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Tyler Ulis vs. Frank Mason

UK_Johnny24 said:
LOL. You guys are a top 5-6 team yeah, but your still not as good as us, nor do you have the talent we do. We'll have 3 top 10, or top 12 draft picks. Kansas doesn't have anyone on their team as good as Skal or Murray. And honestly, I think Briscoe's better than either one of Selden or Mason. We're better than you guys at basically every position. You guys have depth and experience yeah sure. But we do too with a bench of Mulder, Mathews, and Lee. You probably thought the same thing last year before we embarrassed you guys with that 31 point beat down.
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Draftexpress 2016 mock draft shows 1 top 10:

2016 1st Round Mock
1 Skal Labissiere PF/C
Bluff City Legends, HS Senior
2 Ben Simmons SF/PF
Montverde Academy, HS Senior
3 Jaylen Brown SF
, HS Senior
4 Brandon Ingram SF
, HS Senior
5 Dragan Bender PF
Maccabi Tel Aviv U-18, International
6 Malik Newman SG
Jackson Tigers, HS Senior
7 Kris Dunn PG
Providence, Sophomore
8 Henry Ellenson C
, HS Senior
9 Jakob Poeltl C
Utah, Freshman
10 Diamond Stone C
, HS Senior
11 Furkan Korkmaz SG
Anadolu Efes, International
12 Zhou Qi C
Xinjiang, International
13 Demetrius Jackson PG
Notre Dame, Sophomore
14 Cheick Diallo PF/C
Our Savior New American, HS Senior
15 Damian Jones PF/C
Vanderbilt, Sophomore
16 Jamal Murray PG/SG
Canada, HS Junior
17 Sviatoslav Mykhailiuk SG
Kansas, Freshman
18 Nigel Hayes PF
Wisconsin, Sophomore
19 Isaiah Briscoe PG/SG
, HS Senior
20 Caris LeVert PG/SG
Michigan, Junior
21 Troy Williams SF
Indiana, Sophomore
22 Domantas Sabonis PF
Gonzaga, Freshman
23 Justin Jackson SF
North Carolina, Freshman
24 Jake Layman SF
Maryland, Junior
25 Kennedy Meeks C
North Carolina, Sophomore

From DraftExpress.comhttp://www.draftexpress.com/#ixzz3gHlMWwwz
http://www.draftexpress.com
 
whatever mock draft ranking ku players currently have....subtract 10-15 spots. its called the self effect.
 
BostonCat2001 said:
hilarious! this reminds me of last year. and the meetings before. maybe one of these days you will be right. maybe. skal is so much better than diallo its not even funny. clear cut #1 pick in the draft year..going to have people drooling over him. its not a push. the only people considering it a push...would be ku fans. which should tell you all you need to know about the assesment. uk is a clear cut better at 3 starting positions....easy.
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I'll rip a hole in your argument with one simple example.

Who is better:

Karl Anthony Towns or Frank Kaminsky?

I think everyone will tell you that Towns is the better player and better long term prospect (and went in the draft higher because of that).

Now, tell me. Who won the game between Wisconsin and Kentucky in the tournament last year?
 
KnowsAllTellsAll said:
I'll rip a hole in your argument with one simple example.

Who is better:

Karl Anthony Towns or Frank Kaminsky?

I think everyone will tell you that Towns is the better player and better long term prospect (and went in the draft higher because of that).

Now, tell me. Who won the game between Wisconsin and Kentucky in the tournament last year?
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its sports...sometimes the lesser team wins. but at no point ever would anyone with a brain say towns < kaminsky.

just like no one but you actually thinks skal = diallo. when they are not close. ku may win the game...thats different then saying skal and diallo are a push. they are not. skal is better and its not close.
 
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I give it to the KU fans, they continue to be optimistic even though their players have tended to underachieve over the last few years, especially their guards.

Josh Selby was the best guard in that class. He was a lot better than Knight, according to KU fans.

