POLITICAL THREAD

[sambowieshin]

Where was there a CONGRESSIONAL law passed establishing a religion, placing that NS on the govt property? Lacking that it is totally legal and you cannot deny them their FREE EXERCISE thereof.

Can an atheist Satanist witch too? Certainly. Burn a flag while they are at it.

If the founders wanted a total separation SEPARATION then they certailny forgot to include that in the 1st. Their individual opinions or negotiations are not law. The 1st is what passed. Simple words. Do I need a crayon to explain them to you?

You just don't get it. By the government allowing religious expressions on government property, in effect, they ARE endorsing/advocating for a particular religion.
Do you also want to see a bloody goat's head on a satanic shrine right next to your Nativity scene at the courthouse??? Do you want a prayer for satan at the opening of every school board meeting?? Because that's the ugly can of worms you open up when mixing government and religion.
The Founding Fathers specifically stated that in the First Amendment....but you just refuse to comprehend that because of your intense religious beliefs.
They were experienced and knowledgeable about history and people just like you in the Church of England and Catholic Church who were ready and willing to force their religious beliefs down people's throats via the government.
I'm not telling you not to go to church every day. Go!
I'm not telling you not to put up a Nativity scene on your property...I do as well. My grandkids love it.
I'm not telling you not to pray every day.
You have complete religious freedom to do all of that.
I also think if a privately owned business wants to put up Christmas decor that's fine too. It's their choice. I love Christmas decorations personally.
My only issue is when it takes place on tax payer funded public property. It is a slippery slope.

 

[trueblujr2]

I know a little about the Sale and Leaseback thing because I own quite a few commercial buildings and am approached frequently by PE, Developers etc.... who want to buy my stuff and lease it back.

In my case I have no interest at all because they generate cash flow. But if a company like RL who decided to build and operate out of their locations, it is a great way to pull your cash back out of the bricks-n-mortar and then leasing them back for whatever amount and term that you negotiate in advance with the buyer.

THAT is why I have a problem believing the story. When did RL enter into the sale/lease back? 15 years ago? The terms are agreed upon before the sale so did RL agree to a monthly rent that they already knew they couldnt manage? Commercial leases in their case were probably 5yrs to 10yrs with options. And even so there is normally a negotiated rent increase based upon the CPI. THAT may have been what got them in trouble. Bidenflation could well have killed them with a CPI adjustment to their rents. JMHO

I could understand that when Red Lobster was still owned by people who had a vested interest in its success as a brand. When it was owned by the same people operating it. Too many brands sold out to venture capitalists and these hedge funds over the last few years. They were bought with the intent to eventually sell. They are a portfolio piece now, and depending on who holds that portfolio, they might have more interest in the property than the actual business sitting on it.

 

[sambowieshin]

Nothing bolsters government reliance quite like an overblown "pandemic"

For the fascist left, it's like getting a PS5 on Christmas morning.

Nothing overblown about 7 million deaths and counting. Lost 2 of my neighbors to it as well as many in my community.
Facts speak louder than memes.

COVID Live - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

Live statistics and coronavirus news tracking the number of confirmed cases, recovered patients, tests, and death toll due to the COVID-19 coronavirus from Wuhan, China. Coronavirus counter with new cases, deaths, and number of tests per 1 Million population. Historical data and info. Daily...

www.worldometers.info

Novel coronavirus (COVID-19) deaths by country worldwide 2023 | Statista

As of May 2023, the country with the highest number of COVID deaths had over 1.1 million. There have been roughly 6.87 million deaths worldwide.

www.statista.com

 

[vhcat70]

1. No clue that was your reference & still don't see its relevance to me.
2. I don't recall ever hearing this point before. So hard to be OK with or against previously. Certainly seems way over the top by Biden now that I know about it. May it was his security forces, not him? You'd agree the "hit" failed miserably since Trump was uninjured, right?
3. You rightfully distinguish between me & the lefties. Good observation.

