NBA Draft Age Change?

[UK2KJAG]

I heard NBA Commissioner Adam Silver's comments on one and done a while back and it certainly seems he is open to letting guys go straight from high school again. Silver has expressed frustration with guys only going to one semester worth of classes and not wanting to be there when they could be in the NBA. They are rebranding the D-League the Gatorade League and adding teams so each NBA team has their own independent team. Sure seems like the NBA allowing players to go straight to the league or the G-League is picking up steam.

Here's a well written article on the matter:

https://theringer.com/nba-draft-adam-silver-age-limit-ben-simmons-51cc9cfbc034

 

[kydmb99]

In 10 years, the G-League will have made college basketball an afterthought

 

[UK2KJAG]

What I would like to see is something similar to baseball where guys can go after one year or have to play 2 or 3 years in college. I think everyone would benefit from it. Of course it won't ever happen but would be best for the elite high school players, NBA, and College Basketball. Would also give juniors and seniors a better shot at the league

 

[weatherbird]

As has been stated many times, this rule affects very few prospects to begin with. I don't expect the G-League to take off. Mainly because it has direct competition, and it will likely never support itself. College baseball isn't big enough to take away from minor league baseball. But college basketball is so big, a minor league basketball league will struggle to make ends meet, and will constantly rely on the real NBA teams for support. Eventually, the players of the NBA will get tired of money going to support this minor league stuff, and it will probably collapse. There is no perfect solution to the matter, but I wouldn't expect there to be any real changes to the rule anytime soon.

Most of this is coming from the Ben Simmons documentary. Over the last several years, a great deal of the one and done players have come from UK. How many do you know of that didn't finish their second semester? One. And in typical fashion, we are looking at changing the rules to suit a select few.

 

[SilentsAreGolden]

I don't think even if they change it back, that many will go straight to the league. Many will probably try, but after a few try it and don't get drafted in the first round, it will probably self-correct. I would be interested to see if they do change it back, if they will allow players to come back to school if they are not drafted and haven't hired an agent. Also, didn't it use to be the case that you could be drafted, opt to go to school, but have the team that drafted you retain the rights to you?

 

[kydmb99]

The baseball rule is even more unfair than the current rule. Can't believe how many people are advocating for it.

 

[SilentsAreGolden]

The baseball rule is even more unfair than the current rule. Can't believe how many people are advocating for it.

The whole system is whack. Speaking of baseball, there was a guy a while back who signed a minor league contract but was still allowed to play another sport in college. I think it was for a million or something.

 

[ganner918]

I don't think even if they change it back, that many will go straight to the league. Many will probably try, but after a few try it and don't get drafted in the first round, it will probably self-correct. I would be interested to see if they do change it back, if they will allow players to come back to school if they are not drafted and haven't hired an agent. Also, didn't it use to be the case that you could be drafted, opt to go to school, but have the team that drafted you retain the rights to you?

By my count, there are 19 freshmen in this year's draft. In 2005, the final year you could go straight from high school, 10 high school seniors entered the draft (and 2 college freshmen, one of the Morris). Only 2 members of the 2005 high school class that went to college then left after 1 year in the 2006 draft. It looks like the kind of guys trying to get to the league quickly tended to skip college. If we go back to 18 year old high school grads being eligible, with the movement we've seen toward more guys trying to jump early, we might start seeing the majority of top-25 recruits skipping college for the NBA.

 

[DerekMcPwn]

Ignoring the high odds that OP is a Louisville fan, this is silly. OAD isn't going anywhere, at least not as the result of any NBA rules change. And the entire story of why can be told in UK players alone. The "19-years old and one year removed from high school" rule protects the NBA from wasting millions on the Skals, Briscoes, and the Marcus Lees of high school basketball. It's completely free, and it's a *better* proving ground than the D-League. And if you think GMs secretly want the rule abolished so they can get access to undervalued players earlier, look no further than Hamidou Diallo. Kid oozes potential, and is basically a consensus lock for the lottery *next* year, and yet no team would give him even a first-round guarantee this year. Teams are risk-averse like any other business.

