Pilgrim update

[Runnin'Ramel]

Yeah, you can look at it multiple ways, but in reality, Cal is the best at recruiting HS talent (now that K is gone). The problem is, these kids look great against HS talent, but there are too many unknowns with them, in my opinion, to believe that the one-and-done system is the best way to run a program.

Most of these kids aren't polished enough, tough enough or physical enough to compete at this level, even if he had the perfect balance, it's still a disadvantage to put a bunch of HS kids on a court against any team you would see in the sweet 16 and beyond.

Cal is no dummy, he obviously knows this, so my question to him would be, why are you sticking with the one and done method when it clearly isn't working?

He’s not a good enough coach for either method, in order for him to win, a perfect storm of events would need to happen, like what happened in 11/12 with the NBA lockout, a transcendent player and a generational player.

Hopefully the 23/24 season is his last.

This was always the problem with a one-and-done strategy to try to win titles. You *have* to get ELITE talent - the kids who are physically ready to take over a game at the college level, not get pushed around by experienced players who are physical, and are so talented they just beat the other team straight up, even if their coach is sub-par managing the games and (not) making adjustments. Wall/Cousins, Knight, AD/MKG, KAT, Fox/Monk/Bam, Randle level players.

Guys who were highly ranked (top 10 or 15) but not at that level -- think guys like Kevin Knox, Wenyen Gabriel, Chris Livingston, TyTy Washington -- weren't going to be enough to overcome Cal's game management flaws, the experience of other teams, talent of other teams, etc.

And then there were plenty of "busts" relatively speaking -- top 10 recruits that just looked great against high school competition, but were nowhere near ready to dominate at the next level as a freshman (e.g., Boston, Clarke (RIP), Skal, the Dragon, EJ ...).

The one and done model required Cal to get 3-4 top 10 players for that incoming team, mixed with role players like Patrick Patterson or Darius Miller ... even Dominique Hawkins or Derek Willis (at times). He has the first part for next season ... but will he have the second? It's going to require serious work in the transfer portal, clearly.

 

[kl40504]

He’s on the 76ers roster, I don't know what else to tell you.

He’s on the 76ers roster, I don't know what else to tell you.

Read and weep.

McClung joined the NBA G League's Delaware Blue Coats for the 2022–23 season. He accepted an invitation to the 2023 NBA Slam Dunk Contest and became the first G League player to participate in the event.

 

[kl40504]

Very funny, but either way, technically Mac is on their roster.

He is not in the NBA contrary to what you say. He is a G League player.

McClung joined the NBA G League's Delaware Blue Coats for the 2022–23 season. He accepted an invitation to the 2023 NBA Slam Dunk Contest and became the first G League player to participate in the event.

 

[kyjeff1]

This was always the problem with a one-and-done strategy to try to win titles. You *have* to get ELITE talent - the kids who are physically ready to take over a game at the college level, not get pushed around by experienced players who are physical, and are so talented they just beat the other team straight up, even if their coach is sub-par managing the games and (not) making adjustments. Wall/Cousins, Knight, AD/MKG, KAT, Fox/Monk/Bam, Randle level players.

Guys who were highly ranked (top 10 or 15) but not at that level -- think guys like Kevin Knox, Wenyen Gabriel, Chris Livingston, TyTy Washington -- weren't going to be enough to overcome Cal's game management flaws, the experience of other teams, talent of other teams, etc.

And then there were plenty of "busts" relatively speaking -- top 10 recruits that just looked great against high school competition, but were nowhere near ready to dominate at the next level as a freshman (e.g., Boston, Clarke (RIP), Skal, the Dragon, EJ ...).

The one and done model required Cal to get 3-4 top 10 players for that incoming team, mixed with role players like Patrick Patterson or Darius Miller ... even Dominique Hawkins or Derek Willis (at times). He has the first part for next season ... but will he have the second? It's going to require serious work in the transfer portal, clearly.

I'm not sure how you see it, but from my perspective, it sure seems like the kids staying multiple years are bigger and stronger than they were even 5 years ago. Are you seeing the same thing?
It just seems like so many more programs are all in on effective body development and it's making it even harder for even the best freshmen to step in the ring and win.
San Diego State's guys looked like they were at the tail end of a 20 year weight training program and that seems to be the case for more and more programs these days.

 

[kyjeff1]

Read and weep.

