Oregon and Kentucky

[AshWilliams]

Oregon and UK are essentially the same net worth and UK has more revenue. How are they a football power and we are not?

Who would rather go play on the left coast in the cold rain in Suicide Country rather than Horse Country?

We're not doing it right.

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/19/college-sports-programs-valuations.html

17.	University of Oregon	$780M	$151M	Big Ten	Eugene, OR	public
18.	University of Arkansas	$776M	$167M	SEC	Fayetteville, AR	public
19.	University of Kentucky	$775M	$174M	SEC	Lexington, KY	public

 

[Grumpyolddawg]

Oregon and UK are essentially the same net worth and UK has more revenue. How are they a football power and we are not?

Who would rather go play on the left coast in the cold rain in Suicide Country rather than Horse Country?

We're not doing it right.

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/19/college-sports-programs-valuations.html

17.	University of Oregon	$780M	$151M	Big Ten	Eugene, OR	public
18.	University of Arkansas	$776M	$167M	SEC	Fayetteville, AR	public
19.	University of Kentucky	$775M	$174M	SEC	Lexington, KY	public

Because Knight is 86 years old, has a personal net worth of 46B+ and told Lanning he wants to see a NC. To do what it takes and it was covered.

 

[optimus-blue]

Nike

 

[Rockfly78]

Culture.

Not everything is about money. Since the two schools are so similar why isn’t Oregon a basketball power while Kentucky is? Culture

 

[BigBlueFever]

Oregon and UK are essentially the same net worth and UK has more revenue. How are they a football power and we are not?

Who would rather go play on the left coast in the cold rain in Suicide Country rather than Horse Country?

We're not doing it right.

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/19/college-sports-programs-valuations.html

17.	University of Oregon	$780M	$151M	Big Ten	Eugene, OR	public
18.	University of Arkansas	$776M	$167M	SEC	Fayetteville, AR	public
19.	University of Kentucky	$775M	$174M	SEC	Lexington, KY	public

I absolutely love Lexington, but I think you're underselling the Northwest. If you haven't been out there, it's beautiful country. I'm a UK graduate, but Eugene would be a really cool place to go to school.

 

[Wildcat40229]

Oregon was bad to middle of the road until Phil Knight got involved. Brooks was there for 18 years and his best record was 8-4, but mostly at or below .500. There's no way a coach would survive there now, with that track record.

 

[PopesReignOverCardinals]

Oregon and UK are essentially the same net worth and UK has more revenue. How are they a football power and we are not?

Who would rather go play on the left coast in the cold rain in Suicide Country rather than Horse Country?

We're not doing it right.

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/19/college-sports-programs-valuations.html

17.	University of Oregon	$780M	$151M	Big Ten	Eugene, OR	public
18.	University of Arkansas	$776M	$167M	SEC	Fayetteville, AR	public
19.	University of Kentucky	$775M	$174M	SEC	Lexington, KY	public

Program valuation is a made-up thing. It's based on one guy's methodology that assumes all metrics used are equal across all programs.

Phil Knight alone could put Oregon at #1.

 

[gamecockcat]

They have the enormous booster who is a football fan worth $46B as someone above posted. We don't. I would guess a large percentage of our richest boosters are basketball fans. Big difference. I know UK's facilities are very nice but Oregon's are the Taj Mahal. Unbelievable. Plus, even before they started winning big consistently, they played a more interesting style of football, had the multiple jersey looks before anyone else, multiple helmets, etc. Big money made their program cool and they've capitalized on that. Didn't hurt that their rise coincided with USC's fall and now some of the really good CA HS players wind up in Eugene not in Los Angeles (USC's campus, IIRC, borders on some really sketchy areas of LA).

 

[hmt5000]

Program valuation is a made-up thing. It's based on one guy's methodology that assumes all metrics used are equal across all programs.

Phil Knight alone could put Oregon at #1.

Texas is #1. Their endowment fund is insane. I think only Harvard and Princeton have similar endowments.... But they'd be top 5 with Knight going all in.

 

[AshWilliams]

I absolutely love Lexington, but I think you're underselling the Northwest. If you haven't been out there, it's beautiful country. I'm a UK graduate, but Eugene would be a really cool place to go to school.

I have been out there. It rains constantly.

 

[AshWilliams]

Texas is #1. Their endowment fund is insane. I think only Harvard and Princeton have similar endowments.... But they'd be top 5 with Knight going all in.

So, endowment funds aren't included in revenue? Because UK has much more revenue.

 

[PopesReignOverCardinals]

Texas is #1. Their endowment fund is insane. I think only Harvard and Princeton have similar endowments.... But they'd be top 5 with Knight going all in.