So there is every incentive to keep the rule in place, especially when you consider the union-structured draft and pay schedule. Taken together, the rules function as a safety net for the league's worst teams, which invites new investment (new franchises), and cultivates a high level of competition across the board (otherwise, the top teams could snag the best players at an early discount, because they are in the position to both throw away money and take recruiting risks since they already have a winning roster).

So there's every incentive to keep the rule, and so far as I can tell, no good incentive to do away with it. I haven't heard a compelling argument yet. The arguments made in the article are weak. "Lack of player development." Really? Do we honestly believe that the D-League coaches are better than top college coaches? And the "back in my day" arguments supposedly made by veteran players are so full of ****. Those guys spent multiple years in college instead of just one, and have the benefit of years of NBA experience coloring their evaluation of incoming players. They're also full of **** because a lot of the top college players come in and immediately become the MVP of their teams full of grizzled vets. Look at Davis, Wall, Booker, and Towns. And the author's argument that high draft variance benefits the NBA is wrong for the reasons I explained before. The watchability of the sport, and the incentive to invest, are both improved by consistently funneling the best talent to underperforming teams.

And none of this even reaches the point that we shouldn't want to see the rule go because it will sap the college game of its most exciting talent, who will just go pro straight away, or skip college if there is a two-year rule. That's not good for any college hoops fan.

Nothing will change, and it shouldn't.

 

[marshalfan]

The whole system is whack. Speaking of baseball, there was a guy a while back who signed a minor league contract but was still allowed to play another sport in college. I think it was for a million or something.

The minor league baseball player playing ncaa basketball has happened many times

 

[UK2KJAG]

Ignoring the high odds that OP is a Louisville fan, this is silly. OAD isn't going anywhere, at least not as the result of any NBA rules change. And the entire story of why can be told in UK players alone. The "19-years old and one year removed from high school" rule protects the NBA from wasting millions on the Skals, Briscoes, and the Marcus Lees of high school basketball. It's completely free, and it's a *better* proving ground than the D-League. And if you think GMs secretly want the rule abolished so they can get access to undervalued players earlier, look no further than Hamidou Diallo. Kid oozes potential, and is basically a consensus lock for the lottery *next* year, and yet no team would give him even a first-round guarantee this year. Teams are risk-averse like any other business.

So there is every incentive to keep the rule in place, especially when you consider the union-structured draft and pay schedule. Taken together, the rules function as a safety net for the league's worst teams, which invites new investment (new franchises), and cultivates a high level of competition across the board (otherwise, the top teams could snag the best players at an early discount, because they are in the position to both throw away money and take recruiting risks since they already have a winning roster).

So there's every incentive to keep the rule, and so far as I can tell, no good incentive to do away with it. I haven't heard a compelling argument yet. The arguments made in the article are weak. "Lack of player development." Really? Do we honestly believe that the D-League coaches are better than top college coaches? And the "back in my day" arguments supposedly made by veteran players are so full of ****. Those guys spent multiple years in college instead of just one, and have the benefit of years of NBA experience coloring their evaluation of incoming players. They're also full of **** because a lot of the top college players come in and immediately become the MVP of their teams full of grizzled vets. Look at Davis, Wall, Booker, and Towns. And the author's argument that high draft variance benefits the NBA is wrong for the reasons I explained before. The watchability of the sport, and the incentive to invest, are both improved by consistently funneling the best talent to underperforming teams.

Nothing will change, and it shouldn't.

LOL the high odds I'm a UofL fan. What makes me a tard fan for simply posting an article I read off twitter? Die hard Cats fan here since the day I was born so please spare us all the usual message board crap of calling someone a rival fan if they post anything that doesn't lie within your agenda. Honestly don't even know what I said that was negative to UK. I was simply trying to post a relevant article that I think the BBN needs to read. When the NBA commissioner speaks it's worth at least passing along.

 

[jrpross]

The baseball rule is even more unfair than the current rule. Can't believe how many people are advocating for it.

