I said weeks ago that if they hired Penny as HC that he would make his assistants experienced guys. Make Penny the face of the program with x and o coaches around him is better than Penny being a recruiting guy trying to sell another head coach.
Memphis paper reporting Penny/Tubby rumor..
- Thread starter CarolinaCatsFan
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Ridiculous for a high major d1 program to hire someone who has never run a program or even been an assistant at the college level at least.
Yeah, I would be surprised if he isn’t playing here next season.
So Penny Hardaway is gonna win recruiting battle over Cal??? Just listen to that for a second
God, I can't stand these threads that end up exposing even a bit of the residual hatred against Tubby Smith, who left us 10 years ago. Beyond that, the whole premise of the thread is absurd, despite the media coverage. Whoever said that Memphis should hire Hardaway as an assistant just to see how he can actually recruit was right. Moving from high school to a somewhat major college HC job rarely works. It just about takes a genius to succeed. Is Penny Hardaway a genius? Doubtful.
Cal was an assistant at two major conference basketball schools for SIX years before he got a HC job at a decidedly mid-major program. Unless he wins the SEC tourney and the NC in a few weeks, our team will lose 10+ games this year, along with 11, 12, 9, 9, and 9 losses in five other years...after 9 years here. And that's at UK. Head coaching is a tough job. But somehow, I don't see anyone calling our coach "Ten-loss Cal" if he happens to end up averaging that.
Cal was an assistant at two major conference basketball schools for SIX years before he got a HC job at a decidedly mid-major program. Unless he wins the SEC tourney and the NC in a few weeks, our team will lose 10+ games this year, along with 11, 12, 9, 9, and 9 losses in five other years...after 9 years here. And that's at UK. Head coaching is a tough job. But somehow, I don't see anyone calling our coach "Ten-loss Cal" if he happens to end up averaging that.
Article is very telling:
"They likely don’t know that attendance is at a 48-year-low. They likely don’t know that Smith hasn’t been able to recruit a high school player out of Memphis since he got the job. They likely don’t know that athletic department contributions are down by $1.1 million and that the sagging attendance will cost Memphis another $800,000 under the FedExForum lease.
Some of you might say that’s not fair to Smith. I get that, I really do. But is it fair to continue with a coach once you’ve concluded he can’t do the job? By that, I don’t mean just the job on the court, necessarily. I mean everything else that’s involved. Filling a building. Generating contributions. Recruiting at a high level. Representing the university with enthusiasm.
Coaching at this level involves more than coaching at this level. Smith’s inability to understand that is why he is headed to the conference tournament with no guarantee that he will coach beyond that."
Those numbers!
Memphis won't get trashed by the media for firing him though. Even though he was doing the same thing at UK. Only difference is UK is an elite program, and KY is viewed as a racist state by the media goons.
A
anon_9qtxg60vqzy0y
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I have no hate for Tubby, it was just a rough end.
4 Final Fours in 8 years makes your point about Cal very insignificant and trollish.
Penny played this brilliantly. He acted like he didn't really care what Memphis did, he leaked that he would only consider HC position, and he also played Memphis by allowing speculation to run wild in Memphis about Ole Miss.
Inside of the program Memphis was pushing for Penny to consider coming on staff. He made clear it wouldn't happen.
Memphis doesn't really have a choice. Boosters are leaking this story to Geoff to apply the pressure to get fans back in the seats. Penny will sell that arena out for at least the first few years of his honeymoon without even winning. They are a bad hire away from losing their program for good. They are approaching bottom feeder status in an average to crappy conference. It's a bold, high risk / high reward situation. Penny has an extremely laid back personality and is a golf fanatic. He's not an in your face type of Coach, he's closer to Pastner than Cal.
Which is the reason I would be skeptical if I were Memphis. You might be going down the road of Pastner 2.0 - not sure Memphis can afford that.
I've always doubted Wiseman will even play college basketball. But from what I hear, if he does, pulling him away from Penny would be really tough. Hopefully it would come down to a business decision and he really loves Cal as much as he says he does.
Also, I think Memphis is scared that UK has already made contact with Penny about a job, or is about to. Memphis hates Kentucky, all of them. The last thing they want is to watch more Memphis potential and former affiliates end up at UK.
Inside of the program Memphis was pushing for Penny to consider coming on staff. He made clear it wouldn't happen.
