Only thing that bothered me last night

[Aike]

Were the hustle plays. 50/50 balls.

We would have overcome putrid shooting and bad refs if our effort had matched or exceeded Clemson’s.

Wasn’t the worst I’ve ever seen, and the second half was better than the first.

I had this modeled as pretty close to a pick ‘em, so a 4 point loss was far from the end of the world. The important thing is do we learn from it?

Long season full of hot and cold streaks, but effort is non-negotiable.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

Maybe it was lack of hustle.. but it sort of seemed like we just didn't have that extra athleticism to GET those loose balls. I saw a lot of mistakes that made me think "De'Aaron Fox wouldn't have allowed that ball to get far" or "Randle would have cleaned up that board".

I can't help but feeling like I was watching a mid-major team out there. a VERY good mid-major team.. likeable, good basketball players.. but just a team thats kind of meh. I think we've had some past UK teams where not a single player on this team would start for (or at best, maybe 1 guy).

 

[The_Answer1313]

I'm always cautious when it comes to things like effort and desire.

It's like yeah there was a bunch of 50/50 balls and they all seemed to go Clemson's way. Was it because Clemson wanted it more? Maybe. Or maybe they just got lucky.

I don't know. Given the fact it was our first road game, the crowd, everything........it would be very alarming to me if the team couldn't get up for that. I just think we played poorly. Shots weren't falling, we were careless with the ball and especially in the first half Clemson got a ton of offensive boards.

I think if we lacked effort, this is a 15 point Clemson win.

Nothing coming into today suggested this was a lazy team or one that wasn't going to give 100%. We were down double digits to Duke and fought back.

Even last night, we go on that first half run, they respond by going on a 14-2 run i think it was. We battled back from that. Even at the end......Oweh had two good looks at the 3. We were on our way to coming back and if one of those drops, who knows.

I thought we fought even to the end.

 

[Aike]

Maybe it was lack of hustle.. but it sort of seemed like we just didn't have that extra athleticism to GET those loose balls. I saw a lot of mistakes that made me think "De'Aaron Fox wouldn't have allowed that ball to get far" or "Randle would have cleaned up that board".

I can't help but feeling like I was watching a mid-major team out there. a VERY good mid-major team.. likeable, good basketball players.. but just a team thats kind of meh. I think we've had some past UK teams where not a single player on this team would start for (or at best, maybe 1 guy).

That guy who grabbed 20 boards was super athletic.

 

[chroix]

That guy who grabbed 20 boards was super athletic.

A big non athletic dude that knows how to use his weight and leverage doesn’t have to be super athletic to make an impact down low. Chuck Hayes might be the best example.

 

[chroix]

I didn’t like how casual Garrison and Kriisa seemed with the ball early in the game. I’m also ready for Williams to sack up and stop looking so fragile when things go south. You’re a giant, big fella. Go ahead and act like one.

 

[moses1uk]

Pope pooped the bed last night looks like a personnel issue that cant be fixed

 

[B.B.H.]

A big non athletic dude that knows how to use his weight and leverage doesn’t have to be super athletic to make an impact down low. Chuck Hayes might be the best example.

Or the stinking Sheffeler kid that did that to us last night

 

[The_Answer1313]

Let's be honest tho, that guy can rebound. He's done it the last four seasons.

His defensive rebounding % last year was 26.5%. That's good for 26th nationally.
His offensive rebounding % was 12.2%. 84th nationally.

Maybe dude is just good at rebounding.

 

[Aike]

I'm always cautious when it comes to things like effort and desire.

It's like yeah there was a bunch of 50/50 balls and they all seemed to go Clemson's way. Was it because Clemson wanted it more? Maybe. Or maybe they just got lucky.

I don't know. Given the fact it was our first road game, the crowd, everything........it would be very alarming to me if the team couldn't get up for that. I just think we played poorly. Shots weren't falling, we were careless with the ball and especially in the first half Clemson got a ton of offensive boards.

I think if we lacked effort, this is a 15 point Clemson win.

Nothing coming into today suggested this was a lazy team or one that wasn't going to give 100%. We were down double digits to Duke and fought back.

Even last night, we go on that first half run, they respond by going on a 14-2 run i think it was. We battled back from that. Even at the end......Oweh had two good looks at the 3. We were on our way to coming back and if one of those drops, who knows.