Why do you say that? Zero or three might be too much but I've been kind of curious about the possibility of a zero or two rule.

 

[Smashcat]

Silver has expressed frustration with guys only going to one semester worth of classes and not wanting to be there when they could be in the NBA.

Did he mention fake classes at UNC w/ free diplomas?

 

[kydmb99]

Why do you say that? Zero or three might be too much but I've been kind of curious about the possibility of a zero or two rule.

If fairness is your concern it still restricts players from going professional when they are able to...just a different group of players and at a different point in time. The only "fair" solution would be to let players declare immediately out of high school. I just don't think the baseball rule is much better for the players than the current one. In fact it would force a lot of financially needy kids into really bad decisions. Basketball isn't the same as baseball.

For the record, I don't think the current set up is "unfair". I think the NBA should be allowed to set criteria for it's workforce.

 

[bucsrule8872]

I heard NBA Commissioner Adam Silver's comments on one and done a while back and it certainly seems he is open to letting guys go straight from high school again. Silver has expressed frustration with guys only going to one semester worth of classes and not wanting to be there when they could be in the NBA. They are rebranding the D-League the Gatorade League and adding teams so each NBA team has their own independent team. Sure seems like the NBA allowing players to go straight to the league or the G-League is picking up steam.

Here's a well written article on the matter:

https://theringer.com/nba-draft-adam-silver-age-limit-ben-simmons-51cc9cfbc034

It won't solve this problem. There will be guys not good enough to go right out of HS who play one year of college then leave. Who is to say that they will go to class? He is trying to sound like he cares about college bball, but he doesn't care. He is only concerned about the NBA game. That's fine, that's his job.

 

[LeonThe Camel]

In 10 years, the G-League will have made college basketball an afterthought

Not a chance. Do you watch college games because of particular players or because players play for your team.
You could field 5 donkeys in a Kentucky jersey and we would still come out and watch.
On the other hand, you could put the best 10 high school players on 1 team in the NBDL and it would not move the audience meter.

 

[LeonThe Camel]

If fairness is your concern it still restricts players from going professional when they are able to...just a different group of players and at a different point in time. The only "fair" solution would be to let players declare immediately out of high school. I just don't think the baseball rule is much better for the players than the current one. In fact it would force a lot of financially needy kids into really bad decisions. Basketball isn't the same as baseball.

For the record, I don't think the current set up is "unfair". I think the NBA should be allowed to set criteria for it's workforce.

That is about the best argument I have heard for this issue.

The only snag would be that college players under the 2 or 3 year threshold could still play overseas.

 

[kydmb99]

Not a chance. Do you watch college games because of particular players or because players play for your team.
You could field 5 donkeys in a Kentucky jersey and we would still come out and watch.
On the other hand, you could put the best 10 high school players on 1 team in the NBDL and it would not move the audience meter.

Sure, the hardcores will still watch but the casual fans will tune out. The G-League is definitely a serious threat to college basketball.

 

[Phil McKracken]

From all comments I have read from Silver on age limit, it sounded to me like he would rather players stay longer in college instead of coming right from high school or through the current OAD system. He is even quoted in that article as saying he thinks players developing in college is better than playing in the "D" or "G" league straight out of high school. That article was written to excite college bball fans that the NBA is planning to ruin college basketball, but I think Silver has another thing in mind by starting up this public banter on the subject.

The NBA makes money based on star power. These big-time draft picks come in with star power by playing in college basketball. Bringing some no-name in straight from high school and putting him in a "G" league for a few years isn't going to create the same effect. I think folks are over-analyzing this.

 

[wentzel25]

The whole system is whack. Speaking of baseball, there was a guy a while back who signed a minor league contract but was still allowed to play another sport in college. I think it was for a million or something.

Russell Wilson, Chris Weinke come to mind immediately.

 

[KentuckyRLD]

I don't see a thing wrong with the rule just as it is. So what if players leave after a year? The good coaches will manage to recruit and the big time programs will stay the same. To me it is great and I wouldn't change a thing.