McClung joined the NBA G League's Delaware Blue Coats for the 2022–23 season. He accepted an invitation to the 2023 NBA Slam Dunk Contest and became the first G League player to participate in the event.

Are we still talking about "Matt"?

 

[kyjeff1]

He is not in the NBA contrary to what you say. He is a G League player.

McClung joined the NBA G League's Delaware Blue Coats for the 2022–23 season. He accepted an invitation to the 2023 NBA Slam Dunk Contest and became the first G League player to participate in the event.

Cool beans, he’s still on the 76ers' roster. Look it up.

 

[kl40504]

Cool beans, he’s still on the 76ers' roster. Look it up.

He is still in the G league and not the NBA. Look it up

 

[kl40504]

Are we still talking about "Matt"?

Would you like to place a bet on whether Mac McClung is my neighbor? Name the price big boy.

 

[BlueWorldOrder74]

Would you like to place a bet on whether Mac McClung is my neighbor? Name the price big boy.

You have to be about 14.

 

[kl40504]

You have to be about 14.

That still would be 4 years older than you.

 

[kyjeff1]

Would you like to place a bet on whether Mac McClung is my neighbor? Name the price big boy.

You said "Matt McClung" and I don't give a pile of cow dung if he's you're neighbor.

 

[kl40504]

You said "Matt McClung" and I don't give a pile of cow dung if he's you're neighbor.

No one asked you to reply to anything I post. You are all about starting trouble.

 

[kennyskywalker34]

Who will @LmdCat love on now his son Wheeler is gone. And who will he constantly trash now that his whipping boy Livingston is gone?
Funny he chastised everyone who bashed Wheeler. Then he turns around and does the same thing to Livingston.
#hypocrite

 

[yes_takeaside]

Could of been another Pj/ quickly in terms of the jump he made

No not at all. What basic bb skills does he really possess? Good leaper who could get some boards.

Not overly quick, not a good handle, could not create his own shot.

 

[yes_takeaside]

The junp he could have made will be hard to replace, if he came back I could easily see him being a 15 & 8 rebounds type of player

Lol

 

[Dontworryboutit23]

No not at all. What basic bb skills does he really possess? Good leaper who could get some boards.

Not overly quick, not a good handle, could not create his own shot.

Washington wasn’t overly great his freshman year. Livingston had flashes where he was a good shooter. A summer of working on his shot and handle would of had him in a good spot

 

[JonathanW]

I'm not sure how you see it, but from my perspective, it sure seems like the kids staying multiple years are bigger and stronger than they were even 5 years ago. Are you seeing the same thing?
It just seems like so many more programs are all in on effective body development and it's making it even harder for even the best freshmen to step in the ring and win.
San Diego State's guys looked like they were at the tail end of a 20 year weight training program and that seems to be the case for more and more programs these days.

I would agree. And you are seeing fewer impact FR each year because of it. Many UK fans knock Wallace as a disappointment (I disagree!). But I've still seen him ranked in the 5-6 best FR this year. But there is probably only 1 FR that NBA teams aren't nervous about investing their future in (Miller). And Rivals had him ranked as the #17 incoming FR this past year. Yeah, we took the #11 FR (same position) over Miller, and we weren't alone. Only one guy (Filipowski) in the Rivals top 7 last summer finished the year in the top 10 in that ranking I saw.

 

[yes_takeaside]

My issue with your last statement is that we get a disproportionate amount of players with that mindset:

Orton
Dodson
Harrow
Teague
Goodwin
Dakari
Matthews
Wynyard
Gabriel
Vanderbilt
Juzang
Whitney
Lamb
Baker
Green
Harrison
Harrison
Lee
Diallo
Humphries
Briscoe
Hagans
Skal
Montgomery
Johnson
Ty Ty
Fletcher
Boston
Brooks
Hopkins
Livingston


"Getting out of there as quickly as possible" is built into the type of player Cal recruits, regardless of whether they're ready to leave or not.

I mean, you mention someone like Juzang, and half our fans lose their minds, ready to defend him with statements like "It just didn't work out" or "they were at their peak point of potential"; as if staying here for three or four years and battling through adversity and improving draft stock is now considered absurd within our basketball culture.

Cal ran Hump off

Matthews played 4 years in college ( I think, certainly 3)

Pushed Ulis to NBA to make room for Fox

Cal knows what he wants and it’s always the shiny new thing.

 

[yes_takeaside]

His poor shooting was the main reason we lost two of our last five games.

