I actually don't mind the idea of Livingston at SF if he's backing up Reeves and playing 15-18 mpg. All based on supposition, of course, since we haven't actually seen how either player melds and performs with the team. So, Livingston may get to UK and provide enough scoring and other contributions that he starts and Reeves plays behind him. But right now my guess is that Reeves is the best SF option UK has to make the offense work well.
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- Thread starter JonathanW
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People keep complaining that Toppin, Collins, Oscar aren’t shooters.
But they all have a decent form (unlike Wheeler), AND they forget how guys like Patterson and PJ weren’t shooters then became one.
Odds are all 3 won’t be good/decent 3pt shooters next year, but I like the odds at least one of the 3 does.
No doubt. Toppin CAN shoot, he just hasn't had enough opportunities to utilize it.
I mean, lets face it, Cal would rather shoot 10 footers than 3's, he puts very little emphasis on 3 point shooting, but I really hope he changes that this year. I mean, the NBA is all about shooting threes anymore.
2015- Duke’s starting 4 man was Justise Winslow(6’6). They won the national title.
2016- Nova’s starting 4 man was Kris Jenkins(6’6). They won the national title.
2018- Nova’s starting 4 man was Mikal Bridges(6’6). They won the national title.
2019- UVA’s starting 4 man was DeAndre Hunter(6’7). They won the national title.
2021- Baylor’s starting 4 man was Mark Vitale(6’5). They won the national title.
Five of the last seven national champions had a 4 man under 6’8.
Against some teams he can play the 4 spot. he's not afraid of contact and could be quicker than most 4's
True but how many of them were playing next to a 6'7 - 6'8 center (Oscar ain't 6'9!)? And another thought, how many of them took less than one 3PA per game. Outside shooting or size can negate height, but you have to have some other exceptional qualities if you are small.
2015 Duke - Winslow played more SF than PF, 6'9 Jefferson played 21mpg at PF (Plumlee was the backup C)
2018 Nova - Spellman (6'9 260) & Paschall (6'8 255) played 58mpg, add in Roundtree (6'9 235) and that is 69mpg, so Bridges mostly played SF.
2019 UVA - Diakite, Key, Huff & Salt combined for 67mpg, so Hunter mostly played the SF. Key was the smallest of those 4 at 6'8 230.
You are right about 21 Baylor, and 16 Nova. So really just 2 of the last 7.
Reeves will be off the bench I'd be willing to bet as kinda of a microwave scorer. Livingston is gonna play 25. That's kinda why getting transfers will be tough because there's a lot of guys getting 20+ minutes.
I agree that is what makes getting transfers tough (30mpg > 20mpg). Whereas UNC probably has their choice at PF, because they don't have one, and they could maybe at SF too where Black offensively is like Ware. KU had a lot of holes too.
Yeah because while we keep talking about Mayer, he's not THAT good, it's just compared to what they have he has a instant role with big pt. I only think and it's not coming with any advanced knowledge that they'll only be able to bring in a role grad transfer that is aware they won't play much, but maybe wants a opportunity for some spotlight
I hope that our rotation is something like this:
G - Wallace - Wheeler
G - Frederick - Wallace
G - Reeves - Livingston
F - Toppin - Livingston
C - Oscar - Collins - Ware
We've lost a lot of March games because Cal refused to go small. Livingston can fill that Justice Winslow role.
G - Wallace - Wheeler
G - Frederick - Wallace
G - Reeves - Livingston
F - Toppin - Livingston
C - Oscar - Collins - Ware
We've lost a lot of March games because Cal refused to go small. Livingston can fill that Justice Winslow role.
Nice rebuttal. Still, their STARTING 4’s were small ball 4’s.
Not saying Livingston would play all the minutes at 4, but he could start and play a lot of minutes at 4.
My point still stands.
Because of my bias for multiple good perimeter shooters on the floor at the same time, I like your first-string lineup. But I think it would work best in small doses, not as the primary lineup. I believe the team will function best and be the most dangerous with Wheeler at the Point most of the time. My guess is that Wallace is most effective at the PG spot as a freshman if limited to about 10-15 min. a game there (and the rest of his time on the wing). Just my feeling, of course.
