Pitino's 14-14 probation team never lost a conference home game.
- Thread starter Son_Of_Saul
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UMass Cal would destroy current Cal. We need to go find the current UMass Cal.
So what?
None of them were drafted. Hanson was the only one to play pro, earning 8 games of playing time with the Celtics as a favor from Pitino when he was with Boston.
Pitino said of that 1989-1990 team, ""It's the least amount of athleticism I've ever been associated with."
Again, it's weird that you're attempting to inflate the talent level on that team. The household names on that roster were still YEARS away from gaining the necessary experience that would turn them into the "unforgettables" a few seasons later.
You have to remember, we're talking about who they were in 1989-1990, not who they were in the Elite Eight game in 1992. In both cases, none of them were actual future pro players.
Look at the focus. It is a damn shame he could not keep it zipped. We’d had 2 or 3 more championships and they would have been talking P as the best not KdjgduibvnkklskiThe look of a man who put winning ahead of everything, because he tied his identity to winning:
Fair enough. but there's little chance that changes since guys don't stay 3 or 4 years anymore. Those guys would have slid a lot further down that list by now if guys were still playing 3-4 years in college like they used to. Besides, scoring 1000 pts in a college career in those days didn't necessarily make you the second coming. It more than likely meant you were a decent\solid player though.
Are you saying being in the top 45 career scorers at UK makes you a "decent/solid" player? I think it might mean a little more.
When Pitino came to Kentucky he was young and hungry. Got to a final four as a Cinderella. He came to UK not winning anything to speak of and he is probably the best coach we have ever had. Now because of Calipari our fans think we have to have some big name, we are UK by god. This isn’t that complicated, it isn’t calculus. Just hire someone who cares and isn’t a drunk. UK by name alone will get us players.
True about the SEC being better now, but UK should have evolved with the SEC, not moved behind other teams.
Think of it this way, back in the days of guys staying 4 years, 1000 pts means 250 per season. Let's say with regular season and tournament games they played 35 games per year. That would be an average of 7.14pts/gm over the course of that time. So, you really think that's earth-shattering in some way? I don't recall too many guys that I thought were great players that averaged 7pts/gm for their career. Maybe the player averages 2pts/gm in year 1, then 6, then 10 in year 3 and maybe 13 in year 4. Those are decent numbers, not great but certainly decent. I just don't think everyone in that top 45 was a "great" player, some got into that group just because of longevity. Don't get me wrong, I don't think too many of those guys were bad players either, in fact, I'd say they were all decent to great. But not all great.
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152 by 28 games is 5 minutes per game.
He isn’t lying. 5 minutes per game from walkons on a 14-14 team (no mop up minutes) is silly.
did that go the way you thought it was gonna go? Nope.
Cal's protege at UL went 4-28 last year lol. His coaching, or lack thereof, sucks.
And he went 6-17. Probably the worst records for both schools under Cal and his “coaching tree”
Put that same team in today's SEC with Pitino as coach and they'd be lucky to win 1 home game. This comparison is pointless. I think it's an absolute shame we lost back to back home games but this is 3 decades later and times have changed. That's not an excuse that's simple facts.
And yet, Chris Jackson (Soph.), Stanley Roberts (Soph.), and Shaq (Fr.), went 26-9, finished the season ranked 19th in the AP Poll, 3rd in the SEC, and couldn't beat a Kentucky team with only one future NBA player on it. Kentucky's leading scorer was a Senior (Derrick Miller, 19.2 ppg), followed by a junior, Reggie Hanson, the lone future NBA player on the roster (16.4 ppg), and primarily played one senior, one junior, four sophomores, and a freshman (Jeff Brassow). Pitino was doing it with older players.
To me, the fact that UK, with experienced players, was beating LSU, with young talent, shows how hard it is to win the underclassmen.
Cal's prerogative has always been to get the most talented athletes, with the highest ceiling, and hope that he can develop that talent in a year. It's really hard to take 18-year-olds and out-develop 22-24-year-olds. It's also not easy to take a fifth-year guy and mold him into a system that is different than what they were playing for the previous four years. Cal was a step ahead of the game with one-and-dones, but that system is not as valuable in the days of fifth- and sixth-year options for players.
Compare our roster and output with UCONN:
Tristen Newton - Leading scorer - fifth year senior, second year at UCONN - (15.6 ppg)
Cam Spencer - 2nd scorer - fifth year senior, first year at UCONN - (15.5 ppg)
Alex Karaban - 3rd - red-shirt soph., third year at UCONN - (14.2 ppg)
Donovan Clingan - 4th - sophomore, second year at UCONN - (12.6 ppg)
Stephon Castle - 5th - freshman (10.6 ppg).
UCONN's first freshman to show up in the stat sheet for ppg is fifth on their roster. The others have multiple years of college basketball.
Compare that with UK:
Antonio Reeves - 19.7 ppg
Rob Dillingham
Reed Sheppard
Tre Mitchell
DJ Wagner
Justin Edwards
This shows a couple things:
First, these are really good freshman. Even Justin Edwards, who was clearly overrated and should play a second year of college basketball, is the sixth leading scorer. However, if we were to play UCONN, we would probably lose 7/10 times, because the physicality and mentality that it takes to win at this level, against grown men, requires grown men.
Think about it, Tristen Newton and Cam Spencer have been developing their game at the college level since Tyrese Maxey was a freshman at UK. Maxey has been in the League for four years. To put it another way, Newton and Spencer have been playing college level basketball since Reed Sheppard was 15, DJ Wagner was 14, Dillingham was 14, and Justin Edwards was 15.
Obviously, those players have been developing their game over those 4+ years as well, but they haven't been playing high-level college basketball during that time.