Then Selden was a better SG than Aaron Harrison and James Young.

And before the 2013-14 season, they were throwing out stats about Nadir Tharpe saying how he was their best guard down the stretch the year before. They were saying that he would be their "savior" at PG.

Then came the legend of Conner Frankamp. Best shooter ever.

Now it's Frank Mason. The latest legend.

Sorry, but when it comes to KU bball, I'm like the state you guys hate, "Show Me!"
 
Those draft projections will change quite a bit. Nobody had Booker going top 15 this time last year and nobody had KAT going number 1. Briscoe will play his way into being a top 12ish pick and mark this down right now. Murray will be one of the best players in the country and will be a top 10 pick easily and maybe a top 5 pick. Meanwhile Selden will be a 2nd rounder, Mason and Bragg will probably return for another year and just maybe Diallo will be drafted in the top 20. I will say I'm interested to see how the foreign kid looks this year. I've thought he was gonna be a good player when I seen him last year.
 
Why would you go back to the UK game to see how Frank Mason plays when you could just go to ESPN 3 and watch a World University Game from a week ago? He played awful in that game and it was a long time ago.
 
Kiimohawk said:
Why would you go back to the UK game to see how Frank Mason plays when you could just go to ESPN 3 and watch a World University Game from a week ago? He played awful in that game and it was a long time ago.
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why would anyone take anything away from those games? the talent on those international teams was terrible. i think the best player on the one team was heading to princeton for crying out loud. it was YMCA level competition.
 
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MdWIldcat55 said:
Kansas always has equal talent with Kentucky...in July. You are among the imbeciles who said that last summer. By the way -- it is NOT an exaggeration to say Ulis dominated Mason in November. Go back and watch the game if you have the stomach. Your list of stats is less than meaningless. Here's the only stat you need to know: 72-40.
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"My" list of stats demonstrates his lack of impact in that game. He was a non-factor.
 
BostonCat2001 said:
why would anyone take anything away from those games? the talent on those international teams was terrible. i think the best player on the one team was heading to princeton for crying out loud. it was YMCA level competition.
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That's disingenuous and misinformed. Many of those players play professionally overseas. Much like the hand picked teams Kentucky played in the bahamas last year.
 
UK_Johnny24 said:
Those draft projections will change quite a bit. Nobody had Booker going top 15 this time last year and nobody had KAT going number 1. Briscoe will play his way into being a top 12ish pick and mark this down right now. Murray will be one of the best players in the country and will be a top 10 pick easily and maybe a top 5 pick. Meanwhile Selden will be a 2nd rounder, Mason and Bragg will probably return for another year and just maybe Diallo will be drafted in the top 20. I will say I'm interested to see how the foreign kid looks this year. I've thought he was gonna be a good player when I seen him last year.
Click to expand...

That was the refrain here when the summer before the Harrison Twins freshman year. You have zero clue if Briscoe and Murray are going to be first round draft picks. You want them to be. But it will take more than you wanting them to be first round picks to them playing their way into being first round picks.

They are in a class that is weak weak weak at the point guard, shooting guard and small forward positions. That is why everyone was all in on the Ingram, Brown, Newman and Trier. I predict that Murray and Briscoe return for their sophomore seasons.
 
KnowsAllTellsAll said:
That was the refrain here when the summer before the Harrison Twins freshman year. You have zero clue if Briscoe and Murray are going to be first round draft picks. You want them to be. But it will take more than you wanting them to be first round picks to them playing their way into being first round picks.

They are in a class that is weak weak weak at the point guard, shooting guard and small forward positions. That is why everyone was all in on the Ingram, Brown, Newman and Trier. I predict that Murray and Briscoe return for their sophomore seasons.
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out of all your UK-KU predictions...how many have you been right about?
 
