My take on recruiting losses

[uk78]

At the beginning of this last season everything was Kentucky. Media had us as one of the greatest assembled teams ever. Throughout the year there was Kentucky number one and constant media attention, praise, articles, hype, etc. In fact, we landed several recruits early I believe because Kentucky was the number one place it seemed to be. However, that all ended with our loss to Wisconsin and then Duke winning it all.

I don't think it is coincidence that these end of the season recruits are not coming here like before. The magic was ended with our loss. Suddenly, coach K. and Duke returned to be the prominent recognized program where K now adopted the one and done recruiting and beat Cal at his own game. We kept hearing that Diallo was tied to Slice yet he ended up at Kansas. Kansas always seems to get some of these top recruits and have had consistency with their coaching staff. Ingram went to Duke and they had multiple visits with him and why wouldn't he go there? Again, I am saying some of our luster and magic was lost because of all this reporting how we had the greatest team ever yet didn't win it all.

Two other factors I think hurt. Losing Antigua and now Slice I believe also hurt our recruiting. A lot of recruiting is about relationships and these were the guys who had the primary responsibility for that role. Yes, Cal comes and meets you, but the building is those other guys. That's why we had the early success.

I see a lot of rationalizations going on about our team next year compared to others. We will have a good team, but I don't see us competing for a National Championship at this point. There may still be some transfers or other surprises out there. But, if we have a good season, I think we will be fine with future recruiting. I would like Cal to bring in a name that is recognized by the young high school players as well.

Bottom-line? I think our loss combined with all the year long hype hurt us way more than many realize.

 

[Catfan2226]

My take,we spent way to much time and energy focused on certain players ala Newman and let some other kids slip away that were not offered but wanted to play here.

 

[UK_fan_41102]

My take,we spent way to much time and energy focused on certain players ala Newman and let some other kids slip away that were not offered but wanted to play here.

Let me use a famous saying to sum up what you said, "A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush".

 

[RondoBaller21]

I think Slice leaving had more of an affect than many want to believe

 

[the stat man]

I would say the coaches are using he (Cal) had the best team by far in collage basketball, and he couldn't win a national championship with all that talent !! I am guessing the Anti-Cal stuff is being used at an all time high by all coaches.

 

[DwayneMeighan]

I think Slice leaving had more of an affect than many want to believe

Not really. Cal and company had zero problems recruiting before Slice got here, so not sure him being only one season has much to do with anything.

If you want to look at an assistant for an excuse, then look at Antigua. He helped recruit the Towns, Ulis, Booker, Lyles class. This is the first class that Cal has recruited without him. Maybe him leaving is catching up.

 

[Catfan2226]

I would say the coaches are using he (Cal) had the best team by far in collage basketball, and he couldn't win a national championship with all that talent !! I am guessing the Anti-Cal stuff is being used at an all time high by all coaches.

Not just coaches,the media is also using it as well.We had a bad game and beat ourseleves against Wisconsin.Went to the stall ball way to soon.Should have kept taking it to them.If we had,it would have made those 7 departures look a lot better.

 

[Littlemoreaction Lessconversatio]

Yes. Cal isn't a top tier coach. Bo beat him with zero Mc'D's all Americans. K won the title with a substantially inferior team than Cal had. Yes kids this hurts recruiting. Hype is all good until you don't live up to it. Apparently winning more games without a loss in a single season than anyone else without a ring isn't as attractive as most slurpers would have us believe.

 

[Neue Regel]

I really wouldn't over think it. Cal and KY are going to get theirs because in the minds of recruits right now Cal is JayZ, K is Drake and Roy is Conway Twitty.

 

[Aike]

Yes. Cal isn't a top tier coach. Bo beat him with zero Mc'D's all Americans. K won the title with a substantially inferior team than Cal had. Yes kids this hurts recruiting. Hype is all good until you don't live up to it. Apparently winning more games without a loss in a single season than anyone else without a ring isn't as attractive as most slurpers would have us believe.

