ADVERTISEMENT

Leprechauns, unicorns, player retention.

Son_Of_Saul

All-American
Gold Member
Dec 7, 2007
42,441
85,288
113
Naivety.

Over the last month, we’ve all witnessed the slide of Wenyan Gabriel; the sudden emergence of Humphries; and the on-again, off-again productivity of Briscoe and Bam. In that time, we’ve also watched a number of our fans feed a imaginative inkling in their minds that Calipari would be able to convince 7 top 32 players – maybe 8 if you count Knox –to come to UK and compete alongside Briscoe, Bam, SKJ, Gabriel, Humphries, etc. Most fascinatingly of all, we’ve seen some of our fans put together prospective rosters that look something like this (here’s a conservative one with no Knox in the equation):

PG – Briscoe – Green

SG – Diallo – Alexander - Baker

SF –Vanderbilt – Washington

PF – Bamba – Gabriel – SKJ

C – Bam – Richards – Humphries

What’s strange about these projections is that they assume no less than six former top 32 recruits will be willing to come off the bench; that a player would rather be a third string center at UK than make money professionally in Australia; and that former five star studs like Gabriel or SKJ are mutually okay with a supporting role behind a top 3 pick (Bamba). The reality (which we are all aware of), is that UK is landing elite players because Cal is selling them on being the focal point. They aren't coming to UK to play 8 to 11 minutes a game as a third string, former five star all-American.


That said, those of you who are presently decrying the woes of OAD have set yourselves up for being misled if you look at it from a veteran vs. freshmen analysis. I know that in UNC winning the title, some of our fans are looking at the veteran leadership of that UNC team. The reality is that UNC caught lightning in a bottle by keeping Meeks, Jackson, Hicks, and Berry as long as they did (and even then, did everything possible to not look the part of a real national champion). Despite all of that, UK was a Mulder or Willis three pointer away from knocking off UNC (or a swing call in the first half). OAD had little to do with UK’s Elite Eight loss. Wide open missed shots – by veterans no less – and some bad break calls, were the bigger issues.

Also, those of you who are still not convinced that OAD is the way to go, I simply ask you to respond to this question: Would UK have been demonstrably worse this year if they substituted Miles Bridges for Derek Willis? Markelle Fultz for Mychal Mulder? The issue has never been veterans vs. freshmen; rather, it’s always been talent level vs. talent level. UK had massive roster holes this season (namely, inconsistencies at the 4 spot and also no 3 man to match up against elite wing scorers). Those issues both killed UK all season, and ultimately kept UK from winning the title this year.
 
i disagree with talent level versus talent level. Because it's not really about talent as that doesn't equate to current on court performance. Talent just means you have potential to be great. Lebron/AD are two of most talented people currently in NBA. But that doesn't mean as a rookie, they were the best players.

This is going to be most captain obvious comment ever...but the reality is to get 5 best player in each position. The reality of this is that this can be either freshman, sophomore, junior or senior. It doesn't really matter.

Finding those best players can be done by any method whatsoever.

You take freshman class of

Fox, Monk, Bridge, Jackson, and Giles (assume he never got hurt)...anyone going to tell me this team wouldn't have won NT?

Or you take a team of top seniors...are you saying they won't win National Title?

The problem in each is this.
1. You don't really know if Freshman will end up being best of their respective position. While some players are more obvious.

2. You don't know that seniors will end up developing the skills necessary to become top 5 in their respective position.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Son_Of_Saul
i disagree with talent level versus talent level. Because it's not really about talent as that doesn't equate to current on court performance. Talent just means you have potential to be great. Lebron/AD are two of most talented people currently in NBA. But that doesn't mean as a rookie, they were the best players.

This is going to be most captain obvious comment ever...but the reality is to get 5 best player in each position. The reality of this is that this can be either freshman, sophomore, junior or senior. It doesn't really matter.

Finding those best players can be done by any method whatsoever.

You take freshman class of

Fox, Monk, Bridge, Jackson, and Giles (assume he never got hurt)...anyone going to tell me this team wouldn't have won NT?

Or you take a team of top seniors...are you saying they won't win National Title?

The problem in each is this.
1. You don't really know if Freshman will end up being best of their respective position. While some players are more obvious.

2. You don't know that seniors will end up developing the skills necessary to become top 5 in their respective position.

Good thoughts.



I tend to believe talent typically shows up in the actual games. Yes, there are guys (like Jonathan Isaac) who look like they’ll be much better down the road than they presently are. That said, the talent is still there, and to a high degree, it still performs. That rings true for most of these elite OAD players.

My overall point – as directed to those who are screaming for player retention – is that veterans aren’t particularly necessary. Can they add nuance and help define the outcome of a game? Absolutely. But are the contributions of a Derek Willis or Marcus Lee (to cite last year as an example) demonstrably greater than the potential contributions of a Caleb Swanigan (if one substituted him for Lee last year) or Miles Bridges this year?
 
Last edited:
For years now, I've been waiting to see us retain players. We manage to keep some guys 2 years, but they largely leave after year 2 if not the first year. And those that stay around for 4 years have transferred--Wiltjer to Gonzaga, Lee to Cal.

Hopefully we don't lose any to transfer. As it stands, we could enter the season with a good bit of experience.

Gabriel/SKJ/Humphries/Diallo even practiced for a semester. That's an excellent foundation.

But then you read Humphries may go pro overseas. Maybe Gabriel transfers. And then we're left with SKJ and Diallo--and then we lose them both after this year.

It becomes frustrating to say the least.
 
  • Like
Reactions: harlancatfan
For years now, I've been waiting to see us retain players. We manage to keep some guys 2 years, but they largely leave after year 2 if not the first year. And those that stay around for 4 years have transferred--Wiltjer to Gonzaga, Lee to Cal.

Hopefully we don't lose any to transfer. As it stands, we could enter the season with a good bit of experience.

Gabriel/SKJ/Humphries/Diallo even practiced for a semester. That's an excellent foundation.

But then you read Humphries may go pro overseas. Maybe Gabriel transfers. And then we're left with SKJ and Diallo--and then we lose them both after this year.

It becomes frustrating to say the least.
I think you missed the point of the OP entirely. Experience doesn't matter.
 
I was trying to say that he's right, we do want that. And it doesn't seem to be happening anytime soon.
 
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT