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Mackenzie Mgbako picks Duke. Duke has now beaten us for 17/20 top 10 guys since 2015.

Son_Of_Saul

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Duke has now beaten us for 17 out of the last 20 head-to-heads for top 10 RSCI guys. That's an 85% success rate on their end, and a 15% success rate on our end.

In 2017, Calipari started taking open shots at Duke's recruiting pitch. By the spring of 2018, he was openly mocking them and ended up calling them out three or four times publicly in a three year period.

Despite all of Calipari's deflection and excuse making, it's more than "Nike helps them", although that's part of it (and a huge part). Duke is outselling their program against Kentucky.

This stuff started way back in 2009 when we were going after Kyrie. Calipari was at his absolute zenith, and he had Rod Strickland on the staff, who is Kyrie's freaking literal godfather. He also had Wall coming in, and had just sent Evans and Rose to the NBA as #4 and #1 picks, respectively (both won rookie of the year in their NBA debut seasons).

So here was Cal, recruiting Kyrie, and offering Nike support, the keys to the Kentucky point guard kingdom, and a chance to play on the largest stage in the country (the Kentucky brand was better than the Duke brand at that moment, particularly when Kyrie committed to Duke while Wall and Cousins were bringing waves of newfound hype to Lexington and Duke was the under-the-radar, eventual national champion that season).

So why did Kyrie wade through all the fully galvanized Calipari pitch, only to pick Duke at the end? Nike was supporting both programs. Cal's point guard record was the hottest discussion in college hoops. He also had Strickland to dangle in front of Kyrie's family.

So what was it? It ended up being that Duke had a better pitch for players who saw themselves (or wanted to see themselves) as more than the next kid on the NBA fast track. They sold Kyrie on Duke being everything Kentucky was - fast track to the NBA, brightest spotlight, etc. - only doing it on a more superior, elite way. Duke even went so far as to begin poaching everything we did well - "brotherhood" instead of "la familia"; pro day; fully embracing OAD, etc. All we were left with when the smoke cleared was a lesser version of Duke's pitch. They offered academics, future connections provided by university affiliation, and a connection to a real legacy centered around a head coach. Kentucky, under Cal, was only offering the quick ticket to the NBA, and the best possible training for the NBA. When recruits began to question if UK was really the best possible place for player development when compared to Duke, suddenly all of Calipari's best pitches had been thrown, while K was still fine-tuning new ones.

By the time we get to Jabari Parker's recruitment in 2012ish, Coach K's pitch was expanding. Jabari even said he didn't like the way UK was portraying the OAD setting, and came across as if it was all about the NBA with Calipari. Parker, and clearly other kids like Kyrie, wanted more, and their parents wanted more. They wanted the OAD elitism, without the OAD stigma. They wanted the reality of NBA fast-track, but wanted to do it from an elite college academic environment where their parents could pretend their son was bettering himself academically, professionally, and in terms of having future connection through the Duke "set for life" approach.

It worked. By November of 2013, Tyus Jones and Okafor both chose Duke over Kentucky. Winslow followed suit just a few months later.

Since then, Duke has beaten Kentucky for 17 out of 20 top ten guys. While we've been mocking their players and their pitch on the "set for life" angle, few of us have really heard what the players are actually saying. They've literally been telling us the same thing over and over again: they prefer what Duke is pitching to them more than what Kentucky is pitching to them.


Instead of mocking them, maybe Calipari should start listening to them and start selling recruits on everything our state and program can offer besides and beyond the NBA.
 
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Duke has now beat us for 17 out of the last 19 head-to-heads for top 10 RSCI guys.

In 2017, Calipari started taking open shots at Duke's recruiting pitch. By the spring of 2018, he was openly mocking them and ended up calling them out three or four times publicly in a three year period.

Despite all of Calipari's deflection and excuse making, it's more than "Nike helps them", although that's part of it (and a huge part). Duke is outselling their program against Kentucky.

