Gran vs Marrow and P5 vs G5

[YaketySax]

Has a year been established for when Stoops started deferring to Gran’s judgement on recruits and transfers over Marrow? I think media stories can sometimes be overstated. Maybe this one is too, but I was thinking a measure to compare is where players transfer to.

What are the numbers for departed UK players that transfer ending up at P5 programs vice the G5? Only one data point, that’s also a decade old, but the 2014 class was much heralded at its signing, but then a lot of the big names left for MAC schools after a couple of years.

Marrow, just my WAG, was better at evaluating offensive skill positions than other positions. Stoops had the eye for DBs, and White for front seven generally. Marrow would sometimes get misled by OH and MI coaches but that’s not bad because what coach doesn’t really.

I don’t think Marrow’s departure is not a big loss. He was on the down swing and obviously wants an office job. Stoops not trusting his evals (if accurate) is telling. A good replacement (position coach and recruiter) would make his loss even more irrelevant.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Its a sensational story with no truth imo. If you look at the timing, it makes way more sense that it was because wolf. Had it been gran, he would've left before now.

 

[doc4UK]

The results of the last two season speak for themselves. Our talent level along the O-line was terrible. How many Freshmen were major contributors? Some transfers made a splash but the key Freshmen were from Kentucky and this past year Louisville is for the first time dominating in state. Time for a change. Marrow's time has come and gone. Likely Stoops will also be gone in a year or two at the most as we will almost certainly be an after thought in the SEC

 

[K_TIME]

I can see a debate the VInce's recruting slipped lately (but it's hard to sale when the team started sputtering)....but I never understand why some lament Gran....he was a big reason why the offense fell apart.

QB room
Danny Clark
Waker Wood
Gunner Hoak
Nic Scalzo

WR room
Clevan Thomas
Bryce Oliver
Allen Dailey
DeMarcus Harris
Josh Ali....legit kid here

I mean he had our WR room blocking vs. catchging more often. He was the opposite of what we need to listen to in terms of talent and recruiting.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

I can see a debate the VInce's recruting slipped lately (but it's hard to sale when the team started sputtering)....but I never understand why some lament Gran....he was a big reason why the offense fell apart.

QB room
Danny Clark
Waker Wood
Gunner Hoak
Nic Scalzo

WR room
Clevan Thomas
Bryce Oliver
Allen Dailey
DeMarcus Harris
Josh Ali....legit kid here

I mean he had our WR room blocking vs. catchging more often. He was the opposite of what we need to listen to in terms of talent and recruiting.

Yes it was awful winning all those games with an elite OL and running game.

 

[billoliver40]

I think in hindsight a lot of us (yes, US) Thought the answer was moving more to an explosive offense. Didn't happen...and when it did our defense was worn down so badly in the second half we lost games 35-30.

Gran did well. Four bowls, four wins.

 

[K_TIME]

Yes it was awful winning all those games with an elite OL and running game.

Point taken...we did find a way to win games with a pound it out attack.

But if Gran had Yenser/Wolford as his Oline coach...do you think the running success he had would have been the same.

And in concert...if Coen2.0/Bush/Scang... had Schlarman as Oline coach wouldn't they likely have been better OC?

I just don't get the Gran love...he was solid but his last years were a mess and the right move was to try a new approach.

 

[YaketySax]

The results of the last two season speak for themselves. Our talent level along the O-line was terrible. How many Freshmen were major contributors? Some transfers made a splash but the key Freshmen were from Kentucky and this past year Louisville is for the first time dominating in state. Time for a change. Marrow's time has come and gone. Likely Stoops will also be gone in a year or two at the most as we will almost certainly be an after thought in the SEC

I wouldn’t expect returns on recruits for OL or front seven positions until they’ve had three years of S&C. The stud exemptions are five stars UK rarely signs.

 

[YaketySax]

What are the numbers for departed UK players that transfer ending up at P5 programs vice the G5?

I’ve been too busy to look up the answer to my own question.

 

[YaketySax]

I can see a debate the VInce's recruting slipped lately (but it's hard to sale when the team started sputtering)....but I never understand why some lament Gran....he was a big reason why the offense fell apart.

QB room
Danny Clark
Waker Wood
Gunner Hoak
Nic Scalzo

WR room
Clevan Thomas
Bryce Oliver
Allen Dailey
DeMarcus Harris
Josh Ali....legit kid here

I mean he had our WR room blocking vs. catchging more often. He was the opposite of what we need to listen to in terms of talent and recruiting.

I took the story to mean Stoops trusted Gran’s evaluation of teens and transfers over Marrow who we’d think with the title of RC he’d have the final say. Making an example up:

The team has one slot left in a class and gran prefers a project OT but Marrow prefers a different OT. Stoops then sides with Gran thinking his preferred player will be better than Marrow’s in a few years.