Memphis doesn't really have a choice. Boosters are leaking this story to Geoff to apply the pressure to get fans back in the seats. Penny will sell that arena out for at least the first few years of his honeymoon without even winning. They are a bad hire away from losing their program for good. They are approaching bottom feeder status in an average to crappy conference. It's a bold, high risk / high reward situation. Penny has an extremely laid back personality and is a golf fanatic. He's not an in your face type of Coach, he's closer to Pastner than Cal.
Which is the reason I would be skeptical if I were Memphis. You might be going down the road of Pastner 2.0 - not sure Memphis can afford that.
I've always doubted Wiseman will even play college basketball. But from what I hear, if he does, pulling him away from Penny would be really tough. Hopefully it would come down to a business decision and he really loves Cal as much as he says he does.
Also, I think Memphis is scared that UK has already made contact with Penny about a job, or is about to. Memphis hates Kentucky, all of them. The last thing they want is to watch more Memphis potential and former affiliates end up at UK.
Penny is a very hot name on the AAU scene. Would it translate? Maybe not years from now, but in the initial phase it could. Especially with certain recruits.
I would love adding Penny as a recruiter. I have serious doubts about him as a college head coach. The coach he played for did less with more talent than any coach I have ever seen. He needs more apprenticeship under a great college coach to learn the trade. Really sharp guy who could be a great HC someday, but I doubt he's ready yet.
I'd expect nothing less from JFCats. His posts are generally terrible.
The ? in the headline is journalism speak for speculation, not set in stone fact.
Could it happen? Sure.
Could it also be Billy Donovan's wife looking at schools in Lexington?
Could it happen? Sure.
Could it also be Billy Donovan's wife looking at schools in Lexington?
So Memphis is bad this year with an established, veteran coach.
They fire him, hire a guy who has never even built a schedule. He presumably does even worse as a head coach than their current coach while he learns the ropes.
Meanwhile, the NBA changes the age rule and James Wiseman is a top 3 pick.
Now how many years do you give Penny to learn and lose all while his AAU/high school affiliation pipeline dries up? By the time he can actually coach at the college level, the kids he has pull with will be playing at other colleges or in the league.
It's just a stupid move. The guy was a middle school coach a few years ago. I know he's Penny. I know Memphis is one of the most destructibly insular cities in America. But there has to be an adult in the room who has reasoning skills beyond the connection made by 14 year old internet fans.
They fire him, hire a guy who has never even built a schedule. He presumably does even worse as a head coach than their current coach while he learns the ropes.
Meanwhile, the NBA changes the age rule and James Wiseman is a top 3 pick.
Now how many years do you give Penny to learn and lose all while his AAU/high school affiliation pipeline dries up? By the time he can actually coach at the college level, the kids he has pull with will be playing at other colleges or in the league.
It's just a stupid move. The guy was a middle school coach a few years ago. I know he's Penny. I know Memphis is one of the most destructibly insular cities in America. But there has to be an adult in the room who has reasoning skills beyond the connection made by 14 year old internet fans.
He’s won over 80% of his games, higher than Rupp, higher than Pitino. He’s 26-6 in the NCAA Tournament here. 4 final fours. In the face of that, the double digit losses are completely irrelevant. It was relevant for Tubby because that’s all he had to show.....I understand the impulse to defend him, and the urge to recoil from ugly criticism. But he really was mediocre here, entire tenure considered, and his stops at Minnesota, Texas Tech and now Memphis have only confirmed what his critics always insisted: he’s an average coach.
This.
I have no hate for Tubby either, but that 9 year FF drought, inconsistent recruiting and teams that got progressively worse after 2005 did him in.
Cal gets more leeway because he' made the Final Four in half of his seasons prior to this one. 50 percent is greater than 10 percent.
Do you think Dookie V will scold the Memphis fans and administration for not keeping OTS?
DO NOT CLICK!! [Tipton Warning]
http://www.kentucky.com/sports/college/kentucky-sports/uk-basketball-men/article44439759.html
Tubby Smith discusses Kentucky departure upon election to UK Hall of Fame
By Jerry Tipton
August 20, 2013
"When Tubby Smith left Kentucky for Minnesota in 2007, he said the move would take him where he was wanted. On Monday, in reacting to the announcement that he will be among this year's inductees into the UK Athletic Hall of Fame, he offered a clarification.