2. Just now saw earlier post on this. Never heard before.

 

[HymanKaplan]

You just don't get it. By the government allowing religious expressions on government property, in effect, they ARE endorsing/advocating for a particular religion.
Do you also want to see a bloody goat's head on a satanic shrine right next to your Nativity scene at the courthouse??? Do you want a prayer for satan at the opening of every school board meeting?? Because that's the ugly can of worms you open up when mixing government and religion.
The Founding Fathers specifically stated that in the First Amendment....but you just refuse to comprehend that because of your intense religious beliefs.
They were experienced and knowledgeable about history and people just like you in the Church of England and Catholic Church who were ready and willing to force their religious beliefs down people's throats via the government.
I'm not telling you not to go to church every day. Go!
I'm not telling you not to put up a Nativity scene on your property...I do as well. My grandkids love it.
I'm not telling you not to pray every day.
You have complete religious freedom to do all of that.
I also think if a privately owned business wants to put up Christmas decor that's fine too. It's their choice. I love Christmas decorations personally.
My only issue is when it takes place on tax payer funded public property. It is a slippery slope.

I'm pretty sure we all get it.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

You just don't get it. By the government allowing religious expressions on government property, in effect, they ARE endorsing/advocating for a particular religion.
Do you also want to see a bloody goat's head on a satanic shrine right next to your Nativity scene at the courthouse??? Do you want a prayer for satan at the opening of every school board meeting?? Because that's the ugly can of worms you open up when mixing government and religion.
The Founding Fathers specifically stated that in the First Amendment....but you just refuse to comprehend that because of your intense religious beliefs.
They were experienced and knowledgeable about history and people just like you in the Church of England and Catholic Church who were ready and willing to force their religious beliefs down people's throats via the government.
I'm not telling you not to go to church every day. Go!
I'm not telling you not to put up a Nativity scene on your property...I do as well. My grandkids love it.
I'm not telling you not to pray every day.
You have complete religious freedom to do all of that.
I also think if a privately owned business wants to put up Christmas decor that's fine too. It's their choice. I love Christmas decorations personally.
My only issue is when it takes place on tax payer funded public property. It is a slippery slope.

Iirc it's only an issue of they allow one but not another. If they allow all, it should be ok.

One of the dumber decisions I can remember is when scotus decided atheists were on the same level as religious, which is completely illogical.

 

[vhcat70]

You just don't get it. By the government allowing religious expressions on government property, in effect, they ARE endorsing/advocating for a particular religion.

FALSE. Ridiculous conclusion. By that standard, allowing anyone to say anything about their religious beliefs on public property is unconstitutional. Presidents couldn't talk about their religion in the White House.

 

[sambowieshin]

I didn't know any of that was an option.

This is the bullsh** can of worms you ultra right religious goofballs open with your insistance of mixing church/state...

Controversial Satanic altar on display in Iowa State Capitol building

The display is from the Satanic Temple. It features a ram’s head covered with mirrors on a mannequin.

www.kcrg.com

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/25/arts/design/discrimination-sculpture-madison-park-sikander-women.html

Uproar as after-school Satan club forms at Tennessee elementary school

Satanic clubs, whose members do not worship the devil, usually formed in response to presence of religious groups in schools

www.theguardian.com

What is the ‘After-School Satan Club,’ and what is it doing in San Clemente?

Run by The Satanic Temple, the meetings are designed to promote “intellectual and emotional development.”

www.ocregister.com

What is an After School Satan Club?

Here’s what to know about After School Satan Clubs, which have popped up at schools across the country.

www.newsnationnow.com

 

[HymanKaplan]

I get it Sam, LOL

Like I said the other day; you really need to quit overwinding your mental watch.

 

[sambowieshin]

Iirc it's only an issue of they allow one but not another. If they allow all, it should be ok.

One of the dumber decisions I can remember is when scotus decided atheists were on the same level as religious, which is completely illogical.

