If you consider 9 players throughout the history of the NBA many a lot more, then sure.
And i love how people always try to say well Horry has 7, he must be the goat. It’s just hilarious.
There are a lot of arguments about the greatest NBA player ever.
- Thread starter Creed Bratton
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If you consider 9 players throughout the history of the NBA many a lot more, then sure.
And i love how people always try to say well Horry has 7, he must be the goat. It’s just hilarious.
I think this is also a great answer and tough to argue. He didn't have the physical prowess of wilt, but stats speak for themselves.
I think it is probably Jordan. But when someone talks about how important "winning" is, that argument has to go to Bill Russell.
He led San Francisco (!) to 2 NCAA Titles and then won 11 NBA titles, including 8 in a row. I realize those Celtics teams were great, but that is amazing.
He led San Francisco (!) to 2 NCAA Titles and then won 11 NBA titles, including 8 in a row. I realize those Celtics teams were great, but that is amazing.
Jordan got more breaks from the refs than anyone. Constantly pushing off to get free for shots and he took lots of shots. LeBron is roided up and when he retires and gets off the pills and juice he will look like Sammy Sosa. It’s Wilt and Jabbar is right behind him.
Nine. That’s not really a LOT. And all of them but Robert Horry are from the same run of Celtics championships.
Chamberlain was better than Russell. Put Chamberlain on the Celtics teams Russell was on, and they still win every championship.
Bingo, check out Wilt's stats against Kareem head to head. Kareem dominated him. If Jordan had played in the era that Kareem did and vice versa Karrem would be talked about being the GOAT. Same could probably be said about Oscar Robertson. Jordan, Bird and Magic with the TV package put the NBA out front like never before.
He had another Hall of Famer in KC Jones with him both at San Francisco and with the Celtics. The Celtics had multiple Hall of Famers. Those Celtics teams were stacked like no other teams in NBA history. But he was the anchor of their defense, and the undisputed team MVP.
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Here are the Wilt versus Kareem head-to-head stats. It's actually pretty even when you consider that Wilt had revised his game with the Lakers, so that he didn't really focus on scoring. West was their primary scorer. Wilt was at the end of his career, and Kareem when right in his prime considering he was at UCLA for four years. Kareem only shot 46.3% against Wilt, and he was a 55.9% shooter for his career.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tiny.fcgi?id=ZkXGE
You just made an interesting point when you say “the magical Celtics” though. It’s the very reason you can’t use championship’s as the only gauge. Yes Russell was an all-time great, and if you want to put him ahead of Wilt, I totally understand. But to do so solely because on championships is ludicrous. Basketball is a team sport. On the 1960 Celtics ALONE for example, you had
Bob Cousy (HOF’er, 19 points, 9 assists)
Frank Ramsey (HOF’er, 15 points, 7 reb)
Tom Heinsohn (HOF’er, 21 points, 11 reb)
Sam Jones (HOF’er, 12 points, 5 reb)
Bill Sharman (HOF’er, 19 points, career 88% ft’s)
And of course Russell and other HOF’ers. That team was preposterous. Wilt had some good teams, but not like that. Winning should be a factor but not THE deciding factor.
I posted my top 5 the other day and I totally agree with you!
1 MJ
2 Kobe
3 Wilt
4 Bird
5 Magic
* Pistol Pete, was a great but didn’t have any Championships! If he did he would of been in Magic’s place!
just my opinion and I’m sticking to it!!
1 MJ
2 Kobe
3 Wilt
4 Bird
5 Magic
* Pistol Pete, was a great but didn’t have any Championships! If he did he would of been in Magic’s place!
just my opinion and I’m sticking to it!!
Wilt would have dominated him.He was taller ,stronger,quicker better condtioned,and better jumper. He also was more skilled
I think this explains it very well. Not only that, but as Magic said---"What separated MIchael,was how good he was on the defensive side of the ball."
Wilt was named all defensive 2 times....Jordan did so 9X's....Including being named DPOY in 1988..
I have a hard time believing any big guy would have dominated Shaq. Dude was huge. He had every bit if 50lbs on Wilt. ...And no WIlt wasn't taller----both were 7'1". Stronger? I dunno. Shaq stood 7'1", 320. Wilt was 7'1", 270. Quicker probably. But make no mistake, Shaq was athletic as **** for a dude his size.
