Skal Labissiere still not cleared by NCAA...

[2Dope15]

If his handler is being quiet on the situation can we still trust him? I mean if he doesn't get cleared, he can easily play oversees and make money. And of course the handler is going to make money on him over there, he will still could be a top 5 pick next yr. I think the guy wants money and wants it now.

 

[dave5164]

The Kanter issue has always comes up now when there is a player being looked at Kentucky. These two cases are so different and there was money involved in the Kanter Case. Even though alot of people thought the Kanter case was handled wrong by the NCAA there was money and the amount was around $30,000 if i remember correctly. Not real sure on the amount that was in question with the Kanter's but that was the main issue. In the Labissiere case there has been no money issues or academic issues just some questions for his guardian. We all knew about the Money issue that the NCAA was looking at with the Kanter's during that time. It came out pretty quick and that the NCAA was looking into that issue with Kanter. In Skal Labissiere case his guardian was asking some questions on the pay for play with another person. There was NO money that was taken or involved with the Labissiere eligibility and NO issues with his Academic status. It was just a few questions asked by his quardian to another individual about pay. That was it. Everyone needs to let the Kanter case go its been five years now and there was over 30,000 that the Kanter's received from the one team in excess benefits. That is why the Kanter case and Labissiere case are so totally different because of the Kanter money of more than 30,000.

 

[KnowsAllTellsAll]

I've never seen any discussion about the home school his mentor created for Skal to go to school his senior year. Link to the article below.

Is his mentor qualified to run a home school program?

When Hamilton had Labissiere attend two different Memphis-area high schools and play for three different AAU programs, it led to the Tennessee School Sports Athletic Association ruling the prospect ineligible to compete his senior year. Hamilton responded by creating something called Reach Your Dream Prep, a home school team that essentially existed only so that Labissiere would have somewhere to play last year that was outside TSSAA jurisdiction.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab...ear-kentucky-s-skal-labissiere-235744709.html

 

[mj2k10]

The Kanter issue has always comes up now when there is a player being looked at Kentucky. These two cases are so different and there was money involved in the Kanter Case. Even though alot of people thought the Kanter case was handled wrong by the NCAA there was money and the amount was around $30,000 if i remember correctly. Not real sure on the amount that was in question with the Kanter's but that was the main issue. In the Labissiere case there has been no money issues or academic issues just some questions for his guardian. We all knew about the Money issue that the NCAA was looking at with the Kanter's during that time. It came out pretty quick and that the NCAA was looking into that issue with Kanter. In Skal Labissiere case his guardian was asking some questions on the pay for play with another person. There was NO money that was taken or involved with the Labissiere eligibility and NO issues with his Academic status. It was just a few questions asked by his quardian to another individual about pay. That was it. Everyone needs to let the Kanter case go its been five years now and there was over 30,000 that the Kanter's received from the one team in excess benefits. That is why the Kanter case and Labissiere case are so totally different because of the Kanter money of more than 30,000.

It was actually a lot more than 30K . The NCAA ruled that 30K of what he was paid (the total amount I remember reading about was 67K, though that could be off) couldn't count towards living expenses. It didn't help that Fenerbahce, the club he had played for, wasn't too pleased with him, and was more than eager to tell the NCAA that "yes, of course he was a pro, paid way beyond basic living expenses".

The rules about foreign players were changed the year Kanter signed with UK, and the thought was that the NCAA was going to take a liberal position on guys who had played in foreign pro leagues as teenagers. That really didn't happen. It's more liberal than it was before, when guys simply competing at the pro level, paid or not, led to pretty much automatic ineligibility, but there has yet to be a case of a guy explicitly playing for pay being allowed into college basketball. The guys who come over now plan for it in advance by not taking any money (Domantas Sabonis is a good example of that).

Kanter was a precedent case. It wasn't the precedent that most people thought it was going to be, but it also wasn't the NCAA singling out a UK recruit in a way that hasn't been applied in other cases.

