Forgiving Student Loans

[B.B.d.K.]

$11,000 if you get free books, free lodging, free food, and zero living expenses. Pretty naïve to throw out that number.

"Cost of Attendance" is closer to $25,000, for your average college student living in a dorm and having a normal college experience at UK, in 2016. Pretty insane, imo.

"Wise Decision Making" could cut down on that number, but it would still be substantial. What is the % of UK attendees that have their parents living in Lexington?

 

[BigBlueSean]

No.

BCTCS costs about $4,000/year. UK is about $11,000.

That's $30,000 in tuition for a 4-year degree. I realize there are additional costs (books, living expenses, etc), but the majority of those can be mitigated thru wise decision making.

Are some people too poor to afford that? Sure. But that's where Pell Grants and need based scholarships come in. Working like crazy during the summer and throughout the school year. Living at home with your parents, or in a tiny no frills apartment.

College can be VERY affordable, if you actually take time to make some wise decisions. My parents actually had the money to spend, and that's how I made it thru. The concept of a student loan is nice, and it's perfectly reasonable to use in order to further your education. Unfortunately, the reality has become that student loans are mostly used as a crutch to support terrible decision making.

Thats a terrible argument. You act like Pell grants are just in abundance and are thousands and thousands of dollars. Need based scholarships as well are made for a certain demographic that the majority of college students dont fit into. So you are saying essentially you know what, college is affordable, if you live like a hermit and eat bread and cheese... and this general statement of "student loans is a crutch for bad decision making" has 0 evidence to back that up.

 

[B.B.d.K.]

Oh, and just FTR -- BigBlueSean is a teenaged idiot, definitely not taking his side, here.

 

[WettCat]

Graduated in 4 years from Centre. Had no AP classes going in because my high school offered none. Pretty sure we had quite a few "writing intensive courses" too....we called them Blue Books. And here's your link on AP classes. Seems like more and more kids are taking and passing AP courses/credits.

http://whopam.com/images/0522farley.jpg

 

[PTI (pti)]

Well the country collectively is buried under $1.3 trillion in student loan debt. So yeah, I stand by my statement.

As for the "cost of attendance," I think that's nonsense. Lodging? Food? Ummm...don't 18-22 year old humans require food and shelter whether they attend college or not?

Need based scholarships and Pell Grants are made for poor people and low income earners. The ones that need them the most.

I'm sorry, but I'm not going to just fall in line with idiotic conventional wisdom that college is so crazy expensive. If you've got money to spend, go for it. If not, there are plenty of ways to make it thru very affordably.

 

[BigBlueSean]

And we have a bunch of old asses on here that just like "screw you pay your debt, you lazy, ungrateful blah blah blah"

I agree, they need to be paid back...what I'm saying we would be in this situation if College hadn't become a big business and students were getting completely ripped off with interest rates on them. Maybe so incentive based repayment...if your GPS/Apr was this and you graduated in this amount of time of whatever you get rewarded via interest rates or whatever.

The complete college educational system is a fraud and is ripping people off... no way should a 4 year degree take going $ 30,000 worth of debt.

 

[B.B.d.K.]

The key is having wodie parents to pay for it all, imo. My best advice would be to go that route -- you can get a good education, party, make friends/memories to last a lifetime, then begin real life making 30K or so w/ zero debt, and work your way up from there.

That's what the majority of my friends did, and it worked out pretty awesome for all of us.

 

[BigBlueSean]

Graduated in 4 years from Centre. Had no AP classes going in because my high school offered none. Pretty sure we had quite a few "writing intensive courses" too....we called them Blue Books. And here's your link on AP classes. Seems like more and more kids are taking and passing AP courses/credits.

http://whopam.com/images/0522farley.jpg

OK but that still doesn't equate to time it's going to take. You also have to factor in t he fact many change majors at least once during school as well...there are a crap ton of factors that contribute to a degree taking 5 years and just because you did it at Centre doesn't mean it's a norm or everyone should or could do it.

