So is Bush H. a good OC or....

[Blueathletics]

Was he able to put up big numbers at BSU because the comp was weak...?


Boise State's offense in the 2023 season with the Broncos ranking highly in several categories:

• Scoring
  Boise State averaged 41.2 points per game, which was the third-highest in the country. This was the most points per game since 2011.

• Total offense
  Boise State ranked fifth in the country in total offense, averaging 479.5 yards per game.
  
  
  
• Rushing offense
  Boise State ranked fifth in the country in rushing offense, averaging 252.0 yards per game.
  
  
  
• 3rd down conversions
  Boise State ranked seventh in the FBS in 3rd down conversions, averaging 49.6%.
  
  
  
• Red zone offense
  Boise State ranked 10th in red zone offense.
  
  

 

[24Catman]

His play calling was wildly inconsistent, as was his use of our offensive talent, and his offensive statistics were dismal.

 

[Blueathletics]

His play calling was wildly inconsistent, as was his use of our offensive talent, and his offensive statistics were dismal.

Which is what is so confusing when you see his numbers at BSU

 

[rick64]

Boise St didn't miss a beat after he left.

 

[El Gato Calvo]

Stoops put his thumb on the scale again

 

[littlecreek]

All of Kentucky's OCs did well before they got here and then didn't do well here. They seemed to do well enough at their next position after Kentucky. The problem seems to be at Kentucky, whether it's tougher SEC competition, in over their head, or being held back. It could be Stoops not allowing them to do their thing, idk.

 

[3632]

I don’t know but I’ll at least give him this. Yesterday is the first time I’ve heard anyone name specifically what the offense needs in regards to anything. In his post game he said they have to get more length. Seems simple or obvious but at least he’s putting it out there so we know whether our recruiting is being successful toward the goal.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

His play calling was wildly inconsistent, as was his use of our offensive talent, and his offensive statistics were dismal.

This. You can tell when a team is well coached byt out manned. That was not us. We had zero season arc or identify. In fact we were best when running the ball but easily went away from it. Nothing made any sense.

Hes terrible.

 

[UKfan215]

He's the worst playcaller I've seen here in the Stoops era, by far. He just seems to have zero feel for the game and does some of the most boneheaded chit you can imagine at the worst possible times.

Oh, and in regards to Boise State, their offensive numbers actually got better AFTER Hamdan left.

 

[Girthang]

Was he able to put up big numbers at BSU because the comp was weak...?


Boise State's offense in the 2023 season with the Broncos ranking highly in several categories:

• Scoring
  Boise State averaged 41.2 points per game, which was the third-highest in the country. This was the most points per game since 2011.

• Total offense
  Boise State ranked fifth in the country in total offense, averaging 479.5 yards per game.
  
  
  
• Rushing offense
  Boise State ranked fifth in the country in rushing offense, averaging 252.0 yards per game.
  
  
  
• 3rd down conversions
  Boise State ranked seventh in the FBS in 3rd down conversions, averaging 49.6%.
  
  
  
• Red zone offense
  Boise State ranked 10th in red zone offense.

He walked into a football position at Boise St that was already using a similar system. He didn't have to start from scratch on a system completely different than what he was accustomed to scheming.

-Our OL blocking was a completely different scheme.
-Our recruiting focus was for a completely different scheme.
-Our personnel seemingly had no idea what they were doing with the new offense.
-We never ran an uptempo style, like what this OC ran in the past, until we were down big late.
-We had serious personnel deficits due to injury on the DL that prevented us from being able to rotate in quality for quality if we went uptempo on O.
-Then we didn't run the ball like we should have or could have, because we were trying to get the new offense up to speed.
-We fkd around with the QB position constantly instead of sticking with someone, which creates even more issues.
-SEC is another level different than where he came from

How could we possibly know if this OC is good enough or not? We know nothing more about him than we did before the season started, other than he doesn't know what to do with a run oriented offense, doesn't knpw not to run slow developing plays when the QB has no time to throw, nor how not to run jet sweeps against FAST, SEC defenses.

Maybe that's enough on which to base a decision, I don't know.

 

[cathouse]

Was he able to put up big numbers at BSU because the comp was weak...?


Boise State's offense in the 2023 season with the Broncos ranking highly in several categories:

• Scoring
  Boise State averaged 41.2 points per game, which was the third-highest in the country. This was the most points per game since 2011.

• Total offense
  Boise State ranked fifth in the country in total offense, averaging 479.5 yards per game.
  