True but you end up getting satanic shrines at courthouses and after school satan clubs too. Nobody wants to see that crap. Best to keep church and state separated imo as well as the First Amendment's words.

Uproar as after-school Satan club forms at Tennessee elementary school

Satanic clubs, whose members do not worship the devil, usually formed in response to presence of religious groups in schools

www.theguardian.com

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/25/arts/design/discrimination-sculpture-madison-park-sikander-women.html

Dozens gather at Iowa Capitol for closing ceremony of controversial Satanic display

Some in attendance at Saturday's ceremony traveled hours to show their support to Satanic Temple of Iowa, whose Capitol display was vandalized.

www.desmoinesregister.com

 

[sambowieshin]

I get it Sam, LOL

Like I said the other day; you really need to quit overwinding your mental watch.

It's either you or my wife I talk politics with. Tag..... you're it!!!!

 

[AustinTXCat]

This should make Sam and Dion happy, if true:

The stock market has already chosen a winner in the 2024 presidential election​

 

[HymanKaplan]

Levels Sam, levels...

If I said, of one of your comments, that, "that was a real turd in the punchbowl." I'd more than half expect you to go on a three paragraph long diatribe about how you have never even ONCE in your life, taken a s*** in a punchbowl...

 

[BlueRunner11]

People are always going to vote (if they have one) according to their moral compass. Doing so has nothing to do with separation of church and state.

I'm for removing all religion from schools (as well as anything else EXCEPT for the classical academic areas)

My reason for doing so is because it is all distracting from the actual job at hand.

I don’t know if you had children during your time in CA, but part of the 4th grade state wide curriculum (not sure about now) for my son was a mandatory project about the CA Missions, building a diorama, writing a report, etc that takes a large chunk of time from the semester.

My kids teacher was VERY Catholic and over the top enthusiastic about the whole thing with the expectation of students taking a more celebratory and romanticized approach. It required parental involvement which annoyed me considering the topic and massive time involvement to such. Partly out of spite and partly to feel the need to be historically accurate, we included a large section detailing the brutality and the atrocities by the priesthood toward the indigenous people of the time. Including that part was quite frowned upon I later found it and we had “issues” w the teacher the rest of the year.

Massive waste of time and energy.

 

[Bill Cosby]

My 10000' view of the situation with very little info tells me.... RL saw the trend away from their sit down restaurant. They then realized they were headed for BK. That meant their real estate was going to be at peril with creditors....exactly the reason it is not wise to own the real estate under the restaurant company.

With a sale/LB strategy they could pull a lot of cash out of the property which is universally their most attractive asset and easy to monetize. Selling a failing restaurant business not so much. Their earnings? So the cash from the sale was a life-line. Did they try to re-imagine their restaurant? Fast casual? I don't go there so I don't know their target customer. Anyway, ultimately losing customers and eventual rent increases piled on Bidenflation food costs are a deadly combo.

Golden Gate Capital pushed (I assume) the sale leaseback in the 20 teens, before Covid. It was fully out of the investment in 2020 after another large industry player purchased it.

Whoever owns the RL real estate are now tied up in bankruptcy proceedings for the foreseeable future.

No doubt Golden Gate monetized assets to generate returns for its investors as quickly as it could. I just take issue with it being framed as some nefarious conspiracy to sell off land.

Golden Gate found a willing buyer in Thai Union. Of course with the value of hindsight, the strategy looks bad post bankruptcy filing. But 5 years ago RL may have still been an attractive business, even after the sale leaseback, as evidence by Golden Gates ability to exit.

Edit: the world also changed significantly over this time with Covid and the end of the ZIRP era.

 

[sambowieshin]

FALSE. Ridiculous conclusion. By that standard, allowing anyone to say anything about their religious beliefs on public property is unconstitutional. Presidents couldn't talk about their religion in the White House.

The discussion was about Nativity Scenes not mentioning your belief in God during a speech.
It's more to do with the degree of involvement and how intrusive it is for those who have differing beliefs.

