Official Steph Curry is GOAT thread
- Thread starter lakercat
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I'm honestly not sure that would matter. Moving the line back would just create more space to guard, and offenses are picking defenses apart as it is. Shooters and offenses adapt - if they moved it back a foot at the top of the key (there isn't really space to increase the distance in the corners) they would still figure out a way to maximize efficiency IMO.
Moving the line made a huge difference to the game in the mid 1990's You went from Pat Riley like bully ball teams to an era of shooting dominance.
What the shortened NBA 3-point line of the mid-1990s says about the future of long-range shooting
For three years, the NBA managed to turn Steve Kerr into a legend
www.cbssports.com
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Moving the line made a huge difference to the game in the mid 1990's You went from Pat Riley like bully ball teams to an era of shooting dominance.
What the shortened NBA 3-point line of the mid-1990s says about the future of long-range shooting
For three years, the NBA managed to turn Steve Kerr into a legend
Exactly - by shortening the distance, it had the reverse outcome - team PPG continued to trend downward.
From the article you linked;
"But even as individual numbers soared, the change failed to produce the intended result. Total points per game continued to decline in each of the three seasons with the shortened 3-point line"
As teams have continued to shoot more and more threes, effective FG% is at its highest ever. Effective FG% during the seasons with the shortened line was ~.475. Over the last 3 seasons, it's ~.530. That's a MASSIVE difference.
It would make it easier to get 2’s ( I.e higher shooting percentage) and the the three point percentage would also have to go down some by virtue of the distance making the value proposition less than it currently is.
Curry is the best shooter I've seen in a long time but some of the old-timers (Bird, Miller, et al) could also shoot very, very well. I agree with another poster that Steph's game is basically hanging outside the arc and bomb. Seems like 70% of his shots are 3's. He is a marvelous ball handler and, generally, a good passer but his strength is the long ball. The few nights he's missing, he kills the team because he's going to take double digits bombs every night regardless. Plus, many times there is nobody under the basket for a rebound so, if he misses, it's basically a turnover. Now, to be fair, there are plenty of today's NBA players who do the same thing and aren't as good as Curry. But, that's today's NBA, unfortunately.
In a general sense, I find today's basketball very dreary to watch. Most games boil down to a 3-point shooting contest as you can be darn sure that both teams will jack up a ton of 3s with very few exceptions. Watching 6'-11" players throw up 4-7 3s a game is just painful to watch. Sure, Dirk Nowitski was great at it. Doesn't mean everyone his size should be shooting 3s. I can't remember the last time I watched a full quarter of NBA or college basketball. Several years ago every team played pick-and-roll isolation on a majority of trips down the floor and that was dreary, also. When I watch old YouTube videos of the Trailblazers when Walton was in his prime - THAT'S basketball to me. Inside, outside, backdoor cuts, spacing and movement to get open shots (not just 3s), etc. Watching one guy handle the ball and 4 guys camp out on the arc is just not interesting to me at all.
In a general sense, I find today's basketball very dreary to watch. Most games boil down to a 3-point shooting contest as you can be darn sure that both teams will jack up a ton of 3s with very few exceptions. Watching 6'-11" players throw up 4-7 3s a game is just painful to watch. Sure, Dirk Nowitski was great at it. Doesn't mean everyone his size should be shooting 3s. I can't remember the last time I watched a full quarter of NBA or college basketball. Several years ago every team played pick-and-roll isolation on a majority of trips down the floor and that was dreary, also. When I watch old YouTube videos of the Trailblazers when Walton was in his prime - THAT'S basketball to me. Inside, outside, backdoor cuts, spacing and movement to get open shots (not just 3s), etc. Watching one guy handle the ball and 4 guys camp out on the arc is just not interesting to me at all.
Some good points here man.
The game has certainly changed - I grew up in the 80s and was a showtime Laker fan. I still watch a lot of NBA and find todays NBA game very entertaining. Some great young players. I’ll also point out that while the game isn’t as “physical” as it used to be, defense as a whole has gotten way better. Raining a bunch of threes is an effective way to deal with zones (which teams were not allowed to play back in the day.)
ETA - Curry does NOT hang around the outside of the arc and bomb. He never stops moving.
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Emphasis on lessening defense, along with freedom of the 3pt shooter to leg kick and body jump, has certainly helped, not to mention hand checks from defenders (although that wasn't as recent). The rules have already started swinging back and that has certainly affected some of the leagues better perimeter players this year. The offensive player has simply had too much freedom this decade.
I agree with (and HATE) the leg kick and jumping into defensive players. I’d say that only a handful of guys really did that much though. The game will continue to evolve and every team has analysts looking at every possible way to exploit advantages. 10 years from now the game may look different again.
For sure. I'd probably take Curry in this generation as well to be in my top5. He does bring something to the table no one else has, or at least not to his level. In yesteryear.. that's a different story lol. I also would love to see what Reggie Miller could do in the era and with a some of the talent around him that Curry had. On any given day, I'd take Curry over them.. but if I need a shot made with 10 seconds left, Curry is a distant 3rd.
Steph Curry makes 3,000 threes in his career, and will likely reach 5,000 threes. He nearly carried his team to a 24-point comeback against the reigning MVP. Unfortunately, his teammates choked tonight, but he did carry them against the Suns on the road. With DayDay out, I expect Steph to be more assertive. The fact that he broke the all-time record doesn't blow me away, as James Harden will likely get 3,000, and several others will get past Reggie's numbers, but he could have almost double the amount of threes that Allen had when it's all said and done. 3,004-6,973 as of tonight. Unreal.
Steph Curry with another clutch performance with another road win against a top three opponent. Steph just checks all the boxes. I think we know that Steph is why they are three-time champs and no other reason.
Shooting: Check - GOAT
Passing: Check - One of the GOAT
Ball-Handling: Check - One of the GOAT
Rebounding: Check - One of the best rebounders for a guard
Defense: Check - One of the best in the NBA
Shot-blocking: Check - not amazing statistically, but still gets about one every other game. Made up for DayDay's absence tonight
Leadership: Check - He's dragging this band of misfits, who can never stay healthy all at once. Everyone loves to play with Steph.
Coachability: Check
Name a weakness. Btw- Lebron is playing unreal too.
Shooting: Check - GOAT
Passing: Check - One of the GOAT
Ball-Handling: Check - One of the GOAT
Rebounding: Check - One of the best rebounders for a guard
Defense: Check - One of the best in the NBA
Shot-blocking: Check - not amazing statistically, but still gets about one every other game. Made up for DayDay's absence tonight
Leadership: Check - He's dragging this band of misfits, who can never stay healthy all at once. Everyone loves to play with Steph.
Coachability: Check
Name a weakness. Btw- Lebron is playing unreal too.
The leg kick and jumping into the defender isn't a foul anymore, they'll even call the leg kick an offensive foul sometimes.
Yeah that's kind of what my point was. The league swung the pendulum too far into the offensive end of things, and it's starting to come back. People don't want to watch a soft league where scores were getting into the 130-140 range, and they didn't want to see the offensive being SO protected, to the point where players started to exploit it.
People will always find loopholes to the rules though. It’s kind of impossible to anticipate everything.
GOAT fails to reach double-digit points tonight, but he got double-digit assists, a block, and his gravity accounted for many more points. Just his mere presence allows others to shine unlike any other star player. GOAT goes 3-17 and they win because he can impact the game in so many other ways. I feel bad for Dallas, as Steph usually doesn't have two bad shooting games in a row, and Trae Young just got 56 points in a loss tonight.
I saw where LeBron moved into 10th place for all time steals last night. LeBron is now in the top 10 for career points, assists, steals and 3's made. Curry (34 in March) is outside of the top 50 of each of those except 3's. Curry will likely never crack the other top 10s as he trails LeBron and the other true GOAT candidates by such a wide margin. For instance, LeBron has 9,881 career assists vs Curry's 5,196. LeBron has 36,170 career points vs Curry's 19,372. Steals is 2,113 vs 1,332. I don't like LeBron but he has a case for GOAT. Curry, not so much.
Lebron's usage rate is insanely high and plays more minutes; Steph Curry is more efficient. Lebron has also played 1330 games and Steph has played less than 800. Steph averages more steals per game. Steph is gonna show greatness until he's 40; he gets better EVERY YEAR. Furthermore, he has beaten Lebron 3 out 4 times they've played in the Finals. Steph is a better leader as well. Lebron is the best, as in most physically talented player we've ever seen, but Steph is making a case for the GREATEST player. Just like NFL, Aaron Rodgers might be statistically the best QB to play, but Tom Brady is the Greatest. In essence, Lebron is to Steph like Rodgers is to Brady.
Also, think about the gravity that Steph has; no one affects a defense like Steph, and there are no countable stats to show.
Curry has never made the all defensive team unlike the real GOAT candidates like LeBron, Jordan, etc. His stats don't compare well in other areas either. Chris Paul has more than double Curry's career assists. Steph will never get close to the top assist guys. Curry is even way behind guys like Mugsy Bogues (LOL) in assists. That doesn't sound like a GOAT to me. Curry has about half of Jordan's steal total and Michael missed four seasons in his prime. So Curry is simply the best three point shooter of all time who might crack the top 10 in scoring if he plays until he is 40 and continues to score 26 ppg.
As for titles, Curry has only won when surrounded by a team full of all stars and former all stars. We saw what Curry could do last year with only one of those guys on the team. GS didn't even make the playoffs.
Please, Curry is not getting better every year as his scoring is down 5 ppg this year and he is shooting a career worst 42% from the field.
As for titles, Curry has only won when surrounded by a team full of all stars and former all stars. We saw what Curry could do last year with only one of those guys on the team. GS didn't even make the playoffs.
Please, Curry is not getting better every year as his scoring is down 5 ppg this year and he is shooting a career worst 42% from the field.
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There's more to scoring and shooting. He's defending better and impacts the game in so many ways that does not show up on the stat sheet. Don't worry, Klay is back so he has some help and his percentage will go to about 50% like normal (overall FG %).
Another stinker from Curry.. getting drubbed by 40 at the HALF!
Curry is the 4th best fantasy player on the year (was 1st for the first 2 months)..
..But he's just 23rd over the last 30 days
..And he's just 32nd over the last 14 days.
He's soon to be out of the running for an MVP if he doesn't find his game soon. And I think this firmly puts to bed any GOAT status (if not already).
Curry is the 4th best fantasy player on the year (was 1st for the first 2 months)..
..But he's just 23rd over the last 30 days
..And he's just 32nd over the last 14 days.
He's soon to be out of the running for an MVP if he doesn't find his game soon. And I think this firmly puts to bed any GOAT status (if not already).
He and the Warriors put up a stinker, but had a triple double at Memphis, and impacted the game in ways not shown on the scoreboard. Additionally, he led the Warriors to a smackdown against the Bulls. He draws more attention than anyone in history; defenses have to guard him unlike any other player in history, and as a result, guys like Kaminga, Wiggins, and Poole are tearing it up. Steph MADE Draymond Green, Klay Thompson, etc. Notice that none of Curry's teammates are better away from the Warriors (except Durant who is otherworldly). Additionally, who would be MVP over Steph? His shot isn't as strong as of yet this year, but he's better defensively, he's a better leader, and makes those around him better. Imagine if he got calls when he gets murdered like Jordan against the Bad Boy Pistons. If I'm Lebron, Durant, or any guard, I wouldn't want Curry to guard me; that's how good he is defensively this year.
So Steph can show that he can dominate, even when his shot doesn't go in. Shot terrible tonight, but had 12 assists, only 2 TO's, had a steal and a block (again, what else is new?), and hit the game winner at the buzzer. Clutch. Steph is just unstoppable, even when his shot is off. GOAT can light you up, but can still own you if shots aren't going in. He dominates on defense, and he destroys you in every way imaginable on offense. Clutch Curry carries Warriors again.
GS needed a buzzer beater to beat the worst team in the league (Houston) after losing to the lowly Pacers last game. Half the season is over and Curry is shooting a career worst 42% (37% over his last 10 games). Looks like the new rule about unnatural shooting motions is hurting him. Guys can guard him much closer without being called for a foul as he kicks his legs at them on his shot.
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Steph Curry continues to own in Houston, with another masterpiece, going for 40 for the sixth time this season. His slump is over, and he's impacting the game more than ever. When Houston got close, Curry delivered the dagger, over and over. Even more compelling to his GOAT status: He has now passed Kobe for the most 20-point quarters in NBA HISTORY with 37. 225 threes this year; he could STILL break his own record. Insane. GOAT indeed.
GOAT indeed - Go to 3:09
GOAT indeed - Go to 3:09
Jesus how did I know you'd post after his first actual elite game for a supposed elite player in weeks.
And congrats, you did it against Houston.
Idk if you're aware, but nothing about this season is making anyone think Curry is the GOAT. If anything it's proving that if his shot isn't falling he's a far different player. MJ, Lebrong, Kobe.. those guys can carry teams. Steph cant.. it's that simple and this year and last proves it. He better go convince some superstars to take payouts and make another super team.
And congrats, you did it against Houston.
Idk if you're aware, but nothing about this season is making anyone think Curry is the GOAT. If anything it's proving that if his shot isn't falling he's a far different player. MJ, Lebrong, Kobe.. those guys can carry teams. Steph cant.. it's that simple and this year and last proves it. He better go convince some superstars to take payouts and make another super team.
Curry was literally bordering on not being a top25 player in production for that time. He was putrid. GOATs don't do that. GOATs don't need to rely on one facet of the game to be good, otherwise they look pedestrian.
That's what's so polarizing about Curry.. sometimes he can be a top3 player (he was #1 for November and December), and other times he's not even the 2nd or 3rd best player on his team.
Good thing I had Jakob freaking Poeltl last night, who out played Curry in fantasy as Curry did absolutely nothing in the 4th quarter.
Curry is on the verge of falling out of the top 10 for production this season. Which is probably where I'd put him in the rankings currently.. 8th.
Oh, if Zion and Dame come back he's 10th.
Curry is on the verge of falling out of the top 10 for production this season. Which is probably where I'd put him in the rankings currently.. 8th.
Oh, if Zion and Dame come back he's 10th.
Not only does Steph have to play the role of Steph, but he has to play the role of Draymond Green, and they're still winning, and he's close to a double-double every night. What Steph is doing is MORE impressive, even though, his stats for fantasy may not be as high.
^ Wrong. Curry's stats are mostly down from last season. 6 fewer ppg, career worst FG% and 3 pt%, FT attemps down, 3s made per game down. GS has a lot more talent this year plus is Klay back. That is the winning difference.
www.basketball-reference.com
Stephen Curry Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft Status and more | Basketball-Reference.com
Checkout the latest stats of Stephen Curry. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, draft status, shoots, school and more on Basketball-Reference.com
www.basketball-reference.com
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His team is a 35-win team without him.
He's a great, borderline elite player. But he's nowhere near the GOAT talk. And he's VERY one-dimensional. If that shot isnt landing, he offers little else.
HE is currently ranked 2nd for the season on ESPN with a sizable lead on #3.
Ranked 2nd in what?
He had a great November and December, and has dropped off, considerably, since then.
I know fantasy stats aren't the best metric for this... but he's now 8th on the year in production. He was as high as #1 when the season opened. But he's been dropping off steadily as the season rolls on, which tells me the last two months have been pretty bad (I recall at one point he was on a 30-day slump that had him in the late 20's).
Seems to me that he's a player that's great when he has other pieces around him, but he can't carry a team like Lebron, MJ or Kobe could..
Ranked 2nd in the fantasy rankings.
Not in points and yahoo he's not. Is that ESPN?
Steph continues to amaze, putting on a show for the ages. 15 threes in three quarters, and 13 threes in 16 minutes! He hit 12 threes from 30 feet and further. I know this is an all-star game, but he had 50 points (and would have had more under the old rules), and would have likely hit 20 or so threes. Put some respect to his name. GOAT performance tonight!