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MdWIldcat55 said:
LOL. Amazing Kentucky was able to eke out a 32 point win with so many non-factors on the floor. You have no idea how foolish you sound on this thread. I watched the entire game today. You looked at a box score. Jay Bilas was raving about Ulis throughout the game. He was clearly superior to Mason. You are giving the entire Jayhawks fan base a black eye. You should do yourself a favor and stop running your mouth until or unless Kansas stays within 30 of Kentucky in a game.
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I've watched the game many times. Your assessment of Ullis's impact is merely not true. The Twins and your bigs dominated that game.
 
Oh yeah it was 32 points wasn't it? I was thinking it was only 31. But look here! Anybody with an eye for talent will tell you that Ulis, Briscoe, and Murray are WAY better than Graham, Mason, and Selden. Its not even all that close and Graham, Mason, and Selden are good players. Like I said KU's good but we're about to dominate college basketball again this year. Its funny because several people don't realize just how good we're going to be lol. Murray was the missing link. Now we have a pure scorer to go along with everything else. Murray is a true scoring guard. Like I said he'll be one of the best players in the country and not just because I hope he is. And this Ulis Vs Mason thing is a freaking joke for real. Ulis is about to be the best PG in the nation this year. And the Diallo and Skal is a push thing is funny as hell. Diallo is a little better version of Marcus Lee. He'll have more of an impact than Lee has had yeah, but Skal Labissiere will be the best player in the country this year. I mean no joke he's AD 2.0. Then I also think some people are underrating Mathews and Mulder. Those guys are both going to play big roles in us being the alpha males of college basketball again. Bet on it!!!
 
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It's gonna be fun to revisit this thread. Pressure is all on Self after that spanking last year. Plus, this game is in Lawrence. No reason KU shouldn't win. No excuses this time guys.
 
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Good. Both side think they are going to win. True fans of each team should think that. Each fan base think their side has one or more advantages over the other team. Whether that is skill, experience, better point guard, coach, post play or bench depth. There will be no excuses at the end of the game. The score on the scoreboards will be the deciding factor. It won't be UK's 33 point average loss at AFH for their last three games there. It won't be last year's 32-point butt-kicking that Kansas took. Games played in the 50's, 60's or the distant past won't matter. It won't be the number of lottery draft choices that one team has for a a Mock Draft that wont take place for 11 and half months. It won't be the pre-season ratings. The winner of the game is the better of the two schools that night. No excuses!
 
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If KU fans think Murray is all hyped based on just one good game, it's going to be fun when we match up and they get to see early in the season how good Murray really is. It's not just one game. It's everytime he's matched up with the best players in the country he goes off and always looks like the best player on the floor. It's not just us KY fans thinking this. This kid is projected to be one and done and a lottery pick. Forget Ulis vs Mason. It's my opinion we have not only the better point guard in Ulis, but our starting sg and starting sf will also be better point guards than Mason. Ku fans can think they are right there with us in talent, but after our matchup, it will be a lil more clear how our top guys are just more talented than Ku's. What i mean by that is, our top 3 players are on another level than Ku. Our guys will be good enough to leave after just one year and the Ku guys will be trying to prove they might be able to prove their hype, but i doubt it
 
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kentucky_wildcat_#1 said:
If KU fans think Murray is all hyped based on just one good game, it's going to be fun when we match up and they get to see early in the season how good Murray really is. It's not just one game. It's everytime he's matched up with the best players in the country he goes off and always looks like the best player on the floor. It's not just us KY fans thinking this. This kid is projected to be one and done and a lottery pick. Forget Ulis vs Mason. It's my opinion we have not only the better point guard in Ulis, but our starting sg and starting sf will also be better point guards than Mason. Ku fans can think they are right there with us in talent, but after our matchup, it will be a lil more clear how our top guys are just more talented than Ku's. What i mean by that is, our top 3 players are on another level than Ku. Our guys will be good enough to leave after just one year and the Ku guys will be trying to prove they might be able to prove their hype, but i doubt it
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Can you give me examples with links to these games where Murray is the best player on the floor against world class competition?
 
