Global Climate Changes
- Thread starter Caveman Catfan
- Start date
Because it's all bullshit
And - we should absolutely evaluate geo-engineering projects for their apparent & possible unintended/latent impacts on earthly weather patterns
Geo-engineering refers to a collection of techniques & technologies designed to artificially modify weather patterns
The US & the USSR both developed such capabilities during the cold war - China has definitely joined in on what I would call the lower-complexity type projects (remember their boast of preventing the rain while the Olympics were happening?)
Aside fm dumping silver iodide into clouds for seeding rain - there is another technique that revolves around firing extremely powerful electrical radiation into the atmosphere (ionosphere?) - in order to artificially heat large sections of the heavens
The US military was theorizing as early as the mid / late 1940s that hurricanes could be altered via such techniques (steered and amplified I THINK)
I won't try to lay it all out here - but do some searching on geo-engineering + Harvard et al ....
Shouldn't artificial weather manipulation be one of the primary human behaviors to scrutinize if we're talking about possible human caused climate change?
HAARP is located near Gakona, AK & I first became aware of it because of a project assigned to me upon arrival at Ramstein in 1996
The base urgently needed its own Doppler weather system to work with other AWDS & ATCALS gear along the flight line
I had to research radars, radomea, various vendors & other USAF bases / programs where large scale infrastructure & equipment was cited and calibrated
HAARP at the time had a ".mil" domain & has since been moved to Univ-AK Fairbanks purview I THINK
Food for thought
When the institutions had the climate themed banks and carbon credits all worked out before hard science on what's actually happening snd why -- I almost completely disregarded the prominent international tunnel vision version of "climate change activists" right away
I mean - take a long hard serious look at what institutions & types of mad hatters that we'd be FOREVER surrendering very importance decisions , economic/social areas to ---
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No one wants to be right about this’: climate scientists’ horror and exasperation as global predictions play out
Climate expertsAs the northern hemisphere burns, experts feel deep sadness – and resentment – while dreading what lies ahead this Australian summer
Mon 24 Jul 2023 11.00 EDT
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Guardian Australia asked seven leading climate scientists to describe how they felt as much of the northern hemisphere is engulfed by blistering heatwaves, and a number of global land and ocean climate records are broken.
‘I am stunned by the ferocity’
What is playing out all over the world right now is entirely consistent with what scientists expect. No one wants to be right about this. But if I’m honest, I am stunned by the ferocity of the impacts we are currently experiencing. I am really dreading the devastation I know this El Niño will bring. As the situation deteriorates, it makes me wonder how I can be most helpful at a time like this. Do I keep trying to pursue my research career or devote even more of my time to warning the public? The pressure and anxiety of working through an escalating crisis is taking its toll on many of us.- Dr Joëlle Gergis, senior lecturer in climate science Fenner School of Environment and Society, associate investigator ARC Centre of Excellence for Climate Extremes at the Australian National University
‘Even 1.2C of global warming isn’t safe’
We knew by the mid-1990s that lurking in the tails of our climate model projections were monsters: monstrous heatwaves, catastrophic extreme rainfall and floods, subcontinental-scale wildfires, rapid ice sheet collapse raising sea level metres within a century. We knew – just like we know gravity – that Australia’s Great Barrier Reef could be one of the earliest victims of uncontained global warming.But as today’s monstrous, deadly heatwaves overtake large parts of Asia, Europe and North America with temperatures the likes of which we have never experienced, we find even 1.2C of global warming isn’t safe.
Driving all this is the fossil fuel industry. Enabling it are political leaders unwilling to bring this industry under control and who promote policies such as offsetting and massive gas expansion that simply enable this industry to continue.
- Bill Hare, physicist and climate scientist and chief executive of Climate Analytics
‘What other choice do we have?’
This is what climate change looks like now. And this is what climate change looks like in the future, though it will likely continue to get worse.I don’t know how many more warnings the world needs. It’s as if the human race has received a terminal medical diagnosis and knows there is a cure, but has consciously decided not to save itself.
But those of us who understand, and who care, just have to keep trying – after all, what other choice do we have?