 

[BigBlueSean]

Once government got involved the system went to shit. Another thing that simply proves that government isnt "for the people"... it's "to profit from the people"....and that's the reason the institution of higher education has become a big business...

Where my tuition money isn't remotely being invested in my or anyone elses education, but rather to fund sports programs and pay for upgrades, coaches and everything else.... I love sports, but not enough to warrant $35,000 of debt...

 

[PTI (pti)]

Welp, I think we all know that BigBlueSean is an entitled, spoiled little bitch brat.

For the record, I took 5 years. But that was because....

I used all 3 of my retake options
I double majored
I pulled a Van Wilder and tried to stay in as long as possible


And even then, I could easily have been done in 4-4.5. I get it, dude. If you do stupid shit it will cost you. Got it.

 

[WettCat]

Sean, what you must realize is that you probably should never have even gone to college. Its not for everyone. If your overall level of intelligence is such that it took you 5+ years to complete, maybe you shouldn't have even attempted it in the first place.

It's ok, we all have to face certain truths in our lives----I realized early on that the NBA wasn't in my future. I was born a caucasian with short legs and no vertical jump. It wasn't meant to be. It hurt, it hurt really bad. But I accepted it and moved on and have lived a fairly productive life. A life that has provided me the opportunity to attend a few NBA games---so I was able to at least experience a little of my childhood dream of being Kurt Rambis. Even if only for a couple of hours.

 

[BigBlueSean]

Lol at people calling me stupid and entitled. I got a 30 on my ACT, worked my ass off during school and in the summer, double majored and make damn good money now. Im fortunate. I got a job where I could pay my student loans off in 2 years... But I also recognize the system is broken, and its just a big business to make sure the rich keep getting richer.

 

[B.B.d.K.]

false

 

[BigBlueSean]

This is the problem with people today... Everyone wants to sit here and be the person to say "pull your pants up" and act like because something wasn't or hasn't been an issue and effected you, it cant be an issue for anyone else. Act like in today's market its easy as a mf'er to just get out with your fancy degree and get a job paying $45,000+. This world is bigger than your ideas and your perceptions and there are shit tons of people out there who aren't dumb or lazy, and didn't just make horrible decisions that student loan debt is a much bigger burden for than what it really should be.

You do not know other peoples circumstances or issues...and just saying its a bunch of irresponsible, whiny, lazy millennials that don't want to pay their money back is both dumb as shit and wildly inaccurate.

 

[BigBlueSean]

Am I saying forgive all of it? No. What I am saying is 1) Changes need to be made as far as cost goes when it comes to college as a whole, and 2) As long as you didn't just screw around and do nothing give breaks to those who completed college, did well, and didn't just spend recklessly and now do not want to pay it back.

Also think this narrative in high schools of "you HAVE to go to college" needs to be changed and they also need to inform student of options like trade schools and things of the sort as well.

 

[Willy4UK]

Act like in today's market its easy as a mf'er to just get out with your fancy degree and get a job paying $45,000+.

hahahahahaha

 

[BankerCat12]

Long story short, someone thought I was her, so I changed my avatar to a clip from the commercial. Seemed appropriate.

She annoys me to no end in those commercials.

 

[BankerCat12]

I am lucky that my parents were able to pay for my college education. My wifes parents were able to pay for hers as well. Being in banking, I know even more now how lucky I am b/c I see a ton of student debt on these credit reports that would make anyone cringe. Some are on 30yr terms. That's insane.

With that being said, all the people on here bitching and complaining about student debt etc, if you have kids, what are you doing NOW to help your child when he/she becomes that age? Are you going to have them take out student debt or are you saving now to help them eliminate or at least cut some of their needs down? I am hoping you are saving now so your child does not have the same issues like the ones complaining in this thread.

 

[domino79]

The thing about forgiving the debt is that banks would limit to whom they give their loans. Would ultimately be worth it IMO, although I don't agree with the basic principle.
If you find it hard to pay off your debt, get a second job? Oh and always pay more than your monthly bill. Interest is a killer.