 

[kyjeff1]

Everyone needs to stop using the Cam Newton case to make themselves feel better. Keep in mind, the NCAA went out of there way to find an excuse to make Cam eligible. Why? because they stood to profit off of his talent in the title game. The same way they did for the four Ohio State players that were selling their own memorabilia. How ridiculous was that? They were going to get to play in the bowl game as long as they all agreed to come back the next year and serve their suspensions. What a joke that was.

Now, what we have learned is there are cases where the NCAA will come up with reasons to clear a player (Newton and OSU players) because they stand to profit. Buuuuuut we have also seen many cases where they came up with reason's to declare a player ineligible. We know this all too well, if they really wanted to be fair they could have found a reason to declare Kanter eligible but they chose not to. His family said they would pay all monies back and rules are different oversees, paying amateurs is legal over there.
So, here we are with Skal, no money exchanged hands so theoretically he should be fine but the NCAA is one of the most crooked organizations on the country so yeah, we should be concerned.
I honestly think he will be cleared but I will never place money on what the NCAA is going to do.

 

[Aike]

I've never seen any discussion about the home school his mentor created for Skal to go to school his senior year. Link to the article below.

Is his mentor qualified to run a home school program?

When Hamilton had Labissiere attend two different Memphis-area high schools and play for three different AAU programs, it led to the Tennessee School Sports Athletic Association ruling the prospect ineligible to compete his senior year. Hamilton responded by creating something called Reach Your Dream Prep, a home school team that essentially existed only so that Labissiere would have somewhere to play last year that was outside TSSAA jurisdiction.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab...ear-kentucky-s-skal-labissiere-235744709.html

Pretty sure Skal still went to school at Lausanne Collegiate, while playing basketball for RYD.

 

[kybballcrazy]

Pretty sure Skal still went to school at Lausanne Collegiate, while playing basketball for RYD.

You are correct sir. Lausanne Collegiate has an excellent academic reputation. Skal will play.

 

[KnowsAllTellsAll]

Pretty sure Skal still went to school at Lausanne Collegiate, while playing basketball for RYD.

Misread the article. It says his mentor created a home school "team". Sounds like that was strictly a basketball team, not that he was home schooled.

 

[Wildcat-in-STL]

Oh I've heard plenty. But no one on this side is going to believe anything they don't want to hear, and no one in Memphis wants him to clear. It's a no win situation for me so I'm just staying out of it.

It was never just Keith Easterwood and Parrish spouting on my end.

go ahead and say. We believe you heard things but you have to admit, it has to be taken with a grain of salt when its coming from those who want the kid to be ineligible.

 

[michaeluk26]

Unless Humphries turns into a Senior Jorts I see no chance of a FF without Skal.

Marcus would have to have improved leaps and bounds.

Probably the first time I've ever disagreed with one of your posts. Remember, everyone thought the 2011 team was screwed without Kanter. We made the final four because Jorts stepped up as a veteran. If Skal does not play I am truly 100% confident that Lee and Poythress are going to make huge leaps in their game and lead us either way. Maybe not as drastic as Jorts but still a significant jump.

 

[Dakota25]

Unless Humphries turns into a Senior Jorts I see no chance of a FF without Skal.

Marcus would have to have improved leaps and bounds.

Poythress is a great player and Lee would start for most teams in the country too. This team without Skal is still more talented and has better returning players than UK's 2010-2011 final four team. Also this team without Skal is better than past final four teams such as Butler, UConn, and last year's Michigan state just to name a few.

 

[Wildcat-in-STL]

We are in far better shape than in 2011. Humphries is starting off right now a lot better than Harrelson this time that year... and he's probably still only the backup if Skal can't play... Because Lee would be the starter. Ulis, Briscoe, Murray, Poy and Lee... thats five 5 star players..... which is 2 more than we had playing for us in 2011 when we had Knight, Lamb , Liggins, Jones and Harrelson.