 

[Ocornett]

I want to hear more about the donkey basketball team. Will it be all males, females or mixed? What are the rule. How many player donkey's on a team? Will the coach be a donkey? If so, I think coach K would be a great coach because he is a jackass. Maybe, Bobby Knight would come back and coach a team, since he is the biggest jackass of all time.

 

[UKUGA]

Speaking of baseball, there was a guy a while back who signed a minor league contract but was still allowed to play another sport in college. I think it was for a million or something.

Pretty common.

 

[true blue1]

It won't solve this problem. There will be guys not good enough to go right out of HS who play one year of college then leave. Who is to say that they will go to class? He is trying to sound like he cares about college bball, but he doesn't care. He is only concerned about the NBA game. That's fine, that's his job.

This!

 

[GonzoCat90]

He's posturing. He's pretending not to like the current rule in order to use keeping it as a compromise that costs the players something in the next CBA. Smart move. He gets to win twice.

I'll also never understand why, from an academic standpoint, two years of college is better than one. The same guys are going to stop going to class when basketball is done, except now they'll have already breezed their way through a bunch of intro classes and electives.

I know the facade makes people feel better for some reason, but it's pointless. People have been hiding awful rules behind education and children for decades because no one can publicly question it without getting strawmanned to death.

 

[bucsrule8872]

Sometimes I get tired of all the posturing. Just go back to the way it was. If you are ready to go, you are ready to go. The college game will survive. No G-League game is ever going to pack 24,000 fans into an arena on a Wednesday night, like UK can. College bball is about the fans, not the players.

Cal would have to adjust his recruiting. That will be the most difficult part for us. I think he would be fine. He knows how to evaluate talent and tell these kids whether they should go or not. There will be some frustration for sure for fans when a kid commits in the Fall, then decides to go pro. We will all be pulling our hair out.

It will be fine, though. We will survive.

 

[LeonThe Camel]

Sure, the hardcores will still watch but the casual fans will tune out. The G-League is definitely a serious threat to college basketball.

Completely disagree. Who would the average fan be watching. Some high school they have no connection with.
At present, very few college fans watch games with their former players in them. Not going to change.
We are college athletics, not semi pro.
Perfect example is the regional baseball games. The stadium was packed for what amounts to a playoff game. The Legends rarely fill the stadium (playoffs or not).

 

[LeonThe Camel]

I want to hear more about the donkey basketball team. Will it be all males, females or mixed? What are the rule. How many player donkey's on a team? Will the coach be a donkey? If so, I think coach K would be a great coach because he is a jackass. Maybe, Bobby Knight would come back and coach a team, since he is the biggest jackass of all time.

You never watched donkey basketball.
5 donkeys per team, 1 player on each donkey. Dribble the ball while on the back of a donkey before shooting. Players cannot leave the donkey or they get a foul.
We use to play it.

 

[jrpross]

You never watched donkey basketball.
5 donkeys per team, 1 player on each donkey. Dribble the ball while on the back of a donkey before shooting. Players cannot leave the donkey or they get a foul.
We use to play it.

That's not even fair. Everyone knows a donkey could never guard a camel.

 

[JonathanW]

In 10 years, the G-League will have made college basketball an afterthought

I disagree. College basketball is a superior product. Not saying college basketball has better players/athletes, obviously not! But it has a level of excitement that the NBA can't replicate. The players actually (try to) play defense. The coaches actually coach. Every drive doesn't end in a travel (3-4 steps not allowed). Are there problems w/ college ball? Sure, of course.

There are lots of talented players who simply aren't enough of an NBA prospect to even go to an expanded G-league out of high school. Guys who are too short for their position, who aren't quite quick enough, or a good enough jumper, or just not good enough but who developed over time. Just look at UK over the past 25 years. We've had a good number of guys like that.
Woods, Pelphery, Feldhaus, Farmer, Brown, Epps, Sheppard, Pope, Mohammad, Magloire, Hayes, Fitch, Daniels, Estill, Hawkins, Sparks, Bradley, Meeks, Stephenson, Miller, Liggins, Harrellson, WCS, Lee, Ulis, Willis, Hawkins, SKJ, Green, SGA, Baker, Washington.