This stuff started way back in 2009 when we were going after Kyrie. Calipari was at his absolute zenith, and he had Rod Strickland on the staff, who is Kyrie's freaking literal godfather. He also had Wall coming in, and had just sent Evans and Rose to the NBA as #4 and #1 picks, respectively (both won rookie of the year in their NBA debut seasons).

So here was Cal, recruiting Kyrie, and offering Nike support, the keys to the Kentucky point guard kingdom, and a chance to play on the largest stage in the country (the Kentucky brand was better than the Duke brand at that moment, particularly when Kyrie committed to Duke while Wall and Cousins were bringing waves of newfound hype to Lexington and Duke was the under-the-radar, eventual national champion that season).

So why did Kyrie wade through all the fully galvanized Calipari pitch, only to pick Duke at the end? Nike was supporting both programs. Cal's point guard record was the hottest discussion in college hoops. He also had Strickland to dangle in front of Kyrie's family.

So what was it? It ended up being that Duke had a better pitch for players who saw themselves (or wanted to see themselves) as more than the next kid on the NBA fast track. They sold Kyrie on Duke being everything Kentucky was - fast track to the NBA, brightest spotlight, etc. - only doing it on a more superior, elite way. Duke even went so far as to begin poaching everything we did well - "brotherhood" instead of "la familia"; pro day; fully embracing OAD, etc. All we were left with when the smoke cleared was a lesser version of Duke's pitch. They offered academics, future connections provided by university affiliation, and a connection to a real legacy centered around a head coach. Kentucky, under Cal, was only offering the quick ticket to the NBA, and the best possible training for the NBA. When recruits began to question if UK was really the best possible place for player development when compared to Duke, suddenly all of Calipari's best pitches had been thrown, while K was still fine-tuning new ones.

By the time we get to Jabari Parker's recruitment in 2012ish, Coach K's pitch was expanding. Jabari even said he didn't like the way UK was portraying the OAD setting, and came across as if it was all about the NBA with Calipari. Parker, and clearly other kids like Kyrie, wanted more, and their parents wanted more. They wanted the OAD elitism, without the OAD stigma. They wanted the reality of NBA fast-track, but wanted to do it from an elite college academic environment where their parents could pretend their son was bettering himself academically, professionally, and in terms of having future connection through the Duke "set for life" approach.

It worked. By November of 2013, Tyus Jones and Okafor both chose Duke over Kentucky. Winslow followed suit just a few months later.

Since then, Duke has beaten Kentucky for 16 out of 18 top ten guys. While we've been mocking their players and their pitch on the "set for life" angle, few of us have really heard what the players are actually saying. They've literally been telling us the same thing over and over again: they prefer what Duke is pitching to them more than what Kentucky is pitching to them.


Instead of mocking them, maybe Calipari should start listening to them and start selling recruits on everything our state and program can offer besides and beyond the NBA.
Hold up Triple C will get back to you after he cashes his 9 million dollar check and spending time with his dogs. He doesn’t have time for this anymore. Hey but who’s the 20th best player in the portal and how high can they jump?
 
Hold up Triple C will get back to you after he cashes his 9 million dollar check and spending time with his dogs. He doesn’t have time for this anymore. Hey but who’s the 20th best player in the portal and how high can they jump?
It takes a special kind of ego maniac to think he can operate successfully without Nike, the very school that supplies his uniforms.

The moment he punctured the Nike relationship was the moment UK's momentum took a rapid decline in the recruiting world. We beat Duke for Diallo, Knox, and Boston since 2014, and they've beaten us for all the rest of the guys who truly matter, including a guy like Tatum who would have been the missing piece to that 2017 national team.
 
Duke has now beaten us for 17 out of the last 20 head-to-heads for top 10 RSCI guys.

In 2017, Calipari started taking open shots at Duke's recruiting pitch. By the spring of 2018, he was openly mocking them and ended up calling them out three or four times publicly in a three year period.

Despite all of Calipari's deflection and excuse making, it's more than "Nike helps them", although that's part of it (and a huge part). Duke is outselling their program against Kentucky.