  
  
• Rushing offense
  Boise State ranked fifth in the country in rushing offense, averaging 252.0 yards per game.
  
  
  
• 3rd down conversions
  Boise State ranked seventh in the FBS in 3rd down conversions, averaging 49.6%.
  
  
  
• Red zone offense
  Boise State ranked 10th in red zone offense.

If you listened to BH after the game yesterday, he told us why his offense looked so inconsistent (bad) all year. And I quote directly from BH.
"For me at times, when you feel like you wanna go be aggressive, you just are constantly in that mode of dialing it back, turning it on, dialing it back.”

Now, what ( or who) would make an OC "dial it back" when he really wanted to be aggressive??
Yeah. Try another OC. See if we get anything different. Lol.

 

[NoDef]

If you listened to BH after the game yesterday, he told us why his offense looked so inconsistent (bad) all year. And I quote directly from BH.
"For me at times, when you feel like you wanna go be aggressive, you just are constantly in that mode of dialing it back, turning it on, dialing it back.”

Now, what ( or who) would make an OC "dial it back" when he really wanted to be aggressive??
Yeah. Try another OC. See if we get anything different. Lol.

Why would he be "dialing it back". Isn't his job to score points? Dialing it back. Sounds like he is trying to stay conservative.

 

[mebeblue2]

I don’t know but I’ll at least give him this. Yesterday is the first time I’ve heard anyone name specifically what the offense needs in regards to anything. In his post game he said they have to get more length. Seems simple or obvious but at least he’s putting it out there so we know whether our recruiting is being successful toward the goal.

i am curious where we need more length at
i am willing to bet our offense has about the same length as 95% of other teams

 

[cathouse]

Why would he be "dialing it back". Isn't his job to score points? Dialing it back. Sounds like he is trying to stay conservative.

He has a (very conservative) boss on the headphones with him on every call.

Not hard to read between the lines here.

 

[kywildcat41035]

All of Kentucky's OCs did well before they got here and then didn't do well here. They seemed to do well enough at their next position after Kentucky. The problem seems to be at Kentucky, whether it's tougher SEC competition, in over their head, or being held back. It could be Stoops not allowing them to do their thing, idk.

Or it could be Stoops putting his hands on stuff he has no business… I understand he’s the head coach but you got to let your coordinators be coordinators!

 

[UK Widget]

Hard to tell with the revolving door we had with OC's. Yeah playcalling was bad, but just have to think, Bush came in with guys who were recruited/played for a different style. Some of it is due to having a putrid offensive line, some due to not having a good qb (Coen recruited Brock to Kentucky), and every OC we had seems to be more conservative than their last stop, so in other words the head coach is probably mingling a bit. If Stoops returns next season, we have to give BH another go before we say anything unfortunately.

But who knows, I'm done with this.

 

[Cobb4uk]

All of Kentucky's OCs did well before they got here and then didn't do well here. They seemed to do well enough at their next position after Kentucky. The problem seems to be at Kentucky, whether it's tougher SEC competition, in over their head, or being held back. It could be Stoops not allowing them to do their thing, idk.

If you look at all the different OC's we've had since Stoops arrived all we better where they came from. Levis was good when Wandale was here but not so good his 2nd stint. Shannon Dawson wasn't good here but is great at Miami. Evidently Coach Schlarman was the omly one who understood OL talent and coaching. We ran Yenser off and Wolford is even worse, IMO. Being honest something wrong with the defense, no blitz package, UofL had all day to do what ever they wanted. NEEDS TO BE BIG CHANGES!!!

 

[Bluegrass79]

He sucks ball sack . Fire

 

[gamecockcat]

I have no inkling what BH means by 'we need more length' or he had to 'dial it back'. None. Of course, I had no inkling of what he was trying to do all year, so I'm not surprised.

Not sure we sucked on offense because we weren't aggressive enough. Our OL had major issues. Our QBs couldn't read a defense if their life depended on it. IMO, we threw down the field, or more accurately, we called a lot more plays where every receiver was 15+ yards down the field than we ever should have. We had no time to run long route trees. On numerous occasions in every game, we'd have 3rd and 7 and 4 receivers would be running go routes. Play calling was abysmal all year long. Nothing seemed logical about it.

 

[Crankdatmustard]

The guy was horrible. He never kept the defense off balance.

 

[bigbluedon]

Boise St didn't miss a beat after he left.

That means they got someone as good, not that Hamdan was bad. I watched them a bunch last year and was impressed. This is all on Stoops. He handcuffed Hamdan with no QB again this year and a piss poor o line and o line coach. No OC out there can survive this nonsense. Hamdan is not the issue.