The recruits under Gran’s offenses were Marrow recruits. (That’s not to say Gran had perfect play calling either.) Gran cooked the meals based off the ingredients Marrow got at the grocery

 

[Pelosigalore]

Tell me the best HS QB recruit that the staff has developed in Stoops tenure please.
I’ll hang up and listen

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Point taken...we did find a way to win games with a pound it out attack.

But if Gran had Yenser/Wolford as his Oline coach...do you think the running success he had would have been the same.

And in concert...if Coen2.0/Bush/Scang... had Schlarman as Oline coach wouldn't they likely have been better OC?

I just don't get the Gran love...he was solid but his last years were a mess and the right move was to try a new approach.

Yes he would. When gran got here, we couldn't convert 3rd and inches to save our life. Same as 99% of our football history.

Literally the first year hes here, he has barker throw for 300+ and 3 tds in a half. Then two games later pivots to what would become the identity of our program.

Neither schlarman nor those guys got that much better in a year. OL struggled unde schlarman all that time. Gran steps in and we become dominant.

I don't know what he did but something he does is just different especially in the run game.

 

[gamecockcat]

Hypothetically, what would our offense with Levis and Wandale have looked like with Gran as OC? I know we probably don't have them if Gran is OC, but, assuming we did land them, wouldn't Eddie have modified our attack to take advantage of their talents and maybe we'd have resembled the UC offenses he had while there?

 

[Bereacat420]

I took the story to mean Stoops trusted Gran’s evaluation of teens and transfers over Marrow who we’d think with the title of RC he’d have the final say. Making an example up:

The team has one slot left in a class and gran prefers a project OT but Marrow prefers a different OT. Stoops then sides with Gran thinking his preferred player will be better than Marrow’s in a few years.

The recruits under Gran’s offenses were Marrow recruits. (That’s not to say Gran had perfect play calling either.) Gran cooked the meals based off the ingredients Marrow got at the grocery

I was thinking similar to this. In the past Marrow would bring in a guy or two that were head scratchers and after a year they transfer. It could simply mean that he had a couple these he wanted and Gran was against it. Then Stoops sided with Gean and marrow was mad.

 

[paulcalhoun]

Point taken...we did find a way to win games with a pound it out attack.

But if Gran had Yenser/Wolford as his Oline coach...do you think the running success he had would have been the same.

And in concert...if Coen2.0/Bush/Scang... had Schlarman as Oline coach wouldn't they likely have been better OC?

I just don't get the Gran love...he was solid but his last years were a mess and the right move was to try a new approach.

False. I do believe his last season as OC was the Bowden season. It was a pleasure to watch as we figured out a way to win without any actual Qb's to work with at that point. The Va Tech game was one of my favorites. Mr. Lunch Bucket had no answer for Bowden.

 

[YaketySax]

False. I do believe his last season as OC was the Bowden season. It was a pleasure to watch as we figured out a way to win without any actual Qb's to work with at that point. The Va Tech game was one of my favorites. Mr. Lunch Bucket had no answer for Bowden.

Agree on 2019. That whole season was a masterclass by the staff. Lose top two or three QBs but still squeeze the most out of the season to the last drop after already losing most of 2018’s offense/defense production.

That team learned how to win the year before and it showed. They punched above their weight 90% of that season. Second half let down against UT being one exception.

 

[catsfan325]

Don't think this is the point of the thread but I'm actually supportive of the recent shift to G5 transfers who got lots of live game reps vs the P4 kids who maybe had pedigree a few years prior but have never seen the field.

 

[Eccain01]

It probably is true that at some point Gran gained more power then Vince. Whether or not tha was the right choice will be shown here shortly. Gran did a lot of good here but dismissing his role in our inability to produce a passing game is ridiculous. We were horrific his last year here on offense.

 

[billoliver40]

Wasn't Grans last year here with LBjr ending up at quarterback after everyone else was hurt?

 

[sieken]

Wasn't Grans last year here with LBjr ending up at quarterback after everyone else was hurt?

I’m thinking he stayed another year, the Covid year. I could be mistaken though.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

I’m thinking he stayed another year, the Covid year. I could be mistaken though.

Correct. During the covid year he coached the offense on his own for half the season. Schlarman passed before mizzou.

After Mizzou terry and hinshaw had a blowup that saw hinshaw never return.

The wr coach was a partying wildman and apparently vince wasnt much behind him.

 

[vhcat70]

Literally the first year hes here, he has barker throw for 300+ and 3 tds in a half.

5 TD's in that half.

 

[billoliver40]

5 TD's in that half.

And changes gear to finish the season with S Johnson and a guy no one had heard of named Snell.

Gran got it done. Not flashy or fancy.