Anyone Here Have An Electric Car?

[UKnCincy]

I'm just using that as an example because it is a compact car and that's what the Model 3 is considered. It is also the cheapest model that Tesla offers and no other EV brand really sells that well. Tesla is the best brand out there it seems and if you were forced to get an EV, you probably would get one of those.

There are plenty of good options of ICE cars that you aren't forced to get one that costs $40k+ to have good features and be extremely reliable. My wife has a 22 Toyota Camry XSE that's loaded with luxury features and still was like $10k less (maybe much more less than that depending on the options) than the Model 3 new. I'd take it over a Tesla Model 3 any day. Teslas are butt ugly imo and I don't care about racing around in one.

It may be the cheapest model that Tesla offers, but it’s still a luxury car. Just like a 3 Series was the cheapest car BMW sold for decades, but you’d never compare a 3 Series with a Civic. It targets a completely different segment of the market than the Civic.

I’d agree with you that there are some gaps in the market right now for EVs. There are cheaper options out there than a Tesla, like a Chevy Bolt, but those are usually pretty small and I wouldn’t consider those to be a true alternative to something like a Civic or Camry or Accord. If those are the types of ICE vehicles you’re wanting to purchase, then I don’t know that you really have a lot of good EV options at the moment. You’re forced to either buy something pretty small or pay a lot more to buy a luxury car. That’s simply a product portfolio problem at the moment and not necessarily a problem with EVs in general, and it’s also something that eventually will get fixed.

But if you compare an EV to other ICE vehicles from the same segment, then the running costs of an EV become much more attractive. I don’t own an EV either, but there's no denying some of the strengths EVs have, one of which would be cost/ease of ownership if you’re driving something comparable.

If manufacturers can figure out how to make a good performance EV, then it might be hard for me to stick with an ICE at that point.

 

[KyCatFan]

It may be the cheapest model that Tesla offers, but it’s still a luxury car. Just like a 3 Series was the cheapest car BMW sold for decades, but you’d never compare a 3 Series with a Civic. It targets a completely different segment of the market than the Civic.

I’d agree with you that there are some gaps in the market right now for EVs. There are cheaper options out there than a Tesla, like a Chevy Bolt, but those are usually pretty small and I wouldn’t consider those to be a true alternative to something like a Civic or Camry or Accord. If those are the types of ICE vehicles you’re wanting to purchase, then I don’t know that you really have a lot of good EV options at the moment. You’re forced to either buy something pretty small or pay a lot more to buy a luxury car. That’s simply a product portfolio problem at the moment and not necessarily a problem with EVs in general, and it’s also something that eventually will get fixed.

But if you compare an EV to other ICE vehicles from the same segment, then the running costs of an EV become much more attractive. I don’t own an EV either, but there's no denying some of the strengths EVs have, one of which would be cost/ease of ownership if you’re driving something comparable.

If manufacturers can figure out how to make a good performance EV, then it might be hard for me to stick with an ICE at that point.

To be honest, I never really thought of Teslas as being luxurious. Just seemed to be an overpriced specialty car that they could charge more for because of lack of good competition. Unless the current owners keep trading them in for new ones, I think Tesla is going to start struggling pretty soon, if not already. The whole green industry is.

I believe the average person either doesn't like them, can't afford them, has issues with the technology, doesn't want another car payment, or just doesn't like the government's green agenda they are trying to force on us. I think there's going to be major issues with the battery development and disposal of old batteries.

 

[Perrin75]

You forgot a few other costs for EV's. You are going to want a speedy home charger which will cost $2,000 or more especially if your wiring has to upgraded. EV's are much heavier and wear out tires faster. Insurance is higher on some EV's because the very expensive batteries are susceptible to damage in collisions. EV's depreciation is higher because of less demand compared to ICE models. Finally, you may have to replace those $10,000-$15,000 batteries if you keep it long enough. Many EV models don't even qualify for the tax breaks.