Don't recall seeing you around lately. You might want to go ahead and leave again.

 

[Smashcat]

Yes. Cal isn't a top tier coach. Bo beat him with zero Mc'D's all Americans. K won the title with a substantially inferior team than Cal had. Yes kids this hurts recruiting. Hype is all good until you don't live up to it. Apparently winning more games without a loss in a single season than anyone else without a ring isn't as attractive as most slurpers would have us believe.

And apparently beating KU by 32 means little as well. LOL That 40-0 quest for perfection is a phrase I hope I never hear again. Fools gold.

 

[BlueRunner11]

Some of the assanine posts on this board lately smh. Please go find a team worthy of your fair weathered fandom.

Duke Board is that way --------->

<------------ UL board is over there.

 

[USAFSSCAT]

The biggest Problem I see was they were concerned about having to Platoon again.!!!!

 

[DwayneMeighan]

Yes. Cal isn't a top tier coach. Bo beat him with zero Mc'D's all Americans. K won the title with a substantially inferior team than Cal had. Yes kids this hurts recruiting. Hype is all good until you don't live up to it. Apparently winning more games without a loss in a single season than anyone else without a ring isn't as attractive as most slurpers would have us believe.

Um... Duke had just as many McD AA's as UK, so your opinion that K won the title with a substantially inferior team is utter crap.

 

[jrpross]

The biggest Problem I see was they were concerned about having to Platoon again.!!!!

Newman and Diallo could take one look at our roster and see that platooning was not an issue.

 

[Ripcord65]

I agree with 95% of what the OP said.

I think the line that is killing us the most from opposing recruiters is: "He [Cal] couldn't win a national championship with all of that talent."

I think the line being used by opposing recruiters that is a close second is: "Willie Cauley-Stein and Dakari Johnson never improved a bit, offensively, from the time they arrived at U.K. until the time they left. And Karl-Anthony Towns really didn't improve much. But he didn't have much room to improve, because he was already a very, very good offensive post player before he got to Kentucky. How much is Calipari going to help you improve your offensive post play?"

 

[jbuk2]

The biggest Problem I see was they were concerned about having to Platoon again.!!!!

I think you hit it the head with the platoons. We wouldn't have gotten the 4 freshmen last year if they had all waited until now to sign. No one really wants to be a part of platoons. Yes the team last year bought into it but they didn't really have a choice. I'm sure other coaches were asking all of these players if they only want to play 20-25 minutes.

 

[Dream Team 13]

I agree with 95% of what the OP said.

I think the line that is killing us the most from opposing recruiters is: "He [Cal] couldn't win a national championship with all of that talent."

I think the line being used by opposing recruiters that is a close second is: "Willie Cauley-Stein and Dakari Johnson never improved a bit, offensively, from the time they arrived at U.K. until the time they left. And Karl-Anthony Towns really didn't improve much. But he didn't have much room to improve, because he was already a very, very good offensive post player before he got to Kentucky. How much is Calipari going to help you improve your offensive post play?"

And Cal can say that all improves their stock from where they were projected. Also KAT got a ton better over the year. Maybe you weren't watching.

Lies.

 

[*Bleedingblue*]

My take,we spent way to much time and energy focused on certain players ala Newman and let some other kids slip away that were not offered but wanted to play here.

This, was telling several people I know this the past week. You cannot just focus on 1 guy at each position that you need and think your fine. You need to cast a little bigger net that fits what you need to field your team and style.

I would have loved if the staff and spent more time after Bragg as I think he is going to be a very nice player in the future and would be an excellent fit here.
Cal is an outstanding recruiter over all but needs to make a slight adjustment here and their and we will be fine.
One thing I just heard was that some of the negative recruiting against us has to do how we play D. How we switch a lot and never ever play zone, some kids like playing zone as it's much less physical and you don't get beat up as much underneath.