Wheeler makes a lot of positive things happen with the pressure he puts on the opposing team. He needs to continue to limit turnovers, and I think playing him less than 30 minutes a game would help with that because fatigue seemed to me to be a factor in a lot of those turnovers. And in the later part of the season, I thought Wheeler started to only take the 3-pt. shot when he was standing wide-open and could take all-day to shoot. In those situations, he shot it good enough. He just needs to keep doing that and certainly not be hunting that shot (basically the exact opposite of what I wished Grady would have done).
I also agree with you on Reeves getting the majority of the minutes at SF, unless he just can’t/won’t defend or rebound. I like the idea of mixing Livingston in some at SF (providing a contrast to the defense) and some at PF, as you suggest. I just think the offense will be very stagnant and harder for everybody else to get good shots unless Reeves can shoot somewhere around 36-38% from the 3pt. line – because I don’t think Livingston will be able to do that or get the shot off quickly enough.
I’d go smaller and start Livingston at the 4 with Toppin off the bench. I like Toppin’s energy off the bench.
I like your thinking but the problem is Oscar. He’s so good he has to play a ton. Problem is he has no positional versatility as he’s strictly a 5. Say he plays his 32 MPG like last year. If Livingston and Toppin are gobbling up almost all of the minutes at the 4 spot, how do you get any minutes for Collins and Ware?
Let’s not forget Cal in one of his off-season interviews said something along the lines that “Collins can be one of the best players in the country next year”. While I’m sure that’s based in part on potential as well as a confidence building motivator, I have to think Cal plans to play him much more than 7.5 MPG like last year with 7 DNP’s. We’re all tired of hearing the Cal speak of nothing promised. But, given his lofty HS ranking, potential, and the absolute craziness of the NIL in the portal I believe it was at least strongly implied that he’d have a much bigger role to keep him from entering the portal.
When he throws up a 30%3pt shooting and he along with Wheeler let teams sag way back clogging up the offense….don’t be changing your tune
Livingston will play very little if any 4,
I think Collins may play more than Toppin (I correctly predicted Collins would not play much last year) .
And I think combined, Toppin and Collins will average as many 3’s per 40min as Livingston will
Nice job distracting to change the discussion…but point still remains…you play two non shooters at the guard and wings with Livingston and Wheeler…how is that going to work?
Livingston will NOT be our primary SF, THAT is how it will work. Reeves (39% from 3) will be our main SF, with Livingston as backup
Makes more sense
So you think Reeves goes 25Min and Livingston takes the remaining 15 min at the Sf?
Winslow started at the 4 by the end of the year. Jefferson came off the bench. Both were important pieces. Winslow played both the 3 spot and the 4.
I don’t care who started. What matters is minutes. Remember the year BCG had our starting 4 play less than 10mpg.
Plumlee got the backup C minutes meaning all of Jefferson’s 21mpg were at the 4. So Winslow played at most the remaining 19 PF minutes.
If Winslow started and played about half the game at the 4, then that kind of makes him a 4. Half the game is a pretty significant amount of time. He only played 29 minutes total. So based on your estimation, he played most of his minutes (65%) at the 4.
P
good is being very kind, he is okay not great, he can make one every now and then but it’s not his strength at all
LOL, anyone that talks in absolutes about the projected starting lineup for next years team, is FOS. I mean, you can guess, but beyond Oscar and Wheeler, nobody knows anything. Nobody knows which new players will be any good, which ones will be Cal's favorites and which ones will replace Allen and Hopkins in Cal's doghouse.
Most likely, the doghouse gang won't consist of any 5* kids, since they can do no wrong, but there will be a doghouse gang, there always is.
Most likely, the doghouse gang won't consist of any 5* kids, since they can do no wrong, but there will be a doghouse gang, there always is.
Toppin played less minutes at the 4 this season than Winslow played at the 4 that season. So does that mean Toppin isn’t really a 4? How many minutes do you have to play at a position before you can be labeled as playing at that position? What is a player’s primary position?
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