No offense but what the hell are you talking about? I have an EV. You don't have to have a "Speedy" home charger if you don't want. I charged mine for over a year on just straight 120 at the house. I ultimately bought a level two charger for $350 from Amazon (Grizzl-e if anyone is searching for one. It's been great). I paid an electrician $600 to add a 240 outlet in my garage. Installation costs will vary so ask an electrician if you are concerned about this. I then took advantage of a $1000 tax rebate for installing this kind of equipment so ultimately it didn't cost me anything.

My insurance is not higher. If you are concerned about that then talk to you agent and find out which models are higher and which ones aren't just like you would do with an ICE car.

I don't worry about depreciation, because I keep cars for 10+ years but if you do worry about that then shop for the specific models that hold their value just like you would an ICE car.

My car has a 10 year, 100,000 mile warranty on the High Voltage Battery system. In some states that can go as high as 15 year, 150,000. Check your state laws if this is a concern for you. I already asked about getting my battery replaced. It would cost between 5 and 7,000. Basically it would be the equivalent of getting my transmission replaced. Also, my car is a 2018 with roughly 64,000 miles. I have had no noticeable battery degradation.

If you don't want an EV then don't get an EV. Why waste time on a conversation about something that you have no interest in purchasing?

 

[DSmith21]

No offense but what the hell are you talking about? I have an EV. You don't have to have a "Speedy" home charger if you don't want. I charged mine for over a year on just straight 120 at the house. I ultimately bought a level two charger for $350 from Amazon (Grizzl-e if anyone is searching for one. It's been great). I paid an electrician $600 to add a 240 outlet in my garage. Installation costs will vary so ask an electrician if you are concerned about this. I then took advantage of a $1000 tax rebate for installing this kind of equipment so ultimately it didn't cost me anything.

My insurance is not higher. If you are concerned about that then talk to you agent and find out which models are higher and which ones aren't just like you would do with an ICE car.

I don't worry about depreciation, because I keep cars for 10+ years but if you do worry about that then shop for the specific models that hold their value just like you would an ICE car.

My car has a 10 year, 100,000 mile warranty on the High Voltage Battery system. In some states that can go as high as 15 year, 150,000. Check your state laws if this is a concern for you. I already asked about getting my battery replaced. It would cost between 5 and 7,000. Basically it would be the equivalent of getting my transmission replaced. Also, my car is a 2018 with roughly 64,000 miles. I have had no noticeable battery degradation.

If you don't want an EV then don't get an EV. Why waste time on a conversation about something that you have no interest in purchasing?

I didn't say you had to have a 220 charger but rather most would want one. You ultimately got one so you proved me right. Your charger tax credit appears to only cover 30% of the cost up to a max of $1,000. So it still cost you $700. Thanks for pointing the credit out as I thought it had expired.

EV Charger Tax Credit: What You Need to Know

The federal EV charger tax credit for electric vehicle charging stations and equipment is back with a few key changes.

www.kiplinger.com

When the EV makers improve the product, get the cost down and build out a national charging network, I would absolutely consider buying one. I think that is still years away. My next car (buying in 2024) will either be an ICE or hybrid. I am glad that many early adopters are happy with their EV. Most Americans are not ready to make the leap yet though.

 

[Rebelfreedomeagle]

1. You can charge at home every night and never have to worry about going to get gas. The convenience of this is hard to quantify.

This is a very big selling point in my book. Every time a gas pump starts playing commercials at me I want to spray gas on it and light it. I would also be avoiding bro country music, dip spit, shady ass people milling around, and people asking to sell me crap.

 

[Kingseve1]

My cousins Rivian just came in. It’s an SUV and it drives better than my Tesla model S

 

[JDHoss]

My cousins Rivian just came in. It’s an SUV and it drives better than my Tesla model S

I was parked next to a Rivian at Tractor Supply a couple of months ago. I hung around for 10 minutes or so to ask the owner how they liked it, but they never came out and I had to go. Not a bad looking truck though. Much better looking than the bizarre Tesla "truck". I'll be in the market for a new truck in a couple of years and want to take a good look at the RAM Rev, Ford Lightning and Chevy Silverado EV.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

I didn't say you had to have a 220 charger but rather most would want one. You ultimately got one so you proved me right. Your charger tax credit appears to only cover 30% of the cost up to a max of $1,000. So it still cost you $700. Thanks for pointing the credit out as I thought it had expired.

