ADVERTISEMENT

Kick in the teeth

Your scenario is possible, but I'm not convinced it will happen. The passionate fanbases in college football are unmatched in the world of sports, except for maybe some professional soccer teams in Europe and South America. I agree it is likely that some more casual fans may check out, kind of like the few thousand NFL "fans" that quit watching because of kneeling, but I would not bet money on a catastrophic loss of fans.
I would say it is possible. I am old enough to remember when boxing and horse racing were huge national sports. Even Major League Baseball has dropped off in popularity to some degree mainly because of competitive imbalance.

Once it becomes obvious that the teams ponying up massive sums of money year in and year out are going to constantly win, and win easily, that's gonna put those passionate fan bases to the ultimate test
 
Impossible to say if we lost any specific HS recruits, but we certainly lost Rogers to Auburn over it.
My point in these discussions is pretty simple. Combining the rankings of high school recruits and transfers, we are, if anything, better off since NIL, and any suggestion of a collapse because of Mitch (or any other cause) is foolish.

NIL is getting some age on it. We pursued transfer players for the 21/22 season with NIL in hand, pulling in Levis, Jaquez Jones, Dare Rosenthal, Wandale Robinson, and others. And these names lifted a likely 7 win team to 10 wins.
 
I suspect he's tired of the requests correlate strongly to the amount of wealth he has and maybe how much/little access he has been given vs how much he has donated. Some boosters pay for access, while other are alum and just want to help the team put a better product on the field. If he's a basketball booster, then he's probably disappointed in the product results since he's been on board, but I doubt too many football boosters are feeling the same since the team has steadily grown since the boosters started supporting it.
The guy is not a UK graduate, just a good old boy who started a Pallet business and sold it to a International Company. His role as a booster was to get seats behind press table.
 
  • Like
Reactions: satcheluk
As a Wealth Manager, risk management is a daily concern. With my own assets I am willing to take extreme risks on occasion, but with client and employer assets I am the opposite. I think it is wrong to criticize Mitch for taking the conservative approach, but he is fair game if he doesn't adjust his approach now that the unknown risk has been wiped clear.

Agree with you until the last part of your post. Nothing is "cleared" yet. It's just a temporary injunction. Could be removed. Just because there's an injunction doesn't mean everything is OK to do now.

You always do things the right way. Never change just because someone else is doing the wrong thing and profiting from it.
 
Last edited:
azubuikefan said:
Ncaa refused to pay players for too long. This is what happens. They should have found a way to share the enormous revenue the players were making them and not worried about players getting free meatballs at Joe Bolognas.

Agreed with this too many administrators were happy with their pay raises and such and if they had just figured something out early on it wouldn’t have gotten to this version of chaos

The NCAA is STILL not sharing revenue with players and STILL CAN'T.

This STILL isn't about "the NCAA paying players a share of revenue." What is so hard to understand about that and makes people keep confusing that with NIL?

Did the NCAA really screw up this whole thing? Absolutely! Not letting kids profit from building their image was always bullsht. The problem wasn't the kids, but the boosters and the schools then as now not following the rules so they could gain a competitive advantage through cheating. They eliminated it for everyone because they KNEW (and were correct in that knowledge) that some would abuse the system.

This still doesn't make paying players to go to a certain school into NIL.

Investigations can still be ongoing. If it's found that a school and/or its bosters enticed an athlete rather than purchased NIL rights independent of where that athlete enrolled, that would still be punishable within guidelines already established. The former is not NIL.
 
I would say it is possible. I am old enough to remember when boxing and horse racing were huge national sports. Even Major League Baseball has dropped off in popularity to some degree mainly because of competitive imbalance.

Once it becomes obvious that the teams ponying up massive sums of money year in and year out are going to constantly win, and win easily, that's gonna put those passionate fan bases to the ultimate test
You mentioned two industries whose decline in popularity coincided with significant rise in the competition's popularity. Boxing's decline coincided with a rise in UFC/MMA. I was a regular consumer of boxing pay per views and switched to UFC not too long after Tyson imploded. Horse racing was huge mainly because of the gambling component and as gambling/sports books/casinos have been legalized nationwide, track attendance and betting profits have diminished. College football has no direct competitor and I would bet big money there is no significant loss of fans/viewers over the next 5 years. now 20+ years from now, I would say they have a different issue and that is that kids now don't love watching sports on TV nearly as much as we do. I've watched every televised FSU game since I was old enough to sit up and the same for UK since we moved to Lexington in the early 80's. My son loves to go to UK football games in person, but I can't get him to finish the 1st quarter on TV before he gets on the computer to play games with his friends. Maybe that will change when he goes to college, but I was already a die hard college football fan before I went to Jr High.
 
