“ Fit the system”

[AJG-15]

Since we are once again in the portal season and we discuss many options, wanted to ask about the “fit the system “ concept and how important it is . Obviously, we are talking about how they would fit in Pope offensive system but I think the discussion could be expanded a bit.

I will start here and I will add more later . In theory , if you are a club with tons of resources, and have a coach with a proven winning record, you could say I am only going to recruit and bring in players that fit my superior system.

On the flip side, other coaches with less resources at their disposal , adapt their style of play and game tactics to the players they can get.

There is also the option, where coaches will say: “ I want the best of the best” and I will make it work because talent beats experience or coaching style .

How important do you think it is to get players that fits the system vs getting the best of the best , super talented players?

Which approach is better for Kentucky?

How much emphasis should Pope put on skills shooting, passing , making reads, vs row talent and athleticism that he can in time develop into great shooters, passers, but also play defense?

 

[JPFisher]

Since we are once again in the portal season and we discuss many options, wanted to ask about the “fit the system “ concept and how important it is . Obviously, we are talking about how they would fit in Pope offensive system but I think the discussion could be expanded a bit.

I will start here and I will add more later . In theory , if you are a club with tons of resources, and have a coach with a proven winning record, you could say I am only going to recruit and bring in players that fit my superior system.

On the flip side, other coaches with less resources at their disposal , adapt their style of play and game tactics to the players they can get.

There is also the option, where coaches will say: “ I want the best of the best” and I will make it work because talent beats experience or coaching style .

How important do you think it is to get players that fits the system vs getting the best of the best , super talented players?

Which approach is better for Kentucky?

How much emphasis should Pope put on skills shooting, passing , making reads, vs row talent and athleticism that he can in time develop into great shooters, passers, but also play defense?

I think we have to have both.

Pope stated in an interview recently that Oweh does incredible things and has insane abilities. Sometimes, that's a negative, because if he'd just do things the way the system demands, we wouldn't have certain miscues or turnovers. That said, you also have some spectacular, momentum-changing and game-defining moments BECAUSE he goes off the rails.

I think that comment about Oweh provides a indication of how the roster needs to be built. You need a core group that fits the system, but you also need guys who can ad lib and take us to that next level. Imagine how much freer our shooters would've been this season if we had a couple slashers on the team who could take a dude off the dribble.

Pope's system isn't dribble-drive, but those kinds of players demand a different kind of respect. I believe I've seen the board refer to it as "gravity." Those players don't fall into Pope's system perfectly, but they command the defense's attention. So, while Oweh follows the system 80-90% of the time (that's an arbitrary number), sometimes it's his deviation from that that allows him to lead the team in scoring.

TL;DR – We need mostly system guys and a couple loose cannons, IMO.

On the other hand, if everyone is athletic but still has the skills for the Pope system, maybe we can do better with just system guys. Maybe we'll need a larger sample size (in years and roster compositions) to really tell.

 

[chasingwildcat]

I think we have to have both.

Pope stated in an interview recently that Oweh does incredible things and has insane abilities. Sometimes, that's a negative, because if he'd just do things the way the system demands, we wouldn't have certain miscues or turnovers. That said, you also have some spectacular, momentum-changing and game-defining moments BECAUSE he goes off the rails.

I think that comment about Oweh provides a indication of how the roster needs to be built. You need a core group that fits the system, but you also need guys who can ad lib and take us to that next level. Imagine how much freer our shooters would've been this season if we had a couple slashers on the team who could take a dude off the dribble.

Pope's system isn't dribble-drive, but those kinds of players demand a different kind of respect. I believe I've seen the board refer to it as "gravity." Those players don't fall into Pope's system perfectly, but they command attention. So, while Oweh follows the system 80-90% of the time (that's an arbitrary number), sometimes it's his deviation from that that allows him to lead the team in scoring.

TL;DR – We need mostly system guys and a couple loose cannons, IMO.

We need gravity guy

Because "system" can not work in all possessions

We need some guy can give us some hard basket when system can not work

We lack this kind of player last season

 

[UKAlum84]

I think we need multiple transfers at each position who can play at the same level as the starter.

 

[JPFisher]

We need gravity guy

Because "system" can not work in all possessions

We need some guy can give us some hard basket when system can not work

We lack this kind of player last season

I agree that that kind of guy would've been great.

That said, I'm curious if we need one or two gravity guys or if we could get the same effect with greater athleticism across the board.

 

[SemperFiCat]

It would be absolutely maddening to be a coach right now. Maddening.

 

[chasingwildcat]

I agree that that kind of guy would've been great.

That said, I'm curious if we need one or two gravity guys or if we could get the same effect with greater athleticism across the board.

