Cal's Tenure = Pitino's (8 years)

[3rex]

I said at the time, and I say now. Since when is taking a couple of teams to a Sweet 16 enough to warrant UK giving its head coaching job without even talking to other applicants or taking the time to see who was interested? What a farce.

But then again, we know why.

 

[Mojocat]

It's a tough comparison because the status of the program when they took over was night and day. It was not good when Cal took over but it was 10x worse when Pitino took over.

I don't think it's possible to be 10x worse than losing to Vandy by 41.

 

[bthaunert]

I don't think it's possible to be 10x worse than losing to Vandy by 41.

Taking over a 13-18 team, no television, no post season play and 8 scholarship players might be 10 times worse.

 

[kyboy1998]

I don't think it's possible to be 10x worse than losing to Vandy by 41.

Taking over a 13-18 team, no television, no post season play and 8 scholarship players might be 10 times worse.

I agree. Just inheriting Patterson, Miller and Orton without probation alone was better than what Pitino stepped in to.

 

[WildMoon]

Taking over a 13-18 team, no television, no post season play and 8 scholarship players might be 10 times worse.

maybe, for era with 3-4 year player it might not be as bad as you think.

Media perception has grown much bigger in this era than the past eras. People are more aware of whats happening.

While if it was in the same era, that would be disastrous but as time change, condition of what's really bad changes as well.

 

[2Adulterers]

Dont forget Cals record against Pricktino while at U.K.

We must remember that SEXTINO tried to get Larry Ivy to fire Tubby and rehire him offered big money to do it Larry told SEXtino to go screw himself

 

[Sawnee Cat]

I give Coach Cal the edge and there is one important factor nobody mentions. Pitino was not all in for Kentucky. He wanted to use our team as a stepping stone for bigger and better things in the pros. Every year he was flirting with some pro team and finally got the big one. The Boston Celtics. Then he goes to UL and now is stuck with nowhere else to go

 

[Bank Cat]

If anyone who is too young to have really watched UK as it unfolded during the Pitino era, do yourself a favor and watch the UK - Wake Forest 1993 Sweet 16 game.

Wake was a very good #4 seed with an All American in Rodney Rogers. It was a bloodletting. Some of the highest level of basketball I have ever seen played.

 

[littlecreek]

We must remember that SEXTINO tried to get Larry Ivy to fire Tubby and rehire him offered big money to do it Larry told SEXtino to go screw himself

I have never heard this before. Would you care to elaborate?

 

[K-Town Kat]

I agree. Just inheriting Patterson, Miller and Orton without probation alone was better than what Pitino stepped in to.

Don't forget Liggins.

Pitino most certainly inherited a 10x worse situation.

 

[Blueaz]

It's a tough comparison because the status of the program when they took over was night and day. It was not good when Cal took over but it was 10x worse when Pitino took over.

Andersen's injury isn't even as bad of an injury as losing Alex Poythress in 2015 season.

Alex Poythress injury will always be considered the greatest loss in UK history.

Also, why are we fighting against each other about whether Pitino years or Cal years were better? Both were great, and both were great times to be a UK fan.

Hopefully, we can continue with Coach Cal's tenure for another 8 years with another title and 4 final fours.

And DA could have played.

 

[Larry Skaggs]

The NCAA and the referees were not as odious during those days

 

[truebluewildcat]

Pitino was handicapped for two years, so he really did all his work in six. Put him in the dance his first two years, and I think his record shows that he's advancing at least a couple games.

Cal is one of the best at what he does in today's game and obvious Hall of Famer.

Pitino may be a turd in room of turds, but he can beat you with his talent, less talent, and your talent.

Oh, and since we're all about titles here, he has two of them and most give him credit for Tubby's.

 

[2Adulterers]

I have never heard this before. Would you care to elaborate?

It is not public knowledge but Tubby told me it did happen Rick approached Larry Ivy on golf course and said he would like to come back but Tubby had to be let go

 

[UKWildcats#8]

Pitino was handicapped for two years, so he really did all his work in six. Put him in the dance his first two years, and I think his record shows that he's advancing at least a couple games.

Cal is one of the best at what he does in today's game and obvious Hall of Famer.

Pitino may be a turd in room of turds, but he can beat you with his talent, less talent, and your talent.

Oh, and since we're all about titles here, he has two of them and most give him credit for Tubby's.

Your last sentence makes no sense. You seem to be implying Pitino won 2 titles at UK in addition to being given credit for Tubby's. I guess you meant "since" most give him credit for Tubby's. Pitino didn't win a 2nd title. He could have, but he didn't play Anderson.

Pitino can't beat anyone with less talent...if that was the case Pitino would win more at UL and beat UK more.

 

[UKWildcatT]

Andersen's injury isn't even as bad of an injury as losing Alex Poythress in 2015 season.

Alex Poythress injury will always be considered the greatest loss in UK history.
.

Everyone has an opinion, but I'm sorry, I can't agree with this at all.

Anderson was on the verge of greatness, was going to be a first team all American. Shep was redshirted and no one knew Padgett was going to be solid once he came back for the second semester

We had TONS of quality to make up for Postgres; Anderson was a HUGE blow.