That's the entire University of Texas system that includes schools outside of UT-Austin, but Texas A&M and UT-Austin are still enormous on their own. I think the original article is talking only about athletic departments, so it wouldn't be inclusive of the overall endowment number.

Phil Knight could theoretically leave all of his money to the University of Oregon Athletic Department if he wanted to do so. I'm not aware of wealthier person that is as heavily invested in a single college sports program than he is. T. Boone Pickens was only worth about $3 billion at his peak, and Phil Knight is 10x that.

 

[PopesReignOverCardinals]

So, endowment funds aren't included in revenue? Because UK has much more revenue.

Endowments specifically held for the athletic department would be, but not the entire university's endowment.

 

[bthaunert]

I lived in Eugene and worked at the University of Oregon for 8 years. It is beautiful out there and a beautiful campus, I would move back there in a heartbeat.

Oregon has been an “it” program since the mid 90’s. They sucked for years….didn’t make a bowl game for 23 years before making one in 1989. The uniforms started it, then the investment in the facilities, the unique marketing of the program, the up-tempo style and finally the financial investment.

They invested in football and were creative in the way the my did it.

 

[ManitouDan]

Oregon is a Ferrari , Ky is a Pacer .... in terms of cars . Ok ok Ky is a Ford F-150

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Nike and they dont play an sec schedule. Its really that simple.

Our fans, and others, completely under appreciate the grind if an sec schedule. Playing the biggest and best week in and out wears down your players and tests your depth. Other conferences dont have to deal with that.

 

[ManitouDan]

Nike and they dont play an sec schedule. Its really that simple.

Our fans, and others, completely under appreciate the grind if an sec schedule. Playing the biggest and best week in and out wears down your players and tests your depth. Other conferences dont have to deal with that.

I think today it's like that , 6-8 years ago not so much . Maybe I'm wrong , seems like the SEC has really gotten so much deeper the past 5 years . Better. overall coaches , players . We missed the boat not going a different direction than Stoops . We chose a work horse in a race horse league .

 

[Edgarman]

Oregon and UK are essentially the same net worth and UK has more revenue. How are they a football power and we are not?

Who would rather go play on the left coast in the cold rain in Suicide Country rather than Horse Country?

We're not doing it right.

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/19/college-sports-programs-valuations.html

17.	University of Oregon	$780M	$151M	Big Ten	Eugene, OR	public
18.	University of Arkansas	$776M	$167M	SEC	Fayetteville, AR	public
19.	University of Kentucky	$775M	$174M	SEC	Lexington, KY	public

As an old retired financial advisor, "it not always how much you make but how you spend it." Football at Oregon gets a higher percent of revenue than football does at KY. Basketball at KY gets a larger percent than basketball at Oregon. Most schools think basketball is a lesser important sport than KY. The football coaching staff at UK is way way overpaid.

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Investment firms are seeking ways to purchase interests in college athletic programs. The connection between academics and athletics is more tenuous than ever. The place it may be growing is in the way schools are building marketing classrooms, production classrooms, and agency classrooms around their athletic programs. Getting the classroom connected to one of the biggest industries in the country is probably a positive for academics. Otherwise, this partnership continues to confound.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

I think today it's like that , 6-8 years ago not so much . Maybe I'm wrong , seems like the SEC has really gotten so much deeper the past 5 years . Better. overall coaches , players . We missed the boat not going a different direction than Stoops . We chose a work horse in a race horse league .

It's basically been that way his entire tenure. The only thing that changed is there are no more easy games. Now even vandy is tough and physical. In many ways, you could say stoops started the elevation of the sec from the best to truly unprecedented.

I know you hate stoops but really hes uks best chance in this current environment. The core staff gives us the best chance to punch up in an nil world where we are behind and will always be behind. Ya winning with defense and physical run game isnt sexy, but its still winning.

We should expect 4-6 win seasons as baseline. There will be ups and downs depending in recruiting development and portal that year. Thats just reality.

The only other coach that would be comparable and have comparable stability would be summrall. Beyond that, any hire is a major risk and any success

 

[ManitouDan]

It's basically been that way his entire tenure. The only thing that changed is there are no more easy games. Now even vandy is tough and physical. In many ways, you could say stoops started the elevation of the sec from the best to truly unprecedented.

I know you hate stoops but really hes uks best chance in this current environment. The core staff gives us the best chance to punch up in an nil world where we are behind and will always be behind. Ya winning with defense and physical run game isnt sexy, but its still winning.

We should expect 4-6 win seasons as baseline. There will be ups and downs depending in recruiting development and portal that year. Thats just reality.

