A group of cells that is not conscious and can not feel pain and suffering is not a person.
POLL: Is there a God ??
- Thread starter megablue
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"Many lies", yet you can't explain why another religion is false and yours is real. You just can't. Try, I BEG OF YOU.
It is a human being. It is the first stage of being human. No human being has ever become a person without first going though that first stage.
You are ok with ceasing that first stage of being a human. There is a word for ceasing a human... murder. Semantics of person/human are ultiately irrelevant and just there for yout o skirt the issue.
I know mine is real and how that reality necessarily precludes the others from being real. I cannot demonstrate that reality to your or anyone else as I have already said.
But I was speaking more to the logic, the lack thereof of, of "your" statement. You are saying that since lies exist, truth cannot.
You're Godless so you won't understand.
Christianity is based on a risen savior Jesus, other religions are based on someone who is dead and never taught to be the resurrected Son of God.
Look I'm not going to change your mind because I can't only one who can change a person's heart doesn't mean we can't get along and have a beer sometime at a UK game.
Do hope you have that change of heart someday though. God loves you, hope one day you accept that.
This is only true depending on the person you ask. Christianity has many forms.
I don’t believe people that have never heard of God/Christ are doomed to hell, that’s ridiculous. I don’t know what happens to them but I don’t think God says, “sorry should’ve heard about me, off to hell with you.”
I also think that abortion should be legal and up to the person choosing, not anyone’s religion as we don’t live in a society that’s implicitly bound by religious law, they can make that decision for themselves and face any consequences from their decisions, much like everything else in life.
Why do you all think you get to choose for everyone the rules on abortion? Especially if you’re not going to put your money and a home for these children. You’re basically saying, nope doom this child to a miserable existence where it’s parents don’t even want it but hopefully the govt or some kind soul will properly take care of it, because I want it born but not going to help it at all isn’t doing anything but being “righteous” in your mind.
Furthermore, I don’t think you can murder and rape the world and then on your death bed say, “my bad, G, I believe in you and love you now let’s go to heaven big fella!”
The Bible literally says you have to have matching actions with your words and actions are way more judged upon than words.
You’re judged as a human imo. So if you’re saying no one should be allowed to have an abortion but I’m not helping any parentless children, well God sees through your talk and knows your actions.
What research has demonstrated that God’s existence is not a fact?
You are limiting science to studies and experiments? You don’t think science is also observation leading to understanding? I think you have incorrectly limited science.
Life is not defined by your use of the word “conscious” and, if you agree w/ abortion throughout the en utero life, people in the womb can feel pain.
Do you think God’s existence is limited to religions’ ability to define Him?
We also don't even know what consciousness even is.
People think of it as something like going to sleep, or being put under for surgery; one moment you are conscious, the next, you are not. That is "conscoiusness."
But to think of consciousness as such is completely nonsensical for where did it go? No, your consciousness necessarily must have continued to exist, and the moment of its creation must necessarily be at conception.
People think of it as something like going to sleep, or being put under for surgery; one moment you are conscious, the next, you are not. That is "conscoiusness."
But to think of consciousness as such is completely nonsensical for where did it go? No, your consciousness necessarily must have continued to exist, and the moment of its creation must necessarily be at conception.
Is the Bible foundational to your belief, Rogue? What role does it play in the formation of your religion?
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Tweak’s rationale for abortion is incredibly simplistic. If you pass out and lose consciousness and, therefore, cannot perceive pain, you must be life that can be killed. That is a scary bar to argue for abortion.
WildcatfaninOhio
All-American
As a person who has heard about your favorite god, but does not believe him to be real, I guess I’m doomed to that firey place you think is real. But if I had never heard of your favorite god, I’d be safe?
Please don’t ever try to convert nonbelievers. Some of them won’t believe, but will have heard about it, and YOU will cause them to suffer for eternity. You probably couldn’t live with yourself knowing you were the cause.
That's kind of the point. There's no research that can be done to prove/disprove God's existence that is also scientifically valid on a wide scale. Part of the reason I'm agnostic.
There you go putting words in my mouth again. Not once did I say anything about limiting science.
Well, then, we agree your post was wrong when you said “God's existence is not a fact however.” Because, as you admit with your words above, you cannot prove your statement and admit it cannot be proven.
And, I did not put words in your mouth. I guess I just made the mistake of relying upon your words as having meaning.
No, my statement was true. If you can't prove/disprove something then that thing is not factual.
My words never included limiting science so you did put words in my mouth, again.
🤦♂️ I simply asked you to prove your statement and you admitted you could not. If God exists, His existence is, by definition, a fact. You cannot prove He does not exist. So, your statement was incorrect.
You described “science” as experiments and peer reviewed research, or something to that end. Science is much more than that. Science, for example, is observing the incredible complex DNA strands of the most simple of living creatures.
Enjoy the rest of your Derby week.
My statement was that god’s existence isn’t a fact, which it isn’t. If it was, you could back it up with science and that would be widely accepted. It can’t however, that seems like simple enough proof of my statement, regardless of whether you like it or not.
I never said it wasn’t more than that, those were just the examples I used. I beg you to make it through one debate with someone without twisting their words and then ridiculing them about your version of their words after.