 

[Ron Mehico]

Me and wife combined are in an unbelievable amount of student debt, like combined we are over 600K in student debt. All from professional school thank god, as I had a full ride to UK and then in graduate school actually got paid 25K a year to be a TA, but no avoiding professional school debt unfortunately. We are actually better off than some of our classmates who had undergrad debt as well. So obviously this is a big deal to us.

What annoys me to no end is the interest. If I had started professional school one year earlier my interest would be 2.5%, but because of when I started its 6.5%, which is insane to me, and will end up costing me probably 400K extra when its all said and done when I pay it off in a couple of decades. Why the hell is the gov't making 6.5% off of my loan? That's insane. My mortgage is 3.5%, literally the government is making more off of me than my private bank, which just seems wrong on so many levels.

Not to mention I'm currently on the "income based repayment" which has debt forgiveness after 20 years of payments......unless you make above a certain amount. That will be the situation I am in, so I will not be eligible for debt forgiveness. That's right, I will be punished for actually taking out student loans for a high paying job, while others will have all of their loans forgiven for taking student loans they can't afford to ever pay back.

 

[PTI (pti)]

$600k, all from post undergrad??

Lord have mercy. WTF did you study? Please tell us so we can make fun of you. If the answer isn't "neuro nano radio anesthesiological gyno surgery," you're F'd.

 

[DSmith21]

Me and wife combined are in an unbelievable amount of student debt, like combined we are over 600K in student debt. All from professional school thank god, as I had a full ride to UK and then in graduate school actually got paid 25K a year to be a TA, but no avoiding professional school debt unfortunately. We are actually better off than some of our classmates who had undergrad debt as well. So obviously this is a big deal to us.

What annoys me to no end is the interest. If I had started professional school one year earlier my interest would be 2.5%, but because of when I started its 6.5%, which is insane to me, and will end up costing me probably 400K extra when its all said and done when I pay it off in a couple of decades. Why the hell is the gov't making 6.5% off of my loan? That's insane. My mortgage is 3.5%, literally the government is making more off of me than my private bank, which just seems wrong on so many levels.

Not to mention I'm currently on the "income based repayment" which has debt forgiveness after 20 years of payments......unless you make above a certain amount. That will be the situation I am in, so I will not be eligible for debt forgiveness. That's right, I will be punished for actually taking out student loans for a high paying job, while others will have all of their loans forgiven for taking student loans they can't afford to ever pay back.

How do you run up $600,000 in student loan debt for post graduate school? You can go to Vandy for about $45,000 a year currently. $600,000 would pay for 13 years of tuition between the two of you. I am not doubting you but that is the biggest student loan number that I can recall anyone saying that they had.

 

[PTI (pti)]

I continue to stand by my comments. Wise decision making is crucial. Thank you for the reminder, Ron.

 

[jamo0001]

I do enjoy watching how people (not necessarily ITT) are shocked by the rise in education costs. Hopefully their kids will take Econ 101 in college so they can understand that if you dramatically increase demand (via ad lib loans to a bunch of 18 year olds), either the price of the good will rise, the supply will rise, or both.

If the government started handing out easy-peasy loans for car purchases, either the auto companies would jack up the prices, they'd make more cars, or both.

 

[cricket3]

You don't get to drop a "I have 600k in student debt" and not explain how that's even possible.

That's such an unbelievable amount you have to give us something.

 

[anthonys735]

Too many fools who have no business going to college are going to college. We need more people with knowledge of skilled trades in our country, from carpenters to computer techs. I've never seen a job description looking for a philosophy major.

Amen. The trades are starved for good, responsible, clean tradesmen. We both know this more than anyone. These are good paying 50-100k jobs in these industries with little education needed.

 

[Willy4UK]

I do enjoy watching how people (not necessarily ITT) are shocked by the rise in education costs. Hopefully their kids will take Econ 101 in college so they can understand that if you dramatically increase demand (via ad lib loans to a bunch of 18 year olds), either the price of the good will rise, the supply will rise, or both.

