but it was actually a wall to keep Mexicans out.

 

[WettCat]

And....if you took out the 15-20% of the non-working and have NO interest in doing anything other than leaching off the government and other taxpayers segment of the US population, you would find our numbers would increase significantly.

I work for a Finn and a Finnish based company. I spent 12 prior years working for a Swede and a Swedish based company. I've traveled there and had significant discussions with them on all of the above----those countries simply don't have a significant portion of their population unwilling to do anything but sit on their asses burdening the rest of the economy.

Their safety nets are to keep people from falling through the cracks in difficult times and during their retirement. But those nets don't support individuals who have no interest in doing anything for prolonged periods of time.

The Soviets and Greeks did, and look what happened to their economies.

And with regards to your healthcare comment....go talk to individuals living in these utopian healthcare countries and see if they share your opinions. Not that our solution is perfect by any means, but their health care systems have major major flaws.

 

[Bill Cosby]

As they say...if my aunt had balls she would be my uncle.

Which bathroom does she use?

 

[TransyCat09]

Maybe if Americans LISTENED to the citizens they pretend to know so much about they would be better informed. Here is an article that addresses that very point written by a citizen of one of those Nordic countries:
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ers-nordic-countries/473385/?utm_source=yahoo

I could just as easily find Scandinavians who dislike their welfare state. That's like saying, "Here's an article written by a Trump supporter about illegal immigration. Read this if you REALLY want to know what Americans think."

Also, Sweden at least taxes the ish out of its poor and middle class to pay for welfare. They don't soak the rich like you and Bernie want. They do this because the poor and middle class are less able to leave (see British tax exiles). That is the explicit reason for it. So basically, the people who use the services are paying for it in taxes. You, nor anyone else, has presented a case for why taxing someone at a 50% rate to pay for services is better than simply taxing them at a much lower rate and letting them spend that money themselves. I don't spend 50% of my income on retirement or healthcare, why do I need the government doing that for me? TIA

 

[qwesley]

You didn't answer the question.

 

[qwesley]

I do like the voter ID requirement and cap on immigration the Nordics support.

 

[qwesley]

Bernie feeds much more dangerous idiocy than Trump.

 

[qwesley]

but their health care systems have major major flaws.

This effects from this period of healthcare inflation has many many more chapters to write before universal healthcare could seriously be argued to be successful.

 

[WettCat]

I do like the voter ID requirement and cap on immigration the Nordics support.

When I was in Helsinki last summer they were all for accepting the Muslim immigrants based on humanitarian needs. Those same people have changed their opinions, as have most in Sweden.

 

[fuzz77]

And....if you took out the 15-20% of the non-working and have NO interest in doing anything other than leaching off the government and other taxpayers segment of the US population, you would find our numbers would increase significantly.

I work for a Finn and a Finnish based company. I spent 12 prior years working for a Swede and a Swedish based company. I've traveled there and had significant discussions with them on all of the above----those countries simply don't have a significant portion of their population unwilling to do anything but sit on their asses burdening the rest of the economy.

Their safety nets are to keep people from falling through the cracks in difficult times and during their retirement. But those nets don't support individuals who have no interest in doing anything for prolonged periods of time.

The Soviets and Greeks did, and look what happened to their economies.

And with regards to your healthcare comment....go talk to individuals living in these utopian healthcare countries and see if they share your opinions. Not that our solution is perfect by any means, but their health care systems have major major flaws.

I never met a Canadian that would change their system for ours.

Yes, both systems have flaws. Our flaws are that costs have skyrocketed far beyond the ability of all but the most wealthy to pay without the aid of insurance and that insurance is more costly than what most people pay for their housing. 2016 will be the first year that my family medical costs have exceeded what I have paid in insurance in my memory. My wife had outpatient surgery to repair a torn labrum in her hip. $30,000+ and that doesn't include the PT. My first year on a high deductible plan and I'll be damned if I didn't hit it before the end of February.
I bought my house from someone had filed bankruptcy due to medical bills. His kid had leukemia.
Sorry, people shouldn't lose their homes because one of their kids get sick.
Their flaws...I might have to wait for non-emergency care.

