Quit Crying about Refs!!!

[The_Answer1313]

I don't know. I mean there seems to be this notion that offense = athletic ability and defense = just effort.

I don't think it's just effort.

I think some guys can excel on offense but be poor defenders and some guys can be defensive specialists but not great on offense.

We've just had the first skillset quite a bit recently as opposed to the latter.

 

[The_Answer1313]

With refs I tend to take the viewpoint that the officiating is just bad right now. I don't believe every ref is out to "get UK" tho. I think there's a difference between the two.

And that might be why I have a hard time getting too caught up in the whole ref thing lol.

It's like yeah we were called for a ton of fouls in the beginning of that second half vs Alabama. Was some of them questionable? Yeah maybe. The majority weren't tho and the fouls quickly evened up towards the middle of that 2nd half.

It's one of those things this board has always discussed for as long as I remember. You don't want to be too naive and think that some refs aren't corrupt. At the same rate, you don't want to think they all are either lol. The question always gets asked here how often do you feel refs control the game. And I feel like the answers are wide here.

 

[B.B.H.]

I don't know. I mean there seems to be this notion that offense = athletic ability and defense = just effort.

I don't think it's just effort.

I think some guys can excel on offense but be poor defenders and some guys can be defensive specialists but not great on offense.

We've just had the first skillset quite a bit recently as opposed to the latter.

Nate Oats put it very simply in the postgame explaining what they did to beat us. “We found their seals and we had our whales go at their seals.” You can’t get more honest and explicit than that. It wasn’t a scheme issue. Oats knew which personnel limitations to exploit and had the whales to do it. That had a large part to do with why we score 97 and lose at home. Thankfully, with time, Pope will have more whales than seals.

 

[B.B.H.]

With refs I tend to take the viewpoint that the officiating is just bad right now. I don't believe every ref is out to "get UK" tho. I think there's a difference between the two.

And that might be why I have a hard time getting too caught up in the whole ref thing lol.

It's like yeah we were called for a ton of fouls in the beginning of that second half vs Alabama. Was some of them questionable? Yeah maybe. The majority weren't tho and the fouls quickly evened up towards the middle of that 2nd half.

It's one of those things this board has always discussed for as long as I remember. You don't want to be too naive and think that some refs aren't corrupt. At the same rate, you don't want to think they all are either lol. The question always gets asked here how often do you feel refs control the game. And I feel like the answers are wide here.

Completely agree

 

[Wildcat Sheli]

So Calipari got screwed out of that Oakland game? Just curious if you’re going to be consistent enough to say that…I’ll hang up and listen.

Not necessarily. It’s no secret Cal has a difficult time winning when the opponent is coached by a good friend.

But it’s also true that we only win 30% of the time when Dorsey is officiating, and 65.2% of the time with Anderson. That’s some of the lowest winning percentages among active refs. (Highlighted words are linked to further info).
🤷‍♀️

 

[B.B.H.]

Not necessarily. It’s no secret Cal has a difficult time winning when the opponent is coached by a good friend.

But it’s also true that we only win 30% of the time when Dorsey is officiating, and 65.2% of the time with Anderson. That’s some of the lowest winning percentages among active refs. (Highlighted words are linked to further info).
🤷‍♀️

Lol I thought you’d backtrack once you had to take your statement to its logical conclusion. Consistency would be great on these topics but I get it.

 

[Fox2monk]

I'm noticing a bunch of my least favorite posters are saying the calls weren't bad.

Hilarious. There's a reason I can't stand many of these guys. Many of them loved Cal as well.

They can claim refs don’t have an agenda for one bad game but constantly over the course of seasons we get a horrible whistle even at home and this year in our losses we have been out shot on FT’s to the point some teams made more than we took. That is ridiculous.

 

[B.B.H.]

They can claim refs don’t have an agenda for one bad game but constantly over the course of seasons we get a horrible whistle even at home and this year in our losses we have been out shot on FT’s to the point some teams made more than we took. That is ridiculous.

Did you watch UConn vs Butler last night? If so, did you think UConn got hosed?

 

[Fox2monk]

Did you watch UConn vs Butler last night? If so, did you think UConn got hosed?

I did not see that game. I saw they barley escaped and then coaches rant later on on SC and the internet.