I will admit that sometimes you play an opponent and they struggle big time against zones. Some teams really struggle against the press and some struggle against long athletic guys. I do wish Cal would change his philosophy up in regards to that. If UL could beat UConn by 30 we were surely 10-15 points better than them if we emulated the type of D they played against them. I do think we would have won the title last year if we had of done so. Who knows we might have won another in '11 and this year if we would change our D up to disrupt the other team as much as possible. But this is just all speculation and what if.

 

[Jat Cat]

I cant name a coach I would rather have than Cal.... he put us on top of the basketball mountain, where every
Wildcat fan wanted to be... well, we got knocked down... and we will now go right back up that mountain once again.

 

[OHIO COLONEL]

If the OP is correct....then what is the effect on the 2016, 2017, etc. classes when high school sophomores and juniors see that 5, 6 or 7 UK players are drafted here in a month or two? UK will be mentioned much more than Miss State, UNLV, Kansas, etc.

 

[OHIO COLONEL]

I will admit that sometimes you play an opponent and they struggle big time against zones. Some teams really struggle against the press and some struggle against long athletic guys. I do wish Cal would change his philosophy up in regards to that. If UL could beat UConn by 30 we were surely 10-15 points better than them if we emulated the type of D they played against them. I do think we would have won the title last year if we had of done so. Who knows we might have won another in '11 and this year if we would change our D up to disrupt the other team as much as possible. But this is just all speculation and what if.

It's much easier for opposing coaches to game plan against a one dimensional defensive team than one who presses, plays switching zones, etc.

 

[rolaid]

We are good to go with what we have ...another Final four. Good land Cal made it with two guards shooting 37% from floor and a center that couldn't score on any of you guys. We will be better at year end next year. Cal is a great Coach. Our team wasn't 38-1 good.

 

[MdWIldcat55]

Yes. Cal isn't a top tier coach. Bo beat him with zero Mc'D's all Americans. K won the title with a substantially inferior team than Cal had. Yes kids this hurts recruiting. Hype is all good until you don't live up to it. Apparently winning more games without a loss in a single season than anyone else without a ring isn't as attractive as most slurpers would have us believe.

People who had nothing to contribute to this board through last year's Final Four excitement and this year's 38-0 run to the Final Four, but now think they have a license to spread idiotic negativity are like parasites. I wish the moderators would go into Terminix mode.

 

[Aike]

How we switch a lot and never ever play zone, some kids like playing zone as it's much less physical and you don't get beat up as much underneath.

I will admit that sometimes you play an opponent and they struggle big time against zones. Some teams really struggle against the press and some struggle against long athletic guys. I do wish Cal would change his philosophy up in regards to that. If UL could beat UConn by 30 we were surely 10-15 points better than them if we emulated the type of D they played against them. I do think we would have won the title last year if we had of done so. Who knows we might have won another in '11 and this year if we would change our D up to disrupt the other team as much as possible. But this is just all speculation and what if.

They don't play zone in the NBA. Cal coaches players to prepare them for the league. I get why on the college level it irks some fans at times.

 

[RondoBaller21]

We are good to go with what we have ...another Final four. Good land Cal made it with two guards shooting 37% from floor and a center that couldn't score on any of you guys. We will be better at year end next year. Cal is a great Coach. Our team wasn't 38-1 good.

One player gets hurt, we're in trouble

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

Diallo sharing minutes with Lee, Skal, and a senior Poythress is probably a bigger factor than all the conspiracy stuff. He can walk in from day one and start at Kansas.

 

[minjo]

I agree with 95% of what the OP said.

I think the line that is killing us the most from opposing recruiters is: "He [Cal] couldn't win a national championship with all of that talent."