 

[brianpoe]

Probably the first time I've ever disagreed with one of your posts. Remember, everyone thought the 2011 team was screwed without Kanter. We made the final four because Jorts stepped up as a veteran. If Skal does not play I am truly 100% confident that Lee and Poythress are going to make huge leaps in their game and lead us either way. Maybe not as drastic as Jorts but still a significant jump.

Poythress is a great player and Lee would start for most teams in the country too. This team without Skal is still more talented and has better returning players than UK's 2010-2011 final four team. Also this team without Skal is better than past final four teams such as Butler, UConn, and last year's Michigan state just to name a few.

We are in far better shape than in 2011. Humphries is starting off right now a lot better than Harrelson this time that year... and he's probably still only the backup if Skal can't play... Because Lee would be the starter. Ulis, Briscoe, Murray, Poy and Lee... thats five 5 star players..... which is 2 more than we had playing for us in 2011 when we had Knight, Lamb , Liggins, Jones and Harrelson.

You guys all make very valid points.

Here is my take and you can tell me where I am wrong.

Fr Knight & Fr Lamb - I believe a Soph Ulis and Murray and Briscoe can be just as productive if not more.


Jr Miller & Jr Liggins - I do not think we have any idea how Mathews & Mulder (add some Briscoe here at the 3 as well) will do.

Can these first year players match the 19.5 points, 8.6 rebounds, 75% FT, a blistering 42% 3PT%, and not just good, but excellent defense? Not to mention their experience factor.


Fr Jones - In my opinion, Poy will never be the basketball player Terrence is/was. Alex showed great defensive skills and an impressive rebound now and then.

I do not see Alex ever averaging 16 pts and 9 rebounds. I am aware he was a 5 star and an exceptional athlete, but I would argue that we do not have any honest basis to claim he is a great player, not to mention coming off a major injury.


Sr. Jorts & Jr Vargas - 9pts and 11 rebounds, I believe Lee and Humphries can maintain these stat lines.

However, we all know that Jorts brought great basketball intangibles, pick and rolls, toughness, heady plays.

None of these are Lee's strong points. Athleticism over these type of intangibles along with much more body mass?

Jorts only hit 60% on his free throws, yet Lee only makes half that many.

Humphries according to Cal is still pretty much behind. He is an underaged freshman. I like how he played vs the US team, however I do not see him being nearly as physical or aggressive as Jorts. His ability to hit the 10-15 footer and free throws are definitely positives.



So basically here is what I am saying:

Guards - 2015 is as good, although you may need to count all 3 to reach Knight and Lamb's 30 points per game. Ulis' experience is a major plus.

SF - If I am lumping Briscoe with the guards than 2011 is much, much more proven and is safe to say better than Mathews and Mulder at this point.

PF - No doubts that Jones > Poy, can Alex be more than a great wing defender and occasional highlight, not to mention do this after knee surgery?

Without Skal, Poy will be keyed upon by the defense because they do not have to guard Lee out past the basket. (Unless he has picked up a decent jump shot). Poy has not performed well on offense when not being the focus.

C - Until Lee shows that he understands what to do and where to be on defense and can make a free throw, I take a Sr Jorts and his bball skils with less athleticism all day.

Without Skal and a PF to provide points ala T Jones, I do not trust Lee to give us what Jorts did (nor would i have trusted Jorts to be enough without Jones), and I hope Humphries progresses by year end to take up the slack.

Humphries could surprise or be a year away.


The Butler, UConn' and Michigan State teams were all laden with veteran's, and although we can point to an obvious advantage in athleticism, it is hard to predict what a young group like this would do. We do not have a John Wall-Demarcus Cousins or Knight-Lamb-Jones super freshman combo/trio (assuming Skal is out).



Again all of this without Skal -he changes everything.

I just do not see a long run in the tourney without a goto scorer/rebounder/rim protector at the 4 or 5.