 

[DrH. Lecter]

You just don't get it. By the government allowing religious expressions on government property, in effect, they ARE endorsing/advocating for a particular religion.
Do you also want to see a bloody goat's head on a satanic shrine right next to your Nativity scene at the courthouse??? Do you want a prayer for satan at the opening of every school board meeting?? Because that's the ugly can of worms you open up when mixing government and religion.
The Founding Fathers specifically stated that in the First Amendment....but you just refuse to comprehend that because of your intense religious beliefs.
They were experienced and knowledgeable about history and people just like you in the Church of England and Catholic Church who were ready and willing to force their religious beliefs down people's throats via the government.
I'm not telling you not to go to church every day. Go!
I'm not telling you not to put up a Nativity scene on your property...I do as well. My grandkids love it.
I'm not telling you not to pray every day.
You have complete religious freedom to do all of that.
I also think if a privately owned business wants to put up Christmas decor that's fine too. It's their choice. I love Christmas decorations personally.
My only issue is when it takes place on tax payer funded public property. It is a slippery slope.

Read the 1st. It does not say anything about endorsing or advocating. It CLEARLY in WORDS says ESTABLISHING. You can massage or bend the words so that a leftist judge can give you what you want. But to a honest person reading actual words it clearly states CONGRESS not your local town council, shall make NO LAW. It is also equally clear...or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. If I place a display of ANY KIND.

My business's sign or an homage to my favorite band....it is reasonable to restrict that because it arguably creates a "nuisance." Everyone will want to advertise their business or place a statue of Taylor Swift or whatever. Argue that your Nativity display should be moved for THAT reason rather than your hatred religion and want to shit on a Nativity Scene using the 1st amendment and mythical separation as your cudgel. If that is your tactic I will fight you in court as violating my free exercise provision.

 

[vhcat70]

The discussion was about Nativity Scenes not mentioning your belief in God during a speech.
It's more to do with the degree of involvement and how intrusive it is for those who have differing beliefs.

Really? I didn't know.

Nativity scenes are speech. They're a belief expression. Yes, a few weeks vs. 10 words, but the same category. It's not like Nativity scenes take over 25% of a city's land.

 

[DrH. Lecter]

The discussion was about Nativity Scenes not mentioning your belief in God during a speech.
It's more to do with the degree of involvement and how intrusive it is for those who have differing beliefs.

There is no constitutional right or guarantee that you will not be offended.

 

[DrH. Lecter]

Golden Gate Capital pushed (I assume) the sale leaseback in the 20 teens, before Covid. It was fully out of the investment in 2020 after another large industry player purchased it.

Whoever owns the RL real estate are now tied up in bankruptcy proceedings for the foreseeable future.

No doubt Golden Gate monetized assets to generate returns for its investors as quickly as it could. I just take issue with it being framed as some nefarious conspiracy to sell off land.

Golden Gate found a willing buyer in Thai Union. Of course with the value of hindsight, the strategy looks bad post bankruptcy filing. But 5 years ago RL may have still been an attractive business, even after the sale leaseback, as evidence by Golden Gates ability to exit.

Edit: the world also changed significantly over this time with Covid and the end of the ZIRP era.

That makes a lot of sense now. Horrible timing. So based on getting out in 2020 I would assume they held for the usual 3-5 years. So as you said, mid 20teens.

So is the new owner tied up as a creditor now with their "worthless" leases? Or are they on the other side of this via a charge of "fraud," IOW that this was all orchestrated?

 

[sambowieshin]

There is no constitutional right or guarantee that you will not be offended.

And none you won't be sued if I am.

 

[DrH. Lecter]

Totally agree. Lockdown really changed things. Large brands by their very nature were slow to embrace delivery because it wasn't their model and the lockdown time frame kept getting extended. They didn't want a big upfront investment in something that could end anytime.