 

[bigbluedon]

Why would he be "dialing it back". Isn't his job to score points? Dialing it back. Sounds like he is trying to stay conservative.

It’s Stoops is what he is saying.

 

[Tf2217]

He has a (very conservative) boss on the headphones with him on every call.

Not hard to read between the lines here.

Why would we ever need to dial it back. We didn't score more than 20 in any power 4 game. Sounds like the dial was busted and stuck on the dial it back setting.

 

[gamecockcat]

That means they got someone as good, not that Hamdan was bad. I watched them a bunch last year and was impressed. This is all on Stoops. He handcuffed Hamdan with no QB again this year and a piss poor o line and o line coach. No OC out there can survive this nonsense. Hamdan is not the issue.

You may be right. But, you have to admit that there were plenty of plays in every single game that you'd say to yourself 'WTF?'. 3rd and long QB draws. 3rd and long naked screens to slot receivers. Short yardage failures. Red zone mismanagement. If Stoops is calling plays, then the OC should throw him under the bus. If Bush was solely responsible, then a lot of blame falls on him. Plus, he's the QB coach and none of the three QBs can read a defense worth a darn. Isn't he supposed to be able to coach them up?

To your point, there are a lot of problems that he has no control over. But, several are very much his responsibility.

 

[Cobb4uk]

That means they got someone as good, not that Hamdan was bad. I watched them a bunch last year and was impressed. This is all on Stoops. He handcuffed Hamdan with no QB again this year and a piss poor o line and o line coach. No OC out there can survive this nonsense. Hamdan is not the issue.

He also handcuffed all the others. Shannon was horrible here but at Miami he's great, his buddy was great at Cinncy but average here, and the rest who knows. We may have been the weekest OL in football. How many sacks did Murray St. have, 4 I think, that tells it all, IMO.

 

[Girthang]

It’s Stoops is what he is saying.

Nope. It's not Stoops. It's him admitting he has a hard time taking what the defense is giving. That's exactly where he failed this season. He wanted to aggressively pass the ball every fkn game, even after the running game was working well. Game after game he dug us in a hole by passing on 3 straight downs and abandoning the run.

"Dialing it back" for him is not forcing the passing game. I don't know if he's capable of doing it.

 

[Girthang]

I have no inkling what BH means by 'we need more length' or he had to 'dial it back'. None. Of course, I had no inkling of what he was trying to do all year, so I'm not surprised.

Not sure we sucked on offense because we weren't aggressive enough. Our OL had major issues. Our QBs couldn't read a defense if their life depended on it. IMO, we threw down the field, or more accurately, we called a lot more plays where every receiver was 15+ yards down the field than we ever should have. We had no time to run long route trees. On numerous occasions in every game, we'd have 3rd and 7 and 4 receivers would be running go routes. Play calling was abysmal all year long. Nothing seemed logical about it.

"Dial it back" = run the fkng ball

 

[Bluesnky]

Pass blocking is a rare talent in college football. If you’re making throwing the ball a big part of your plan, but cannot recruit OL that have the ability to pass block against the median defense on your schedule, then you are putting the cart before the horse.

I think that is the reason these guys were successful before and after leaving here, and why things are worse now than ever. The scheme change has been disastrous.

 

[3632]

i am curious where we need more length at
i am willing to bet our offense has about the same length as 95% of other teams

We don’t. Other than Key our recievers aren’t long bodied or long armed guys. Tight ends here have generally been shorter armed. Rodriguez probably our longest TE. Several linemen not long arms to engage blocks before the d gets into their bodies. Height only matters to see well in traffic but it’s no different than basketball. Longer wingspans regardless of height create bigger catch radius. Some of these guys on the line don’t have SEC type reach. Bad feet and short reach are bad combos for too many guys.

 

[kats23]

I have no clue about Hamdan, but I know Stoops' philosophy is to run the football, control the clock, and have a great defense. But ever since Gran, he has recruited these pro-style coordinators who want to run plays that develop deep down the field. That's not what the line was recruited for and there is a difference between run blocking lineman and pass blocking lineman. From size, speed, footwork, and lateral quickness all this makes a difference. If they wanted to incorporate passing the ball more, it needs to be more of a quick strike philosophy with slants, and screens, using the running back out in space. Getting the QB mobile with naked bootlegs. Try to get your wideouts to use YAC.

