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The Ukraine war. (Yes, we'll mind our manners)

Thats a curious moral compass. You realize usaid orchestrated a coup in Ukraine and installed a friendly leader. Zelinski is still in power, so that tells you hes just a usaid/cia puppet

Usaid bought 90% of the Ukraine media. Paid millions to "influencers" to drive friendly opinion.

So if you think thats doing "nothing wrong", id hate to see what else you find acceptable.
He's not a usaid (whatever the hell that is) / cia puppet. There was no "coup" installed in Ukraine.
You super paranoid. I guess years of Art Bell / Twilight Zone did you in. My "moral compass" is very strong.
 
He's not a usaid (whatever the hell that is) / cia puppet. There was no "coup" installed in Ukraine.
You super paranoid. I guess years of Art Bell / Twilight Zone did you in. My "moral compass" is very strong.

You do realize this is all out in the open? It isnt even theory or guesswork. Its literally facts and both the paper and money trail are all public.

Pretending it isnt is akin to being a flat earther.
 
The Western orchestrated coup installed the presidents before Zelenskyy.

Zelenskyy was "elected" democratically to bring unity among all Ukrainian people by ending corruption and war after playing the role on a TV show. His party was renamed Servant of the People after the show and his fictional role in it.

The country was literally brainwashed by an Oligarch, other nationalist interests, to vote for a comedian "servant of the people" who campaigned on ending the war in the Donbas peacefully, only to renege on those campaign promises once other interest$ and hard-line nationalists told him no.
 
Some people? I'd say all but a few idiots. Emotional advantage over Russia is senseless nonsense I've only ever heard from you now on here.

A bigger man would admit that their motivation for not supporting Ukraine was all money, not lives, since they're now willing to risk lives to get profit.

Yeah, Bub. You go with that if it makes you feel better. You probably need it. You try so hard.
 
So Putin wants new elections in Ukraine. What a shock. We're back to the original problem. Either Putin will slowly absorb all of Ukraine, something a lot of you couldn't care less about, or he'll install another puppet so he can pretend to the world that Ukraine is a sovereign country.
Zelensky is polling under 20% in Western polls. Zalushney, the guy Zelensky fired, is polling close to 30%....
 
So Russia gets land, a ton of natural resources and a promise that Ukraine won't join NATO (after already gutting their nuclear capabilities last time) and Ukraine gets to hand over the remaining 50% of it's minerals to the US, still be extremely susceptible to attack and not participate in the negotiations. No wonder Zelensky said no.

I wish Trump would have sent the Art of the Deal ghost writer instead.
Ukraine sent the black ledger to the fbi during the MuhRussia hoax. It was so fake that the fbi didn't even consider it after initial review. Ukraine was actually worried Trump would hold it against them after he won but were shocked he treated them better than Obama had. Then they stabbed him in the back again by sending people to the US to campaign for Harris during an election which was "a foreign government interfering in our election"..... Trump had every right to make them bend a knee. How many times do you let a 3rd rate corrupt oligarchy try to play you?
 
You're missing my point. It's a great deal for the US and Russia but a deal Ukraine doesn't have to take.

The EU is going to have to finally get off its ass. Assuming they can help support Ukraine in the absence of the US, this thing will just continue to drag out until Russia wins or quits.

So, no, taking this deal isn't the guaranteed outcome everyone thought it would be.

When the Saudis are questioning why a non party is negotiating peace without one of the participants, you know something is wrong.
LOL.
 
He blamed them for the war yesterday, so it isn't surprising that he isn't a fan.

It just feels like bizarro world when you have people advocating for Russias autonomy when they have been an enemy of our state for the entirety of my life.

No one batted an eye about USAID and it's less than 1% budget impact, but now it's the devil. Canada was our staunchest ally until they became rats who abuse our relationship.

The ability to sway opinion so rapidly is disturbing.
How many Americans have been killed by Russian in your life? I grew up like you. Oddly, Communism is in fashion and all the hate just got shifted to the continent communism came from. Bernie Sanders loved the cccp but oddly supports ukr against Russia. I guess its just politics.
 
If Trump announces that he wants out of NATO, would you support that?

I ask becuase I feel like it's the setup we are getting. Make unreasonable demands, complicate relationships with allies, blame NATO and then leave.
If nato refuses to meet their financial responsibilities and keep bringing in millions of 3rd worlder's at an unsustainable rate... yea... we should get out quick because Europe is about to melt down in the next decade and it's so predictable that going in later is a waste.
 
No offense intended, but an opinion piece that includes the caveat that there could be several libertarians that would disagree with the opinion is hardly a monolith.