Contrast that with smaller locally owned shops. They were nimble and already had doordash as an option. So they, that were able to survive, were able to change their structure to cater to delivery. Oddly I see several fast casual that still now have delivery as their core business. Complete 180.

The other factor was imo ordering from locally owned places opened people to the reality that quality massively slipped in large chains. Central food preparation and distribution to a location where it's warmed up or just seared no longer cut it.

Texas Roadhouse is an interesting example because they constantly deliver higher quality than their competitors and it shows. Iirc they are a Louisville area company and really expanded the last few years.

Another interesting conversation is how many large scale food concepts came out of Louisville. It's pretty incredible given the size of city and state.

As a side gig I am a partner in a struggling small restaurant. 20% of our sales come from DD, UberEats and GrubHub. We have to adjust up the menu price for the three because there just isnt enough profit there to give up 30%. So we pass that on and you pay it for convenience.

The delivery 3 are a factor in any decision as to where to locate. There are awful locations in Louisville to leverage delivery. For example, the river creates a real barrier. A 10mile radius gets chopped down if the river is nearby. So you get out your map, pick a point, and try to sweep in the greatest number of people in a full 10 mile radius....plus taking in the demo of the area. I personally would balance rent against its ability to include the east end of Louisville. Middletown, Anchorage, St. Matthews and into downtown for lunch business. I like some areas along Bardstown Rd for the balance of rent and radius. 20 to 25% of your business is too much to ignore. Also catering!!!

 

[Bill Cosby]

That makes a lot of sense now. Horrible timing. So based on getting out in 2020 I would assume they held for the usual 3-5 years. So as you said, mid 20teens.

So is the new owner tied up as a creditor now with their "worthless" leases? Or are they on the other side of this via a charge of "fraud," IOW that this was all orchestrated?

If there’s fraud there’s fraud. Who knows. Nothing indicates there was.

I know in one scenario, everything is frozen through the bankruptcy process and a potential acquirer can pay off any past due balances and take over the properties as the lessee. If not, the lease would be terminated and the past due balance is just another debt in the bankruptcy. I don’t know the ins and outs of the various options and Chapters though.

 

[DrH. Lecter]

If there’s fraud there’s fraud. Who knows. Nothing indicates there was.

I know in one scenario, everything is frozen through the bankruptcy process and a potential acquirer can pay off any past due balances and take over the properties as the lessee. If not, the lease would be terminated and the past due balance is just another debt in the bankruptcy. I don’t know the ins and outs of the various options and Chapters though.

RL should consider squatting.

 

[Bill Cosby]

If RL was a democrat, I’m sure it would.

 

[sambowieshin]

Really? I didn't know.

Nativity scenes are speech. They're a belief expression. Yes, a few weeks vs. 10 words, but the same category. It's not like Nativity scenes take over 25% of a city's land.

What's the point in enjoying a Nativity scene if there is a shrine to Satan right next to it? Just keep it on private property and it's never an issue.
Otherwise it can become a big, hot mess.

Controversial Satanic altar on display in Iowa State Capitol building

The display is from the Satanic Temple. It features a ram’s head covered with mirrors on a mannequin.

www.kcrg.com

Uproar as after-school Satan club forms at Tennessee elementary school

Satanic clubs, whose members do not worship the devil, usually formed in response to presence of religious groups in schools

www.theguardian.com

 

[Bill Cosby]

What's the point in enjoying a Nativity scene if there is a shrine to Satan right next to it? Just keep it on private property and it's never an issue.
Otherwise it can become a big, hot mess.

Controversial Satanic altar on display in Iowa State Capitol building

The display is from the Satanic Temple. It features a ram’s head covered with mirrors on a mannequin.

www.kcrg.com

Uproar as after-school Satan club forms at Tennessee elementary school

Satanic clubs, whose members do not worship the devil, usually formed in response to presence of religious groups in schools

www.theguardian.com

If you guys are erecting a shrine because you worship satan, you’re goddam lunatics.

