UK Draft Round 2 - LukaszObrcut vs. Son_Of_Saul

[DraftCat]

Welcome to March Madness this is Round 2 of the 2024 UK Draft. (Click Here for Bracket).

Voters - Please vote for the team you believe would win in a 1 game elimination format. You will be able to change your vote and voting period is open for 48 hours. If a tie should occur I will extend the voting by another 2 hours until the tie is broken. Your vote will be visible.


@LukaszObrzut - Jamal Mashburn, Patrick Patterson, Jamal Murray, Rajon Rondo, Scott Padgett, Mike Phillips, John Pelphrey, Ramel Bradley, James Lee, Mike Pratt, Mark Coury

vs.

@Son_Of_Saul - John Wall, Demarcus Cousins, Jodie Meeks, Antonio Reeves, PJ Washington, Keldon Johnson,Tyler Herro, Mark Pope, Reggie Hanson, Cason Wallace, Jarrod Polson

 

[Fox2monk]

On the surface I think SOS wins this. Very great shooting team, and one of the best PG/C combos ever here, I believe it would be hard to stop them with that kind of spacing. Almost everyone on his roster outside CUZ and Wall can shoot and that makes up for their one weakness.

On the other hand I think LukasZ has an advantage at forwards as Monster mash would dominate that defensive lineup. I think Rondo is one of the best guards you could ask for to help stop Wall. I like the toughness of his team as well. I think in the end the lack of a couple dominate big men to help Patterson would do him in. I think his team is best equipped to stop Saul and his overall lack of inside presence.

James Lee, Mike Phillips, and Pelphrey are as tough as guys gets to counter big cuz alone.

This matchup is way closer after inspection than it seems at first glance, although I believe SOS gets by a hair in a one game series due to hot shooting.

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

1. Mashburn is the second best player in this draft, behind Issel.

He's a matchup nightmare. He's going to get 25 points in any of these games.

That said, he was not good in college at guarding guys like Juwan Howard. Mashburn tended to overcompensate. College PJ is a lot like college Howard in terms of skill. Not quite as good, but he possesses some similar skills.

If Mashburn doesn't guard Washington, he's going to have to guard Reeves, Hanson, and Keldon Johnson at the 3. Again, Mashburn is not a lockdown defender and never has been. He's going to score 25, but he's also going to give up 20 to the guy he's defending.

2. I like Murray for @LukaszObrzut as an inside-out player for their team (he was a heck of a draft pick and perfectly aligned with Mashburn's skillset), but he struggled against length. His presence (and Monk's on another team) is precisely why I drafted Cason Wallace. I actually think this is a game where I would probably play Wallace more than Reeves if it stays close late.

3. All respect to Mike Phillips, Padgett, Patterson, and Mashburn, but who in that frontcourt is going to defend Cousins? Phillips was pretty great as a sophomore. Does he stop Boogie? Maybe so. That's a big key in this matchup.

4. Rondo is college was very good. Wall in college was great. I have a real advantage at the point guard. He has a real advantage at the 4 with Mashburn.

5. Meeks and Murray offset each other. Both are going to score 18 to 22 in this game.

6. If he plays Mashburn at the 4, who does he use at the 3? If Mash plays the 3, he's going to have chase Reeves off screens all night. That's a scenario where I would play Reeves a ton of minutes at the 3. Let Mashburn go for 25 to 30. Contain Murray, guard Padgett and the rest of the front court one-on-one, and bait Rondo into a track meet. Sag off Rondo, limit their fast break, and make it a game where my depth can play a big factor.

This is a pretty awesome matchup. College Wall/Boogie/Meeks vs. College Mashburn/Murray/Rondo

 

[LukaszObrzut]

Will write some more when I get home.

I love my team. & I love this matchup for me.
Cousins was a great 23 min per game player. He was a good one for UK .. but SOS will have to make some decisions here.

Overall my team has better basketball players. I wanted a veteran team , with toughness and winning culture.

A combination of defense and offense - Mashburn will be a nightmare but so will Rondo in a fast paced style offense surrounded by clutch shooters in big moments.

Murray and Meeks are not the same player.
When Rondo gives Wall all he wants, Meeks is not near as comfortable as an off guard.

Rondo single season most steals vs Wall single season most turnovers

Cousin had 79 turnovers in 893 minutes
Vs
Patterson 41 turnovers 1255 minutes.

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

Will write some more when I get home.

I love my team. & I love this matchup for me.
Cousins was a great 23 min per game player. He was a good one for UK .. but SOS will have to make some decisions here.

Overall my team has better basketball players. I wanted a veteran team , with toughness and winning culture.

A combination of defense and offense - Mashburn will be a nightmare but so will Rondo in a fast paced style offense surrounded by clutch shooters in big moments.