This stuff started way back in 2009 when we were going after Kyrie. Calipari was at his absolute zenith, and he had Rod Strickland on the staff, who is Kyrie's freaking literal godfather. He also had Wall coming in, and had just sent Evans and Rose to the NBA as #4 and #1 picks, respectively (both won rookie of the year in their NBA debut seasons).

So here was Cal, recruiting Kyrie, and offering Nike support, the keys to the Kentucky point guard kingdom, and a chance to play on the largest stage in the country (the Kentucky brand was better than the Duke brand at that moment, particularly when Kyrie committed to Duke while Wall and Cousins were bringing waves of newfound hype to Lexington and Duke was the under-the-radar, eventual national champion that season).

So why did Kyrie wade through all the fully galvanized Calipari pitch, only to pick Duke at the end? Nike was supporting both programs. Cal's point guard record was the hottest discussion in college hoops. He also had Strickland to dangle in front of Kyrie's family.

So what was it? It ended up being that Duke had a better pitch for players who saw themselves (or wanted to see themselves) as more than the next kid on the NBA fast track. They sold Kyrie on Duke being everything Kentucky was - fast track to the NBA, brightest spotlight, etc. - only doing it on a more superior, elite way. Duke even went so far as to begin poaching everything we did well - "brotherhood" instead of "la familia"; pro day; fully embracing OAD, etc. All we were left with when the smoke cleared was a lesser version of Duke's pitch. They offered academics, future connections provided by university affiliation, and a connection to a real legacy centered around a head coach. Kentucky, under Cal, was only offering the quick ticket to the NBA, and the best possible training for the NBA. When recruits began to question if UK was really the best possible place for player development when compared to Duke, suddenly all of Calipari's best pitches had been thrown, while K was still fine-tuning new ones.

By the time we get to Jabari Parker's recruitment in 2012ish, Coach K's pitch was expanding. Jabari even said he didn't like the way UK was portraying the OAD setting, and came across as if it was all about the NBA with Calipari. Parker, and clearly other kids like Kyrie, wanted more, and their parents wanted more. They wanted the OAD elitism, without the OAD stigma. They wanted the reality of NBA fast-track, but wanted to do it from an elite college academic environment where their parents could pretend their son was bettering himself academically, professionally, and in terms of having future connection through the Duke "set for life" approach.

It worked. By November of 2013, Tyus Jones and Okafor both chose Duke over Kentucky. Winslow followed suit just a few months later.

Since then, Duke has beaten Kentucky for 16 out of 18 top ten guys. While we've been mocking their players and their pitch on the "set for life" angle, few of us have really heard what the players are actually saying. They've literally been telling us the same thing over and over again: they prefer what Duke is pitching to them more than what Kentucky is pitching to them.


Instead of mocking them, maybe Calipari should start listening to them and start selling recruits on everything our state and program can offer besides and beyond the NBA.
I have come to the realization that Dook is the premier destination for all of the high level recruits in this day and age..UK just doesn’t have that swag we used to and that falls all on Calipari getting old..he doesn’t give a shit anymore..he does t have the desire to grind anymore because Barnhart gave him a lifeline to be complacent..when he was hungry..Wall, Cousins, Kat, Fox, Monk, seeked him out..he fed them what they needed to hear, and the feeling was recriprocal..now, Cal has no desire to feed anything..he’s rich and lazy…time to go
 
Yet we both have zero titles
They won in 2015 when the change started. Does that count?

And what does K losing with these elites have to do with Cal not landing them? It's two different arguments entirely. Does K's lack of tournament success with those guys negate the fact that Cal wanted them, recruited them for years, but still lost those recruitments?

If Cal has shown us anything, it's that he needs elite, top-shelf NBA talent to win. This is why losing these recruiting wars has been so brutal. Cal actually does better with elite freshmen than K does, but he still can't beat Duke's pitch.
 
Cal is going to have to find another way. Duke is taking whoever they want now. Even with K retiring.