All he's saying is that we shouldn't be funding a war we aren't directly involved in for US security. I'd assume a lot of libertarians would agree but hardly anyone would assume all.
You need to meet Richie...LOL
 
I hope you have multiple eyebrows to work with: this is likely just the beginning of a tumultuous scrapping of security arraignments that predate the births of all commenting in this thread.

I wonder what Trump will call the Taiwanese government when China ups the ante.
Were Englishmen a minority in London when those agreements were agreed to? Do you guys really think that people just moving to somewhere makes them English? LOL, London is a Muslim city now. The UK is scared to even stop grooming gangs in the UK. They won't even let the media report on it. England is lost dude.

And you also need to read up on Taiwan. Their government is close to 50/50 on rejoining China. How stupid would you feel if we start a war with China and then Taiwan votes to join China? It's not the 80' anymore.
 
- Can’t call Zel a dictator without calling Putin a dictator. Bad messaging and nonsensical. Trump may be forcing Europe to finally spend money to beef up their militaries and meet their NATO spending requirements by leaving them out of initial peace talks in Saudi, as part of a strategy. Poland, correct me if I’m wrong, is the only country meeting/exceeding their military obligations. Germany has a big election coming up Sunday which will dictate their future Ukrainian policy.

- Ukraine didn’t start the war 🤡, but we have a right to audit where all of this money went - about 67 billion (in mostly old and out of date gear that we were scrapping), and under 20 billion in grants for government and via the EDA, as I’ve discussed many times on here.

- Let’s see where the talks go. Now is NOT the time to be reducing sanctions on Russia, FFS.
Putin at least had an election... and didn't arrest clergy and ban news outlets. Western media is still available in Russia.
 
Had the United States funded a 3 year war between Germany and Czechoslovakia before Munich? It’s not the same, by an incredible degree.

It’s time for it to end. Ukraine is incredibly lucky to have as much territory left as they do.
It's Boris Johnsons fault they'll lose as much as they are going to. They could have just lost Donbas and a small area around Crimea. Now they are going to lose most of area East of Dnipro.
 
I'm an 80s baby so I remain unconcerned about spending crazy amounts of money to kill Russian soldiers while Americans are not in danger.

For nothing but money, we might be able to hobble the Russians for two decades if we keep paying for the Ukrainians to bleed them. Why not?
Because Russia is no longer communist. Because spending is too much to the point we are $36T in debt with us looking at $41T by the end of the year.... Choices man. You can't just do everything you want all the time.
 
Hank's post was so idiotic I can't think straight. We want Russia to be an ally and counterbalance the Chinese. It's not 1985.
This is the big gorilla in the room nobody wants to talk about. The neocons want to overthrow Russia to put military bases on Chinas northern border. What makes a hell of a lot more sense is just to just normalize relations with Russia, since they have territory tensions with China, and just put China in a smaller box.
 
You want to ally with the Russians and I'm the idiot? They don't call you Waterhead for nothing, cochise.
Ally and not being enemy isn't the same thing. Russia doesn't trust China completely and China is a much bigger global threat. We just need to not be enemies.
 
But actually had an election. Zelensky won't even go through the farce. He's so far behind that he knows he can't even fake a win and it be believable. LOL.
So far behind all of parliament (including the opposing parties) voted in affirmation of following their constitution and not having elections during martial law.
Whatever tiring some of the Ukrainian people had of Zelensky, trumps idiotic negotiating tactics galvanized the population back behind him.
Kick Putin the f out of Ukraine.
 
So far behind all of parliament (including the opposing parties) voted in affirmation of following their constitution and not having elections during martial law.
Whatever tiring some of the Ukrainian people had of Zelensky, trumps idiotic negotiating tactics galvanized the population back behind him.
Kick Putin the f out of Ukraine.
OK. You go join up tough guy. I'll pay your plane ticket and give you a rifle and body armor. Good luck.
 
Now do the rest of NATO.... You start to see why many of us are tired of pretending it's a defense organization.
NATO troops responded to Americans needs in the GWOT and bled with our boys.
NATO members have improved their funding and defense industries since T called them out and Putin invaded.
Poland is probably on track to be a high functioning military force, Finland isn’t someone to f with
nato is improving quickly.
 
NATO troops responded to Americans needs in the GWOT and bled with our boys.
NATO members have improved their funding and defense industries since T called them out and Putin invaded.
Poland is probably on track to be a high functioning military force, Finland isn’t someone to f with
nato is improving quickly.
LOL. France said they could send 2000 troops to Ukraine to fight if needed. Germany said they could probably do around 10K. We already showed the UK probably can't send more than 20K tops... You are basically putting all the heavy lifting on US and the former Bloc countries. I already can see you are fine with people you don't know dying in great numbers for something you thought about for 15 seconds but you do realize people actually live on the border with Russia and they have 1000's of nukes right? LOL
 
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