With Skal, Poy can flourish as the guy who is not focused on (hopefully).


I may be wrong on all of this, I hope and believe Skal will play, if not, I hope I am incredibly wrong about this assessment.

 

[.S&C.]

go ahead and say. We believe you heard things but you have to admit, it has to be taken with a grain of salt when its coming from those who want the kid to be ineligible.

Some of my information isn't necessarily from guys who hate Skal and want him ineligible. It's guys who work with people around him and they have an opinion on what happened, why it happened, and where it will end. It's up to the NCAA now anyway, so no one knows and therefore there's no point in discussing what some of these coaches think. To me, he's good until they say he's not.

For the record, Parrish and Easterwood do not necessarily want the kid to be ineligable, they just think it could reach that far.

 

[jarms24]

Matt Jones essentially saying that Jeff Goodman put this garbage out because it's more of a retaliatory move since his boy Rick Pitino is under fire. MJ said UK folks are not even remotely concerned.

 

[Hoskins21]

It's a non-issue. UK fans are paranoid and always will be. Skal will play and I'll bet on it.

 

[UKCATSFREAK]

Kanter took money.

Skal didn't.

Apples and oranges.

Skal will play. Unless, of course, the NCAA is looking to set another new precedent, in which case I would say all bets are off for any of our recruits.

No disrespect but I didn't mention Kanter. Everyone keeps comparing Skal to Enes, which I think is irrelevant. It's the hundreds of other cases across the nation in which there is ZERO consistency in the NCAA rulings. That's what has me a bit on edge. That and the fact that nobody knows exactly what Skal's guardian was trying to do but I do know that there were a lot of people, especially around Memphis, that were saying he was bad news and could cause problems for Skal. Now, I'm not saying that there is a problem because I personally think he will be fine. We have THE BEST compliance person in the business working for us in Sandy Bell, so I'm not too concerned. My point is that I understand that some are concerned. People shouldn't be bashed on here and made to look stupid for being concerned. That's all I meant.

 

[UKCATSFREAK]

We are in far better shape than in 2011. Humphries is starting off right now a lot better than Harrelson this time that year... and he's probably still only the backup if Skal can't play... Because Lee would be the starter. Ulis, Briscoe, Murray, Poy and Lee... thats five 5 star players..... which is 2 more than we had playing for us in 2011 when we had Knight, Lamb , Liggins, Jones and Harrelson.

Were Ulis and Lee both 5 stars? I think Ulis was on 1 site but I think most had him around 30-40. I thought Lee was somewhere around 25-35. I could be wrong though, my memory isn't as good as it once was. Lol.

 

[RC_Texas]

Were Ulis and Lee both 5 stars? I think Ulis was on 1 site but I think most had him around 30-40. I thought Lee was somewhere around 25-35. I could be wrong though, my memory isn't as good as it once was. Lol.

Scout and Rival had Lee at a 5*. ESPN had him at 4*. Kansas recruited Lee. I wanted him to be a Jayhawk. I think he has a great chance to have a breakout year.

 

[UKCATSFREAK]

Rumblings? You mean rumors? A lot of the same went on and around with Anthony Davis ($200,000) and Nerlens Noel. Both played without missing a game. People linking Skal to Kanter are nothing but paranoid. Kanter had a $30,000 paper-trail. Skal doesn't.

You are missing my point. Why are you trying to convince me that there is nothing to be concerned about? I never said there was reason to be concerned. I was simply saying that I can understand why some are concerned because of the rumblings/rumors (same thing) that were surrounding his recruitment. Let me say this again, I am a bit weary just because we are dealing with the NCAA but I am weary of every major recruit like this. The lack of consistency and the complete randomness of the rulings made across the country are appalling. You can never predict what they will find. I wouldn't go as far as to say concerned but a bit on edge because of the NCAA. If it gets to be November and he is not cleared then I will start to get concerned that there is an issue but at this point, I am preparing to buy my Skal jersey for this season.