I think our system is great.

When we face teams having similar or lower athleticism with us in beginning of the season, our system looks extremely great, we have #1 average scoring points per game. Our system then has some problem in SEC plays with better athletic opponents

We just need players with better size and athleticism or gravity guys in our system.

 

[BlueBomb]

I think we need multiple transfers at each position who can play at the same level as the starter.

Well, yeah...

 

[AJG-15]

I think we have to have both.

Pope stated in an interview recently that Oweh does incredible things and has insane abilities. Sometimes, that's a negative, because if he'd just do things the way the system demands, we wouldn't have certain miscues or turnovers. That said, you also have some spectacular, momentum-changing and game-defining moments BECAUSE he goes off the rails.

I think that comment about Oweh provides an indication of how the roster needs to be built. You need a core group that fits the system, but you also need guys who can ad lib and take us to that next level. Imagine how much freer our shooters would've been this season if we had a couple slashers on the team who could take a
TL;DR – We need mostly system guys and a couple loose cannons,

On the other hand, if everyone is athletic but still has the skills for the Pope system, maybe we can do better with just system guys. Maybe we'll need a larger sample size (in years and roster compositions) to really tell.

Very good point about Oweh. We need few more players like that . He was the most productive team player, most consistent and he leap tremendously from his previous year production. Some of it is him getting older but I think also has to do with playing in the system of Pope.

 

[AJG-15]

In my opinion we need to focus on multi year players that are long and athletic and have some good skills , let’s say good shooting form , good iq , good passing but maybe not so good dribbling that can develop in time.

As coach you can teach and develop almost everything but you can’t teach size and row athleticism.

 

[TFCats11]

“Fits the System”, is a Gas Lighting attempt to deflect from the fact that UK simply isn’t spending the money to compete with the other Blue Bloods!

I’m sure that’s going to cause some snowflakes to be BH, but it’s a fact, until proven otherwise!

Is that why UK passed on Dybansta, Wilson, Ament, Peterson, and numerous others in the portal?

Not stirring the pot, trolling, or otherwise, I’m legitimately wondering!

Edit: BTW, Pope heavily recruited all the players I listed above.

 

[AJG-15]

It would be absolutely maddening to be a coach right now. Maddening.

That’s why many of them retired.

 

[Butters' Dad]

“Fits the System”, is a Gas Lighting attempt to deflect from the fact that UK simply isn’t spending the money to compete with the other Blue Bloods!

I’m sure that’s going to cause some snowflakes to be BH, but it’s a fact, until proven otherwise!

Is that why UK passed on Dybansta, Wilson, Ament, Peterson, and numerous others in the portal?

Not stirring the pot, trolling, or otherwise, I’m legitimately wondering!

Edit: BTW, Pope heavily recruited all the players I listed above.

It's obvious to any who doesn't insist on self-delusion but there are more of those sorts of posters on here than sensible ones who can add 2 and 2.

 

[AJG-15]

“Fits the System”, is a Gas Lighting attempt to deflect from the fact that UK simply isn’t spending the money to compete with the other Blue Bloods!

I’m sure that’s going to cause some snowflakes to be BH, but it’s a fact, until proven otherwise!

Is that why UK passed on Dybansta, Wilson, Ament, Peterson, and numerous others in the portal?

Not stirring the pot, trolling, or otherwise, I’m legitimately wondering!

Valid point .

 

[AJG-15]

As other coaches learn to counter his offensive system having some disruptive players that can get their own and play defense to would beneficial. There were many times when Oweh saved us.

 

[shaudyshaud]

System should be adjusted based on personnel available.

 

[chasingwildcat]

System is good

But we also need player with good size and athleticism, and star players in the system

System will not always work

We need these kinds of players to create simple plays

We need talent in the system

 

[bucsrule8872]

Great thread OP.

Here is another thing: winning mentality.

Lamont Butler didn’t just “fit the system,” he was a winner. He was proven at this level.

If Butler hadn’t gotten hurt, we may very well still be playing right now.

I like to look at NCAA tournament experience as an important statistic.

Look at the guys Pope brought in last year:

Butler- played in the title game.
Kriisa- played in the Sweet Sixteen with Zona.
Almonor- won two tourney games as a 16 seed.
Brea- played in the tourney, won a game.
Carr- played In the NCAA tourney as a Freshman.
Robinson- played in the NCAA tourney.

Now finding guys like that is hard to do, especially now that the COVID year exemption guys are gone.

But those guys are the ones that, come tourney time, will not freeze up on you. They have already been there and they can pack you across the finish line.

We don’t make the Sweet Sixteen without those guys this year.