Not a chance he was stronger. 265 vs 325 and just look at their bodies. Wilt dominated because there was no one his size back then. Shaq would have broken him.
All I know is if the game was on the line and I needed a basket im taking Jordan. If my life was on the line I'd take Larry Bird. Forget where I heard that.
But it's to hard comparing different era's. I just appreciate greatness.
But it's to hard comparing different era's. I just appreciate greatness.
Absolutely. And he had complete say in what went into The Last Dance. Jordan was the first real sports figure to be marketed like he was. He had massive exposure through all kinds of things like McDonald's, Nike, and way more endorsements.
Not saying Michael wasn't the GOAT. Just saying he had a lot of propaganda working in his favor.
So do you think the stats of a man in his prime compared to one 11 years older and near the end of his career in a head to head match-up are relative?
You are giving a ton of credit based on team mates. Why didn't Jordan just keep winning titles for who ever would have him? Does Robert Horry belong high on the GOAT list?
You managed to come up with an even more unreasonable assertion than the one you are calling out.
Wilt was not playing a one on one tournament. This is a silly argument that is always repeated ad nauseam.
Robert Horry was a role player on some great teams. I don't think he should be on the GOAT list but if you do, by all means, include him on yours.
Jordan was the best player in the league on the best team ever assembled. He walked away from the game in his prime for two seasons (essentially).
If you don't agree that is fine, Wilt was a great player, I am sure...probably the best center ever but he is not the best player of all time, jmho.
I've gone through my reasoning in this thread so won't do it again- so we can just agree to disagree if necessary.
Stronger...lmao. Shaq ripped down entire basketball goal systems... collapsed.
They were roughly the same height and when Shaq was in his prime he ran the floor like a gazelle.
These Paul Bunyan stories of Wilt are priceless. Someone said he bench pressed 500 pounds earlier in this thread...hilarious stuff, to go along with his 50 inch vertical, ok.
Wilt was probably more skilled but the domination thing is a bit much...
I was just pointing out that titles are not the final say in any argument as many wish to assert.
Not to mention most of his competition were grocery store clerks or auto mechanics who played basketball on the side.
Wilt was an insane athlete that would have athletically dominated in any era. Maybe he wouldn’t have dominated as much as he did but the dude is a top 5 player IMO.
Jordan would tell someone he was going to steal the ball from them, then do it, then tell them he was going to go down the court and score on them, and then do it. He talked trash and backed it up again and again.
Jordan played under a different set of rules than everyone else. He was the cash cow of endorsements and protected by the league. He was taken apart by the physicality of the Pistons early in his career. Without the generous advantages given to him, he would have been a good player, but not even in the discussion as GOAT.
Also I didn't see it pointed out, but people like to say he would've won 8+ in a row, if not for the baseball stint. Are we just going to gloss over the fact that his first year back Houston won it all?
He was fresh and had already played a lot of regular season games, but they weren't good enough to get it done, until the next year when they brought in a 3rd hofer in Rodman.
They’ll never be another Jordan. His willingness to work, evolve, learn, and unequivocal desire to win championships sets him apart along with his unmatched athletic abilities.
Jordan benefited the new modern era of NBA marketing and international visibility. It was Bird and Magic that created this new era of marketing, but it was Jordan’s arrival that sent it to an entirely new level that it is even today with the arrival of social media.
Speaking of social media, could you imagine Jordan doing some of those iconic dunks and clutch shots today with Tick Tock, FB, and Twitter. How viral would his dunk at UNC cradling it before flushing it thru?
As a sport fan, I’m fortunate to have witnessed Jordan during my childhood. My whole neighborhood was UK fans for the most part. But when Jordan’s UNC team took the floor, it didn’t matter we were in some sort of neighborhood pick up ball 3-on-3 tourney on a low-rim. Our games stopped, and everyone of us crowded into the closest kid’s living room to watch him play. Great memories.
His first season back he played 7 games before the playoffs. They then lost to the Magic in ECF iirc.
That was after he sat out for almost 2 full seasons. This was the repeat season for the Rockets.
The Rockets won vs Knicks in 94 and Magic in 95.
Jordan's first season back they started their second 3peat.
Arguing that Michael Jordan isn't the greatest basketball player of all time is like arguing that the Earth is flat.
You are just never going to be right.
You are just never going to be right.