If the government started handing out easy-peasy loans for car purchases, either the auto companies would jack up the prices, they'd make more cars, or both.

College is seeing a decline in attendance through out the US. Not sure that has any relevance to your point.

I remember going to UK when it was under a $1000 a semester. I tried to see about going back and completing my degree there and it was $6K a semester in 2008/2009. Well, i nearly shit my pants on that one.

 

[BigBlueSean]

I am lucky that my parents were able to pay for my college education. My wifes parents were able to pay for hers as well. Being in banking, I know even more now how lucky I am b/c I see a ton of student debt on these credit reports that would make anyone cringe. Some are on 30yr terms. That's insane.

With that being said, all the people on here bitching and complaining about student debt etc, if you have kids, what are you doing NOW to help your child when he/she becomes that age? Are you going to have them take out student debt or are you saving now to help them eliminate or at least cut some of their needs down? I am hoping you are saving now so your child does not have the same issues like the ones complaining in this thread.

Started that fund a year ago...

 

[Ron Mehico]

Me and my wife are health care professionals. No need to give you guys my personal info, but we will be just fine, I promise. And yes, it is a very common amount of debt for my profession. We were both in school for 4 years and then had 3 years of specialty training that we had to pay for as well, so that was basically for 7 years of education after a B.S. (and M.S. in my case).

Edit: And also, since I am a health care professional and am in a crucial job that is needed for the greater good of society, I think its complete bullshit that me and my classmates have to pay that much for school, which we literally have no choice for, just because schools can jack up tuition that much because they know people will still apply. But that's a topic for another thread.

 

[BigBlueSean]

Amen. The trades are starved for good, responsible, clean tradesmen. We both know this more than anyone. These are good paying 50-100k jobs in these industries with little education needed.

Completely agree with this... the problem is in high school and middle there needs to be more conversation, and opportunity to expose kids to these alternative to college routes. All I ever heard in HS was you gotta go to college and get a degree if you want to be anyone to amount to anything.. Hell I got a cousin who has his GED and is now a team leader at Toyota making bank with kickass benefits.

 

[BigBlueSean]

Wow... 600k is a crazy.... I have a buddy who got his bachelors at Georgetown, Went to Law School at OSU, then Med school at EKU, and finally got his masters in international business from UK and he has like $220k.... I thought that was massive.... Harvard Law is one of the most expensive degree's to get... I believe its like 65k a year.... even if it took 5 years that still doesnt get to 600k...

 

[Ron Mehico]

Wow... 600k is a crazy.... I have a buddy who got his bachelors at Georgetown, Went to Law School at OSU, then Med school at EKU, and finally got his masters in international business from UK and he has like $220k.... I thought that was massive.... Harvard Law is one of the most expensive degree's to get... I believe its like 65k a year.... even if it took 5 years that still doesnt get to 600k...

Well seeing as how average law school debt is 150K and average med school debt is 250K, then you're buddy either had help or is lucky as all hell.

Edit: Its for me and my wife again as a reminder, we each have 300K.

 

[jamo0001]

Me and my wife are health care professionals. No need to give you guys my personal info, but we will be just fine, I promise. And yes, it is a very common amount of debt for my profession. We were both in school for 4 years and then had 3 years of specialty training that we had to pay for as well, so that was basically for 7 years of education after a B.S. (and M.S. in my case).

Edit: And also, since I am a health care professional and am in a crucial job that is needed for the greater good of society, I think its complete bullshit that me and my classmates have to pay that much for school, which we literally have no choice for, just because schools can jack up tuition that much because they know people will still apply. But that's a topic for another thread.

Now I'm intrigued. I don't think Pharmacy fellowships last 3 years. And I think most NP/PA fellowships are only 1.