 

[Rex Kwon Do]

Love when people compare us to all these places that don't have to spend an effing *dime* defending themselves......got good the good ole U S of A for that.

Certainly frees up some coin to do as you see fit. How's that Nordic Air Force looking these days? Can fend off Putin's SU-27s, prolly.

<------- would be fine with a 1 decade Purge-type era when they're on their own......maybe then the bitching will stop?

 

[BigBlueSean]

Love when people compare us to all these places that don't have to spend an effing *dime* defending themselves......got good the good ole U S of A for that.

Certainly frees up some coin to do as you see fit. How's that Nordic Air Force looking these days? Can fend off Putin's SU-27s, prolly.

<------- would be fine with a 1 decade Purge-type era when they're on their own......maybe then the bitching will stop?

Do we as a country really need an $800 billion dollar military budget? almost 7x the amount the China who comes in at 2nd....I mean for real though... Canada isnt going to do shit to us... Mexico Down isnt going to do jack and we are protected by 2 oceans on either side. WTF do we need $800 billion dollar military budget for? Can we not maintain the worlds most advanced military with 100 billion dollars (Still $50 million more than China)? Maybe put that excess to good use rather than building tanks that by the time they are done being produced are already outdated and scrapped. Why do we need these state of the art fighter jets when majority of the stuff we do now can and is done via drone? Now if that money actually was allocated to PAY TROOPS AND VETERANS what they deserve instead of barely over poverty line salaries that is one thing...but its not used in that way. This country's military spending is the biggest and most egregious misappropriation of funds in the world.

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

Trump will make Iraq pay the six trillion dollars plus ongoing interest it cost us to depose Hussein and set the wheels in motion for Syria and ISIS; take their Babylonian relics and sell them to he highest bidder when they refuse to pay.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Do we as a country really need an $800 billion dollar military budget? almost 7x the amount the China who comes in at 2nd....I mean for real though... Canada isnt going to do shit to us... Mexico Down isnt going to do jack and we are protected by 2 oceans on either side. WTF do we need $800 billion dollar military budget for? Can we not maintain the worlds most advanced military with 100 billion dollars (Still $50 million more than China)? Maybe put that excess to good use rather than building tanks that by the time they are done being produced are already outdated and scrapped. Why do we need these state of the art fighter jets when majority of the stuff we do now can and is done via drone? Now if that money actually was allocated to PAY TROOPS AND VETERANS what they deserve instead of barely over poverty line salaries that is one thing...but its not used in that way. This country's military spending is the biggest and most egregious misappropriation of funds in the world.

Because we play world police, like dummies. I have no doubt government spending could be cut insane amounts, across the board, if we'd eliminate waste only.

 

[WettCat]

For those trying to compare the Nordic's public policies to that of the US, don't forget that the Sweden's population is basically equal to Virginia and Finland/Norway are each on par with Minnesota. Most people don't realize just how small these countries are. My boss moved from Helsinki to Atlanta last Fall....Metro Atlanta has a greater population than his entire country.

Financial and public policy offerings don't always scale when you increase by 30 and 60 fold. Especially when the number of people on welfare and/or public assistance is X times greater than the population of their entire countries. (I inserted X instead of a real number because of the extreme variation of reporting that I found----virtually all from different news sources with their own agenda--including our own governments.)

 

[BernieSadori]

Lilyhammer looks pretty desolate.