- Prof Lesley Hughes, board member of the Climate Change Authority and an emeritus professor at Macquarie University
‘History will judge them very harshly’
I still recall reading the 1985 Villach conference report, alerting the scientific community to the possible link between greenhouse gas production and climate change. In 1988, I directed the Australian Commission for the Future and worked with CSIRO’s Graeme Pearman on Greenhouse ‘88, a program to draw public attention to what the science was showing.Now all the projected changes are happening, so I reflect on how much needless environmental damage and human suffering will result from the work of those politicians, business leaders and public figures who have prevented concerted action. History will judge them very harshly.
- Prof Ian Lowe, emeritus professor in the School of Science at Griffith University
‘Only time will tell’
While we’ve been saying for decades now that this is what to expect, it’s still very confronting to see these climate extremes play out with such ferocity and with such global reach. It’s going to be Australia’s turn this summer, no doubt about it.El Niño: what does it mean for Australia – and are more heatwaves and bushfires inevitable?
It makes me feel deeply frustrated to watch the slow pace of policy action – it’s bewildering to see new fossil fuel extraction projects still getting the go-ahead here in Australia. And with this comes deep resentment for those who have lobbied for ongoing fossil fuel use despite the clear climate physics that have been known about for almost half a century.
Over the last few weeks I’ve found myself wondering is this finally going to be the year when any doubts about the climate change crisis are blown away by a spate of costly climate extremes. That could be one benefit of 2023 being off the charts like this. Only time will tell.
- Prof Matthew England, scientia professor, Australian Centre for Excellence in Antarctic Science (ACEAS), University of New South Wales
‘What we are living through now is just the beginning’
I spent the last four weeks at a German research institute in the middle of the current heatwave. Travelling to my hometown, Berlin, on weekends to see my elderly and sick dad, trying to keep him cool in his city flat and convincing him that drinking water might be a good idea (not always successfully). I also bragged to colleagues and friends complaining about the heat, “This is nothing; try to live through a heatwave in Australia!” Australia is great for bragging. There are always bigger, more extreme and more venomous examples down under.I felt a mild scientific curiosity to see materialise what we have been forecasting for years.
Was I surprised by this heatwave? Of course I was not. If anything I felt a mild scientific curiosity to see materialise what we have been forecasting for years. I also felt sad. We know that what we are living through now is just the beginning of much worse conditions to come. What this will do to our ecosystems, water availability, human health, infrastructure and supply chains? We know the answer.
The northern hemisphere is on fire! The temperature records being broken are record breaking!
- Prof Katrin Meissner, director of the Climate Change Research Centre, University of NSW
It is distressing to see the widespread damage caused by the current outbreak of extreme events in many parts of the globe. Unfortunately, they are not a one-off but part of a longer trend fuelled by human greenhouse gas emissions. So they are not unexpected.
Snow fell in Johannesburg this week for the first time in more than a decade, causing a flurry of activity among residents eager to see the rare winter wonderland.
But but Florida is a swampland. That's all the proof right there!
I don't know if you've looked around but the country is drastically cutting carbon emisssions. However, your liberal buddies are 1) not holding China and India accountable for the same and 2) are claiming that the US should fund this for every third world country. Lastly, your team is not interested in nuclear at all.
Btw... all you are doing is wasting carbon-created electrons posting stuff no one will ever read.
It’s more like someone just got a cold, a certain subset of assholes blew it out of proportion for political and profit reasons, a scientific “consensus” was developed by the “experts”, any opposing views were censored, and the one, sole allowable solution to the “problem” was a new experiment that happened to make the fear mongerers billions and billions of dollars with no regard to the damage it was causing throughout the world.
Death is a great analogy. It's elitist arrogance to think anyone can cure death. Death and natural changes to the climate are inevitable. No one has a clue how much, if any, impact man has on the climate. It appears to not be that much, if at all.
To further the analogy, intellectuals propose curing potential cancer by starving the individual to death all while they go on living luxe. In their warped view, death by starvation isn't a death by cancer; so it worked. And their luxe life is necessary to pursue the starvation death of others.
Before you pull out the dependably predictable and pathetic strawman - noone disputes we should do what we can to make our impact as minimal as reasonably possible.
It’s been 100 proven that green house gases trap heat causing warming of the planet. The cure is in getting to net zero emissions
That’s not possible though my man. You have to find some kind of compromise. It’s never going to happen with corporate influence. You can say this or that should happen but it’s not going to do anything.