 

[B.B.H.]

I did not see that game. I saw they barley escaped and then coaches rant later on on SC and the internet.

I’ll be with you until the end of time that college refs suck, especially in the SEC….but I’d recommend watching the UConn vs Butler game from last night. Perfect counterpoint to the KY gets screwed narrative. (And you don’t have to agree let me be clear). Butler got hosed lol. But go watch the foul disparity and the way the game played. It’s a perfect parallel

 

[Fox2monk]

I’ll be with you until the end of time that college refs suck, especially in the SEC….but I’d recommend watching the UConn vs Butler game from last night. Perfect counterpoint to the KY gets screwed narrative. (And you don’t have to agree let me be clear). Butler got hosed lol. But go watch the foul disparity and the way the game played. It’s a perfect parallel

I’ve seen too many game where we get called for things other teams don’t. We shoot 3’s or layups with the best of them and we get no calls. We got outshot by 16 FT’s in our own building. That’s crazy. 36 FT attempts for Bama. We never get calls like that. I can understand a game here or there but it’s been like that in every loss this year.

 

[B.B.H.]

I’ve seen too many game where we get called for things other teams don’t. We shoot 3’s or layups with the best of them and we get no calls. We got outshot by 16 FT’s in our own building. That’s crazy. 36 FT attempts for Bama. We never get calls like that. I can understand a game here or there but it’s been like that in every loss this year.

No game will be officiated consistently enough or perfectly enough due to the human element. There will always be missed calls no matter what. Is this something where your mind is willing to be changed? If I literally show you multiple clips where we got favorable calls from that game would that move the needle?

 

[Fox2monk]

No game will be officiated consistently enough or perfectly enough due to the human element. There will always be missed calls no matter what. Is this something where your mind is willing to be changed? If I literally show you multiple clips where we got favorable calls from that game would that move the needle?

I’m sure you could, but I can show more for Bama or hosts of other teams too. It’s cool you feel that way I just don’t agree. I thought it was a Cal thing, but it’s not so far with Pope. It’s a little better but still bad.

 

[B.B.H.]

I’m sure you could but I can show more for Bama.

Well, understand, I’m not saying there will be an “equal” amount of missed calls. I’m not expecting that to happen. If this is a thing where no evidence can be shared and no one’s mind can change I won’t waste my time. However, I do think it is an important topic in one sense. I think it is obvious I do not think Ky is singled out in the bad refereeing. I’m willing to use my personal time to show it if facts matter. I do believe we were waxed versus Georgia but not these other games. Go watch UConn vs Butler as an objective CBB fan and pay attention to the whistle

 

[Fox2monk]

Well, understand, I’m not saying there will be an “equal” amount of missed calls. I’m not expecting that to happen. If this is a thing where no evidence can be shared and no one’s mind can change I won’t waste my time. However, I do think it is an important topic in one sense. I think it is obvious I do not think Ky is singled out in the bad refereeing. I’m willing to use my personal time to show it if facts matter. I do believe we were waxed versus Georgia but not these other games. Go watch UConn vs Butler as an objective CBB fan and pay attention to the whistle

I watch other games and agree overall most refs just aren’t very good.

 

[BigBlueManSouthCentralKY]

Why can't refs be instructed to just not call any fouls that could go either way, fouls that they can't 100% for sure see and fouls that are ticky tac. So what if they miss calling 20 fouls. Wouldn't the game be much better for the players, coaches and fans? Why not err that way instead of the refs being a big part of the game?

 

[B.B.H.]

Why can't refs be instructed to just not call any fouls that could go either way, fouls that they can't 100% for sure see and fouls that are ticky tac. So what if they miss calling 20 fouls. Wouldn't the game be much better for the players, coaches and fans? Why not err that way instead of the refs being a big part of the game?

Personally, I’d prefer the refs go tighter on the whistle. It would have to be for a prolonged period of time. It’s the only way to clean up the SEC wrestling matches. Right now, in the SEC the idea is to foul until the refs are tired of calling fouls and that’s probably why most of the conference looks like the tune squad at halftime of Space Jam

 

[BigBlueManSouthCentralKY]

Like hand checking for instance. You see a nothing hand check called a foul sometimes and on the other end you see a guy literally grabbing another player and throwing him aside with no call. We see so many replays of players driving the ball and on their shot they aren't even touched with the defender just holding his arms straight up.