If you're an MD who did an MPH, then I guess that could explain your situation

 

[jamo0001]

Wow... 600k is a crazy.... I have a buddy who got his bachelors at Georgetown, Went to Law School at OSU, then Med school at EKU, and finally got his masters in international business from UK and he has like $220k.... I thought that was massive.... Harvard Law is one of the most expensive degree's to get... I believe its like 65k a year.... even if it took 5 years that still doesnt get to 600k...

Since when did EKU have a med school?

 

[BigBlueSean]

Since when did EKU have a med school?

It was pre-med.

 

[BigBlueSean]

Well seeing as how average law school debt is 150K and average med school debt is 250K, then you're buddy either had help or is lucky as all hell.

Edit: Its for me and my wife again as a reminder, we each have 300K.

OK, Combine that helps out a little...

I could have been in that boat, but luckily I had family that was faculty at USC so I got a major discount at USC for my masters.

 

[B.B.d.K.]

My wife was too prideful to let her parents pay for her Graduate School after they funded her college, so she took out a loan TWICE the amount of what she needed (maybe more) to pay for it and lived the high life for 4 years. Luxury Apartment, endless dining/drinking budget, and God knows what else. As a result, we'll be paying on it for the rest of our lives. (not really, but long enough)

Cracks me up to think about it, really, b/c he's as 'smart' and frugal as anyone I know, or have ever met. The lesson to me is that 20 year olds cannot be trusted on their own to make wise decisions, imo

The payment is part of our lives, and it doesn't even factor into our budget...it's just there and will be for a long ass time. Haven't thought about it in forever until this thread, tbh. I don't even 'see' it on our banking statements, kinda like NHL highlights on SportsCenter.

Overall, worth it given her job -- but she could have gotten by on half of what she 'took'. Amazing that they'll pretty much give you whatever and seem to have no clue how much a student REALLY needs. I don't know the details of how it works b/c I never had to worry about it, but the amount she got/took is absolutely insane.

Fully realize there are way more people who did the same thing, yet have a shit job and nothing to show for it.

 

[BigBlueSean]

If I had it all to do again and actually knew all my options a little more in depth I would have become an electrician.

 

[BigBlueSean]

My wife was too prideful to let her parents pay for her Graduate School, so she took out a loan TWICE the amount of what she needed maybe more) and lived the high life for 4 years. Luxury Apartment, endless dining/drinking budget, and God knows what else. As a result, we'll be paying on it for the rest of our lives. (not really, but long enough)

Cracks me up to think about it, really, b/c he's as 'smart' and frugal as anyone I know, or have ever met. The lesson to me is that 20 year olds cannot be trusted on their own to make wise decisions, imo

The payment is part of our lives, and it doesn't even factor into our budget...it's just there and will be for a long ass time. Overall, worth it given her job -- but she could have gotten by on half of what she 'took'. Amazing that they'll pretty much give you whatever and seem to have no clue how much a student REALLY needs. I don't know the details of how it works b/c I never had to worry about it, but the amount she got/took is absolutely insane.

I had a buddy that got so many grants (which you dont have to pay back) in college he made over $2,000 a semester. Luckily he was my roommate and we really never worried about much at all...

 

[KingOfBBN]

Once government got involved the system went to shit. Another thing that simply proves that government isnt "for the people"... it's "to profit from the people"....and that's the reason the institution of higher education has become a big business...

Where my tuition money isn't remotely being invested in my or anyone elses education, but rather to fund sports programs and pay for upgrades, coaches and everything else.... I love sports, but not enough to warrant $35,000 of debt...

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Yep. To be honest, ever since I went back to college to finish my degree, I have lost most of my interest in college athletics. It bothers me that I worked my ass off to get good grades and a lot of these idiots can barely read yet get a free pass. Also, the students had to fund nearly 70 percent of the athletics budget. That's BS. WTF do any of us care about paying for athletic gear, the unnecessary travel and overpaid coaches? Why do we keep funding things that only produces major losses?

The majority of schools are not like Alabama and Ohio State. They lose massive amounts of money