The only other coach that would be comparable and have comparable stability would be summrall. Beyond that, any hire is a major risk and any success

Maybe so .. if .. IF , sell out to the run .. do the wishbone or whatever . Have our flagship be a totally run dominated offense .. forget trying to pass 30 times a game . Forget " balance" do something others dont do and have trouble preparing for .. in the run game .

 

[CatPatrick13]

The football coaching staff at UK is way way overpaid.

You got that right brother.

 

[CatPatrick13]

[QUOTE="gamecockcat, post: 13414868, member: 3264"
(USC's campus, IIRC, borders on some really sketchy areas of LA).
[/QUOTE]
This is correct. Very urban and lousy crime rate outside of campus.

 

[FirewithFire]

Like many others have said, the answer is NIKE. You cannot overstate how important it is to have a popular company like Nike in your corner. Oregon gets all of the new Unis, shoes, helmets, tech, and color combos before anyone else. The most important thing that they get, however, is the benefit of Nike advertising specifically for them. Think about how many kids wear Nikes, then think about how advertising affects youth choices. Oregon instant win.

I think that it's ironic that Brooks sparked Oregon's rise from the dirt. He did the same here for UK, but in typical UK fashion they botched the resurrection. We have the money. We have the fans. What we don't have are football minded admins.

 

[truebluewildcat]

Good football culture and decision making.

Yes Phil Knight helps but if all it took was a rich billionaire then a lot of other programs would be better than what they are. He’s not nearly the richest alumni out there. I’ve discussed in other threads about how richest individual alumni and alumni bases don’t really determine athletic success like folks think. It’s a convenient excuse. Blame the rich guy or lack there of.

It doesn’t take a lot of effort to look up richest alumni bases and individuals to see there’s only a couple of big successful sports schools on the list. Texas, Michigan, USC…and how many titles do they have? One or two each in modern history. All three have been down for a majority of the last 20-25 years.

Chip Kelly has a lot to do with it. That was a great hire. Unconventional guy from off the beaten path given the keys and okay to do what he did.

Dan Lanning is obviously another great hire.

Ducks are a national brand/platform and can recruit anywhere but there’s a lot of talent out west, up and down the PNW, and big mountain/sky country.

Both Kelly and Lanning are not only good coaches and recruiters, they put together good staffs too.

 

[bthaunert]

Good football culture and decision making.

Yes Phil Knight helps but if all it took was a rich billionaire then a lot of other programs would be better than what they are. He’s not nearly the richest alumni out there. I’ve discussed in other threads about how richest individual alumni and alumni bases don’t really determine athletic success like folks think. It’s a convenient excuse. Blame the rich guy or lack there of.

It doesn’t take a lot of effort to look up richest alumni bases and individuals to see there’s only a couple of big successful sports schools on the list. Texas, Michigan, USC…and how many titles do they have? One or two each in modern history. All three have been down for a majority of the last 20-25 years.

Chip Kelly has a lot to do with it. That was a great hire. Unconventional guy from off the beaten path given the keys and okay to do what he did.

Dan Lanning is obviously another great hire.

Ducks are a national brand/platform and can recruit anywhere but there’s a lot of talent out west, up and down the PNW, and big mountain/sky country.

Both Kelly and Lanning are not only good coaches and recruiters, they put together good staffs too.

Funny Chip Kelly story. I had accepted the job at Oregon back in the summer of 2007 while working at Penn. A few weeks before I left, I played golf with a good friend who brought a friend along. He was the OC at a D III school in NJ called Rowan University. He says to me, “I hear you’re going to Oregon. They just hired my buddy Chip Kelly from New Hampshire as their OC. He’s going to change college football.”

Dude wasn’t wrong. What a brilliant hire. I was there until 2016. Talk about a great time to be there.

 

[BlueRaider22]

#1 - Nike/Phil Knight money

#2 - Draw a 800 mile radius around each school. Which one has more schools to compete against in terms of recruiting, etc.

#3 - Competition - Historically, how competitive has the SEC been on a national level compared to the PAC12? Like Saban said recently in regards to the 12 team playoff, "If 9-3 Ole Miss played in any other conference outside the SEC/BIG10, they'd likely be undefeated and in the playoffs."

#4 - Allocation - I might be reaching here, but different schools allocate more funds to different areas. For example, I would be willing to bet that UK allocates much more money from donors/revenue to the basketball program than Oregon does. And you could even say this relative to other conference opponents.....for example, I'd bet that Oregon might have been one of the greatest spenders on football while they were in the PAC12. Whereas Kentucky likely ranks in the bottom 1/3rd of spenders on football in the SEC.