There’s obviously more to it than salesmanship. I think it’s more Duke being the flagship Nike program and the rich alumni base imposing their will now that NIL exists. (which lets be honest, they were doing it well before it was legal but now they can do more)

No one is going to out recruit them going forward.

We just gotta hope scheyer falls on his face and that these guys don’t play multiple years for them.
 
Heck, the ghost of K is even out-recruiting Cal now. 2023 is 2 classes away and Duke already has 5 kids locked up where we have only a home grown kid that is the biggest LEGACY(Dad and Mom both were stars at UK) recruit in our history. Thank goodness he is a top 15 talent. However, Cal's history with Ky kids has been a shaky one.

I no longer want to here ANY of the Calism BS(Gold Standard, We eat first, Kentucky isn't for everyone, playing here is HARD, etc.) that now makes him look like an out of touch has been. When is he going to realize all of that CRAP portrays our program in such a poor light that this generation of athletes are looking elsewhere before he even gets the opportunity to SCARE THE _ELL out of them???

Cal's low key HUMBLE BRAG about Anthony Davis getting the least amount of shots and KAT not being allowed to shoot jumpers has DESTROYED his ability to have ANY CHANCE at attracting those type of program changing players. Even a "Basketball Benny" like me can see this, why can't our $9 million/year HOF coach see it????


It's to the point that I get _ISSED OFF just thinking about it!!!
 
Heck, Duke probably made out in the Kevin Knox recruitment as well. UK did them a favor there too.
Knox to Duke would have likely led to them making a Final Four that year. Put him with Bagley, Carter, Trent, Duval, and Allen and that team likely gets through Kansas and gives Villanova a real run for their money.
 
Knox to Duke would have likely led to them making a Final Four that year. Put him with Bagley, Carter, Trent, Duval, and Allen and that team likely gets through Kansas and gives Villanova a real run for their money.

True. I just thought he seemed to dog it here a lot. I mean he had 15.6 per, but it could have been more I thought.
 
Heck, the ghost of K is even out-recruiting Cal now. 2023 is 2 classes away and Duke already has 5 kids locked up where we have only a home grown kid that is the biggest LEGACY(Dad and Mom both were stars at UK) recruit in our history. Thank goodness he is a top 15 talent. However, Cal's history with Ky kids has been a shaky one.

I no longer want to here ANY of the Calism BS(Gold Standard, We eat first, Kentucky isn't for everyone, playing here is HARD, etc.) that now makes him look like a out of touch has been. When is he going to realize all of that CRAP portrays our program in such a poor light that this generation of athletes are looking elsewhere before he even gets the opportunity to SCARE THE _ELL out of them???

Cal's low key HUMBLE BRAG about Anthony Davis getting the least amount of shots and KAT not being allowed to shoot jumpers has DESTROYED his ability to have ANY CHANCE at attracting those type of program changing players. Even a "Basketball Benny" like me can see this, why can't our $9 million/year HOF coach see it????


It's to the point that I get _ISSED OFF just thinking about it!!!
Truth.

Cal alienated UK from Nike.

He alienated about half of the elite players with his "it's not for everyone pitch."

He messed up big time when the class of 2015 (think Newman, Jaylen Brown, Zimmerman and company) heard from other coaches that Cal had told the Trey Lyles class they were losing virtually everyone from the 2014, only to have to compete with a returning WCS, Poythress, etc. That cost us more than anything, because opposing recruiters began playing the angle of what happens at Kentucky when their is a log jam. Our opponents did a thorough job of discrediting Cal at that time.

So Cal had the perfect storm come together between 2013-2016. The evident deception regarding the "we're losing 7 or 8" from the 2014 team that never materialized and left guys like Lyles playing out of position; the alienation of the program from Nike; Duke outpitching us; and even the Skal debacle to some degree (Cal had told Harry Giles to watch how Skal developed at UK, and it never happened; a fact that resulted in a recruiting embarrassment for Kentucky and Cal).

We've never been the same since. We couldn't even finish the job and punctuate the Malik Monk class by adding Miles Bridges, who was heavy UK lean for much of his recruitment.
 
Duke has now beaten us for 17 out of the last 20 head-to-heads for top 10 RSCI guys. That's an 85% success rate on their end, and a 15% success rate on our end.

In 2017, Calipari started taking open shots at Duke's recruiting pitch. By the spring of 2018, he was openly mocking them and ended up calling them out three or four times publicly in a three year period.

Despite all of Calipari's deflection and excuse making, it's more than "Nike helps them", although that's part of it (and a huge part). Duke is outselling their program against Kentucky.

This stuff started way back in 2009 when we were going after Kyrie. Calipari was at his absolute zenith, and he had Rod Strickland on the staff, who is Kyrie's freaking literal godfather. He also had Wall coming in, and had just sent Evans and Rose to the NBA as #4 and #1 picks, respectively (both won rookie of the year in their NBA debut seasons).

So here was Cal, recruiting Kyrie, and offering Nike support, the keys to the Kentucky point guard kingdom, and a chance to play on the largest stage in the country (the Kentucky brand was better than the Duke brand at that moment, particularly when Kyrie committed to Duke while Wall and Cousins were bringing waves of newfound hype to Lexington and Duke was the under-the-radar, eventual national champion that season).

So why did Kyrie wade through all the fully galvanized Calipari pitch, only to pick Duke at the end? Nike was supporting both programs. Cal's point guard record was the hottest discussion in college hoops. He also had Strickland to dangle in front of Kyrie's family.

So what was it? It ended up being that Duke had a better pitch for players who saw themselves (or wanted to see themselves) as more than the next kid on the NBA fast track. They sold Kyrie on Duke being everything Kentucky was - fast track to the NBA, brightest spotlight, etc. - only doing it on a more superior, elite way. Duke even went so far as to begin poaching everything we did well - "brotherhood" instead of "la familia"; pro day; fully embracing OAD, etc. All we were left with when the smoke cleared was a lesser version of Duke's pitch. They offered academics, future connections provided by university affiliation, and a connection to a real legacy centered around a head coach. Kentucky, under Cal, was only offering the quick ticket to the NBA, and the best possible training for the NBA. When recruits began to question if UK was really the best possible place for player development when compared to Duke, suddenly all of Calipari's best pitches had been thrown, while K was still fine-tuning new ones.

By the time we get to Jabari Parker's recruitment in 2012ish, Coach K's pitch was expanding. Jabari even said he didn't like the way UK was portraying the OAD setting, and came across as if it was all about the NBA with Calipari. Parker, and clearly other kids like Kyrie, wanted more, and their parents wanted more. They wanted the OAD elitism, without the OAD stigma. They wanted the reality of NBA fast-track, but wanted to do it from an elite college academic environment where their parents could pretend their son was bettering himself academically, professionally, and in terms of having future connection through the Duke "set for life" approach.

It worked. By November of 2013, Tyus Jones and Okafor both chose Duke over Kentucky. Winslow followed suit just a few months later.

Since then, Duke has beaten Kentucky for 17 out of 20 top ten guys. While we've been mocking their players and their pitch on the "set for life" angle, few of us have really heard what the players are actually saying. They've literally been telling us the same thing over and over again: they prefer what Duke is pitching to them more than what Kentucky is pitching to them.


Instead of mocking them, maybe Calipari should start listening to them and start selling recruits on everything our state and program can offer besides and beyond the NBA.
you really need to get a life away from this message board.... it's a big world go explore it
 
They won in 2015 when the change started. Does that count?

And what does K losing with these elites have to do with Cal not landing them? It's two different arguments entirely. Does K's lack of tournament success with those guys negate the fact that Cal wanted them, recruited them for years, but still lost those recruitments?

If Cal has shown us anything, it's that he needs elite, top-shelf NBA talent to win. This is why losing these recruiting wars has been so brutal. Cal actually does better with elite freshmen than K does, but he still can't beat Duke's pitch.