  • Like
Reactions: law1127
My point in these discussions is pretty simple. Combining the rankings of high school recruits and transfers, we are, if anything, better off since NIL, and any suggestion of a collapse because of Mitch (or any other cause) is foolish.

NIL is getting some age on it. We pursued transfer players for the 21/22 season with NIL in hand, pulling in Levis, Jaquez Jones, Dare Rosenthal, Wandale Robinson, and others. And these names lifted a likely 7 win team to 10 wins.
Totally agree that we are a net positive in NIL, but it's not hard to imagine that would could have done significantly better if Mitch had been 100% on board from the get go. I also recognize his reasons for being conservative with the risk management, so am certainly not blasting him. Given the way the courts are leaning, I am going to be critical of him if he doesn't get more vocal about promoting NIL as an essential element of our team's success.
 
The guy is not a UK graduate, just a good old boy who started a Pallet business and sold it to a International Company. His role as a booster was to get seats behind press table.
Then it makes sense that he's getting tired of the requests. He already got what he wanted, so the incentive has passed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: KYCAT78
Agree with you until the last part of your post. Nothing is "cleared" yet. It's just a temporary injunction. Could be removed. Just because there's an injunction doesn't mean everything is OK to do now.

You always do things the right way. Never change just because someone else is doing the wrong thing and profiting from it.
It's a fair point. It's not a final ruling, so my comments would be better suited for that eventuality. I'm not a lawyer, but there seems to have been a relatively clear signal from the various judicial regimes, as ot where this is headed. While there is not zero risk, maybe there's room to loosen his stance?
 
Then it makes sense that he's getting tired of the requests. He already got what he wanted, so the incentive has passed.
I believe he has to pony up each year to keep his seats. I do not know for sure I think my son told me his contribution requirement is 100k plus cost of seats.
 
A federal judge yesterday put an injunction on the NCAA enforcing any rules on NIL.
If this ruling holds, that pretty much finishes the hopes of a lot of teams that don't have unlimited funds.
Not even semi pro....just age appropriate pro ball.

Nice while it lasted.
If it holds.
If.
My opinion is football and power 5 hoops will be getting 99% of the nil dough and at some time in the near future all other sports will be club teams with zero scholarships . This is going to destroy college sports as we know it jmo.
 
Ncaa refused to pay players for too long. This is what happens. They should have found a way to share the enormous revenue the players were making them and not worry about players getting free meatballs at Joe Bolognas.
Spot on they deserve everything coming their way and it’s going to be ugly.
 
Im for a pyramid system like the EFL has. Start with the top 30 teams and work your way down. The teams who want to stay in the top tier will have to dish out cash. If not, they are relegated down to the next level.
 
Im for a pyramid system like the EFL has. Start with the top 30 teams and work your way down. The teams who want to stay in the top tier will have to dish out cash. If not, they are relegated down to the next level.
That too is a possibility and while some will watch, I won't be one of them
 
My opinion is football and power 5 hoops will be getting 99% of the nil dough and at some time in the near future all other sports will be club teams with zero scholarships . This is going to destroy college sports as we know it jmo.
.Can't legally happen if university receives any government funding. Football would have to be semi pro or some other name. TitleIX prevents that from happening.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ky grandpa
What the schools that filed suit don't realize, is if they choose to, 4-5 teams will sign the top players every year, and those 4-5 aren't in the southeast.
Sort of... 10 of the top 15 are in the SE that would actually care enough about sports to do this at a big scale. SoCal would seemingly have enough money to buy any player but they will blow tons of money on a few stars and not have the fan base to attract a full roster. Most mega wealthy people don't care about college sports so you need tons of people who can pony up $1000 or so.
 