Post all the stats in the world, powers that be dgaf. And they won’t unless you can make it profitable and bring china and India into the loop.
Without doing those things you’re literally screaming into gale force winds.
Now, in the spirit of truth and balance, tell us all the good things that result in Carbon emissions. The greening of the planet? Is that a bad thing?
Is it scientific to say we must get to zero emissions or are some emissions healthy for the ecosystem?
Religious extremism about this issue is not a good thing.
FWIW, Sardinia broke a continental record for Europe, highest temperature recorded in the continent in the month of July yesterday, 118 or so.
On heat in southern hemisphere, I seem to recall that I have read that climate change is likely to be less pronounced in the southern hemisphere for several reasons, more water, less land than northern hemisphere, a lot less industrialized, and more importantly, a hell of a lot less people, 3/4 of all humans live in Asia, Europe and N. America (a small handful of Asians live in Southern hemisphere). Seve can check me out on this, in case I am wrong about the modeling of southern hemisphere.
Cole, buddy, I wish you had not posted the Lexington records for July, given that we expect highs to be near 100 the next few days, if we break a record, I will hold you personally responsible for a version of the classic "Announcer's Curse". At least it didn't happen while I was scoring the Barbasol and walking 18 three days in a row.
As for the argument that we will wreck our economy with renewables while China burns more coal every day, which has been posted in 1000 different ways, the reality is not nearly that black and white. This quote from the Washington Post (which I know many on here consider to be a comic book) on July 16, but you can Google and find similar info in many sources:
In China’s energy transition, it is the best of times and the worst of times.
When US climate envoy John Kerry visits Beijing this week, he will find himself in a country that’s light years ahead of the US in building clean power. Spending on renewable energy will average nearly $250 billion a year between 2021 and 2023, close on the levels of every rich nation put together, according to the International Energy Agency. BloombergNEF expects China to install 154 gigawatts of solar panels this year, nearly half the 344GW total worldwide; it will also account for more than half of the wind power connected between now and 2030. China’s solar panel supply chain is already approaching the scale needed for the world to hit net zero. The future is happening now.
At the same time, there’s also no other country that is spending as much on dirty energy. Investment in new coal power has all but ceased everywhere else in the world, but in China it’s booming. Almost every one of the 40GW of coal plants given the go-ahead last year was in China, where the pace of approval doubled to its highest level since 2016. The world’s coal consumption would have peaked in 2018 were it not for the additional 862 million tons of annual production China has added since — a pile of solid fuel equivalent to every ton burned in the US and European Union, put together.
Finally, Seve, I know you are right, but you may as well turn around and talk to the drywall in your office, these guys don't care.
On heat in southern hemisphere, I seem to recall that I have read that climate change is likely to be less pronounced in the southern hemisphere for several reasons, more water, less land than northern hemisphere, a lot less industrialized, and more importantly, a hell of a lot less people, 3/4 of all humans live in Asia, Europe and N. America (a small handful of Asians live in Southern hemisphere). Seve can check me out on this, in case I am wrong about the modeling of southern hemisphere.
Cole, buddy, I wish you had not posted the Lexington records for July, given that we expect highs to be near 100 the next few days, if we break a record, I will hold you personally responsible for a version of the classic "Announcer's Curse". At least it didn't happen while I was scoring the Barbasol and walking 18 three days in a row.
As for the argument that we will wreck our economy with renewables while China burns more coal every day, which has been posted in 1000 different ways, the reality is not nearly that black and white. This quote from the Washington Post (which I know many on here consider to be a comic book) on July 16, but you can Google and find similar info in many sources:
In China’s energy transition, it is the best of times and the worst of times.
When US climate envoy John Kerry visits Beijing this week, he will find himself in a country that’s light years ahead of the US in building clean power. Spending on renewable energy will average nearly $250 billion a year between 2021 and 2023, close on the levels of every rich nation put together, according to the International Energy Agency. BloombergNEF expects China to install 154 gigawatts of solar panels this year, nearly half the 344GW total worldwide; it will also account for more than half of the wind power connected between now and 2030. China’s solar panel supply chain is already approaching the scale needed for the world to hit net zero. The future is happening now.