Don’t forget at the time, Duke claimed they didn’t even still have an offer for Boston. So who knows of that one is even a win.

Players wanted to play for Calipari when they thought it was a special offer. Another thing Calipari did that was stupid - telling people they could use the UK name as a hat on the table without an offer. That’s a special kind of retarded. Cals ego is worse than I thought it was and I always knew it was bad.

Duke had no problem telling kids no, they can’t use their program name and no, we’re not offering you.

It had the reverse effect Conpari imagined. He really thought players were simpletons, that they only cared about money and nothing else. Well this proves they want to win too, and be in a special type of “club” and Duke fed them that. Nike thought it was a hot seller, and the rest is history. Calipari destroyed himself by taking the passive “I’m too good to care about any of that” routine. Kentucky literally became the hat on the table after that, and Duke became the hat they picked.
 
To me, the real decline started in 2017. That was the same year Cal coached the USA World Cup basketball team.

Coaching that team was supposed to give Cal an inside track on kids like Cam Reddish, Quickley, Zion, etc.. Instead Zion somehow ended up not being on the team (I’m sure that had nothing to do with his handlers not wanting him around Cal) and the USA team lost out on the gold medal for I think the first time ever after being single-handedly beaten by RJ Barrett while Cal sat on the sideline with a dazed look.

The whole experience just cemented both Reddish and Barrett to Duke. I think that was the same year Lebron and an agent were caught having lunch with Reddish, and I think is the year Nike went all in on steering kids to Duke, which is why it was not very surprising in retrospect that Zion picked Duke ”out of the blue” later that year.
 
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It doesnt matter who Duke gets as long as you can counter.
Im fine with Knight, Randle,Towns ,Booker, and Ulis instead of Irving,Parker, Okafor, Winslow, and Jones.
The OP thinks we should never miss on a player, which is unrealistic.
Throw rankings out the door and UK's signees still out perform Duke's.
UK alums dominate Duke's on the next level so talented players are still coming to Lexington.
 
It doesnt matter who Duke gets as long as you can counter.
Im fine with Knight, Randle,Towns ,Booker, and Ulis instead of Irving,Parker, Okafor, Winslow, and Jones.
The OP thinks we should never miss on a player, which is unrealistic.
Throw rankings out the door and UK's signees still out perform Duke's.
UK alums dominate Duke's on the next level so talented players are still coming to Lexington.
I never said I thought we should "never miss out on a player."

Just don't get beat 85% of the time by the same school for top 10 recruits. Don't you think that's fair?

Like Cal said, "You don't have to hit 'em all, just don't miss 'em all."

The same is true for recruiting.
 
I never said I thought we should "never miss out on a player."

Just don't get beat 85% of the time by the same school for top 10 recruits. Don't you think that's fair?

Like Cal said, "You don't have to hit 'em all, just don't miss 'em all."

The same is true for recruiting.
Duke will not miss until something changes. The minute K decided to recruit multiple top 10 guys he has gotten anything he has wanted. This will continue until Nike doesn't think it's worth sending people to Scheyer for whatever reason.
 
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I never said I thought we should "never miss out on a player."

Just don't get beat 85% of the time by the same school for top 10 recruits. Don't you think that's fair?

Like Cal said, "You don't have to hit 'em all, just don't miss 'em all."

The same is true for recruiting.
I understand your point of being beaten out for the highest ranked playes but Cal has always found a way to get just as talented players.
To me Herro, Johnson, and Quick have passed up Barrett,Reddish, and Jones.
Zion is Zion.
Im not going to hold it against Cal on Zion.
I don't think he f'd that up.
 
It’s a troubling trend but we have to see what Chin and Antigua Along with Jai accomplish.

Really good start with Sharpe, Livingston snd Wallace…stinks with how Sharpe situation will play out

But those guys needs to stack another class for 2023 and beyond…and if Ky starts to become transfer U Instead of high end high schools kids mixed in with some transfers….then we’ll know the writing is in the wall for Cal
 
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Like I've said, it's going to take time for Antigua, Lucas and Chin to do work and fill in the void left behind by Barbee and Justice.