.Can't legally happen if university receives any government funding. Football would have to be semi pro or some other name. TitleIX prevents that from happening.
the ncaa would have to pay each athlete the same but nil isn't in anyway part of Title 9.... But I do think football and BBall break from the ncaa because of the money. Hard to justify the top 40 teams bringing in 75% of the money and the bottom 70 teams only bring in 25%.
 
  • Like
Reactions: deep3
Even if the present financial model continues, and it won't, the NCAA is on the downward slope to oblivion. Won't likely matter and anyone around to remember this conversation will be thinking years from now how ashamed we should have felt for wasting our time on it.
 
You mentioned two industries whose decline in popularity coincided with significant rise in the competition's popularity. Boxing's decline coincided with a rise in UFC/MMA. I was a regular consumer of boxing pay per views and switched to UFC not too long after Tyson imploded. Horse racing was huge mainly because of the gambling component and as gambling/sports books/casinos have been legalized nationwide, track attendance and betting profits have diminished. College football has no direct competitor and I would bet big money there is no significant loss of fans/viewers over the next 5 years. now 20+ years from now, I would say they have a different issue and that is that kids now don't love watching sports on TV nearly as much as we do. I've watched every televised FSU game since I was old enough to sit up and the same for UK since we moved to Lexington in the early 80's. My son loves to go to UK football games in person, but I can't get him to finish the 1st quarter on TV before he gets on the computer to play games with his friends. Maybe that will change when he goes to college, but I was already a die hard college football fan before I went to Jr High.
I see the same thing with my almost 20 year-old. He’s a fan, if fact, I’d say he’s a big fan. But it’s just different than it was with us. Their attention spans are shorter for sure. Plus, it looks like this younger generation on the whole is going to have a lot less disposable income than we had.
 
  • Like
Reactions: satcheluk
the ncaa would have to pay each athlete the same but nil isn't in anyway part of Title 9.... But I do think football and BBall break from the ncaa because of the money. Hard to justify the top 40 teams bringing in 75% of the money and the bottom 70 teams only bring in 25%.

I understand NIL isn't part of TitleIX. It was posted that all teams would become club teams except football with no scholarships. At least that is how I read it. That is illegal under Title IX if a school receives government money. All other male sports may become club sports with no scholarships, but female will have 85 scholarshipped athletes in some sports.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hmt5000
I would say it is possible. I am old enough to remember when boxing and horse racing were huge national sports. Even Major League Baseball has dropped off in popularity to some degree mainly because of competitive imbalance.

Once it becomes obvious that the teams ponying up massive sums of money year in and year out are going to constantly win, and win easily, that's gonna put those passionate fan bases to the ultimate test
Imo baseball was more popular and a better product when the Yankees were the evil empire. The problem with baseball has been starting its meaningful games after bedtime for 2 generations and failing to market stars. Most people couldn’t pick 3 mlb all stars out of a crowd. Imagine saying that in 1998.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hmt5000
azubuikefan said:
Ncaa refused to pay players for too long. This is what happens. They should have found a way to share the enormous revenue the players were making them and not worried about players getting free meatballs at Joe Bolognas.



The NCAA is STILL not sharing revenue with players and STILL CAN'T.

This STILL isn't about "the NCAA paying players a share of revenue." What is so hard to understand about that and makes people keep confusing that with NIL?

Did the NCAA really screw up this whole thing? Absolutely! Not letting kids profit from building their image was always bullsht. The problem wasn't the kids, but the boosters and the schools then as now not following the rules so they could gain a competitive advantage through cheating. They eliminated it for everyone because they KNEW (and were correct in that knowledge) that some would abuse the system.

This still doesn't make paying players to go to a certain school into NIL.

Investigations can still be ongoing. If it's found that a school and/or its bosters enticed an athlete rather than purchased NIL rights independent of where that athlete enrolled, that would still be punishable within guidelines already established. The former is not NIL.
The money making programs have been sharing the revenue, it’s called title ix.
 
I believe he has to pony up each year to keep his seats. I do not know for sure I think my son told me his contribution requirement is 100k plus cost of seats.
He's a bigger fan than I am. I'll pony up for football, and I rented SEC basketball tourney suites for 5-6 years, but I just don't enjoy watching games in Rupp except for 1 or maybe 2 games a year.
 