"I didn't mean it that way," he said when reminded of the inference that UK did not want him to remain as basketball coach. He noted the distinction between feeling wanted and feeling needed. It was not necessarily that he felt unwanted by UK. After 10 seasons as Kentucky coach, he sensed that Minnesota had a greater need for his talents.
"I tell recruits it's just as important to be needed as wanted," Smith said. "You have to make that determination. How much are you valued? ...
"I always felt comfortable (at UK). It was just time for a change. I miss the folks there."
But another consideration led Smith to move his success-everywhere coaching career to the next stop.
"You don't want to be where you're tolerated," he said, "but where you're celebrated."
Smith is starting anew at Texas Tech after being fired at Minnesota earlier this year. "There's a shelf life everywhere," he said."
http://www.kentucky.com/sports/college/kentucky-sports/uk-basketball-men/article44439759.html
Tubby Smith discusses Kentucky departure upon election to UK Hall of Fame
By Jerry Tipton
August 20, 2013
"When Tubby Smith left Kentucky for Minnesota in 2007, he said the move would take him where he was wanted. On Monday, in reacting to the announcement that he will be among this year's inductees into the UK Athletic Hall of Fame, he offered a clarification.
"I didn't mean it that way," he said when reminded of the inference that UK did not want him to remain as basketball coach. He noted the distinction between feeling wanted and feeling needed. It was not necessarily that he felt unwanted by UK. After 10 seasons as Kentucky coach, he sensed that Minnesota had a greater need for his talents.
"I tell recruits it's just as important to be needed as wanted," Smith said. "You have to make that determination. How much are you valued? ...
"I always felt comfortable (at UK). It was just time for a change. I miss the folks there."
But another consideration led Smith to move his success-everywhere coaching career to the next stop.
"You don't want to be where you're tolerated," he said, "but where you're celebrated."
Smith is starting anew at Texas Tech after being fired at Minnesota earlier this year. "There's a shelf life everywhere," he said."
Maybe, ya know?
So, about your prediction that UK is going to the NIT. Still find that true? You don't answer any of these questions, so I feel the need to keep asking. It would be over quickly if you just answer the question.
*waits patiently*
Memphis was relevant in the 80's for a bit but the couple good years Cal had there recently they have been an after thought. No one cares about that program and I'm sure they pump a lot of money into that program. Penny would attract recruits for a few years and then downhill from there because he's not gonna have the access to those players in the summer like he did while coaching aau.
Memphis should just pull an old school Memphis move and hire Rick Pitino in the hopes that the Brian Bowen allegations result in minimal damage to him from the NCAA.
Enlighten us JFCats22 what do you know about Wiseman and his relationship with Penny?
So what if Memphis hires Penny and then sucks azz because he has no college coaching experience. Maybe that would be some silver lining to you guys but not to me...... what matters to us is that we'd lose out on more recruits like Wiseman.
Yes Memphis might be screwing itself over just to get recruits but it will also screw us over in making us lose recruits we really need.
If you want to get the best recruits now...... we need to pray tubby keeps his job and see if Penny wants a job as an assistant and give him like 2 mil a year...
Yes Memphis might be screwing itself over just to get recruits but it will also screw us over in making us lose recruits we really need.
If you want to get the best recruits now...... we need to pray tubby keeps his job and see if Penny wants a job as an assistant and give him like 2 mil a year...
With the FBI stuff going on...why hire an AAU coach? Memphis East had a few players that had their eligibility challenged because of moving to play for Penny.
Tubby is WAY overpaid, but after all the Lawsons and the rest of the roster turnover of the last 2 years...his team is about to win 20 games, improving from last season. If you've watched Memphis and seen that roster you would know he's done a good job this season.
He's bringing in a good 4 star and everyone will be back for them next season, I think he should get a chance to finish what he has started. I think he could be a good coach in a conference like the AAC and not risk NCAA trouble.
Tubby is WAY overpaid, but after all the Lawsons and the rest of the roster turnover of the last 2 years...his team is about to win 20 games, improving from last season. If you've watched Memphis and seen that roster you would know he's done a good job this season.
He's bringing in a good 4 star and everyone will be back for them next season, I think he should get a chance to finish what he has started. I think he could be a good coach in a conference like the AAC and not risk NCAA trouble.
It's also pretty insane that in this time of rigid amatuerism and regulations that you can just hire a kid's high school coach with no recruiting restriction.
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