We were subpar in coaching staff for years and it was inexcusable - Cal should have been fired or let go after the 9-16 season. Absolutely unacceptable what he allowed to happen here.

Stella better get her GD groove back and the next step is putting together a team that can win #9. Absolutely nothinng less than that is acceptable here - especially after the under achieving cluster the last few years has been.
 
Duke has now beaten us for 17 out of the last 20 head-to-heads for top 10 RSCI guys. That's an 85% success rate on their end, and a 15% success rate on our end.

In 2017, Calipari started taking open shots at Duke's recruiting pitch. By the spring of 2018, he was openly mocking them and ended up calling them out three or four times publicly in a three year period.

Despite all of Calipari's deflection and excuse making, it's more than "Nike helps them", although that's part of it (and a huge part). Duke is outselling their program against Kentucky.

This stuff started way back in 2009 when we were going after Kyrie. Calipari was at his absolute zenith, and he had Rod Strickland on the staff, who is Kyrie's freaking literal godfather. He also had Wall coming in, and had just sent Evans and Rose to the NBA as #4 and #1 picks, respectively (both won rookie of the year in their NBA debut seasons).

So here was Cal, recruiting Kyrie, and offering Nike support, the keys to the Kentucky point guard kingdom, and a chance to play on the largest stage in the country (the Kentucky brand was better than the Duke brand at that moment, particularly when Kyrie committed to Duke while Wall and Cousins were bringing waves of newfound hype to Lexington and Duke was the under-the-radar, eventual national champion that season).

So why did Kyrie wade through all the fully galvanized Calipari pitch, only to pick Duke at the end? Nike was supporting both programs. Cal's point guard record was the hottest discussion in college hoops. He also had Strickland to dangle in front of Kyrie's family.

So what was it? It ended up being that Duke had a better pitch for players who saw themselves (or wanted to see themselves) as more than the next kid on the NBA fast track. They sold Kyrie on Duke being everything Kentucky was - fast track to the NBA, brightest spotlight, etc. - only doing it on a more superior, elite way. Duke even went so far as to begin poaching everything we did well - "brotherhood" instead of "la familia"; pro day; fully embracing OAD, etc. All we were left with when the smoke cleared was a lesser version of Duke's pitch. They offered academics, future connections provided by university affiliation, and a connection to a real legacy centered around a head coach. Kentucky, under Cal, was only offering the quick ticket to the NBA, and the best possible training for the NBA. When recruits began to question if UK was really the best possible place for player development when compared to Duke, suddenly all of Calipari's best pitches had been thrown, while K was still fine-tuning new ones.

By the time we get to Jabari Parker's recruitment in 2012ish, Coach K's pitch was expanding. Jabari even said he didn't like the way UK was portraying the OAD setting, and came across as if it was all about the NBA with Calipari. Parker, and clearly other kids like Kyrie, wanted more, and their parents wanted more. They wanted the OAD elitism, without the OAD stigma. They wanted the reality of NBA fast-track, but wanted to do it from an elite college academic environment where their parents could pretend their son was bettering himself academically, professionally, and in terms of having future connection through the Duke "set for life" approach.

It worked. By November of 2013, Tyus Jones and Okafor both chose Duke over Kentucky. Winslow followed suit just a few months later.

Since then, Duke has beaten Kentucky for 17 out of 20 top ten guys. While we've been mocking their players and their pitch on the "set for life" angle, few of us have really heard what the players are actually saying. They've literally been telling us the same thing over and over again: they prefer what Duke is pitching to them more than what Kentucky is pitching to them.


Instead of mocking them, maybe Calipari should start listening to them and start selling recruits on everything our state and program can offer besides and beyond the NBA.
You are forgetting one component, dook started ramping up ok on paying the kids too, families getting million dollar homes, etc: cal wouldn't. Now with nil, that can even the paying field. But I would think dook has more billionaire donors than uk.