I think the line being used by opposing recruiters that is a close second is: "Willie Cauley-Stein and Dakari Johnson never improved a bit, offensively, from the time they arrived at U.K. until the time they left. And Karl-Anthony Towns really didn't improve much. But he didn't have much room to improve, because he was already a very, very good offensive post player before he got to Kentucky. How much is Calipari going to help you improve your offensive post play?"

The OP's thoughts crossed my mind, before I read it.
The fact that our loss at the end of our glorious run was a factor in giving rival coaches the ammunition to use on young recruits against Calipari is undeniable.
Yes, we not only lost the championship possibility at that game, but more importantly we lost the trust in our ability to use our number one team in the nation for the entire season to bring back the crown.
For the rival coaches to use that against us on seventeen and eighteen year olds fresh out of high school is a way to change their minds about where to play their college ball.
Anyway, we the UK fans should not lose confidence because of it, and continue supporting our players, coaches, and players even more.
Setbacks are common things in sports, being losses or not getting most of our targeted recruits, life goes on. Another year, another try, and maybe better luck and better results.
GO CATS

 

[*Bleedingblue*]

It's much easier for opposing coaches to game plan against a one dimensional defensive team than one who presses, plays switching zones, etc.

Yes you are correct. Especially when they see how a certain team played us and it really disrupted and exposed us ie Georgia. I was really expecting something different after witnessing that but no adjustments were made. ND and Wisconsin both pretty much did what Georgia did and we almost got best by ND and feel just short to Wisconsin. We had the talent to beat just about any one at their own game but Wisconsin had just too much size and grabbed so many boards and we had 2 guys just not show up at all and it doomed us. I think most of these discussions would not even come up if we had won the title even if everybody knew that their was some issues in the closet with that Gorilla.
Their was just a handful of times this year where we played some and I thought we played terrific on D. I know from playing on how difficult it was to change the O on the fly when you saw man to man and then a 2/3 next time down court.
I had one coach like 30 years ago who used to have a style of D where it was a mixture of man to man and Zone spending on where the ball was positioned on the court. It worked out really well and we won a lot of games. Unfortunately for him his drinking over came his coaching abilities and lost his job. It was a difficult D to learn but it was like art when you mastered it.
Most every kid today knows the basic D's of man to man 1/3/1, 2/3, 3/2, etc etc.


As far as the nba just running man to man I could care less what they do this is KY.

 

[stereonut]

I think you hit it the head with the platoons. We wouldn't have gotten the 4 freshmen last year if they had all waited until now to sign. No one really wants to be a part of platoons. Yes the team last year bought into it but they didn't really have a choice. I'm sure other coaches were asking all of these players if they only want to play 20-25 minutes.

I can't disagree with your theory. Something is/has been going on with the spring recruiting and I don't think it is because Cal is missing these guys because of a lack of effort. As we all know, he works relentlessly.

Still, I'm coming around to your thinking concerning platooning being used against us. The majority of the stars want big, big minutes, so this springs class has decided to go where they are pretty much guaranteed that. I don't think they liked the (potential) idea of platooning.

Just my humble opinion that might be ludicrous.

 

[FHAZCat]

As a fan who has followed recruiting since Bob Gibbons published his first mailout recruiting letter, I fail to see how having the #2 ranked recruiting class is a disaster.

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

Cal calls out the NCAA on a bi-monthly basis.


Why the hell can't he call out some of these rival coaches who smear our program? What's with the passive aggressive approach with vague blog posts and cryptic interview references? Make it public. Burn down some villages, Cal. Time to take this stuff to the next level.

 

[lawrencekash]

My take is that Cal spent all his energy on 40-0. Thought he had it as did I. So what. I relished every minute of a magical season and I will totally enjoy next year even if we lose in the first round of the NIT. History will record what a great run we have had and it is not over yet.

 

[Littlemoreaction Lessconversatio]

People who had nothing to contribute to this board through last year's Final Four excitement and this year's 38-0 run to the Final Four, but now think they have a license to spread idiotic negativity are like parasites. I wish the moderators would go into Terminix mode.