First, it was Thomas Robinson is better than Anthony Davis, then it was Jeff Withey is better than Willie Cauley-Stein, last year it was Alexander and Ellis are better than any of the UK bigs. Eventually, Kansas fans are either going to be right or will need to stop evaluating players. Currently, Calipari is owning Kansas and Self pretty badly. If Kansas doesn't win this season on their home floor then they never will again, at least not while Calipari is here. Stop with the comparisons Kansas fans, at least until you get some right.
 
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KnowsAllTellsAll said:
Can you give me examples with links to these games where Murray is the best player on the floor against world class competition?
Click to expand...

Another example, the 2013 Jordan Brand Classic International Game. Murray scored 24. The next leading scorer on his team was a kid named Diallo with 12.

Thon Maker was on the other team.

I know it's not the Nike Hoops Summit, but it's a pretty big stage with decent competition. If it was terrible competition Diallo would have dominated, wouldn't you think?
 
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KnowsAllTellsAll said:
Can you give me examples with links to these games where Murray is the best player on the floor against world class competition?
Click to expand...

Left a video for you right there. The guy is citing games, you should have the common decency to look some things up yourself after he cites it since you're so curious.
Also, I left some stats above for you, pertaining to the offensive and defensive efficiency of both players. The discussion pretty much ends there, as Ulis, statistically, is a better offensive and defensive player, which would make him a better all-around basketball player. Plus, his brand of basketball is simply more aesthetically pleasing than Mason's.
If you choose to ignore that, and be narrow minded, that's on you, but all signs point to Ulis being a better basketball player, and with 2 less years of experience.

 
bucsrule8872 said:
Another example, the 2013 Jordan Brand Classic International Game. Murray scored 24. The next leading scorer on his team was a kid named Diallo with 12.

Thon Maker was on the other team.

I know it's not the Nike Hoops Summit, but it's a pretty big stage with decent competition. If it was terrible competition Diallo would have dominated, wouldn't you think?
Click to expand...

That doesn't count. That's an all-star game with zero defense. All the credit, like I said before, for his Nike Hoops Summit performance where they actually defend and he was basically unstoppable. But I'll sit back and wait for a response to these numerous other legit games where he dominated.
 
jrpross said:
He almost bagged a triple double with 29 points, 8 rebounds, and 10 assists in the Canadian All-star game shortly after the Nike Hoop Summit this year.
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Look, I'm not doubting that Murray is going to be a stud. I just doubt that he's going to be better than a third year player in Selden. I also think it is equally as probable that he is a two year player as he is a one and done. This was a weak class for guards.
 
KnowsAllTellsAll said:
That doesn't count. That's an all-star game with zero defense. All the credit, like I said before, for his Nike Hoops Summit performance where they actually defend and he was basically unstoppable. But I'll sit back and wait for a response to these numerous other legit games where he dominated.
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Steve Nash was quoted as saying he could play in the NBA right now. But I guess you know more about basketball than Steve Nash.
 
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jrpross said:
Steve Nash was quoted as saying he could play in the NBA right now. But I guess you know more about basketball than Steve Nash.
Click to expand...

Many players could do this, but the one and done rule prevents it. Nash basically said that Murray could be drafted on potential and develop into an NBA contributor. (Full quote below)

“I think, absolutely he could, if not because he’s ready right now, maybe because people see the potential (in him) is just immense, and if they can get him and develop him…Even now is not too soon.”
 
Selden was suppose to be as good or better than Aaron Harrison and James Young when they were Freshmen.

He was suppose to be as good as Aaron Harrison and Devin Booker when he was a Sophomore.

Now he is suppose to be better than Jamal Murray.

We shall see.

I was high on Selden coming in. I was high on him last year. I thought he would be on of the best players in the country as a Sophomore.