If you guys are erecting a shrine to satan because you’re trolls with nothing better to do, you’re goddam lunatics.

So in either event, I suppose the nativity scene helps to expose dipshit lunatics that should be ostracized.

 

[trueblujr2]

As a side gig I am a partner in a struggling small restaurant. 20% of our sales come from DD, UberEats and GrubHub. We have to adjust up the menu price for the three because there just isnt enough profit there to give up 30%. So we pass that on and you pay it for convenience.

The delivery 3 are a factor in any decision as to where to locate. There are awful locations in Louisville to leverage delivery. For example, the river creates a real barrier. A 10mile radius gets chopped down if the river is nearby. So you get out your map, pick a point, and try to sweep in the greatest number of people in a full 10 mile radius....plus taking in the demo of the area. I personally would balance rent against its ability to include the east end of Louisville. Middletown, Anchorage, St. Matthews and into downtown for lunch business. I like some areas along Bardstown Rd for the balance of rent and radius. 20 to 25% of your business is too much to ignore. Also catering!!!

I swear i'm gonna find this restaurant one of these days and spend money at it. That's a threat!

 

[DrH. Lecter]

What's the point in enjoying a Nativity scene if there is a shrine to Satan right next to it? Just keep it on private property and it's never an issue.
Otherwise it can become a big, hot mess.

Controversial Satanic altar on display in Iowa State Capitol building

The display is from the Satanic Temple. It features a ram’s head covered with mirrors on a mannequin.

www.kcrg.com

Uproar as after-school Satan club forms at Tennessee elementary school

Satanic clubs, whose members do not worship the devil, usually formed in response to presence of religious groups in schools

www.theguardian.com

You cannot legislate away stupidity. Best to let your enemy show how unreasonable and disgusting they really are.

 

[DrH. Lecter]

I swear i'm gonna find this restaurant one of these days and spend money at it. That's a threat!

PM me and I will discuss.

 

[hmt5000]

Thanks for confirming you don’t have any idea what you’re talking about. You speak about Jewish people as if they’re some novelty. The Jewish sabbath is Saturday and begins at sundown on Friday. We’re in the spring/summer so there is no way that anyone could argue that having trial on Fridays was an attempt by the judge to “keep Jews off the jury” as you said.

OK... I was just repeating what some NY media types suggested. But how about the other stuff? Is Dershowitz ignorant and doesn't know what he's talking about either? Have you actually followed this trial at all or are you just assuming the judge is fair?

 

[vhcat70]

What's the point in enjoying a Nativity scene if there is a shrine to Satan right next to it? Just keep it on private property and it's never an issue.

And it's never an issue if you don't speak religion on public property.

And the point is the distinction between God & evil. The contrast is profound.

 

[UK_fan_41102]

 

[trueblujr2]

View embedded media

As long as their failure results in them not being able to move forward until competency can be displayed, then OK, but I have a feeling they have or will lower the standards for what's considered a pass/fail. That seems par for the course these days.

 

[vhcat70]

View embedded media

3% is up to 50%. What was it before DEI infected the place? What is UKMS? 25%? i don't know.

 

[trueblujr2]

PM me and I will discuss.

I think you have to be a paying member to PM somebody or am i missing something because I can't figure out how.

 

[hmt5000]

 

[HymanKaplan]

Rosa Parks was a staged "plant"

The real RP was Claudette Colvin.

 

[Dionysus444]

Your religion is Statism. You worship secular humanism. You tell us all the time that there are multiple religions throughout history so Christianity is not unique or special. You define ours so we can define yours. You redifine gender into a spectrum. Secular humanism is on a spectrum that should too be separated from the state.

Religion and philosophy are inherently different. Only one invented and requires the idea of blind faith.

 

[55wildcat]

I think you have to be a paying member to PM somebody or am i missing something because I can't figure out how.

I think your right. Paying members can PM you. I would like to find out where as well.