I thought we fought even to the end.

Didn’t say we weren’t up for it. Thought Clemson was more amped up than us and maintained pretty well.

I’ve played a lot of games and watched a lot more. Even coached a few. Like to think I recognize when we are getting outhustled.

Yeah we fought, but we were fighting uphill. I think that was our own doing.

 

[Emarc]

Missed free throws irk me. Seen us lose too many games at the line.

 

[fatguy87]

Even last night, we go on that first half run, they respond by going on a 14-2 run i think it was. We battled back from that. Even at the end......Oweh had two good looks at the 3. We were on our way to coming back and if one of those drops, who knows.

We had a number of wide open looks from three in the last quarter of the game that felt like they would have propelled us to victory if they went in.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

That guy who grabbed 20 boards was super athletic.

I can't argue that lol. But the fact remains, there is a reason a lot of these guys are still playing college and were on mid majors or lesser P5 programs as bit players. Like Kerr for example, can't stay in front of anyone. Half the guys can't shoot free throws, no one can create their own shot. Carr getting bullied in the paint a lot. I saw a lot of those 50/50 balls that we almost got, but I suspect the deciding factor wasn't a lack of hustle, but a lack of ability. It's why Cal for being such a bad actual coach, was able to win games: athleticism and sheer talent is still a big factor.

 

[The_Answer1313]

I'm like 1 min into Pope's presser after the game...

"I was proud of our guys effort"

 

[WeWant9]

Missed free throws irk me. Seen us lose too many games at the line.

That’s a big concern for me with this current team.

 

[Aike]

I can't argue that lol. But the fact remains, there is a reason a lot of these guys are still playing college and were on mid majors or lesser P5 programs as bit players. Like Kerr for example, can't stay in front of anyone. Half the guys can't shoot free throws, no one can create their own shot. Carr getting bullied in the paint a lot. I saw a lot of those 50/50 balls that we almost got, but I suspect the deciding factor wasn't a lack of hustle, but a lack of ability. It's why Cal for being such a bad actual coach, was able to win games: athleticism and sheer talent is still a big factor.

We got them against Duke after we ran them in the ground.

End of the day, all of these guys will have to look in the mirror and decide if they gave it 100%. Even something like 95% won’t cut it for this team in the biggest games.

I’m not worried. Just taking notes. If anything, if I’m Chandler/Travis/Noah this week I’m diving on every loose ball in practice. Their time may come sooner than we think.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

I do also think our guys were not ready for this, for what it's worth. I think they were shell shocked by the environment. I think the calls got to them. I think they were struggling with Clemson's defense. They definitely were not on their A game.

 

[Emarc]

I do also think our guys were not ready for this, for what it's worth. I think they were shell shocked by the environment. I think the calls got to them. I think they were struggling with Clemson's defense. They definitely were not on their A game.

Amen.

 

[Aike]

I'm like 1 min into Pope's presser after the game...

"I was proud of our guys effort"

Welp, ya got me. They must not have gotten out hustled at all.

Or maybe…they were getting out hustled and stepped it up.

Pope isn’t going to dwell on negatives. Not his style. That’s what message boards are for.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

We got them against Duke after we ran them in the ground.

End of the day, all of these guys will have to look in the mirror and decide if they have it 100%. Even something like 95% won’t cut it for this team in the biggest games.

I’m not worried. Just taking notes. If anything, if I’m Chandler/Travis/Noah this week I’m diving on every loose ball in practice. Their time may come sooner than we think.

IDK what to make of our game against Duke, and I'm not sure it's really the tell-tale sign of who we are.

Duke was young, AND pretty inexperienced with each other. It was just as new of a team together, sans Proctor and another guy. Their coaching is suspect, certainly worse than Pope IMO. And they lost bodies down the stretch. I really can't take much from that Duke game, seeing as how dicey we've looked since. I think Duke lost that game as much as we won.

 

[Aike]

I do also think our guys were not ready for this, for what it's worth. I think they were shell shocked by the environment. I think the calls got to them. I think they were struggling with Clemson's defense. They definitely were not on their A game.