EV Charger Tax Credit: What You Need to Know

The federal EV charger tax credit for electric vehicle charging stations and equipment is back with a few key changes.

www.kiplinger.com

When the EV makers improve the product, get the cost down and build out a national charging network, I would absolutely consider buying one. I think that is still years away. My next car (buying in 2024) will either be an ICE or hybrid. I am glad that many early adopters are happy with their EV. Most Americans are not ready to make the leap yet though.

When you look at all the work, energy and resources it takes to make these EV batteries.. you start to realize it ain't doing that much more for the environment.

I saw this on Facebook and take it with a grain of salt because.. well, "facebook". And more knowledgeable folks here, please verify this:

----------------------------------------------

DID YOU KNOW??

This is a Tesla model Y battery. It takes up all of the space under the passenger compartment of the car.

To manufacture it you need:
--12 tons of rock for Lithium (can be extracted from sea water)
-- 5 tons of cobalt minerals (Most cobalt is made as a byproduct of
the processing of copper and nickel ores. It is the most difficult
material to obtain for a battery and the most expensive.)
-- 3 tons nickel ore
-- 12 tons of copper ore

You must move 250 tons of soil to obtain:
-- 26.5 pounds of Lithium
-- 30 pounds of nickel
-- 48.5 pounds of manganese
-- 15 pounds of cobalt

To manufacture the battery also requires:
-- 441 pounds of aluminum, steel and/or plastic
-- 112 pounds of graphite

The Caterpillar 994A is used for the earthmoving to obtain the essential minerals. It consumes 264 gallons of diesel in 12 hours.

Finally you get a “zero emissions” car.

Presently, the bulk of the necessary minerals for manufacturing the batteries come from China or Africa. Much of the labor for getting the minerals in Africa is done by children! If we buy electric cars, it's China who profits most!

BTW, this 2021 Tesla Model Y OEM battery (the cheapest Tesla battery) is currently for sale on the Internet for $4,999 not including shipping or installation. The battery weighs 1,000 pounds (you can imagine the shipping cost). The cost to replace Tesla batteries is:

Model 3 -- $14,000+ (Car MSRP $38,990)
Model Y -- $5,000–$5,500 (Car MSRP $47,740)
Model S -- $13,000–$20,000 (Car MSRP $74,990)
Model X -- $13,000+ (Car MSRP $79,990)

It takes SEVEN years for an electric car to reach net-zero CO2. The life expectancy of the batteries is 10 years (average). Only in the last three years do you begin to reduce your carbon footprint. Then the batteries have to be replaced and you lose all the gains you made in those three years.

 

[Kingseve1]

I was parked next to a Rivian at Tractor Supply a couple of months ago. I hung around for 10 minutes or so to ask the owner how they liked it, but they never came out and I had to go. Not a bad looking truck though. Much better looking than the bizarre Tesla "truck". I'll be in the market for a new truck in a couple of years and want to take a good look at the RAM Rev, Ford Lightning and Chevy Silverado

The lightning looks really nice. As the range improves, I’ll be all over the lightning

 

[jameslee32]

🤣

Tesla Cybertruck: Survey finds that two-thirds of respondents wouldn't buy it

A new survey finds most people would not buy Tesla’s Cybertruck.

finance.yahoo.com

 

[JDHoss]

🤣

Tesla Cybertruck: Survey finds that two-thirds of respondents wouldn't buy it

A new survey finds most people would not buy Tesla’s Cybertruck.

finance.yahoo.com

Buy it? They'd have to pay me to drive it. I've been driving for 50 years, and it's the ugliest vehicle I've ever seen.

 

[BlueRaider22]

Buy it? They'd have to pay me to drive it. I've been driving for 50 years, and it's the ugliest vehicle I've ever seen.

The Chevy Aztec says hello.