 

[TNCatfanforever]

I absolutely love Lexington, but I think you're underselling the Northwest. If you haven't been out there, it's beautiful country. I'm a UK graduate, but Eugene would be a really cool place to go to school.

If you haven’t traveled in Oregon don’t trash it. Beautiful area.

 

[Grumpyolddawg]

Texas is #1. Their endowment fund is insane. I think only Harvard and Princeton have similar endowments.... But they'd be top 5 with Knight going all in.

Texas endowment is misleading, it's for the UT system. I am sure UT Austin provides the vast majority but it isn't just one schools. Stanford is also in the ballpark and could be more than just UT Austin.

Harvard must have some of the Oak Island treasure as they are the largest by a good bit.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Texas endowment is misleading, it's for the UT system. I am sure UT Austin provides the vast majority but it isn't just one schools. Stanford is also in the ballpark and could be more than just UT Austin.

Harvard must have some of the Oak Island treasure as they are the largest by a good bit.

Iirc a&m is tops or close to the top.

 

[satcheluk]

Oregon and UK are essentially the same net worth and UK has more revenue. How are they a football power and we are not?

Who would rather go play on the left coast in the cold rain in Suicide Country rather than Horse Country?

We're not doing it right.

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/19/college-sports-programs-valuations.html

17.	University of Oregon	$780M	$151M	Big Ten	Eugene, OR	public
18.	University of Arkansas	$776M	$167M	SEC	Fayetteville, AR	public
19.	University of Kentucky	$775M	$174M	SEC	Lexington, KY	public

Seriously? Ever hear of Phil Knight and his $1B+ in donations to the school? They have more NIL money than any other team and it isn't even close., not to mention that they can divert money to athletics because he also donates huge to the school's other areas of need. Just donated $500mm recently.

 

[satcheluk]

So, endowment funds aren't included in revenue? Because UK has much more revenue.

Do you include your income in your savings column?

 

[satcheluk]

#1 - Nike/Phil Knight money

#2 - Draw a 800 mile radius around each school. Which one has more schools to compete against in terms of recruiting, etc.

#3 - Competition - Historically, how competitive has the SEC been on a national level compared to the PAC12? Like Saban said recently in regards to the 12 team playoff, "If 9-3 Ole Miss played in any other conference outside the SEC/BIG10, they'd likely be undefeated and in the playoffs."

#4 - Allocation - I might be reaching here, but different schools allocate more funds to different areas. For example, I would be willing to bet that UK allocates much more money from donors/revenue to the basketball program than Oregon does. And you could even say this relative to other conference opponents.....for example, I'd bet that Oregon might have been one of the greatest spenders on football while they were in the PAC12. Whereas Kentucky likely ranks in the bottom 1/3rd of spenders on football in the SEC.

The donors choose the allocation, hence Stoops, Cal etc complaining about the inordinate amount of time they have to spend fundraising. These coaches cultivate the donor relationships individually, so they are donating to a program except for the occasional generic athletic department donation.

 

[satcheluk]

Texas endowment is misleading, it's for the UT system. I am sure UT Austin provides the vast majority but it isn't just one schools. Stanford is also in the ballpark and could be more than just UT Austin.

Harvard must have some of the Oak Island treasure as they are the largest by a good bit.

Rank	Institution name	FY23 endowment market value	Change %
1	Harvard University	$49,495,108	0.1
2	University of Texas System	$44,967,186	5.4
3	Yale University	$40,746,900	-1.5
4	Stanford University	$36,495,000	0.4
5	The Trustees of Princeton University	$34,058,774	-4.8
6	Massachusetts Institute of Technology	$23,453,446	-5.2
7	Trustees of the University of Pennsylvania	$20,962,965	1.2
8	The Texas A&M University System & Related Foundations	$19,285,472	5.7
9	University of Michigan	$17,875,691	3.0
10	The Regents of the University of California	$17,689,324	14.7
11	University of Notre Dame	$16,616,524	-0.7
12	Northwestern University	$13,699,895	-3.0
13	Trustees of Columbia University	$13,642,667	2.7
14	Duke University	$13,237,963	9.3
15	Washington University	$11,467,279	-6.4
16	The Johns Hopkins University	$10,538,865	27.8
17	Emory University	$10,239,776	2.4
18	Cornell University	$10,035,558	2.0
19	The University of Chicago	$9,869,725	-0.5
20	University of Virginia	$9,799,870	-0.6

 

[R.O.T.Muckinfush]

Oregon and UK are essentially the same net worth and UK has more revenue. How are they a football power and we are not?

Who would rather go play on the left coast in the cold rain in Suicide Country rather than Horse Country?