I'd like to see who you're starting in this game.

 

[Fox2monk]

Will write some more when I get home.

I love my team. & I love this matchup for me.
Cousins was a great 23 min per game player. He was a good one for UK .. but SOS will have to make some decisions here.

Overall my team has better basketball players. I wanted a veteran team , with toughness and winning culture.

A combination of defense and offense - Mashburn will be a nightmare but so will Rondo in a fast paced style offense surrounded by clutch shooters in big moments.

Murray and Meeks are not the same player.
When Rondo gives Wall all he wants, Meeks is not near as comfortable as an off guard.

Rondo single season most steals vs Wall single season most turnovers

I had a rough time determining a winner. I love your teams toughness and I think you do matchup well with his team at crucial spots.

 

[LukaszObrzut]

I'd like to see who you're starting in this game.

Rondo, (Junior)
Murray, (Freshman)
Mashburn, (Junior)
Padgett (Senior)
Patterson (Junior) All Sec Defense

Spread the floor, play up in tempo, but can slow in down in the half court- not as turnover prone. SOS team will be put on an island.

Mashburn is the best player with the best matchup. Murray is the best playmaker in terms of creating of the guards. Patterson and Padgett high IQ players to go well with the big 3

Quality bench with championship experience .. James Lee will break Reeves or Meeks if Mashburn doesn’t before

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

Rondo, (Junior)
Murray, (Freshman)
Mashburn, (Junior)
Padgett (Senior)
Patterson (Junior) All Sec Defense

Spread the floor, play up in tempo, but can slow in down in the half court- not as turnover prone. SOS team will be put on an island.

Mashburn is the best player with the best matchup. Murray is the best playmaker in terms of creating of the guards. Patterson and Padgett high IQ players to go well with the big 3

Quality bench with championship experience .. James Lee will break Reeves or Meeks if Mashburn doesn’t before

Wall vs. Rondo
Meeks vs. Murray
Reeves vs. Mashburn
Washington vs. Padgett
Cousins vs. Patterson.

You have one definitive advantage - Mashburn. Even in the matchup, Mash is going to have to chase Reeves all over the court when the game turns into a grindhouse game. Mash is going for 28 and 8? Fine. Reeves is going to make him follow through three or four off-ball screens each possession. I've also got Hanson, who was a defensive dynamo who averaged 16 points 7 rebounds, 2 blocks, and 2 steals per game. He also knows Jamal's game. They played together in 1991. That insight is going to go a long, long way in this matchup. We won't be addressing Mashburn blind. We'll have Hanson's firsthand experience.

I have objectively solid advantages as point guard and center. Cousins might have been the best big man to ever play here. Meanwhile, Patterson at 6'8" is going to handle him? Wall's better than Rondo by a county mile. This isn't the Rondo of the Celtics NBA finals. Let's remember that. He was very good in college. Wall was great in college and was our most electrifying player - perhaps ever.

Washington vs. Padgett is a tie. Meeks vs. Murray is a tie.

My bench is a tad better. Pelphrey is legit for you, and Mike Phillips is a great backup, but Hanson is at least on Pelphrey's level, and Hanson is my third or fourth guy off the bench whereas Pelphrey is your first or second. Your bench is almost nonexistent when it comes to scoring. Who provides a consistent offensive spark for your bench? Bradley? He was good for 7 points when he's coming off the bench. He's also a 41% career field goal shooter. He's a volume guy who simply can't be counted on to deliver in a game that doesn't allow him to shoot it at least 10 times. Plus, his assist to turnover ration was putrid at UK. It was almost 1 to 1.

You're in an interesting spot. Mashburn and Murray are really the type of players that are volume scorers and demand shots. If either of them are off on any given night, you're sunk. Meanwhile, I've got five scorers in my starting five, and two coming off the bench. I can afford a bad game from Meeks or Reeves and still have a counterpunch with Herro or Keldon off the bench. I also have a legit lockdown defender in Cason Wallace who can at least try to contain Murray. Who do you have that's going to lockdown my wing guards? James Lee isn't going to do it. Murray's not going to do it.

 

[LukaszObrzut]

I would also like to highlight why I picked some guys. I wanted guys that fit roles.

James Lee- notorious for nasty dunks, being tough and arguably the best 6th man on a very talented championship team, similar to this one.

John Pelphrey- shooter, that played the game right- charges, back door passes (assist numbers 145) his senior year-and great size for his position

For comparison Reeves 54 Meeks 63 and Washington 63 assists

Mike Phillips- known for some of the strongest hands and setting tough screens- played as twin towers - but up insane numbers when relied upon

Mike Pratt 2nd team All American- 1st team All Sec- played with UK Legends-

Ramel Bradley- do it all player, great rebounder at guard for size- All Sec defense

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

People are mocking Cousins for only playing 24 minutes/game.

