After what he has done to Cliff Alexander? I cannot see him recruiting there again.
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Any top 10 player that would go to KU is crazy..Not only Cliff, but look what he did to Selby
Didn't know Wiggins was from Chicago.
Wiggins, the Morris twins, McLemore and Aldrich will be pretty good-really good in the league for a while...Chalmers = meh...who knows w/ Embiid and Oubre...Arthur & Henry destined to be bench players. Not a great track record for an ELITE school.Any top 10 player that would go to KU is crazy..Not only Cliff, but look what he did to Selby
Bill Self also turned the #12 overall ranked Sherron Collins into an undrafted player who could only get a cup of coffee in the NBA.
That's 2 high profile prospects out of Chicago that Self failed to get drafted.
He was the #12 ranked prospect coming out of high school. So he may not have been considered an "elite NBA prospect" but he was definitely an NBA prospect.Come on now, Collins was never considered an elite NBA prospect. And that had nothing to do with what school he went to. Some guys are just very good college basketball players and not meant to play in the NBA.
I just looked at the 2016 and 2017 classes and there isn't a whole lot of talent in Chicago right now. It's usually cyclical so I'm sure someone will pop up soon. It's just bizarre after Rose, Davis, Parker, and Okafor in recent years (all top-3 picks) that there is nobody in the top-25 in the next 2 classes.With the talent pool there, I can only see our presence growing in Chicago. Tuff, hard nosed, high energy recruits aplenty.
He was the #12 ranked prospect coming out of high school. So he may not have been considered an "elite NBA prospect" but he was definitely an NBA prospect.
Thats good news for Self, cause he isnt getting any of them! HahaI just looked at the 2016 and 2017 classes and there isn't a whole lot of talent in Chicago right now. It's usually cyclical so I'm sure someone will pop up soon. It's just bizarre after Rose, Davis, Parker, and Okafor in recent years (all top-3 picks) that there is nobody in the top-25 in the next 2 classes.
He was 5'11 and 190#. And I'm sure that was Bill Self's recruiting pitch to the Collins family. Come to Kansas as a 5* recruit and then I'll do everything to prepare myself to blame your lack of an NBA career on your physical limitations.He was a fat 5'9 point guard. Not a huge market for that despite his high school ranking.
Josh Harrellson, DeAndre Liggins and Darius Miller weren't even in the same stratosphere of being considered for the NBA draft. Cal worked and DEVELOPED these young men and they got drafted. So, what you're admitting is Self can't take under developed players and work with them developing them into the best versions of themselves. Thanks for making our point for us.I know you guys want to blame Self, that's just the nature of fandom. But if Cliff, Selby and Sherron are your examples one year removed from the #1 and #3 picks being Kansas guys well your argument is pretty flawed. I know, here comes the Excuse Train but...
Sherron Collins is 5'11 in shoes and like the SECOND he graduated he turned into a bowling ball. KU made radio commercials in Lawrence while he was there that no fast food restaurant was allowed to serve him. That's real. He can still ball, he just played in the scrimmage but you should see how fat he is.
Cliff and Selby played partial years and had injuries. Cliff threw his career away. He showed up at KU with like, no fundamentals. He can dunk and block everything and in highschool he never had to do anything else. He needed a year or two to develop simple skills that most guys know. He had terrible footwork and couldn't handle double teams or defensive assignments. He was going to work on that but oops his family screwed that up for him. It's sad.
When you go to a college and get six months of training before dribbling your career down your leg it isn't Self that has ruined it. Those guys had serious flaws in their game and needed more than six months to fix them, but the ranking system tells them they are NBA-bound so they leave and you see what that gets them.
Blaming Self for these guys is silly.
FollowI know you guys want to blame Self, that's just the nature of fandom. But if Cliff, Selby and Sherron are your examples one year removed from the #1 and #3 picks being Kansas guys well your argument is pretty flawed. I know, here comes the Excuse Train but...
Sherron Collins is 5'11 in shoes and like the SECOND he graduated he turned into a bowling ball. KU made radio commercials in Lawrence while he was there that no fast food restaurant was allowed to serve him. That's real. He can still ball, he just played in the scrimmage but you should see how fat he is.
Cliff and Selby played partial years and had injuries. Cliff threw his career away. He showed up at KU with like, no fundamentals. He can dunk and block everything and in highschool he never had to do anything else. He needed a year or two to develop simple skills that most guys know. He had terrible footwork and couldn't handle double teams or defensive assignments. He was going to work on that but oops his family screwed that up for him. It's sad.
When you go to a college and get six months of training before dribbling your career down your leg it isn't Self that has ruined it. Those guys had serious flaws in their game and needed more than six months to fix them, but the ranking system tells them they are NBA-bound so they leave and you see what that gets them.
Blaming Self for these guys is silly.
Tell us then, what is Bill Self's strongest argument for developing NBA talent? He's got Wiggins who I think will be a superstar. Then who is next? Or is everybody else just a poor worker with physical limitations, low fundamentals, and no work ethic?Self has worked and developed a ton of guys. My point was you can't expect Cliff and Selby to get worked and developed into NBA starters in six months, especially when those guys don't buy in.
I'm going to ignore the fact that you're making a "player x did this so player y should do this" analogy that is inherently flawed and say that instead you're referring to guys who played multiple years at Kentucky which gave them time to be developed whereas Selby and Cliff were at KU a time period measured in months. Surely you can see how that's apples to oranges.
It's also been 3 years since T-Rob went #5 and has set the NBA on fire........ oh wait.Again, it has been one year since Wiggins and Embiid went 1 and 3.
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Bomani JonesVerified account@bomani_jones
just realized cliff alexander didn’t get drafted. self is the anti-cal for these one-and-done guys, isn’t he?
I'm more interested in NCAA penalties forAfter what he has done to Cliff Alexander? I cannot see him recruiting there again.
After he goes to the wig shop.As long as Bill is cutting the checks he can go anywhere