 

[JDHoss]

The Chevy Aztec says hello.

That was from Pontiac, and yes, it was ugly, but no match for the Cyber truck.

 

[rick64]

Ontario man’s EV battery replacement cost $50,000

A man in Stoney Creek, Ont. attempted to replace the battery on his electric vehicle and was shocked to learn that it was going to cost him over $50,000 to replace.

tnc.news

 

[UKnCincy]

Ontario man’s EV battery replacement cost $50,000

A man in Stoney Creek, Ont. attempted to replace the battery on his electric vehicle and was shocked to learn that it was going to cost him over $50,000 to replace.

tnc.news

My reaction to that is that you can find nightmare car stories for any make/model car if you go looking for them.

Just ask anyone who had an IMS bearing failure in their Porsche 996 or spun a rod bearing in their E46 M3. Both of those failures frequently resulted in engine replacements costing between $20k and $30k ($35-$53k in today’s dollars if inflation adjusted). And BMW, Porsche and their respective dealers weren’t always willing to be helpful when those happened.

Sometimes, people just have really bad luck with a car, and that can happen with any type of car.

 

[Chuckinden]

This is a very big selling point in my book. Every time a gas pump starts playing commercials at me I want to spray gas on it and light it. I would also be avoiding bro country music, dip spit, shady ass people milling around, and people asking to sell me crap.

While my wife and I considered an EV for a couple years, the defining point came when I had to get out in 20 degree weather with a wind chill that had to be below zero to get gas. I told her then we are getting an EV.

As for my Model 3, I don't really consider it a "luxury" car. It has a lot of neat features and the bright white seats are awesome, but even with 4 doors I consider it a mid sized vehicle.

If I was looking to get another EV today, I would look around, but their are so many things to consider as EV support and charging capabilities.

We have a trip planned in a couple months for five of us to DisneyWorld and we are driving, but we will take the BMW X5 SUV that has much more room for all the crap we have to take...family notwithstanding.

 

[CAT Scratch FVR]

Electric vehicle sales are growing — a record of over 300,000 vehicles represented a 50% increase in the third quarter — but they still make up less than 8% of total car sales in the U.S., according to Cox. In interviews with the Wall Street Journal, auto dealers said customers are reluctant to switch to all-electric cars over concerns about price, reliability and a dearth of charging stations.

Biden wants EVs to make up half of all new car sales by 2030 — and if he can crush gas-powered sales down hard enough, he might just make it!

 

[wildcatcorner]

My wife and I bought a BMW i4 recently. So far, it's great. We can make it to Lexington and back to Louisville on a single charge (we typically only take it to 80-85% to prolong battery life). There's an Electrify America charging station a mile from the house which is great because we get free 30 minute charging for 2 years. I haven't even installed a home charger yet.

The car handles great, is such a smooth ride and has unbelievable power. I've been wanting an EV for years and I am not disappointed. Our next car, whenever that is, will definitely be another EV.

 

[roguemocha]

By the way, I'm driving around in a 12 year old 2011 KIA Sportage that's only got 79k miles on it and been paid off for a few years (bought it used in 2015). Just spending gas money, oil changes, and insurance on it. Only maintenance has been brakes and tires in 8+ years. So I'm really not planning on another vehicle for myself until it falls apart. Maybe by then the cost of Teslas will go down, batteries will get better, reliability will go up, and they won't be so butt ugly.

Never been a car guy so I’m right there with you. I but used with cash. 2010 Kia Soul for $4K is my car. Put 75 K miles on it in 5 years. Can’t imagine paying a monthly for a car, just don’t care about what gets me to work.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Never been a car guy so I’m right there with you. I but used with cash. 2010 Kia Soul for $4K is my car. Put 75 K miles on it in 5 years. Can’t imagine paying a monthly for a car, just don’t care about what gets me to work.

Your car probably involved less slave labor than an EV.

 

[jameslee32]

Huge Tesla recall because of Auto Pilot technology specifically.

 

[DreadLox]

One friend years ago had a Leaf. Another now drives a Tesla. A relative and a good friend drive a hybrid.