All I asked was for you to evince your statement. And, you cannot. It’s that simple. If God exists, His existence is a fact. If God does not exist, his existence is not a fact.
So, saying “God’s existence isn’t a fact” is something that must be proven, if you contend the statement is true. You are the one who made the statement. You are the one who cannot back it up. Saying that I cannot prove God’s existence is a fact is not proof that your statement is correct. That is illogical.
When I say “God’s existence is a fact,” you may challenge me in the same way. If I respond by saying your inability to prove God’s existence is not a fact is proof supporting my statement, you would rightfully call me on that.
I did not twist your words. You said what you said. Again, sorry I took you at your word. Seriously.
I can only say the same thing so many times before you acknowledge that you don’t get it. Please understand what a scientifically proven fact is and then compare that to how God’s existence is viewed. Those are not the same, do you want me to provide links to articles or something? If God’s existence was widely viewed as a scientific fact then what the hell is the point of faith?
You literally do this EVERY TIME we speak. And not only that, multiple people have called you on it in the past. You twist words then make the argument about your manipulation of other people’s points. I know you refuse to acknowledge that as well but it is a fact (pun intended).
If you don’t get that you cannot just state things as fact that you cannot prove, there is no way you will understand.
And, you making up that I twist your words like you are some sad message board victim does not make that a fact. Scientific or otherwise. Grow up.
lol calling me a victim, it’s like you can only say the same five times every time we interact on here.
Dude, you tap dance and blame others for your dumb comments more than anyone on this board. The Matteo rabbit hole, as you squirm and worm to avoid backing up your own words. Lol
People are religious due to fear factor. From an early age you're told if you don't believe in this, you'll go to a place where you suffer, burn, get tortued, and shown all kinds of images of your loved ones dying. It's bullet-proof. Humans have no idea what happens after death, so you scare em into believing something. It's a tried and true tactic. A very human creation, if you ask me, the bible and everything in it has the fingerprints of actual people. Not the son of a godly being. Look at covid, the rise of the nazis, cults, etc etc. The fear of the unknown is the basic human fear instinct. It's what all fears boil down too. Im agnostic, btw. So I am not immune to this fear either.
What always gets me is christians who laugh at ancient egyptian gods and native american spirits. But then turn around and do the same.
It's much more likely life is a simulation than a god made us. Our DNA looks like computer code if you ever break it down, btw.
What always gets me is christians who laugh at ancient egyptian gods and native american spirits. But then turn around and do the same.
It's much more likely life is a simulation than a god made us. Our DNA looks like computer code if you ever break it down, btw.
you have a tendency to try to call me on the exact things that you do, it’s laughable. We both know you’re smart enough to know what a scientific fact is, don’t sit here and try to say that God’s existence can be categorized as such.
My gosh, you twist, turn, and squirm. Scientific fact? This is what you said:
Your words. 🤦♂️
I didn’t say you were doomed to anything. I actually said it’s more important to be a good person in my opinion than a believer if you’re not going to believe. If you’re a bad person and non-believer I’d say you’re screwed.
And don’t worry, people that know me know my feelings in Jesus. I don’t proselytize to anyone that doesn’t ask.
Just answer the question, Rogue. I am trying to figure out what religion Roguism is. It appears to be what the Catholics used to call cafeteria Catholicism. What is the Bible to your faith?
Let’s say that human life in some stages does not matter, as you contest, when is abortion wrong?
It’s very important and sitting on my nightstand. I don’t believe it to not be full of fables, metaphors and analogies though that are used to express stories or morals.
To me, it doesn’t mean everything in it is God’s Word. You know why?
Because it’s been bastardized 1000x for 1000 men’s personal gains.
Very important books were taken out due to society at the time and its perception of things. Mary has a book, a bunch of people have books that aren’t counted in the “Bible” because it’s not what they wanted 1100 years ago or whatever.
This false premise is founded solely on your belief that you are right and there is no God. What a hypocritical position you have taken with such hubris.
Your statement is unprovable, Matteo. If you think otherwise, where is the evidence? Back it up.
There may be holy books that are not included in the Bible, but how does Rogue pick and choose what is fact and what he can ignore in scripture?
And, what did Jesus mean when he said, " I am the way, the truth, and the light, nobody can come to my Father except through me?” Is that quote you believe or reject?
We have very old manuscripts and many of them to demonstrate the accuracy of scripture as it existed. So, we don’t have to act as if it has been bastardized. The word is available.
Anything unprovable to you is just something that you refuse to believe or acknowledge. I’ve been telling you the same thing all day. God’s existence can’t be proven or disproven and because of that it can’t be a fact.
Facts, in contrast, have a very concrete nature to them in that you can prove them true time and time again. I struggle to understand why that statement requires me to provide me outside evidence for you to be proven correct. If you can’t accept that answer then quit asking.
Dumb contradiction. Think about that comment for a minute. Read my posts in this very discussion. I have faith and admit it. Wow.
Wrong. Facts are facts whether you realize them or not. We don’t know the true nature of worn holes, but that true nature exists. Facts don’t spring into being only when science catches up. It was a fact all along that the earth was round, even before we could prove it.
lol
Well I guess since you don’t want to let things go, I’ll just say agree to disagree. Sometimes I think about how much happier your life would be if you didn’t get on here and argue with strangers day in and day out.
