Thats fine, if you stick with it. I'm not sure the others will.
I also think I can live without every hearing that last catch phrase ever again.. lol
Pope on KSR
- Thread starter LXWildcat
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Thats fine, if you stick with it. I'm not sure the others will.
I also think I can live without every hearing that last catch phrase ever again.. lol
At least a couple years. We had to hear about young, non-robots being their brothers keeper and pooping ice cream for 15 years, so a precedent has been set.
I understand that you understand that he understands the assignment. Does anyone understand that I understand that Eight Banners understands that Mark Pope understands the assignment?
So much more sincere than the brainless self aggrandizing blather from the fat bloated kneeler
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This is another one that cracks me up. These coaches are making their paychecks on the backs of many African-Americans. Do you think Pope wouldn't stand with his players on this? And if he declined, what sort of message does that send to the future players who want to come here?
Let's hope this never becomes an issue again, because I don't think some of you would like to know where Pope stands on this matter.
Cal spent 35 years helping mostly black families.. and you were shocked he stood with them (even If I, personally, don't agree with him)? lol. I don't know if we will ever get more info on this, but I would bet this is kind of when the divide between Cal and the fanbase started (or grew even more). I'm sure Cal was just as annoyed with the other side of the aisle, as we were with him on this matter.
I think it started with the end of the Wisconsin game. Or maybe it was blowing the golden opportunity in 2018. Or the Auburn game. Or the 9-16 team. Or losing to St. Peters. Or Shaedon Sharpe. Or losing to Oakland. Any one of those things created more of a rift with the fan base than kneeling for the anthem.
I think the all those things contributed to it but I think the big divide started when PJ Washington was injured and he would always just say "I don't know. I haven't seen him". I think that was the true beginning of it all. That was the shift in Cal to being the contrarian to the fan base and the fan base beginning to get frustrated with him. The rest just followed suit.
Well for starters, half of those incidents came AFTER the kneeling. and it's pretty clear that caused a rift because posters in THIS VERY THREAD, still bring it up lol.
It was a huge issue, it was the topic of conversation here for months. People had very strong feelings on both sides. I would bet Cal was shocked, and probably pissed, at how much back lash he got. Now, I'm again not saying I agree with his stance on this.. Im just saying, to him, he was probably just as pissed at some of the fanbase, as they were pissed at him.
Fast forward to the last few years where it really seems like Cal gave up, maybe out of spite.. and yeah, I think the kneeling incident absolutely added fuel to a growing fire.
I'm guessing Wells is one of them. I think he would be one of the best players in CBB next year if he's back.
It will be interesting to see how fans react to Pope doing some of the same things Cal got crushed for (and I was one of the fans crushing him). Last year the two leading scorers at BYU came off the bench.
It's going to be fun for sure lol. I'm rooting for Pope and I think hes gonna be a fantastic coach.. but yes, I have tabs and receipts on the things we banged Cal for. The injury thing really cracks me up. Anyone who follows any sport, knows that injury news is always under-reported. For whatever reason, the coaches and organization don't feel the need to give any info out. The Bengals enver reported on Burrows already injured arm, Knicks fans had no idea what was goiung on with OG and Randle. Even Hockey, they jsut tell you upper body/lower body.
I'll take your word for it. I was against kneeling because I felt you were disrespecting veterans to show your disdain for cops, but once everyone started doing it I quit caring. I felt sorry for the veterans but that was about it.
I feel for Mark if he doesn't get to where he thinks he should be as coach.
he talks about the crushing weight of responsibility, I hope this has a happy ending for him
I would be tampering things down a bit if I were him - you just need to be moving in a positive trajectory. Don't take on everything in your first year
he talks about the crushing weight of responsibility, I hope this has a happy ending for him
I would be tampering things down a bit if I were him - you just need to be moving in a positive trajectory. Don't take on everything in your first year
I don't really like it either, and still don't. But I get why he did, and probably why he felt he needed to do it. And I also get that Pope, if confronted with this again, will probably do the same thing.
If Cal “gave up” the last few years and continued to cash fat checks then he is dispicable.
I think the key is only being 2 spots max... if you have a fairly solid roster of 11 guys, 2 late additions (NBA withdrawals or guys reclassifying) are icing on the cake.
For the NBA draft guys, it may be a major bonus to add. For guys reclassifying, it could add a huge piece to start building toward the future.
I bet Pope is going to weigh the long term and short term of it before he'd commit.
Its not to question what he ethically believes but he understands that as the coach he has an obligation to the program.
We don't even know if it's something he'd agree with the players on. But I think it's far too early to just assume he's going to really think hard on this and do so with the "obligation to the program". There also needs to be an obligation to the players, and if you're not careful with their values and viewpoints, all the sudden you're not getting recruits anymore.
For all the hang wringing that Cal got from the fans for kneeling.. nothing happened. Viewership and sales were fine. He probably made the smart decision to stand with his team.