It feels more like a round peg-square-hole type of thing here the last 4 years.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

Which is what is so confusing when you see his numbers at BSU

It really isn't when you consider his whole body of work. Petersen hired him, after previously having him on the UW staff, to call plays in 18. He was there two years. The offense struggled big time. Petersen retired after Hamdan's second year. Jimmy Lake, Petersen's DC, was hired to replace Petersen. Lake didn't retain TWO coaches from Petersen's staff. Hamdan was one of them. That's telling.

Hamdan then wound up at Mizzou with Drink. Drink struggled managing everything while also calling plays. He gave Hamdan a three game audition at the end of Hamdan's third year to be the offensive play caller. The result? Drink hired Kirby Moore and Hamdan was gone. Again, very telling.

When you look at the totality of Hamdan's work, the 2023 BSU performance was the anomaly. Not the other way around.

 

[cole854]

Was he able to put up big numbers at BSU because the comp was weak...?


Boise State's offense in the 2023 season with the Broncos ranking highly in several categories:

• Scoring
  Boise State averaged 41.2 points per game, which was the third-highest in the country. This was the most points per game since 2011.

They only avg. 32ppg last year and they lost every game against better comp. This w/ an AA RB.

 

[cathouse]

Why would we ever need to dial it back. We didn't score more than 20 in any power 4 game. Sounds like the dial was busted and stuck on the dial it back setting.

BH was just letting people know that when HE wanted to get aggressive on play calling, he was forced to reign it back in by someone or something.

Not really that hard to figure out who.

 

[Bluesnky]

BH was just letting people know that when HE wanted to get aggressive on play calling, he was forced to reign it back in by someone or something.

Not really that hard to figure out who.

Maybe I’m alone in this but to me the aggressiveness was the worst part. All the first down sacks and incompletions have been driving me crazy for three years now.

 

[Girthang]

Maybe I’m alone in this but to me the aggressiveness was the worst part. All the first down sacks and incompletions have been driving me crazy for three years now.

100% agree. It's incredibly frustrating

 

[Crankdatmustard]

UK was the only Power 5 team in the country to not score 21 points in ANY Conference game. We also finished 114 in total offense.

Complete embarrassment

 

[Girthang]

BH was just letting people know that when HE wanted to get aggressive on play calling, he was forced to reign it back in by someone or something.

Lol. Except he didn't. That refusal to take what the defense was giving is what cost us games like the Georgia game. We could have mixed up the run (that was working) with the pass and gotten into FG range, but instead we tried to throw it on 3 straight downs and lost yardage.

I know everyone wants to blame every single decision and failure on Stoops, but that is just insane. For the last 3 years it is abandoning the running game and being "aggressive" (ie stupid) and "passive" (ie chickensht) that has cost us victories.

When we tried to score at every opportunity, including going into halftime, we've done very well. When we've tried to get the easy and gimmicky sht too early, we paid for it. See the USC trick play at our own goal line, trying deep shots that got sacks and INTs early in a series, and thinking that we had to throw the ball every down because we were down two scores is what hurt us. Not going up tempo when it is working and backing into halftime with poor clock management are examples of the passive insanity.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

He's the worst playcaller I've seen here in the Stoops era, by far. He just seems to have zero feel for the game and does some of the most boneheaded chit you can imagine at the worst possible times.

Oh, and in regards to Boise State, their offensive numbers actually got better AFTER Hamdan left.

If you listened to BH after the game yesterday, he told us why his offense looked so inconsistent (bad) all year. And I quote directly from BH.
"For me at times, when you feel like you wanna go be aggressive, you just are constantly in that mode of dialing it back, turning it on, dialing it back.”

Now, what ( or who) would make an OC "dial it back" when he really wanted to be aggressive??
Yeah. Try another OC. See if we get anything different. Lol.

Some of it is due to having a putrid offensive line

Immediately after the game, he and stoops started the messaging about the OL being the problem.

We all knew this OL wasnt good in pass blocking. So why continue to run deep drops and deep routes? They had virtually zero chance of success. Bush ran way more deep stuff than anyone we ever had, while having a poor pass blocking OL. All usually with the defense having both safeties back. It was insane.

Equally as stupid, we ran block pretty well. Iirc our rbs averaged about 4-5 ypc which is really good given our competition. Yet we barely ran the ball.

I immediately knew in the sc game he was way over his head. We could literally run the ball at will, yet kept calling deep pass sets into two deep safeties and their incredible pass rush. If we run the ball that game, we win and probably flip out seasons.

 

[zannmann]

We have had several OCs all perform worse here, Stoops is the common denominator.