 

[warrior-cat]

Do we as a country really need an $800 billion dollar military budget? almost 7x the amount the China who comes in at 2nd....I mean for real though... Canada isnt going to do shit to us... Mexico Down isnt going to do jack and we are protected by 2 oceans on either side. WTF do we need $800 billion dollar military budget for? Can we not maintain the worlds most advanced military with 100 billion dollars (Still $50 million more than China)? Maybe put that excess to good use rather than building tanks that by the time they are done being produced are already outdated and scrapped. Why do we need these state of the art fighter jets when majority of the stuff we do now can and is done via drone? Now if that money actually was allocated to PAY TROOPS AND VETERANS what they deserve instead of barely over poverty line salaries that is one thing...but its not used in that way. This country's military spending is the biggest and most egregious misappropriation of funds in the world.

Not sure, but I think China does not pay the same prices we do for our military equipment or research and testing. They steal a lot of secrets that have already been tested and just mold their equipment after that all the while, paying pennies to their workers to do it.

 

[P19978]

Maybe we should model our economy after that bastion of effective socialism, Brazil.

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wire...razil-economy-faces-painful-downturn-39071933

 

[wkycatfan]

If our country's model is so bad, why do people keep breaking immigration laws to come here?

 

[WettCat]

 

[bigblueinsanity]

If our country's model is so bad, why do people keep breaking immigration laws to come here?

Like I said before, it's why the Berlin Wall needed armed guards. No one's trying to bust into non capitalist countries

 

[qwesley]

All these macro seemingly reasonable general arguments for capitalism have been proven wrong by fuzz's anecdotes of his co-workers and his 134 years of world travels....and the dozens of questions you repugs refuse to answer.

 

[Mashburned]

The most hilarious folks are the "but ___ country does this!!!"...

Yes, and we can to it you're willing to fight for your state...

So, who wants to create our own lil Norway, or whoever, right here in KY? We can literally do that. It won't be easy, but it is possible.

And guess what? TN can be whatever they want to be, etc.

There are 50 states all sucking the federal dick and it disgusts me. It's so stupid and it's not good for anybody but the Feds who continue to snatch up more and more power and influence.

 

[krazykats]

If our country's model is so bad, why do people keep breaking immigration laws to come here?

Because you can operate money making schemes here without being controlled. We are free from tyranny no matter how much we complain about corporations.

I don't know what it's like but from people I've discussed foreign countries with that's the legit difference.

 

[DaBossIsBack]

Because you can operate money making schemes here without being controlled. We are free from tyranny no matter how much we complain about corporations.

I don't know what it's like but from people I've discussed foreign countries with that's the legit difference.

Yep. Money making schemes without control. And if something goes wrong the state will just bail you out with money from the people you schemed. It's a pretty sweet deal really.

 

[krazykats]

By schemes I meant operations really. People don't want to give Mexicans credit but they have really taken over certain industries and they crush it honestly.

Not everything about foreigners is illegal.

 

[TransyCat09]

Paging fuzz...

 

[TransyCat09]

You didn't answer the question.

 

[Rex Kwon Do]

It reminds me of my travels when I saw the Pakistani's unlawfully kept out of East Berlin by that....that God forsaken wall. They wanted in. They wanted in so badly, everyone did. Many peoples. Also the Inuit. I think I saw some of them too.

So many hard working folks simply trying to get into East Berlin for free healthcare, college, and foodstuffs. All prevented by Ronald Reagan's wall.

Mr. Reagan, get the proper permits and have your wall safely removed by OSHA standards and norms!

 

[Supreme Lord Z]

Our military budget is so huge because it is what keeps the world open for the globalists to exploit. They can't exploit slave labor and open up new markets and escape pesky EPA standards here in the US if they don't have somewhere else to bribe, steal, and plunder. But of course they want to then sell it all here at top dollar and with a sweet tax deal.

We have a rigged system where sovereignless borderless corporations are stealing us blind, confusing our stupid electorate with inflammatory pointless hot-button social issues, and using our political system to keep it all legit and also running a massive and extremely successful propaganda campaign to convince our stupid voters that the one power they have to fight these greedy criminal corporations... our form of government... is what the problem is instead of the solution to stopping their criminal exploitations.