Bottom line, dook is going what it takes, uk and isn't.
 
Duke has now beaten us for 17 out of the last 20 head-to-heads for top 10 RSCI guys. That's an 85% success rate on their end, and a 15% success rate on our end.

In 2017, Calipari started taking open shots at Duke's recruiting pitch. By the spring of 2018, he was openly mocking them and ended up calling them out three or four times publicly in a three year period.

Despite all of Calipari's deflection and excuse making, it's more than "Nike helps them", although that's part of it (and a huge part). Duke is outselling their program against Kentucky.

This stuff started way back in 2009 when we were going after Kyrie. Calipari was at his absolute zenith, and he had Rod Strickland on the staff, who is Kyrie's freaking literal godfather. He also had Wall coming in, and had just sent Evans and Rose to the NBA as #4 and #1 picks, respectively (both won rookie of the year in their NBA debut seasons).

So here was Cal, recruiting Kyrie, and offering Nike support, the keys to the Kentucky point guard kingdom, and a chance to play on the largest stage in the country (the Kentucky brand was better than the Duke brand at that moment, particularly when Kyrie committed to Duke while Wall and Cousins were bringing waves of newfound hype to Lexington and Duke was the under-the-radar, eventual national champion that season).

So why did Kyrie wade through all the fully galvanized Calipari pitch, only to pick Duke at the end? Nike was supporting both programs. Cal's point guard record was the hottest discussion in college hoops. He also had Strickland to dangle in front of Kyrie's family.

So what was it? It ended up being that Duke had a better pitch for players who saw themselves (or wanted to see themselves) as more than the next kid on the NBA fast track. They sold Kyrie on Duke being everything Kentucky was - fast track to the NBA, brightest spotlight, etc. - only doing it on a more superior, elite way. Duke even went so far as to begin poaching everything we did well - "brotherhood" instead of "la familia"; pro day; fully embracing OAD, etc. All we were left with when the smoke cleared was a lesser version of Duke's pitch. They offered academics, future connections provided by university affiliation, and a connection to a real legacy centered around a head coach. Kentucky, under Cal, was only offering the quick ticket to the NBA, and the best possible training for the NBA. When recruits began to question if UK was really the best possible place for player development when compared to Duke, suddenly all of Calipari's best pitches had been thrown, while K was still fine-tuning new ones.

By the time we get to Jabari Parker's recruitment in 2012ish, Coach K's pitch was expanding. Jabari even said he didn't like the way UK was portraying the OAD setting, and came across as if it was all about the NBA with Calipari. Parker, and clearly other kids like Kyrie, wanted more, and their parents wanted more. They wanted the OAD elitism, without the OAD stigma. They wanted the reality of NBA fast-track, but wanted to do it from an elite college academic environment where their parents could pretend their son was bettering himself academically, professionally, and in terms of having future connection through the Duke "set for life" approach.

It worked. By November of 2013, Tyus Jones and Okafor both chose Duke over Kentucky. Winslow followed suit just a few months later.

Since then, Duke has beaten Kentucky for 17 out of 20 top ten guys. While we've been mocking their players and their pitch on the "set for life" angle, few of us have really heard what the players are actually saying. They've literally been telling us the same thing over and over again: they prefer what Duke is pitching to them more than what Kentucky is pitching to them.


Instead of mocking them, maybe Calipari should start listening to them and start selling recruits on everything our state and program can offer besides and beyond the NBA.
All that is probably true, but the bottom line is, these kids parents started seeing the same used car salesman we all see. The way he choked away the 2015 game that EVERYONE was watching, hurt the recruiting immensely
 
All that is probably true, but the bottom line is, these kids parents started seeing the same used car salesman we all see. The way he choked away the 2015 game that EVERYONE was watching, hurt the recruiting immensely
These kids don’t care about college basketball. It’s apparent. Cal has put a shit ton of players in the pros. More than any other program so that dog don’t hunt.
 
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