Yes. First true road game. Hostile environment against a tournament level team with a bullseye on your back for the first time. Hopefully a good learning experience.

 

[Aike]

IDK what to make of our game against Duke, and I'm not sure it's really the tell-tale sign of who we are.

Duke was young, AND pretty inexperienced with each other. It was just as new of a team together, sans Proctor and another guy. Their coaching is suspect, certainly worse than Pope IMO. And they lost bodies down the stretch. I really can't take much from that Duke game, seeing as how dicey we've looked since. I think Duke lost that game as much as we won.

We haven’t looked dicey. Not sure what you’ve been watching.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

We haven’t looked dicey. Not sure what you’ve been watching.

Maybe more so poor shooting since Duke. But the two prior games we did let the opponent hang around. It just looked a little like teams were starting to figure us out, and it's what me think we'd go 1-1 (per the other thread) over the next two games.

Edit: my bad, the last two games, not all the games since Duke. IDK why I thought there was only 2 games after Duke.

 

[FitchandMurray29]

Hustling is such an interesting point. The Zackery kid really symbolized it for the night.

He was the beneficiary to a number of hustle call/no-calls that incorrectly went in his favor significantly. I think that would’ve helped the energy/hustle perception as those plays popped.

My interesting stat that seals the deal on the loss.

We had 7 possessions in the last 4:30 of the game. We missed 6 3s total in those trips down the floor. Won’t win any competitive/toss-up type games when we have that happen.

 

[BlueWorldOrder74]

Have to agree. I posted numerous times that our energy and hustle just wasn’t there for long stretches.

 

[ukcatz12]

Maybe it was lack of hustle.. but it sort of seemed like we just didn't have that extra athleticism to GET those loose balls. I saw a lot of mistakes that made me think "De'Aaron Fox wouldn't have allowed that ball to get far" or "Randle would have cleaned up that board".

I can't help but feeling like I was watching a mid-major team out there. a VERY good mid-major team.. likeable, good basketball players.. but just a team thats kind of meh. I think we've had some past UK teams where not a single player on this team would start for (or at best, maybe 1 guy).

This has always been the answer. It was the same way in the first half of the Duke game. We looked better in the second half, but we were definitely aided by Duke's lack of ability to hit open 3s in that second half.

This isn't an insurmountable problem, but it is a problem. At the end of the day we played a good team tough in a hostile road environment when our PG was limited a bit with foul trouble. Not the end of the world. But this definitely isn't the team people convinced themselves it was after the Duke game and a few blowouts of cupcakes.

 

[BarefootBeach]

These guys are human, bad game. Human psychology says these guys are a little cocky, being undefeated and having beaten Duke. They know Clemson is not nearly as good as Duke. They got smashed with a right hook last night. They'll refocus, only problem is next game is not at Rupp and they are playing a better team. I'm doing my part, we're already in Seattle and I'll be screaming my lungs out for the big blue Saturday 💙

 

[Ripcord65]

. . . .

My interesting stat that seals the deal on the loss.

We had 7 possessions in the last 4:30 of the game. We missed 6 3s total in those trips down the floor. Won’t win any competitive/toss-up type games when we have that happen.

Yes ... and (and I could be wrong, but) ... I don't think Koby Brea took any of those end-of-game 3's ! In fact, I'm not sure Brea was even on the floor for the last 4:30 ! That was - and still is - puzzling to me.

Anybody have any thoughts about that ?

 

[JRCAT14]

Welp, ya got me. They must not have gotten out hustled at all.

Or maybe…they were getting out hustled and stepped it up.

Pope isn’t going to dwell on negatives. Not his style. That’s what message boards are for.

I mentioned lack of intensity and effort in another post and that is still my opinion, but would clarify that I saw that in the first half. IMO that set the tone and allowed Clemson to dictate how the game was played and the officials allowed it to happen as well. The effort in the second half was definitely better as the rebounding statistics show. The inability to consistently make shots though done them in.

 

[JerseyCat84]

Anytime we hustled Ayers called a foul so I can see how that gets into players' minds. Clemson, meanwhile, was allowed to elbow and slap forearms.

That said this UK team is a hodge-podge of former mid major players and I suspect overachieving and over ranked. We've played very well at home and neutral courts but now the real grind of SEC away games begins.