 

[WildMoon]

Everyone has an opinion, but I'm sorry, I can't agree with this at all.

Anderson was on the verge of greatness, was going to be a first team all American. Shep was redshirted and no one knew Padgett was going to be solid once he came back for the second semester

We had TONS of quality to make up for Postgres; Anderson was a HUGE blow.

no
no
no

Best player doesn't = Biggest loss. You need to look at the bigger picture.

 

[UKWildcatT]

no
no
no

Best player doesn't = Biggest loss. You need to look at the bigger picture.

I do get what you're saying

 

[littlecreek]

It is not public knowledge but Tubby told me it did happen Rick approached Larry Ivy on golf course and said he would like to come back but Tubby had to be let go

Do you remember what year it was and how did Tubby feel about it

 

[truebluewildcat]

Your last sentence makes no sense. You seem to be implying Pitino won 2 titles at UK in addition to being given credit for Tubby's. I guess you meant "since" most give him credit for Tubby's. Pitino didn't win a 2nd title. He could have, but he didn't play Anderson.

Pitino can't beat anyone with less talent...if that was the case Pitino would win more at UL and beat UK more.

I meant Pitino has two titles (UK, UL) and also gets a lot of credit for Tubby's. I know the thread was about his tenure at UK but the fact that he has won a title at UL, I think is important.

The talent disparity between UK and everyone else including UL has been so significant it's almost unbelievable. So I don't think it's entirely fair to say "well he hasn't beaten us more with less talent".

In his 8 years here he had around half the amount of NBA talent as Cal has had here, and there's not a significant difference in winning %, titles, or final 4s. Again, two of those years he was hamstrung.

Look, I'm happy with Cal and understand what he's doing here is great. But what P did here and the caliber of coach he is cannot be understated.

Just like Cal, P is a call (or lack there of), injury, in game decision, stomp, and shot away from owning the majority of a decade and maybe pulling a Wooden.

 

[3rex]

It is not public knowledge but Tubby told me it did happen Rick approached Larry Ivy on golf course and said he would like to come back but Tubby had to be let go

Well if Tubby, that bastion of integrity, said it then it must be true.

Either way has nothing to do with who had the better 8 year run.

 

[MEMEBLUE]

If Pitino had stayed at Kentucky, he would have won several more Championships. When he left for the NBA he had restored Kentucky back to the national spotlight. I think that when commentators talk about Duke's run in that time frame, Kentucky would have been mentioned right along side them.

Here's a question I would throw out there. How many championships do you think Pitino would have won in the last 8 years with Calipari's players.As my Louisville friends like to say, how many Mcdonald All-Americans does it take for Kentucky to come up empty every year? So the question is, who is the better bench coach?

 

[littlecreek]

Comparing Pitino's time @ UK to Cal's is like comparing apples to oranges. It is two different eras: 4 year vs OAD. RP's system is complex and freshmen rarely contribute while Cal's is simpler and freshmen dominate. Cal has the edge now while RP had the edge in the 90's.

 

[littlecreek]

If Pitino had stayed at Kentucky, he would have won several more Championships. When he left for the NBA he had restored Kentucky back to the national spotlight. I think that when commentators talk about Duke's run in that time frame, Kentucky would have been mentioned right along side them.

Here's a question I would throw out there. How many championships do you think Pitino would have won in the last 8 years with Calipari's players.As my Louisville friends like to say, how many Mcdonald All-Americans does it take for Kentucky to come up empty every year? So the question is, who is the better bench coach?

Cal's McD AA are all freshmen and then they go pro. RP's McD AA have to stay 4 years. Experience makes it easier for coaches to succeed.

 

[3rex]

Cal's McD AA are all freshmen and then they go pro. RP's McD AA have to stay 4 years. Experience makes it easier for coaches to succeed.

they can stay 4 years now if they like.

 

[littlecreek]

they can stay 4 years now if they like.

What would you do: stay four years in college and then play overseas (RP's system) or go one yr to college and then become a millionaire (Cal's system)?

 

[3rex]

What would you do: stay four years in college and then play overseas (RP's system) or go one yr to college and then become a millionaire (Cal's system)?

lol...you do realize we had players go to the NBA under RP right?

 

[2Adulterers]

Do you remember what year it was and how did Tubby feel about it

1999 and Tubby has never gotten over it

 

[Estil]

So they both served two terms as President, eh coach of UK basketball...and Joe B Hall served three (I guess he left because of some "no fourth term" movement? hee hee) and Tubby served the maximum possible a President can (ten years; two elected terms plus up to two years taking over as VP). So I guess that makes BGC the Gerald Ford of the group? hee hee

 

[Estil]

lol...you do realize we had players go to the NBA under RP right?

Not to mention when he went to the Celtics didn't he take a few of his players like Antroin Walker with him?

 

[Estil]

As much as fans want to hate the man, Pitino came to UK and helped revive a program on probation.

You mean like how Benedict Arnold was one of the Patriots' best generals prior to him becoming among the most infamous traitors of all time? Why do you think I like to refer to Pitino as Benerick?