 

[UKCATSFREAK]

Scout and Rival had Lee at a 5*. ESPN had him at 4*. Kansas recruited Lee. I wanted him to be a Jayhawk. I think he has a great chance to have a breakout year.

Gotcha! I agree, I think he will have a great year also.

 

[Hoskins21]

You are missing my point. Why are you trying to convince me that there is nothing to be concerned about? I never said there was reason to be concerned. I was simply saying that I can understand why some are concerned because of the rumblings/rumors (same thing) that were surrounding his recruitment. Let me say this again, I am a bit weary just because we are dealing with the NCAA but I am weary of every major recruit like this. The lack of consistency and the complete randomness of the rulings made across the country are appalling. You can never predict what they will find. I wouldn't go as far as to say concerned but a bit on edge because of the NCAA. If it gets to be November and he is not cleared then I will start to get concerned that there is an issue but at this point, I am preparing to buy my Skal jersey for this season.

UK fans will always be concerned about something. That will never change. Most eligibility issues aren't dealt with until the start of the season. Heck, we didn't know about John Wall needing to sit two games until a couple of days before our first exhibition game that year. This isn't something that will drag out.

 

[Mark Gastineau]

Think ya'll might get a kick out of this thread:

http://northcarolina.forums.rivals....or-ncaa-clearance-to-play-for-wildcats.17144/

Some UNC fans are patting themselves on the back because Roy apparently passed on Skal (and Diallo as well). Good gracious, the denial/idiocy in Chapel Hill these days is just shocking

 

[ARC Dog]

The denial in this thread is worse.

 

[Hoskins21]

The denial in this thread is worse.

Please elaborate. I bet Skal plays without missing a game and UNC gets hammered.

 

[gracetoyou]

The denial in this thread is worse.

There's nothing to deny. Just because of a loose accusation of his guardian asking someone in Memphis about how to cash in on a player doesn't mean anything has been done to affect Skal's amateur status. But the NCAA has to look into something like that since Skal is a high profile player & those statements have been so publicized.

I'd bet money they find nothing. Question is...how long will they drag this out? He has been clear academically...this is totally about amateurism.

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

The denial in this thread is worse.

Nah. You're pretty much off on this one.

 

[dave5164]

The Kanter case with the NCAA investigating was so much different than the Labissiere case right no w. If you remember even Nerlens Noel had a few people questioned by the NCAA on his recruitment. They had thought one Michael Sweeney had given money to Noel. He had mentioned when they had traveled to Florida he did pay for plane fare to Florida nd something else was mentioned but like Sweeney said he wasn't a booster at Kentucky and did no wrong with Noel. So, the same with Labissiere and his Handler asking a person with knowledge about what he could receive for being Labissiere's handler. There was NO Money exchanged and No Paper Trail for any money involved with Labissiere. That is why most of the fans on here are trying to say to a few users that the Kanter case and the Labissiere case are night and day. It is alot like Noel's friends being investigated by NCAA and no money trail found back to Nerlins Noel. I don't think anyone on here is trying to convince anyone not to be concerned about this because no one knows what the NCAA is looking at towards the handler. We are just saying that the Kanter case had a Money Trail of over 67,000 which was $33,000 in excess of Benefits from Fenerbahçe Ülker. This then classified Kanter as a professional player with the amount of money he had received for playing for them. Fenerbahce Ulker turned in all the paperwork and the money trail to the NCAA that he did play for them in the EuroLeague which is considered Professional league. There is no Money and no Money Trail in the Labissiere case and on top of that there are no problems with his Academic Status. That is why most on here and Coach Cal and UK are saying that there should be NO Problems with Labissiere and should play from day one.

 

[TNCatfanforever]

If he were at any place other than UK there would be no question. Emmert and the NCAA hate Cal and UK. I think he may play but I have a feeling it may be a multiple game suspension....and bet your bottom dollar he won't play against Duke.