Our middle class has collapsed under the weight of the corruption. So to combat any support for leveling the playing field and actually helping that besieged middle class of workers they trot out stupid policies like raising the minimum wage and other programs that actually would only marginally help the poverty class and ultimately bring further pain to a besieged middle class. That is purposeful so they can say "see, your social welfare programs only make people lazy so you need to keep giving your money and tax breaks to the job creators otherwise all these lazy people will just suck up all your money because they are freeloaders."

It is all so broken that it will never be fixed. The raping and plunder will continue until some form of social uprising takes place. Then the globalists can simply move on to greener pastures in another country full of suckers and leave the skeleton of our country behind for us to rip each other apart in.

 

[Rex Kwon Do]

http://www.breitbart.com/tech/2016/04/22/pro-hillary-pac-spending-1-million-to-hire-online-trolls/

Deeee? No, seriously.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

http://www.breitbart.com/tech/2016/04/22/pro-hillary-pac-spending-1-million-to-hire-online-trolls/

Deeee? No, seriously.

Deeee fuzz and DaBossIsBack dreams have all come true. Now they'll finally be paid to do what they already do for free

 

[Levibooty]

Like I said before, it's why the Berlin Wall needed armed guards. No one's trying to bust into non capitalist countries

This is a misleading assumption that is just uniformed to say the least. Sweden has more Iraqi born citizens in one city than all of Canada and the USA combined. Migration to the Nordic states is a huge continental movement that is happening. People find the Nordic states so appealing that the capacity of these states to handle the massive influx of people is challenging their small countries ability to handle all the people coming looking for a peaceful and prosperous life.

 

[Levibooty]

Go here to grasp the consequences of the reckless decisions made by the Bush administration. Also note the numbers of people migrating to Europe vs the USA.

http://www.unhcr.org/558193896.html

 

[JHB4UK]

Go here to grasp the consequences of the reckless decisions made by the Bush administration.

the decisions that Hillary voted to approve, invading Afganistan & Iraq? the same kind of policies she continued as Secretary of State, attacking Yemen, Somalia, toppling the governments in Egypt & Libya?

and the same Dems who curse Bush will crawl on their knees to vote for Hillary in Nov. such incredible hypocrisy.

 

[qwesley]

I blame Bill for not funding Taliban pre-k in the 90's after the first WTC attack. Should have been a wake up call that we needed to do more. If only hashtags would have been around then.

 

[P19978]

Go here to grasp the consequences of the reckless decisions made by the Bush administration. Also note the numbers of people migrating to Europe vs the USA.

http://www.unhcr.org/558193896.html

For folks whose mantra is "Forward" you sure do look in the past a lot.

 

[P19978]

DC has to change. Here is one more example why I'm now all in for Trump (BTW, as an investment advisor this drives me nuts!):


The government is now referring to our Social Security checks as a "Federal Benefit Payment." This isn't a benefit. It is our money paid out of our earned income! Not only did we all contribute to Social Security but our employers did too. It totaled 15% of our income before taxes.

If you averaged $30K per year over your working life, that's close to $180,000 invested in Social Security.

If you calculate the future value of your monthly investment in social security ($375/month, including both you and your employers contributions) at a meager 1% interest rate compounded monthly, after 40 years of working you'd have more than $1.3+ million dollars saved!

This is your personal investment. Upon retirement, if you took out only 3% per year, you'd receive $39,318 per year, or $3,277 per month.

That's almost three times more than today's average Social Security benefit of $1,230 per month, according to the Social Security Administration. (Google it – it’s a fact).

And your retirement fund would last more than 33 years (until you're 98 if you retire at age 65)! I can only imagine how much better most average-income people could live in retirement if our government had just invested our money in low-risk interest-earning accounts.

Instead, the folks in Washington pulled off a bigger "Ponzi scheme" than Bernie Madoff ever did.

 

[WalkersGoggles]

Just want us to dial back the world policing $$$.