 

[Cowtown Cat]

I’ve seen too many game where we get called for things other teams don’t. We shoot 3’s or layups with the best of them and we get no calls. We got outshot by 16 FT’s in our own building. That’s crazy. 36 FT attempts for Bama. We never get calls like that. I can understand a game here or there but it’s been like that in every loss this year.

We have RARELY gotten a foul call around the bucket all season! Butler/Oweh are hammered constantly and they rarely get that call.

 

[Cowtown Cat]

How many rule changes have happened as a direct result of a UK game, just in the last decade alone? That’s quite telling to me.

 

[Kybluedude]

No doubt the squeaky wheel gets the oil.

Coaches Oats and Hurley are proof

Coach Pope’s silence is interpreted as a sign of affirmation they are doing a good job and secondly, no doubt there is no fear of a public tongue lashing plus it makes it easier to give the complainer his way to quiet him down. Oaks worked those refs like a pro in the second half when he had them in front of him.

 

[B.B.H.]

No doubt the squeaky wheel gets the oil.

Coaches Oats and Hurley are proof

Coach Pope’s silence is interpreted as a sign of affirmation they are doing a good job and secondly, no doubt there is no fear of a public tongue lashing plus it makes it easier to give the complainer his way to quiet him down. Oaks worked those refs like a pro in the second half when he had them in front of him.

So you believe if someone is loud like Hurley their team will shoot more free throws? Asking for a specific reason

Men's Basketball vs Butler on 1/21/2025 - Box Score - University of Connecticut Athletics

The official box score of Men's Basketball vs Butler on 1/21/2025

uconnhuskies.com

At home, UConn 14 free throw attempts, Butler 28 free throw attempts

 

[Kybluedude]

So you believe if someone is loud like Hurley their team will shoot more free throws? Asking for a specific reason

Men's Basketball vs Butler on 1/21/2025 - Box Score - University of Connecticut Athletics

The official box score of Men's Basketball vs Butler on 1/21/2025

uconnhuskies.com

At home, UConn 14 free throw attempts, Butler 28 free throw attempts

Jan 18 2025 Rupp Arena
Free throws
Alabama 34
Kentucky 20

 

[B.B.H.]

Jan 18 2025 Rupp Arena
Free throws
Alabama 34
Kentucky 20

And?

 

[Kybluedude]

And?

Oates- constant whining- 14 more free throws- at Rupp Arena.
Squeaky wheel got the oil.

 

[B.B.H.]

Oates- constant whining- 14 more free throws- at Rupp Arena.
Squeaky wheel got the oil.

That’s not the way logic works though.

Hurley constantly whines and the opposing team shot double the free throws in his home building.

You already have your answers for free throw disparity and some of you would rather not hear it: A.) Pope himself stated in his coach’s show that he does not teach his team to draw fouls. He believes it places the game unnecessarily in the refs’ hands and removes the team from other offensive outcomes. B.) Oats himself told you in the postgame what they did to capitalize on Kentucky’s defensive weaknesses….”We isolated their seals and sent our whales at their seals.” Anyone with a keen eye and openness to fair analysis could see the game and say, “Yeah that is obviously what happened.” When you have defensive mismatches that are matched up with players they cannot defend on an island, excessive fouling occurs.

None of these things mean that any game is going to be called perfectly “even”. Nor does it mean that refs are good (frankly SEC officiating has been horrific). They miss calls in every game and in various situations. This will happen to various degrees until the end of time as long as humans are the ones with whistles dangling around the neck.

At the end of the day if you want to believe officiating is specifically, as a profession, hellbent on tearing down the prestige of the University of Kentucky men’s basketball, I will respect your opinion and stand united on all the things that make us fans of our team but simply disagree on this point. I think it is laughably absurd.

 

[BigBlueManSouthCentralKY]

A play in the GA/AR game had a driver going to the basket and the defender had his arms straight up just standing there and they called the foul on the defender. I have seen this thousands of times over the years. Why can't the defender around the rim be allowed to put his arms straight up? What is he supposed to do? It should be a no call but the offensive player gets bailed out most of the time.