 

[Dablueman]

If fairness is your concern it still restricts players from going professional when they are able to...just a different group of players and at a different point in time. The only "fair" solution would be to let players declare immediately out of high school. I just don't think the baseball rule is much better for the players than the current one. In fact it would force a lot of financially needy kids into really bad decisions. Basketball isn't the same as baseball.

For the record, I don't think the current set up is "unfair". I think the NBA should be allowed to set criteria for it's workforce.

Fairness? Nope it's all bs driven by agents on the player side and a better product on the court on the league's side. This is about money.

Lots of businesses and industry require restrictions on age and level of education. This is not a fairness argument.

The last year of straight out of HS 10 players jumped but that was an anomaly. It was usually 3 or 4 at most. I think it be realistic to think every year u might lose 6 or 7 guys. Foreign players are taking up more spots than ever before.

So you let them come straight out of HS or college for 2 years. It allows the players union/agents to make some money and then the league gets alot more seasoned player as well.

 

[UKvisitor]

I have concern over the quality of coaching a high school player would receive going to any NBA development league over a year or two in college with HOF active coaches. Not many HOFers coaching NBA development leagues.
If I were a high school player thinking of the NBA, would I want my development be with coaches trying to prove themselves or with coaches who has proved themselves?

 

[JDHoss]

I have concern over the quality of coaching a high school player would receive going to any NBA development league over a year or two in college with HOF active coaches. Not many HOFers coaching NBA development leagues.
If I were a high school player thinking of the NBA, would I want my development be with coaches trying to prove themselves or with coaches who has proved themselves?

I don't see it as an issue. After this draft and last year's draft, clowns like Lorenzo Romar and Johnny Jones will have produced 5 1st round picks between them. Their coaching didn't seem to hinder them at all.

 

[UKvisitor]

Their coaching didn't seem to hinder them at all.

Only in their draft order. Better coaching usually means better players.
Who even coaches the NBA development teams?

 

[JDHoss]

Only in their draft order. Better coaching usually means better players.
Who even coaches the NBA development teams?

Draft order? Simmons was #1. Fultz will likely be the #1 this year. Here is a list of current D-League head coaches. I guarantee you that it's better coaching than Jones and Romar.

http://dleague.nba.com/coaches/

Here's a list of former D-League coaches who moved up.

http://dleague.nba.com/coaching-callups/

 

[UKvisitor]

Simmons was #1. Fultz will likely be the #1 this year.

Simmons was drafted that high despite his college coaching and has done nothing. (sorry to hear of his injury) http://www.espn.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/3907387/ben-simmons

IDK anything about Fultz
There will be players like that after high school but not many. Everyone can't be like those 2. Concern for the many, not the few.

 

[JDHoss]

Simmons was drafted that high despite his college coaching and has done nothing. (sorry to hear of his injury) http://www.espn.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/3907387/ben-simmons

IDK anything about Fultz
There will be players like that after high school but not many. Everyone can't be like those 2. Concern for the many, not the few.

IMO the G-League will provide them with good instruction, as well as unlimited instruction, which they will never get in college.

 

[UKvisitor]

IMO the G-League will provide them with good instruction, as well as unlimited instruction,

It is not the amount, it is the quality. Think "drinking water".

Some quenches your thirst, some is bland, some taste bad, and some is not worth drinking.

Coaching/developing is alot like that.

 

[JDHoss]

It is not the amount, it is the quality. Think "drinking water".

Some quenches your thirst, some is bland, some taste bad, and some is not worth drinking.

Coaching/developing is alot like that.

Really don't see it as an issue. Several of the coaches listed have been involved in player development previously, and it's in the NBA's best interest to see that the players they draft and place in the G-League do in fact get the proper coaching. Allowing guys to be drafted straight out of high school shouldn't pose an issue for college basketball's popularity.

 

[mebeblue2]

we will see a TAD before the NBA ever goes back to the NAD