Jay Bruce sucks.......

[bigbluefattycat]

Originally posted by Beavis13:
Bruce-O-Meter


.214

Burritos sent me to the isher and Bruce gets a hit while I'm gone.

I guess you didn't take an ish during that last ab. Way to break the streak Beav.
This post was edited on 6/13 9:15 PM by bigbluefattycat

 

[Beavis606]

Bruce-O-Meter


.213




At least he tried to go to LF.

 

[Beavis606]

Bruce-O-Meter


.212

 

[DK Cat]

I think of all the points that PTI made in this thread, the most telling is Bruce's inability to hit lefthanded pitching. I don't care how old he is, the kid looks like he has never faced a lefty in his life. Until he figures out to hit a southpaw, he will be a very average major league player or as PTI posted earlier a platoon player.

 

[PTI (pti)]

Originally posted by DK Cat:
I think of all the points that PTI made in this thread, the most telling is Bruce's inability to hit lefthanded pitching. I don't care how old he is, the kid looks like he has never faced a lefty in his life. Until he figures out to hit a southpaw, he will be a very average major league player or as PTI posted earlier a platoon player.

.148 / .268 / .230 vs lefties this year


I don't give a flying touch if he was a #1 draft pick, if he was the #1 overall prospect in baseball, if he's the second coming of jesus christ....just look at the #s. No interpretation or analysis needed. He cannot hit left-handed pitching.

He has 3 extra-base hits and 4 rbi vs lefties all year.



I still haven't heard one sensible, rational explanation for why he will all-of-a-sudden figure out how to change this. Because he's supposed to be really good? Well, evidently every lefty in baseball disagree, and they also couldn't give a flying touch where he was drafted.

 

[bigbluefattycat]

Beav you need to fire up the Baby Donkey-O-Meter.

 

[PTI (pti)]

At what point will it become "PC" to start ripping Jay Bruce?

avg = .213
on-base % = .300
slugging% = .462
ks = 53
walks = 29
homers = 17

Adam Dunn - [a whole assload of walks]


True story.

 

[syrus12]

Don't worry. He'll figure it out.

 

[JumperJack]

Originally posted by PTI (pti):
At what point will it become "PC" to start ripping Jay Bruce?

avg = .213
on-base % = .300
slugging% = .462
ks = 53
walks = 29
homers = 17

Adam Dunn - [a whole assload of walks]


True story.

What exactly are you wanting the Reds to do with him? Who do you replace him with or trade him for?

 

[bigbluecatfan73]

Originally posted by PTI (pti):
At what point will it become "PC" to start ripping Jay Bruce?

avg = .213
on-base % = .300
slugging% = .462
ks = 53
walks = 29
homers = 17

Adam Dunn - [a whole assload of walks]


True story.

Jay Bruce will be fine. Baseball is a game of adjustments. And once Jay figures out he can't always pull a lefty's outside pitch and needs to start slapping it to left field, he will be a really good hitter. I think we need to be looking at Brook Jacoby (spelling?) and ask why he hasn't helped Bruce figure that out yet. I am wondering if he does anything at all. We need to pluck Tony Gwynn from San Diego State and make him our hitting coach. A guy that finished his career with over 3100 hits should be able to coach up other guys with hitting problems.

 

[Beavis606]

Originally posted by bigbluecatfan73:
We need to pluck Tony Gwynn from San Diego State and make him our hitting coach.

I don't think the Reds are willing to pay his food per diem.

 

[PTI (pti)]

Blaming the hitting coach -->

Poor Jay Bruce. Guy can't even buy a break. In his 2 rookie league stops, at Dayton, at Sarasota, at Chattanooga, at Louisville...


....never could find a good hitting coach.

 

[bigbluefattycat]

Originally posted by PTI (pti):
Blaming the hitting coach -->

Poor Jay Bruce. Guy can't even buy a break. In his 2 rookie league stops, at Dayton, at Sarasota, at Chattanooga, at Louisville...


....never could find a good hitting coach.

Like Eric Davis said there is no way a kid should come up and not know how to bunt. Davis also said that the minor leagues are not teaching these kids how to play. They stick guys in the three hole and don't teach them how to move runners or do anything else. They make it to the majors and they may not bat in the three hole which means they come up not knowing how to play.

The amount of players that come through the system with the spin to win batting approach is ridiculous. These kids come up on talent to hit a fastball but can't adjust to big league breaking pitches. I don't know if you blame the people who drafted or the people who developed but something has to change.