I think Pope will be successful highly here and one of the best parts, this is his dream job. No worries about the Pros or another team snagging him, even if offered an incredible opportunity.
IMO kneeling is the most humble form of protest I can think of so if somebody thinks that is terrible then they must not agree with the right to protest unless they agree with the protesters. I still havn't figured out how it was about veterans except that some people said they were disrespecting veterans. Just to be clear I think peaceful protest against the government or any government agency is fine and our right, even for those who disagree with me.
what obligation does he have with the players that requires him to align to their political or social beliefs?
the underlying assumption here is that Cal was correct in his decision when you talk about the obligation he had to his players, but even he admitted he probably wouldn't do that again given the backlash, and secondly, a more astute coach would have discussed there is a time and a place to effectively protest, and if you strongly believe in that, then lets talk about using your platform in a way that brings about meaningful change. I mean seriously, nothing meaningful came from that moment except a bunch of UK fans and donors were upset at the team taking on a social commentary of injustice. People won't be talking about the brave stance of the UK players or the impact of the moment. Its largely forgotten among everyone except UK fans and the players involved.
Cal could have balanced his ties to the the players he represented and the obligation to the university.
Kneeling wasn't a binary option to bring about change. Its was an impulsive and poorly thought out response for a coach that wasn't prepared for the moment.
If you're kneeling because you're worried about losing future recruits...well I don't think I need to finish that thought.
So Reed will be anywhere from 8 to top 18. Still decent money but that doesn’t buy UK legend status he would have by giving us another year. Bringing UK out of the Cal dumpster fire to NCAA Tournament run would be epic for him and UK.
Biggest non issue ever, IMO. When I heard about it, I paid it zero attention but knew a segment of the fanbase would erupt in anger.
The only thing that was hurt by the kneeling were oversensitive feelings (ironically those with the most hurt feelings over this issue are the same people who like to call others soft or snowflake).
I personally stand, but don’t give a rat’s ass what anyone else does as long as they’re doing it lawfully without harming others or destroying property that doesn’t belong to them.
That was probably the first nail in Cal’s UK coffin for many because a) it happened during a losing season b) Cal didn’t back down from his stance c) this state likes its conservative politics more than its UK basketball.
Not disagreeing with you - just tagging in a couple of observations...
1. Cal did it because he is a weak politician type person. Not because he had any strong feeling either way - not out of respect or disrespect... just out of sheer weakness and trying to appease a fad.
2. He chose to do it at Florida, on their home floor... SUPER WEAK PUSS move, very disrespectful to Florida. Why not do it at your own home court? We all know the answer - and he always fooled himself into thinking it was a great chess/PR move and that he could control that, and other narratives.
Personally, even as a Vet, it's not close to the biggest reason I was over Cal. I stand, I salute, etc... but the anthem has been being disrespected more and more each year with just casual standing, staying seated, giving no respect for it. I get the posture of kneeling was in peaceful protest of... something... but overall being casual and disregarding is a trend that has been happening for a long time. Was it a line in the sand shift? Clearly for some - yes. But overall I just think it was one of many situations he handled poorly, then instead of any humility, thought he was above it. That trend of thinking he was above it all escalated to the final leaving over a weekend and moving his "same business - just a different location" mentality (Zero respect for UK - just HIM moving HIS business to a new location). He's learned nothing, and changed nothing.
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I think all coaches have SOME obligations to the players. And that was a very tumultuous time. I think Cal thought at the time it was a good idea, and probably a good BUSINESS idea to stand with his team, while he's going on in home recruiting visits.
The problem was, I don't think he realized how pissed off many of the fans would get, and that's probably why he regrets it now.
But yes, I do believe this was a pivotal moment in the relationship he had with the fans. Because to me, it sure seems he was fine losing games in the end because it was almost like a big "fu" to the fans that he became embattled with. I think the kneeling sort of snowballed from there.
We can pretend it meant nothing, but as we see in the political landscape now, many people refuse to even communicate with their opponents. So this was just something that fed into that.
Btw, Cal is part of this. While I think the fans dug their heels on some of this stuff, so did he. It was like one of those bad divorces where a couple is fighting over a lamp. He almost seemed to loathe BBN in the end, wanting to win, but only inspite of them. He's just as much to blame and I wish he would have just focused on coaching and let some of this shit go.
The flag and the anthem are big deals to veterans. If I felt strongly that taxation is theft, and wanted to protest, I'd do so outside a government building.
You tell the team that while they are representing the basketball team it is not their choice to make and they will stand up and respect the national flag. You also tell them if this is something they feel strongly about they can on a non game day do something charitable in furtherance of this cause. As their coach you should probably offer to help them set this up and or participate with them at that point.
That would be teaching them actually life skills of how to properly deal with situation like this in a professional manner.
There are literally folks here on RR calling for Mark's head if he DOESN'T take on everything.
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