 

[the nail at the foul line]

One thing to consider is where these guys have been most of their college career and all the sudden they are ranked fourth in the nation. Maybe they started to believe praise.

 

[JerseyCat84]

One thing to consider is where these guys have been most of their college career and all the sudden they are ranked fourth in the nation. Maybe they started to believe praise.

I think the team will fall back to what most "experts" and even UK fans expect them to be ranked... between 10-20.

 

[brianpoe]

Yes ... and (and I could be wrong, but) ... I don't think Koby Brea took any of those end-of-game 3's ! In fact, I'm not sure Brea was even on the floor for the last 4:30 ! That was - and still is - puzzling to me.

Anybody have any thoughts about that ?

Brea entered the game with 20 seconds left on the game clock... I really do not care about his defense, in a game in which we need points I think he should have be on the court, even if they are taking his shots away he opens the floor.

 

[anonymous_2011]

I think the foul situation hurt our 50/50 balls. They were calling a lot of fouls on us at the start of the game and that set the tone.

 

[KYFOSSIL]

IDK what to make of our game against Duke, and I'm not sure it's really the tell-tale sign of who we are.

Duke was young, AND pretty inexperienced with each other. It was just as new of a team together, sans Proctor and another guy. Their coaching is suspect, certainly worse than Pope IMO. And they lost bodies down the stretch. I really can't take much from that Duke game, seeing as how dicey we've looked since. I think Duke lost that game as much as we won.

So let me get this straight after a four point loss on the road to a solid team you’ve decided we are a good mid major and the duke win was a fluke?? Im sorry bit thats weak.

 

[B.B.H.]

I really do not care about his defense

Right there is your problem. I love Brea and definitely agree he should get more run going forward than Kriisa and Garrison but defense matters. Brea did literally nothing yesterday to suggest he was a difference maker. He really needs to show some kind of intermediate scoring because I don’t see him becoming a slasher. He’s just frankly slow.

 

[Lempface]

Let's be honest tho, that guy can rebound. He's done it the last four seasons.

His defensive rebounding % last year was 26.5%. That's good for 26th nationally.
His offensive rebounding % was 12.2%. 84th nationally.

Maybe dude is just good at rebounding.

I'm sure he is, but he isn't snagging all of those without committing a single foul...

 

[brianpoe]

Right there is your problem. I love Brea and definitely agree he should get more run going forward than Kriisa and Garrison but defense matters. Brea did literally nothing yesterday to suggest he was a difference maker. He really needs to show some kind of intermediate scoring because I don’t see him becoming a slasher. He’s just frankly slow.

I fear that the only one capable of making intermediate shots on this team is a freshman that isnt ready to play and even more of a defensive liability. That said, we have witnessed tons of great long range shooters in college bball through the years that were not good on defense but were very impactful due to their shooting. If Brea hits shots it puts tons of pressure on the defense, and even if they shut him down his presence opens the floor.

As for last night, 2 things come to mind; the offense was truly stagnate at times, we desperately needed Brea during those scoring droughts with Butler out, and Im not sure who was playing such great defense that they couldn't be substituted for Brea? I do believe that Carr's bad night was also a big issue that we are not discussing, he can make the offense tick in different ways.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

So let me get this straight after a four point loss on the road to a solid team you’ve decided we are a good mid major and the duke win was a fluke?? Im sorry bit thats weak.

I think we might have a top5-6 coach in the making, who is working with mid-major type talent... and it's also NEW talent to him, and new to each other. So there's a lot of room to improve. But I've been a little worried about this roster since it was put together.. much more so than worried about Pope's abilities as a coach.

I also don't think any game has a team play 100% perfect, and the losing team play 100% poorly. Kentucky did a lot of things right in the 2nd half against Duke (and a lot of that goes to my point above in coaching).. and Duke did a lot of things wrong.. or rather, have a lot of things "go wrong" for them. Their center was basically useless due to cramps, and they lost a good bench piece in Sion James due to injury.

 

[mdlUK.1]

A big non athletic dude that knows how to use his weight and leverage doesn’t have to be super athletic to make an impact down low. Chuck Hayes might be the best example.

Yeah but there is no damn way that clown bangs around like he did, grab 20 boards but ZERO fouls? No freakin way.