 

[PTI (pti)]

Originally posted by bigbluefattycat:

The amount of players that come through the system with the spin to win batting approach is ridiculous. These kids come up on talent to hit a fastball but can't adjust to big league breaking pitches. I don't know if you blame the people who drafted or the people who developed but something has to change.

It puts coaches/managers at lower levels in a tough situation, that's for sure.

Let's look at Jay Bruce in Louisville:

(49 games) = .364 / .393 / .630 / 10 homers / 37 rbi

He was absolutely *crushing* the ball. What was his manager supposed to do? Have him bunt more often? Preach the sac fly? Or just let him keep MASHING? I don't know the answer.


*However* --> if you dig into the numbers a little further, there was "evidence" there that Jay Bruce wasn't ready to be a big-shot at the major league level.

45 strikeouts / 12 walks


I remember fans whining and crying that the Reds organization was holding Bruce back to save $$. I just "knew" (

) he'd be a stud, but also cautioned that he didn't know how to work the count. At one point that year, he had 25 ks and only 5 walks. Which is AWFUL. That is Russ Branyan material right there.


I think two things need to happen:

1> The organization from the very top to the very bottom needs to be run seamlessly. Preach on-base %. In Moneyball, Michael Lewis wrote that Billy Beane basically told every single one of his minor league managers "lead the league in walks, or you're fired."

Why don't more GMs do this? If the NFL had a farm system, would the Patriots allow their AAA to play the run-and-shoot, their AA to run a triple-option, and their A to run a conventional offense? No.

2> Less scouting. More statistical analysis. There is no sport where statistics tell you more about a player than in baseball. The data is RIGHT THERE, and there's *tons* of it.

Ryan Hanigan played 558 games at the minor league level, and only struck out 3 more times than he walked. And carried a .383 on-base %. What dumbass "scout" made up their mind that he wasn't capable of hitting in the bigs???



Jay Bruce --> just overhyped. Everyone got caught up in his AAA hot streak and his power #s, and forget to look at the fact that he just isn't that great of a hitter. Sorry.

 

[Beavis606]

Originally posted by PTI (pti):
If the NFL had a farm system, would the Patriots allow their AAA to play the run-and-shoot, their AA to run a triple-option, and their A to run a conventional offense? No.
Spread option, FTW.

 

[teach them linear]

he had a hit against a lefty last night we should throw a party!

 

[bigbluefattycat]

Originally posted by PTI (pti):

Originally posted by bigbluefattycat:

The amount of players that come through the system with the spin to win batting approach is ridiculous. These kids come up on talent to hit a fastball but can't adjust to big league breaking pitches. I don't know if you blame the people who drafted or the people who developed but something has to change.

It puts coaches/managers at lower levels in a tough situation, that's for sure.

Let's look at Jay Bruce in Louisville:

(49 games) = .364 / .393 / .630 / 10 homers / 37 rbi

He was absolutely *crushing* the ball. What was his manager supposed to do? Have him bunt more often? Preach the sac fly? Or just let him keep MASHING? I don't know the answer.




Like Eric Davis said and what I believe is that you better teach the kid to play the damn game. He is not mashing in the bigs and can't get a bunt down either. If you want to win you better have 8 hitters who can play the damn game. It's not small ball it is baseball. It is how you win. Just ask the F'n Cardinals how they can bring guys up and plug them in do things to help them win.

You are right about having the same philosophy from top to bottom. If we are going to play the right way with defense and fundamentals your ass better be able to bunt when you get here.

 

[bigbluecatfan73]

Originally posted by PTI (pti):
Blaming the hitting coach -->

Poor Jay Bruce. Guy can't even buy a break. In his 2 rookie league stops, at Dayton, at Sarasota, at Chattanooga, at Louisville...


....never could find a good hitting coach.

First of all I am not saying completely blame the hitting coach. What I am saying is that he is hired to do a job and apparently isn't doing a very good job of it. Not just with Bruce, but I think we only have two people hitting over .300 right now. I was watching the game the other day and they were showing the Reds hitting coach and saying that he has started to have the players make up their own scouting report for each pitcher. What player who is playing against a different pitcher every night has time to do that? Seriously?

What does that guy do?

Second of all I bet you just love it when the team loses. I can tell from your ridiculous posts that you enjoy bashing the Reds. I hate "fans" like you. I don't know if it is jealousy or what but people like you can't just root for someone to do well. What would be your solution to this problem? Bench him? In favor of who? Trade him? For who? There are other people who are hurting this team a lot worse than Jay Bruce, yet you only focus on him because of the hype that he had coming up. Its pathetic really, I mean what did he ever do to you? Knock up your sister or something?