 

[Wildcat-in-STL]

what are we denying? The NCAA isn't going to hammer Skal because of something an AAU coach in Memphis has an axe to grind. You don't think the NCAA knows all about the "kingpins of memphis" and them strong arming kids into going to memphis or else?

 

[preacher_tom]

http://www.kentucky.com/2015/10/10/4081502/uk-basketball-notebook-with-madness.html

 

[hotelblue]

so vitale's concern is we need him for size up front. right dick. thanks.

these people who ask skal questions. is it an interview? is it multiple people randomly contacting him from the same office? it doesn't specify but i'd like to know what they're asking because at this stage why didn't they ask these questions before he committed? seems like the ncaa is suddenly proactive in his case. wish they were in others. they are amazingly inconsistent as we know, and biased. let's see what they do.

 

[blubo]

http://www.kentucky.com/2015/10/10/4081502/uk-basketball-notebook-with-madness.html

Be Warned!! this is a link to a jerry tipton story. i unknowingly clicked on it---thanks preacher. if you want to give him a hit go ahead, but you know what to expect and you're right.

 

[jrpross]

I don't get why Vitale says "they need size badly." Assuming Skal plays, which I really think he does, they have 4 extremely solid guys to man the 4 and 5 positions between 6'8" and 7'. I'm more worried about them getting enough playing time more than I am depth.

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

If his status is still unclear in three weeks, I'll start worrying. Until then, that article reads of whorish appeal written by one of the media's most cynical pimps. The fact that he used an old, semi-senile commentator as his primary source is hilarious.

 

[Orange Soda King]

Tipton warning!

 

[hotelblue]

Tipton warning!

yeah thanks. the thread i responded in was merged to this. which was a good idea, no disclaimer there either.

 

[JPScott]

We are just saying that the Kanter case had a Money Trail of over 67,000 which was $33,000 in excess of Benefits from Fenerbahçe Ülker. This then classified Kanter as a professional player with the amount of money he had received for playing for them. Fenerbahce Ulker turned in all the paperwork and the money trail to the NCAA that he did play for them in the EuroLeague which is considered Professional league.

No this is incorrect. Despite Pete Thamel's continued insinuations Kanter was NEVER declared a professional by the NCAA. The $33,000 was deemed to be in excess of what the NCAA considered proper, but this was all related to reimbursements for expenses which were allowable. (I.e. Reimbursements for expenses were allowed, the issue was that the Kanters received more than the NCAA computed that he was due).

This was a second-level issue with respect to NCAA eligibility. The first level is whether the player is deemed a professional or whether he is still an amateur. Kanter cleared this stage-gate. The next level is whether they received more in expense reimbursement (which are allowed) than the NCAA deems appropriate.

Kanter did play WITH professionals but this by itself did NOT disqualify him as an amateur. This was made explicitly clear in the NCAA's rule 2009-22. (Prior to that rule playing with professionals was more problematic for those wishing to retain their amateur status.)

FWIW I wrote extensively about the Kanter case at the following link:

http://www.bigbluehistory.net/bb/media2010.html#nytimes-kanter

 

[KA4Prez]

...yet I don't get why on earth people mention Kanter when discussing Skal. The only 2 common things in that equation are the NCAA and Kentucky.

There have been thousands of other NCAA eligibility rulings for thousands of reasons since Kanter's fate was sealed. Why people believe the two decisions are inter-related is beyond me.

 

[W2R]

Lol Tipton looking for anything now he is looking at message board rumors. Easterwood went on Parrish show and said he had "heard" from people that Hamilton had tried to shop Skal No one ever came forward. It was the week of Skal committing to UK. Matter months of nothing someone said on message board it was Easterwood.
Hamilton messed up by pulling Skal out of ECS and the whole transfer fiasco. The reach your dreams didn't help his cause. But the grades never suffered and nothing ever transpired.