We're not doing it right.

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/19/college-sports-programs-valuations.html

17.	University of Oregon	$780M	$151M	Big Ten	Eugene, OR	public
18.	University of Arkansas	$776M	$167M	SEC	Fayetteville, AR	public
19.	University of Kentucky	$775M	$174M	SEC	Lexington, KY	public

Dumb post. Have you ever been to the west coast?

 

[MrHotDice]

I absolutely love Lexington, but I think you're underselling the Northwest. If you haven't been out there, it's beautiful country. I'm a UK graduate, but Eugene would be a really cool place to go to school.

If you think everyone in California is nuts well the left coast of Oregon and Washington are all bat shit crazy Portland is full of dangerous people and makes San Francisco look like Disnay World. Eugene may be fine but Portland is the home of the greatest sales of women buying bear spray and mace in America for a reason

 

[Grumpyolddawg]

Iirc a&m is tops or close to the top.

According to wikki, A&M is a little less than half of Texas, not sure who the first one is. Both dwarfs UGA's.

Rank	Institution name	FY23 endowment market value	Change %
1	Harvard University	$49,495,108	0.1
2	University of Texas System	$44,967,186	5.4
3	Yale University	$40,746,900	-1.5
4	Stanford University	$36,495,000	0.4
5	The Trustees of Princeton University	$34,058,774	-4.8
6	Massachusetts Institute of Technology	$23,453,446	-5.2
7	Trustees of the University of Pennsylvania	$20,962,965	1.2
8	The Texas A&M University System & Related Foundations	$19,285,472	5.7
9	University of Michigan	$17,875,691	3.0
10	The Regents of the University of California	$17,689,324	14.7
11	University of Notre Dame	$16,616,524	-0.7
12	Northwestern University	$13,699,895	-3.0
13	Trustees of Columbia University	$13,642,667	2.7
14	Duke University	$13,237,963	9.3
15	Washington University	$11,467,279	-6.4
16	The Johns Hopkins University	$10,538,865	27.8
17	Emory University	$10,239,776	2.4
18	Cornell University	$10,035,558	2.0
19	The University of Chicago	$9,869,725	-0.5
20	University of Virginia	$9,799,870	-0.6

Yeah, I am sure most of the A&M and Texas funds are from the main schools, but it also has to maintain the systems. I know Stanford's is from tech, but where is all that ivy league money coming from, just being near 300 years old?.

 

[Girthang]

Oregon was bad to middle of the road until Phil Knight got involved. Brooks was there for 18 years and his best record was 8-4, but mostly at or below .500. There's no way a coach would survive there now, with that track record.

And a lot of the reason a coach wouldn't is what Brooks did.

Best season was 9-3 regular season. 7-1 conference record. Pac10 champion. 9-4 with loss to #2 PSU in rose bowl.

9 of 18 seasons at or above .500
3 Seasons of 8 or more wins.

Won the PAC10 after a rough 3 year stretch.

 

[Girthang]

Like many others have said, the answer is NIKE. You cannot overstate how important it is to have a popular company like Nike in your corner. Oregon gets all of the new Unis, shoes, helmets, tech, and color combos before anyone else. The most important thing that they get, however, is the benefit of Nike advertising specifically for them. Think about how many kids wear Nikes, then think about how advertising affects youth choices. Oregon instant win.

Exactly. Yuuuge. It's what Gatorade did for UF for decades. Best thing we could hope for is to recruit and land a huge sports product/marketing Co here in KY.

I think that it's ironic that Brooks sparked Oregon's rise from the dirt. He did the same here for UK, but in typical UK fashion they botched the resurrection.

It's both cool and sad at the same time.

We have the money. We have the fans. What we don't have are football minded admins.

We have the money to compete in the old pac10. We don't have the money or commitment from the fans, boosters, and admin to win the SEC. We don't have football minded fans. We have some. Most don't or can't look at UK Football objectively because of their basketball mindset.

We also don't allocate enough money to football recruiting and we can't just hop on a private jet to recruit the best QB, OL, WR, or other position player in the country.

 

[CRZ4UK]

I lived in Eugene and worked at the University of Oregon for 8 years. It is beautiful out there and a beautiful campus, I would move back there in a heartbeat.

Oregon has been an “it” program since the mid 90’s. They sucked for years….didn’t make a bowl game for 23 years before making one in 1989. The uniforms started it, then the investment in the facilities, the unique marketing of the program, the up-tempo style and finally the financial investment.

They invested in football and were creative in the way the my did it.

So you are saying they did everything our AD won’t do.
Barnhart would hide under his desk for a week if asked to up the Cool factor at UK.