We did our part by dropping down to 1 car and rarely driving it.

If we were serious about AGW, we'd bring back mass transportation. Trains and other forms of shared transportation produce the least CO2. Electrics are too damn expensive and currently demand exotic materials that require filthy kinds of mining.

I remember someone accusing some environmentalist of wanting civilization to go back to the 19th century, and he said -- perfectly seriously -- that the 1920s would do. If you put it to a vote: 1920s tech and inconvenience vs. risking civilization and Business As Usual, well, we've already voted, haven't we?

 

[jameslee32]

Good thing ICE vehicles never require any mining for their components. Not that EV's are immune to such things prior to and including production but I fault nobody for making that leap to reduce emissions, for the tax break or just because they're cool. The total cost payoff and the transition itself is what I find interesting. I mean the only person who expected EV's to have lower depreciation, insurance rates and repair costs for example is Musk. Nothing new to technology of course.

 

[jameslee32]

🤣

 

[MrHotDice]

Is that sarcasm? If so, it was better than mine.

As gas prices decline and EV prices rise, no one will give a hoot about EV. Look for the Japanese to start making normal scaled down pick up truck for working people and again take over the market. The person at Ram, Ford, and GM who listened to all the EV bull shit from the Biden government should resign or be fired. $90,000 pick up trucks are already one year old and worth half their sticker price. New or not, it’s worth half.

 

[wildcatcorner]

As gas prices decline and EV prices rise, no one will give a hoot about EV. Look for the Japanese to start making normal scaled down pick up truck for working people and again take over the market. The person at Ram, Ford, and GM who listened to all the EV bull shit from the Biden government should resign or be fired. $90,000 pick up trucks are already one year old and worth half their sticker price. New or not, it’s worth half.

Maybe I'm reading the wrong articles, but it doesn't look like EV prices are rising.

 

[Catfan in Tn.]

GM, Ford announce several car models will lose electric vehicle tax credit in 2024

The Cadillac Lyriq, Chevrolet Blazer, E-Transit, Mach-E and Lincoln Aviator Grand Touring plug-in hybrid will be impacted

www.foxbusiness.com

 

[wildcatcorner]

GM, Ford announce several car models will lose electric vehicle tax credit in 2024

The Cadillac Lyriq, Chevrolet Blazer, E-Transit, Mach-E and Lincoln Aviator Grand Touring plug-in hybrid will be impacted

www.foxbusiness.com

Ah ok. That makes sense.

 

[jameslee32]

Speaking of transportation on the Friday before Christmas.

High-speed train company Hyperloop One shuts down

Based on an Elon Musk idea, with previous backing from Richard Branson, the firm will close this month.

www.bbc.com

 

[HymanKaplan]

Once they invent an actual zero emissions electric car I'll consider it.

 

[KYExtemper]

For me this is a no right now because of a lack of national infrastructure. All this green energy push is trying to leap into the great unknown without building an actual foundation for it. It's policy malpractice.

 

[KyCatFan]

For me this is a no right now because of a lack of national infrastructure. All this green energy push is trying to leap into the great unknown without building an actual foundation for it. It's policy malpractice.

It's like that Bible verse talking about a foolish man building his house on sand.

 

[HymanKaplan]

Well, all of that, and the fact that "EV's" are more expensive and worse for the environment (as currently constituted) than internal combustion vehicles.

 

[Chuckinden]

Once they invent an actual zero emissions electric car I'll consider it.

No you won't.

 

[jameslee32]

🤣

 

[Catfan in Tn.]

Tesla recalls 120,000 vehicles over potentially faulty doors that could open in a crash

Affected vehicles include the 2021 to 2023 Tesla Model S luxury sedan and the Model X SUV.

www.cnbc.com

 

[the nail at the foul line]

 

[Caveman Catfan]

No you won't.

Wrong, because he just did.

 

[jameslee32]

Yet not hanging from a bridge.

 

[JDHoss]

We've now got 6 Tesla, a Hyundai, and I believe a Kia EVs in our neighborhood now.