 

[Beavis606]

A couple of t shirt designs you can buy online:

 

[ScaryEnigma]

Bruce doing his best Dunn impression tonight. 2 Fielding goofs already. Line drive goes right between his legs to the wall and on a pop up he calls off Phillips and then can't catch the ball.

You guys greatly overvalue Bruce's fielding ability. He has a good arm but he is average to below average as a fielder.

 

[bigbluefattycat]

Originally posted by ScaryEnigma:
Bruce doing his best Dunn impression tonight. 2 Fielding goofs already. Line drive goes right between his legs to the wall and on a pop up he calls off Phillips and then can't catch the ball.

You guys greatly overvalue Bruce's fielding ability. He has a good arm but he is average to below average as a fielder.

You are not going to get an argument after this ass beatin by the Phills.

How about the Creeper with the "Those walks will kill you." After Janish gave up hit and run after walking a guy.

 

[bigbluefattycat]

"In comes Jason Werth and out goes Dick Pole." Grande

 

[bigbluefattycat]

Little write up by Fay for ya PTI. I know you like the stats.

"With little else to complain after about last night's 4-3 Reds win, posters turned Jay Bruce into a topic. Some suggested time in the minors for Bruce. To which I say: Come on!


His batting average stinks. He looked bad last night, two strikeouts, a double play. But you've got to look beyond his average.


Here's a look at the numbers for three NL Central right fielders:


Hunter Pence. .301/.369/.488 with 44 runs, 11 homers and 35 RBI

Corey Hart. . . .256/.325/.424 with 46 runs, 9 homers and 35 RBI

Jay Bruce. . . . .212/.288/.451 with 38 runs, 18 homers and 41 RBI


Pence is going to the All-Star Game this year. Hart went last year. If you look beyond the batting average, Bruce has been about as productive as the other two. Bruce has the best arm of the three -- 10 assists.


Batting average would be a great stat if a single were equal to home run. Who do you want on your team? Brandon Phillips (.270)? Or Freddy Sanchez (.316)?


The other side of it is Bruce hit .364 in Triple-A last year and .305 the year before. There's not a lot for him to learn there.


I think Bruce will get his batting up. I also think he should sit more often against tough left-handers. But if you want the best chance to win now and develop for the future, you live with him as your every day right fielder."

The case of Jay Bruce

 

[3 fan]

Your last sentence is correct and the #1 reason that Joey Votto should be in left field starting tonight and from here on out.
Develop him now and you can put Votto/Alonso in the lineup for a decade if Dusty doesn't screw it up somehow.

 

[PTI (pti)]

Not sure at all what John Fay is trying to prove.

Jay Bruce's on-base %

career = .303
2009 = .285

This in incredibly terrible. Jeff Francouer-type #s. He is Adam Dunn minus all the walks. I love his arm in right field, but he's (at best) average defensively, has no speed, and brings NOTHING to the plate other than hitting home runs off right-handed pitching.

We all agree that Adam Dunn sucks. So when do people start admitting that Jay Bruce is WORSE??

batting average:
bruce = .209
adunn = .260

on-base%:
bruce = .285
adunn = .396

homers:
bruce = 18
adunn = 22

rbi:
bruce = 41
adunn = 59

runs:
bruce = 38
adunn = 39

 

[bigbluefattycat]

Compare them at the same age.

Jay Bruce sucks worse at the plate.

Jay Bruce is better in the field.
This post was edited on 7/9 10:41 AM by bigbluefattycat

 

[Beavis606]

1. Bruce has to get much, much better against lefties. You can't be an everday player hitting so poorly (.185 this year, .188 career) against them. Brook Jacoby/Dusty Baker should be fired if Bruce doesn't try to go opposite field every single time against LH pitching. I'd put a debit card reader in the dugout and swipe it for a $1,500 fine every time he tried to pull one.

2. I'd like to see him get a *little* more selective at the plate, but I damn sure don't want to see him turn into a walking machine like the Fat Donkey. If you're paid to drive in runs, you have no business taking pitches that are a half inch off the black.

 

[PTI (pti)]

Originally posted by bigbluefattycat:
Compare them at the same age.

Jay Bruce sucks worse at the plate.

Jay Bruce is better in the field.

This post was edited on 7/9 10:41 AM by bigbluefattycat

Jay Bruce is *considerably* worse at the plate.

Jay Bruce has a *much* better arm.

Jay Bruce is a little better in the field.