At the same time, there’s also no other country that is spending as much on dirty energy. Investment in new coal power has all but ceased everywhere else in the world, but in China it’s booming. Almost every one of the 40GW of coal plants given the go-ahead last year was in China, where the pace of approval doubled to its highest level since 2016. The world’s coal consumption would have peaked in 2018 were it not for the additional 862 million tons of annual production China has added since — a pile of solid fuel equivalent to every ton burned in the US and European Union, put together.
Finally, Seve, I know you are right, but you may as well turn around and talk to the drywall in your office, these guys don't care.
I did see an article yesterday talking about all the coastal cities that will be underwater by 2050.
Thought to myself, well I guess it’s been long enough it’s time for this prediction again. You know because 30 years ago they said it would all be under water by 2020…
Thought to myself, well I guess it’s been long enough it’s time for this prediction again. You know because 30 years ago they said it would all be under water by 2020…
I think people care but no one offers a VIABLE solution and maybe there just isn’t one yet, idk, but until there is this is all a waste of time.
What party has stopped us from building nuclear power plants? What party has acted like the transition must be abrupt, rather than accept all forms of energy as we move to a lesser carbon footprint?
The extremist fear mongering has actually done more to stop the transition than any other group. The lack of reasonableness is not a healthy approach.
And, please, let’s never use the term “renewable energy” again. Stop with the fiction.
If someone sits in a building, with no urgency to leave, and tells you it's on fire - would you believe them? Of course not.
However if said person says the building is on fire and proceeds to rush out - you should definitely believe that.
When the people preaching climate change start acting in accordance with their sermons, I'll give it more credence
This thread will obviously continue for the next few months, when we will see fall arrive, then winter......same as it does every year.
Great Post T! We are the second biggest carbon emitter and we are the global leaders. Anyone that can tie their shoes, knows what is coming in the energy sector. We ought to be the leaders in renewable energy, which is now cheaper than fossil fuels. Then we would no longer dealwith the Saudis playing with their oil prices
Im fine with Nuclear. Coal is a killer to people downwind of it. Coal is a Huge air pollutant and known to get in the lungs and cause heart attacks and strokes. Ask the folks in Evanston, Indiana about their 7 coal plants
Half of the Texas Grid is powered by solar and wind. With a reliable dispatchable energy source to supplement for times of low wind and sunshine, our entire grid could run on solar and wind and supplemented by hydro power, H2, or nuclear.
The Texas winter failure of a couple years ago was the fault of frozen natural gas lines.
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And then what? I guess your plan is for the planet to cool, but by how much? And what if it continues to cool, how do you stop it? Surely you don't think you can fine tune the temperature of the planet?
So do you agree global warming is a real thing and that transition is necessary? If you do, then we can have a reasonable discussion.
We absolutely need fossil fuels for the reasonably foreseeable future, but there does have to first be a consensus that a transition is necessary.
I think everyone knows a transition will happen eventually, the issue is when will it be a feasible proposition?
I don’t believe in unilateral preconditions for a “reasonable discussion”. In fact, such statements suggest you can only be contextually reasonable, which is not reasonable.
Whether there is current warming or not is an observable phenomenon.
I do not believe there is an existential threat, nor do I believe there is evidence for that.
I believe in first providing life sustaining affordable energy to everyone in the world, as it does the most at saving lives.
I have no problem transitioning to alternative energy sources that meet my previous expectation.
We need fissile fuels and we should not demean. All forms of energy that creates affordable resources. Transitioning is fine, regardless of consensus. Why be so dogmatic and rigid when people don’t oppose transition?
Many people on this very thread oppose transition, think the whole concept of global warming is BS, so every dollar spent on renewable energy is a wasted dollar, don't pretend they dont
No such thing as renewable energy.
If you want to tax me so some dipshit in Washington and/or some other unaccountable globalist body can redistribute it where it sees fit and manipulate the market, yes that is a wasted dollar. To me. Obviously to the “green energy” industry it’s a gift. Goes for oil too, so don’t get your panties in a bunch.
![[laughing]](http://l.yimg.com/j/assets/img/emoticons/classic/laugh.r191677.gif "Laughing [laughing]")