I don't plan on being around much now either though the new format is cool. Way too many Cal slurpers here for a guy with only one championship from all that talent. That's exactly why we missed on all those recruits btw like it or not.

 

[etowncatfan]

I agree with 95% of what the OP said.

I think the line that is killing us the most from opposing recruiters is: "He [Cal] couldn't win a national championship with all of that talent."

I think the line being used by opposing recruiters that is a close second is: "Willie Cauley-Stein and Dakari Johnson never improved a bit, offensively, from the time they arrived at U.K. until the time they left. And Karl-Anthony Towns really didn't improve much. But he didn't have much room to improve, because he was already a very, very good offensive post player before he got to Kentucky. How much is Calipari going to help you improve your offensive post play?"

I have to disagree with he couldn't win with last years talent. 2012 showed he could win it all. I think most these kids could care less about a National Championship. Aka Newman to Mississippi State Zimmerman to UNLV and possibly Jalen Brown to a school that will not win the NCAA next year. Diallo and Ingram are the only two who picked a team with a chance IMO.

 

[lawrencekash]

So some of you want BCG back? I will take Cal over any Coach in the nation. His ability to recruit the very best may be the reason he hasn't won a 2nd championship because of lack of continuity. The 40-0 quest was there but life is not always fair and we went down. No harm no foul. That is why they play all the games. Had he gone 40-0 I bet he would have gone to the NBA although my brain can never understand why he would do that?

 

[stereonut]

So some of you want BCG back? I will take Cal over any Coach in the nation. His ability to recruit the very best may be the reason he hasn't won a 2nd championship because of lack of continuity. The 40-0 quest was there but life is not always fair and we went down. No harm no foul. That is why they play all the games. Had he gone 40-0 I bet he would have gone to the NBA although my brain can never understand why he would do that?

Agree except for the first question.

I haven't seen anyone even remotely "want BCG back".

 

[kybassfan]

I think the larder was full, the corn was bursting out of the crib and the hay was pushing off the roof. In other words, we were stacked, deep. For much of the year it looked like we had outstanding players that might potentially return in the form of Booker, Johnson, maybe the twins, maybe even Lyles. Plus we had some more definite returnees like Ulis, Poythress and Lee not to mention the substantial commits we already had. This was a very unusual situation, more so than I think any year to date with Cal.

Guys were looking at their options in case the larder remained full. Got late in the year and they stood on their cards.

That said, I'm not concerned. Basketball is a lot more than the biggest, fastest and quickest. Intensity, skill, hard work and team execution and development are still critically important. You can be the greatest athlete or the five greatest but you still have to play basketball. I firmly believe that the team for the upcoming year still has plenty of physical capability to perform surprisingly well if they master the things that Cal always preaches. I think the top notch athletes we've been getting have made a few of us forget all the ingredients necessary to make for a successful team. I don't think Mr Ulis and Mr Poythress have forgotten though.

For myself, I expect to be watching Kentucky Basketball next fall.

 

[thebluestripes]

I'm not going to worry too much over one lackluster recruiting class. Now if cal starts getting tubby style recruits 2 or 3 years in a row, color me worried.
I see this recruiting cycle as the perfect storm against cal. First he tells the public that he was going to leave before finding out the twins were coming back. He loses coach o', starts platooning. brings in slice who helped very little and quit at one of the worst times possible. Finally coach k got in on the one and done action and done quite well sadly. It may not of happened all in that order, but it all came together to hurt this years recruiting.
The thing that puzzles me, is cal coming into this season letting everyone know that he was leaving until a few players came back. That probably hurt as much as anything

 

[WildcatFan60]

Poor UK. We have another top 5 recruiting class. A team that just set all kinds of records. 4 final fours in last 5 years.

Probably not the class we were hoping for, but we will not be the dregs of the SEC or anything like that. This will not be 2013 again.

Enjoy the ride.