 

[sinker16]

Originally posted by Beavis13:
1. Bruce has to get much, much better against lefties. You can't be an everday player hitting so poorly (.185 this year, .188 career) against them. Brook Jacoby/Dusty Baker should be fired if Bruce doesn't try to go opposite field every single time against LH pitching. I'd put a debit card reader in the dugout and swipe it for a $1,500 fine every time he tried to pull one.

2. I'd like to see him get a *little* more selective at the plate, but I damn sure don't want to see him turn into a walking machine like the Fat Donkey. If you're paid to drive in runs, you have no business taking pitches that are a half inch off the black.

Can't have people cloggin the base paths up

 

[Beavis606]

Originally posted by sinker16:

Can't have people cloggin the base paths up

For the most part, the Reds don't have problems getting runners on. They have problems driving them in. They were 4th in MLB in LOB last year.

Q: Who had a better chance of driving in runs last year?
A> Adam Dunn if he stood there with the bat on his shoulder like a (w)ussy looking for a walk.
B> Adam Dunn when he acted like he had a pair and actually swung the bat.
C> Edwin Encarnacion, Joey Votto or Paul Bako, the three guys that typically batted behind him.

HINT: The answer is B>
This post was edited on 7/9 12:35 PM by Beavis13

 

[PTI (pti)]

Jay Bruce has a lower on-base % this year than both Zack Duke and Jaime Moyer.

 

[Rupp-is-god]

Get off Bruce's back. If you send him to louisville who replaces him? Outside of his average his other #'s look good he's going to flirt with 40 hrs and 100 rbi's this year. Look at what he did in louisville he hit the ball often and hard. Not too much he can learn in the minors.And he also has 10 assists there is no better option we have at RF.
This post was edited on 7/9 1:29 PM by Rupp-is-god

 

[syrus12]

PTI is never going to let up on this topic.

 

[PTI (pti)]

Originally posted by syrus12:
PTI is never going to let up on this topic.

Two things could happen for me to let up on this topic:

a> Bruce starts not sucking
b> people like Rupp-is-god admit that he stinks. Or at least that all he's capable of is hitting home runs and throwing people out. He's pretty much awful at the rest of baseball.

 

[bigbluecatfan73]

Originally posted by PTI (pti):

Originally posted by syrus12:
PTI is never going to let up on this topic.

Two things could happen for me to let up on this topic:

a> Bruce starts not sucking
b> people like Rupp-is-god admit that he stinks. Or at least that all he's capable of is hitting home runs and throwing people out. He's pretty much awful at the rest of baseball.

Well since you are having trouble letting go, let me help. Just stop watching. If you stop watching you don't have to worry your little head over Jay Bruce's "inadequate ability" and you can fill your evenings with pottery or stained glass making or some other hobby other than Jay Bruce Bashing. I know it will be difficult.

But on the bright side we can all go back to discussing actual topics and stop reading your mindless drivel.

 

[wastra]

Originally posted by Beavis13:

Originally posted by sinker16:

Can't have people cloggin the base paths up

For the most part, the Reds don't have problems getting runners on. They have problems driving them in. They were 4th in MLB in LOB last year

?

The Reds are currently 25th out of 30 ML teams in OBP. They were marginally better last year (24th).

They have HUGE troubles getting runners on.

Most of that in 2008 was inability to hit, as they actually took a decent number of walks last year, but ranked 29th in hits.

 

[bigbluefattycat]

Well I hope you are happy. Baby Donkey will ride the pine for the next two days.

Lance is lighting his ass up on the pre game rattling off stats that would make PTI drop the viagra and go natural.

 

[sinker16]

Originally posted by PTI (pti):
Jay Bruce has a lower on-base % this year than both Zack Duke and Jaime Moyer.

That's pretty sucktastic. I called this thread stupid at first, but he has looked worse and worse since then.

 

[PTI (pti)]

Originally posted by sinker16:

Originally posted by PTI (pti):
Jay Bruce has a lower on-base % this year than both Zack Duke and Jaime Moyer.

That's pretty sucktastic. I called this thread stupid at first, but he has looked worse and worse since then.

Bruce actually surged ahead of Moyer in this hotly-contested race.. Both hitters were 0-fer-1 last night, bringing their season averages to...

Moyer = .276 on-base %
Bruce = .284 on-base %


Best part isn't that Moyer is a FORTY-SEVEN YEAR OLD PITCHER, but the fact that he's still in the race, and only has *one* hit all season, and is hitting .048.

 

[Beavis606]

Bruce's bones suck.