 

[Estil]

I don't think it's possible to be 10x worse than losing to Vandy by 41.

How about our only losing season since 1927 and Eddie Sutton being a lame duck coach at best?

 

[Mojocat]

How about our only losing season since 1927 and Eddie Sutton being a lame duck coach at best?

Pitino inherited a worse situation than Calipari. I was protesting the hyperbole ("10 times worse"). Or maybe, since it's Pitino, the king of exaggeration, the hyperbole was intentional, kind of an irony thing. Heh.

To be literal, 10 times worse than the 41 point loss to Vandy would mean the talent Pitino inherited would lose to that same Vandy team by....410 points. Possible. Not likely.

 

[UKWildcats#8]

I meant Pitino has two titles (UK, UL) and also gets a lot of credit for Tubby's. I know the thread was about his tenure at UK but the fact that he has won a title at UL, I think is important.

The talent disparity between UK and everyone else including UL has been so significant it's almost unbelievable. So I don't think it's entirely fair to say "well he hasn't beaten us more with less talent".

In his 8 years here he had around half the amount of NBA talent as Cal has had here, and there's not a significant difference in winning %, titles, or final 4s. Again, two of those years he was hamstrung.

Look, I'm happy with Cal and understand what he's doing here is great. But what P did here and the caliber of coach he is cannot be understated.

Just like Cal, P is a call (or lack there of), injury, in game decision, stomp, and shot away from owning the majority of a decade and maybe pulling a Wooden.

Your argument is flawed. Most of those NBA studs Cal has churned out were not NBA studs at UK. Raw freshmen talent is not easy to harness and do well with, just ask anyone other than Cal. Hard to be consistent. Pitino had more experienced talented teams at UK. Much easier to be consistent and win with those. He had a mix of stud young talent (Walker, Mercer) with guys that stayed 4 years to really dominate. Hell Walker and Mercer would be 1 and dones in today's era.

 

[littlecreek]

If Pitino had stayed at Kentucky, he would have won several more Championships. When he left for the NBA he had restored Kentucky back to the national spotlight. I think that when commentators talk about Duke's run in that time frame, Kentucky would have been mentioned right along side them.

Here's a question I would throw out there. How many championships do you think Pitino would have won in the last 8 years with Calipari's players.As my Louisville friends like to say, how many Mcdonald All-Americans does it take for Kentucky to come up empty every year? So the question is, who is the better bench coach?

I had some friends who were UL fans to tell me that RP had to have 9 NBA draft picks on the team to be able to win the championship while he was at UK

 

[brianpoe]

I wanted Donovan the day RP left.

I see what you're saying now. And I can see how us not being Florida wasn't enough to overcome Tubbys laziness or BCG's ineptitude. Or even, as you said, bad decisions. But we were on a run under RP that would've continued for a while, in my opinion. Whether that would've resulted in more NCs, hard to tell.

Thank you. And you may be right. He could have possibly won many. As much as I can't stand UL or Pitino today, he did save the program. Hopefully Cal wins another 1-2 and ends the debate.

This is always amusing, when posters say they wanted Donovan when Pitino left.

You guys would be out of your freaking minds if UK hired a 31 year old coach with 20 losses in his two seasons at MARSHALL and went 13-17 in his one year at Florida (he did win one more game the next year to go 14-15)...

 

[3rex]

This is always amusing, when posters say they wanted Donovan when Pitino left.

You guys would be out of your freaking minds if UK hired a 31 year old coach with 20 losses in his two seasons at MARSHALL and went 13-17 in his one year at Florida (he did win one more game the next year to go 14-15)...

amusing or not, that's fine. I'm just telling you who I wanted to get the job.

People with foresight, and those who are not averse to risk, see a whole lot deeper than W-L record.

 

[3rex]

I had some friends who were UL fans to tell me that RP had to have 9 NBA draft picks on the team to be able to win the championship while he was at UK

well, if your friends at U of Lousyville said it then it must be true.

 

[topps coach]

That was an entirely different era RP never never had to deal with replacing the heart of your team each year.Both runs were great but imo Kal's run is more difficult

 

[mktmaker]

Andersen's injury isn't even as bad of an injury as losing Alex Poythress in 2015 season.

Alex Poythress injury will always be considered the greatest loss in UK history.

Also, why are we fighting against each other about whether Pitino years or Cal years were better? Both were great, and both were great times to be a UK fan.

Hopefully, we can continue with Coach Cal's tenure for another 8 years with another title and 4 final fours.

I guess you are serious about that.

Do you realize how good Derek Anderson was? Consider that Ron Mercer was 3rd in voting for national player of the year. But Derek was the best player on the team.

But most knowledgeable Kentucky fans know that the most catastrophic injury in UK history was the Mike Casey's car crash broken leg prior to the 1970 season.

Casey was more outstanding than DAN ISSEL in their sophomore season.

In 1970 we went 25-1 before entering the NCAA tournament as #1 in the country -- without the injured Mike Casey.

• 
  Said Issel: "I'm convinced in my mind that if Mike had been able to play his senior year and been the player he was his sophomore and junior years, we would have had a great opportunity to add another championship banner to Kentucky's total."