My point is, Cal's system of one-and-dones works in a world where Kansas, Duke, UNC, etc., are all playing with the same hand. They were once all trying to get the best freshmen to come and play for them, and sprinkle in a couple of upperclassmen here and there. Now it is trying to sprinkle in one-and-dones with multi-year players, and not having freshmen as the face of the program.
The problem is, Cal won't change, and he cannot outcoach other top-tier coaches, and he can no longer out-talent teams as he has done in the past. If he could change one thing, he would be back to the top of the coaching game, and that would be to start recruiting players back for future seasons, instead of insisting on their exit for the NBA. I get it, if a player is a lottery lock, they should go, unless they have unfinished NCAA business. Otherwise, these fringe draft players should be recruited back for another year with urgency.
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He wouldn’t have lost a 14 point lead to Kansas and sure wouldn’t have let UT score ten points in out of bounds plays.
Yea and Cals SEC record other than last 3 years has been built on one of the weakest Conferences.
In 1993-1994, Pitino had the following roster:
Tony Delk (Soph.)
Rodrick Rhodes (Soph.)
Travis Ford (Sr.)
Jared Prickett (Soph.)
Andre Riddick (Jr.)
Jeff Brassow (Sr.)
Walter McCarty (Soph.)
Jeff Sheppard (Fr.)
- Pitino lost to #21 Indiana on a neutral floor
- @ Georgia, giving up 94 points, to a team that finished 14-16 overall, and 7-9 in conference
- @ Florida - Florida won the SEC East that year, finished 14th in AP Poll
- v. Arkansas at Rupp - Ark. won SEC West, NCAA Championship
- @ #14 Syracuse, giving up 93 points
Back to back losses
@ South Carolina, in the last SEC game of the year, to a team that finished 9-19, 4-12 in SEC
***By the way, in this game, Kentucky led South Carolina by 9 at halftime.
They did turn it around and win the SEC Tournament, but lost in the second round of the NCAA to Marquette, who finished 24-9, #21 in AP Poll
Pitino also coached losses. Pitino also gave up leads. Pitino is a better coach that Calipari, but he was not invincible.
I'd go back in a heartbeat and watch every one of that team's games over any of the games UK has played since 2015.
I agree, SEC has only been a top 3 conference in about half of Cals years here. Same concept applies though, you put this years UK team and have them play the probation teams SEC schedule and they go either undefeated or lose 1 game and win by 20+ majority of games. College basketballs landscape has changed a ton over 30+ years. It's not the same as it once was. Fans just seem to have a hard time realizing that.
Just as the 90s basketball was drastically different from the 50s and 60s so is 2020s basketball from the 80s and 90s. It's night and day different.
Its hilarious how debbie downers always want to compare todays game to college basketball in the 80's or 90's.
Its a completely different game, the 3 point line is much farther out because players are more better than they used to be, full court pressure is now a liability on defense, the 5 spot weren't guarding the perimeter or shooting 3's, point guards weren't 6'6 and as much as this will hurt...Richie Farmer wouldn't even see the floor today for any SEC program.
Its a completely different game, the 3 point line is much farther out because players are more better than they used to be, full court pressure is now a liability on defense, the 5 spot weren't guarding the perimeter or shooting 3's, point guards weren't 6'6 and as much as this will hurt...Richie Farmer wouldn't even see the floor today for any SEC program.
Wrote this in another post on Tuesday
I miss Kentucky basketball!
But, if you were around in 1988-89, it was the worst shape the program has ever been in my lifetime. There were comments like, will UK ever regain its status as a college basketball power. CM Newton picked the absolute best available to lead us out of the abyss in Rick Pitino and it did not take long.
Is there a “Pitino” out there today? Will our AD and administration find him?
CCC has definitely damaged the program, but it is not as bad as it was in the 1988-89 season. The star players left and these returning players beside Reggie Hanson had not really played prior to that season. As some were predicting that this team may not win a game all season, they went 14 and 14 and Big Blue Nation was so elated and loved these players and coaches. They were treated like they had won the National Championship. They are to this day one of my favorite UK teams. Big Blue Nation will support the next coach that proclaims proudly and loudly that he is here to put the program first and took the job only to work towards SEC regular, SEC tournament, and National Championships. If that is done, BBN will explode as Kentucky basketball will be back!
Hope this starts with the next season!
Oh and Antigua was terrible at USF. None of Cal’s coaching tree has averaged over .500😂
Not at all making a case for Cal, but even the OP knows the SEC was GARBAGE in the 90s (aside from Arkansas). There simply isn't an apples to apples comparison from that 14-14 team and today just due to the fact that the SEC is a totally different animal now vs. then.
It's best to just look at season stats and end of year results between Cal and Pitino at UK. Then it becomes obvious Pitino was and probably still is a better overall game coach.
It's best to just look at season stats and end of year results between Cal and Pitino at UK. Then it becomes obvious Pitino was and probably still is a better overall game coach.
That team was also very good as they had Rodney Dent at center. But when he went down, so did our chances of winning it all. I would say Rick had a lot less talent than Cal but did way more with it.
Nice narrative pics don't lie nicely doneThe look of a man who put draft picks ahead of winning, because he tied his identity to his NBA draft legacy:
That's the thing that pisses me off.
Cal can coach. He took over a UMASS team that won like 3 games in 2 seasons and shortly had them in the NCAAT. Before Camby. So a bunch of 3 star players.
The man could coach at one time. He just cares about recruiting 5 stars and NBA draft picks now.
He warned us all in 2012 after they won the title. He made a comment that he was glad that was out of the way and people could stop worrying about titles now .
The look of a man who put draft picks ahead of winning, because he tied his identity to his NBA draft legacy:
Couldn't make it there as a head coach so found an alternative route to attach himself to the NBA.
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