It wasn’t like he was taking minutes from better shooters.

 

[JonathanW]

Cal ran Hump off

Matthews played 4 years in college ( I think, certainly 3)

Pushed Ulis to NBA to make room for Fox

Cal knows what he wants and it’s always the shiny new thing.

Matthews was afraid to compete with Briscoe for PT. Similar players, 2/3's with very limited offensive ability who could defend.

Humphries, didn't he go to make $$?

Ulis, as much as I loved him, it was the right thing to do. His stock was never going to get higher (without a growth spurt) than it was, so if he was to ever make it in the NBA, that was the time to go for it. Now had NIL existed then, DAMN!!!! Ulis at UK for 4 years would've been a no-brainer.

 

[maysvilleky]

Livingston’s camp is delusional. If we lose him to the draft fine, but if he transfers I just ugh. He should easily be back with NIL.

It sounds like Livingston’s camp wants no part of Cal. They’re trying to convince a team to use the late round 1 pick and then take all year to teach Livingston basketball skills.

 

[Ron Mehico]

Would you like to place a bet on whether Mac McClung is my neighbor? Name the price big boy.

Just FYI but G league players make like 50k a year.

 

[yes_takeaside]

Matthews was afraid to compete with Briscoe for PT. Similar players, 2/3's with very limited offensive ability who could defend.

Humphries, didn't he go to make $$?

Ulis, as much as I loved him, it was the right thing to do. His stock was never going to get higher (without a growth spurt) than it was, so if he was to ever make it in the NBA, that was the time to go for it. Now had NIL existed then, DAMN!!!! Ulis at UK for 4 years would've been a no-brainer.

Ulis was never going to make it in the NBA. If Cal didn’t have a commitment from Fox Ulis stays.

Hump was pushed out to make room for Bamba & Richards. Of course Cal didn’t get Bamba

 

[kyjeff1]

No one asked you to reply to anything I post. You are all about starting trouble.

Says the guy that trolls the board endlessly

 

[G-PIP]

Matthews was afraid to compete with Briscoe for PT. Similar players, 2/3's with very limited offensive ability who could defend.

Humphries, didn't he go to make $$?

Ulis, as much as I loved him, it was the right thing to do. His stock was never going to get higher (without a growth spurt) than it was, so if he was to ever make it in the NBA, that was the time to go for it. Now had NIL existed then, DAMN!!!! Ulis at UK for 4 years would've been a no-brainer.

Agree. Ulis' decision to leave for the draft when he did was the right decision for him at that time.

 

[kyjeff1]

I would agree. And you are seeing fewer impact FR each year because of it. Many UK fans knock Wallace as a disappointment (I disagree!). But I've still seen him ranked in the 5-6 best FR this year. But there is probably only 1 FR that NBA teams aren't nervous about investing their future in (Miller). And Rivals had him ranked as the #17 incoming FR this past year. Yeah, we took the #11 FR (same position) over Miller, and we weren't alone. Only one guy (Filipowski) in the Rivals top 7 last summer finished the year in the top 10 in that ranking I saw.

Yeah, I don't get the Wallace critisism either. The guy played very well for someone who, as a freshman, had to move to pg in the most physical league in the country and he had back and knee problems.

But yeah, it looks to me like the juniors and seniors we're seeing these days, are built much better than they used to be and they are much stronger, well rounded basketball players too.

 

[kyjeff1]

Ulis was never going to make it in the NBA. If Cal didn’t have a commitment from Fox Ulis stays.

Hump was pushed out to make room for Bamba & Richards. Of course Cal didn’t get Bamba

I think Ulis had to go when he went, he was only getting a cup.of coffee in the NBA either way, but if he didn’t go in 2016, he may never have seen another window of opportunity.
It sucks being short in this sport.

 

[kl40504]

Just FYI but G league players make like 50k a year.

His contract is more than that. He has a two way contract with the 76's. Another update for the two-way contract is the salary. McClung will now receive a flat rate of $508,891. That is equivalent to half of the rookie minimum contract. The contract should last for one year, until the Philadelphia 76ers make a decision on whether they want to convert the deal to a full-time contract or choose to go in another direction.

 

[bnewt]

It sounds like Livingston’s camp wants no part of Cal. They’re trying to convince a team to use the late round 1 pick and then take all year to teach Livingston basketball skills.

Because ccc can't teach