He just hasn't progressed like he was suppose to. Maybe he makes a big leap this year, but I have to see it. He keeps fooling me into thinking he is a star. I don't want to get fooled again.
 
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How many years do we have to wait before we can say more experience isn't going to change these Kansas players into studs.
 
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KA4Prez said:
I don't think there is anyone I'd take over Ulis for what UK has next year. However, this is just false. PER 48 NUMBERS...

Frank Mason - 18.1 PPG, 5.6 APG, 5.2 RPG, 2.0 SPG, .1 BPG, 44.1% FG, 42.9% 3PTFG%, 78.6 FT%
Tyler Ulis - 11.3 PG, 7.3 APG, 3.6 RPG, 2.0 SPG, .2 BPG, 40.6 FG%, 42.9 3PTFG%, .80.8 FT%
Click to expand...

Rhavicc said:
Also, I left some stats above for you, pertaining to the offensive and defensive efficiency of both players. The discussion pretty much ends there, as Ulis, statistically, is a better offensive and defensive player, which would make him a better all-around basketball player. Plus, his brand of basketball is simply more aesthetically pleasing than Mason's.
If you choose to ignore that, and be narrow minded, that's on you, but all signs point to Ulis being a better basketball player, and with 2 less years of experience.
Click to expand...

Another Kentucky poster posted stats which basically disprove your underlined assertion. Aesthetically pleasing? You not a fan of Alan Iverson or any other attack the rim point guard?
 
KnowsAllTellsAll said:
That doesn't count. That's an all-star game with zero defense. All the credit, like I said before, for his Nike Hoops Summit performance where they actually defend and he was basically unstoppable. But I'll sit back and wait for a response to these numerous other legit games where he dominated.
Click to expand...

The same defense was played on Diallo and he barely scratched out double digit points, but it doesn't count?

It doesn't count because it doesn't support your argument.
 
bucsrule8872 said:
Selden was suppose to be as good or better than Aaron Harrison and James Young when they were Freshmen.

He was suppose to be as good as Aaron Harrison and Devin Booker when he was a Sophomore.

Now he is suppose to be better than Jamal Murray.

We shall see.

I was high on Selden coming in. I was high on him last year. I thought he would be on of the best players in the country as a Sophomore.

He just hasn't progressed like he was suppose to. Maybe he makes a big leap this year, but I have to see it. He keeps fooling me into thinking he is a star. I don't want to get fooled again.
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Not going to dispute this. He has been erratic his first two years and disappeared during the biggest games. However, he's now been moved to the 3 and doesn't have to be a primary ball handler and he exploded at the WUG. I'm cautiously optimistic that will carry forward this year. If he plays like that, I have no doubt he will have a bigger impact than Murray this upcoming season.
 
Last edited:
bucsrule8872 said:
The same defense was played on Diallo and he barely scratched out double digit points, but it doesn't count?

It doesn't count because it doesn't support your argument.
Click to expand...

I have made no argument on Diallo in this thread or others on Rupp. Don't attribute nonsense to me as fact.
 
Bottom line, after the last 4-5 years of Kansas fans stating one of their players will be better than X player
is for UK and then looking absolutely stupid at season's end, I just have trouble taking them serious. They
were (at one time) a decent fan base but now with their hatred of Cal/jealousy of UK they are as bad as UL.

According to them, every year they have the best players at nearly every position with the best coach and
simply just don't measure up.

Darryl
 
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dlh331 said:
Bottom line, after the last 4-5 years of Kansas fans stating one of their players will be better than X player
is for UK and then looking absolutely stupid at season's end, I just have trouble taking them serious. They
were (at one time) a decent fan base but now with their hatred of Cal/jealousy of UK they are as bad as UL.

According to them, every year they have the best players at nearly every position with the best coach and
simply just don't measure up.

Darryl
Click to expand...

I don't hate Calipari. He is a good recruiter and a good coach.
 
Kansas fans have nothing to stand on against Calipari and UK, so they're left grasping at straws.
 
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