Meanwhile, Karl Towns played 21 minutes/game for the '15 team; and Nazr Mohammed played 21 minutes/game for the '98 team.

Boogie's playing 28 minutes in this game against your guys, and I'm going to get him a touch down low on every possession. I'm going to make Patterson defend him. You're essentially playing a guy who didn't even play that much 5 for the BCG years (for a reason), to play out of position against arguably the greatest big man we've had in school history. It looks fine on paper, but not in reality. Boogie's cooking Patterson in this matchup, and I imagine you'll be turning to Mike Phillips by the second TV timeout.

 

[LukaszObrzut]

Wall vs. Rondo
Meeks vs. Murray
Reeves vs. Mashburn
Washington vs. Padgett
Cousins vs. Patterson.

You have one definitive advantage - Mashburn. Even in the matchup, Mash is going to have to chase Reeves all over the court when the game turns into a grindhouse game. Mash is going for 28 and 8? Fine. Reeves is going to make him follow through three or four off-ball screens each possession. I've also got Hanson, who was a defensive dynamo who averaged 16 points 7 rebounds, 2 blocks, and 2 steals per game. He also knows Jamal's game. They played together in 1991. That insight is going to go a long, long way in this matchup. We won't be addressing Mashburn blind. We'll have Hanson's firsthand experience.

I have objectively solid advantages as point guard and center. Cousins might have been the best big man to ever play here. Meanwhile, Patterson at 6'8" is going to handle him? Wall's better than Rondo by a county mile. This isn't the Rondo of the Celtics NBA finals. Let's remember that. He was very good in college. Wall was great in college and was our most electrifying player - perhaps ever.

Washington vs. Padgett is a tie. Meeks vs. Murray is a tie.

My bench is a tad better. Pelphrey is legit for you, and Mike Phillips is a great backup, but Hanson is at least on Pelphrey's level, and Hanson is my third or fourth guy off the bench whereas Pelphrey is your first or second. Your bench is almost nonexistent when it comes to scoring. Who provides a consistent offensive spark for your bench? Bradley? He was good for 7 points when he's coming off the bench. He's also a 41% career field goal shooter. He's a volume guy who simply can't be counted on to deliver in a game that doesn't allow him to shoot it at least 10 times. Plus, his assist to turnover ration was putrid at UK. It was almost 1 to 1.

You're in an interesting spot. Mashburn and Murray are really the type of players that are volume scorers and demand shots. If either of them are off on any given night, you're sunk. Meanwhile, I've got five scorers in my starting five, and two coming off the bench. I can afford a bad game from Meeks or Reeves and still have a counterpunch with Herro or Keldon off the bench. I also have a legit lockdown defender who can at least try to contain Murray. Who do you have that's going to lockdown my wing guards? James Lee isn't going to do it. Murray's not going to do it.

Come on. Volume shooters. Thats the definition of Reeves, Meeks and Herro.

You don’t want Wall to be a volume shooter.

Mashburn is the best player on the court. Maybe he can chase Reeves around. Maybe Reeves will shoot 1-15 from the field like he did against Kansas St.

Wall sure, a great player.. 149 turnovers over the course of a season makes for a lot of empty possessions- not ideal going against Rondo- who hands and wingspan did not just become a thing in the NBA.. don’t kid yourself, the advantage, if any is not great.

I don’t need scoring off my bench. I don’t want guys that are chunking shots up- I’ve seen enough of that in real time to know it’s not a recipe to win ncaa tournament games.

I’ll take experience over freshman every day.
I’ll take the bench I have over yours. I’m not sure how you could say otherwise

Ramel Bradley is a dog on defense.

 

[LukaszObrzut]

People are mocking Cousins for only playing 24 minutes/game.

Meanwhile, Karl Towns played 21 minutes/game for the '15 team; and Nazr Mohammed played 21 minutes/game for the '98 team.

Boogie's playing 28 minutes in this game against your guys, and I'm going to get him a touch down low on every possession. I'm going to make Patterson defend him. You're essentially playing a guy who didn't even play that much 5 for the BCG years (for a reason), to play out of position against arguably the greatest big man we've had in school history. It looks fine on paper, but not in reality. Boogie's cooking Patterson in this matchup, and I imagine you'll be turning to Mike Phillips by the second TV timeout.

That’s fine. I’ll take that. Give it to Cousins every time. - I’ll play the odds. Patterson was a great basketball player here. Sure look at size if you want- but he knew how to get in position- there’s a reason he was all sec defense

Who is your backup? All academic team Mark Pope?

W are talking about letting a turnover fouling machine get the ball every time- he better score because he’s going to have his hands full on the other end. Sure he won’t be tired or anything at that size.

You need to worry about how to guard Mashburn- Reeves isn’t the answer