  • Like
Reactions: KYCAT78 and hmt5000
I see the same thing with my almost 20 year-old. He’s a fan, if fact, I’d say he’s a big fan. But it’s just different than it was with us. Their attention spans are shorter for sure. Plus, it looks like this younger generation on the whole is going to have a lot less disposable income than we had.
You're last point is more important than most realize. I bought my son whole life insurance and opened an investment account for him when he was a few months old and will leave him an income producing portfolio when we pass. The new normal is upon us.
 
  • Like
Reactions: gojvc
s

So, your response is that you cannot name a football player we lost as result of Mitch’s claimed reluctance to embrace NIL.
You don’t know who we possibly could have gotten if he had his ducks in a row. That’s my response to that. It would likely be closer to the talent level of others in the SEC tho. Instead of being one of the few programs in this league, that takes more 3 stars than blue chips. Great, dynamic individuals don’t concern themselves with rule following. It’s all about bending to the rules to your benefit.
 
Then capitalism is evil because the entire system is built on the desire to make as much money as possible and to put the fewest roadblocks in the way that would prevent the accumulation of wealth.
Capitalism when done correctly is good. Jesus only slammed it when it was abusive to the poor or in the Temple. He lived among the marketplace folks and participated in private enterprise Himself.

Issues happen with Greed and avarice.(look at Ananias and Saphira). That’s the LOVE discussed.

Competitive and fair business practices providing for your needs- Good

Price Gouging and kickbacks - Bad
 
Capitalism when done correctly is good. Jesus only slammed it when it was abusive to the poor or in the Temple. He lived among the marketplace folks and participated in private enterprise Himself.

Issues happen with Greed and avarice.(look at Ananias and Saphira). That’s the LOVE discussed.

Competitive and fair business practices providing for your needs- Good

Price Gouging and kickbacks - Bad
Jesus? If the accounts of when he existed are accurate, it would have been 1700-1800 years before Capitalism began. I agree that greed is bad, so it's curious why the party that claims to love Jesus so much blocks any attempts to suppress the greedy powers of our economic structure. I'm a financial insider and wish we had more regulation to protect the little guy, but our system was built, is grown by, protected by and benefits mostly the greediest among us.
 
Jesus? If the accounts of when he existed are accurate, it would have been 1700-1800 years before Capitalism began. I agree that greed is bad, so it's curious why the party that claims to love Jesus so much blocks any attempts to suppress the greedy powers of our economic structure. I'm a financial insider and wish we had more regulation to protect the little guy, but our system was built, is grown by, protected by and benefits mostly the greediest among us.
I lean conservative, but I’m a strong believer in stakeholder theory. I oppose exorbitant CEO bonuses especially when business isn’t that well. If anything from an optics level. If there’s greed I want to see it exposed and addressed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: satcheluk and KT34
the ncaa would have to pay each athlete the same but nil isn't in anyway part of Title 9.... But I do think football and BBall break from the ncaa because of the money. Hard to justify the top 40 teams bringing in 75% of the money and the bottom 70 teams only bring in 25%.

NCAA doesn't have anything to do with TiTLEIX, but members of the NCAA who sponsor every team in the NCAA certainly do. Unless laws change, not likely, there will be a female scholarship for every male scholarship. Why did so many schools give up sports like wrestling and start up volleyball? It was to fall in line with TitleIX. Break Title IX law and NIL is the least of your worries. Well the university's because they lose federal funding.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rembrandt90
A federal judge yesterday put an injunction on the NCAA enforcing any rules on NIL.
If this ruling holds, that pretty much finishes the hopes of a lot of teams that don't have unlimited funds.
Not even semi pro....just age appropriate pro ball.

Nice while it lasted.
If it holds.
If.
It is a temporary injunction while the discovery phase continues. Common in trials.
 
I lean conservative, but I’m a strong believer in stakeholder theory. I oppose exorbitant CEO bonuses especially when business isn’t that well. If anything from an optics level. If there’s greed I want to see it exposed and addressed.
I respect that. I work in finance and before was C level Executive Search Consultant in Asia and it makes me sick the income/bonuses that C-level folks get without regard for long term implications. I believe a significant portion C-level merit compensation should be held in trust during a claw back period to make sure the short term moves weren't designed to maximize bonus pay only to cause damage down the road. In Japan, they have a stakeholder philosophy where CEOs avg 30-40x worker salary and if they have a long run of great management/stewardship, then they are rewarded with enormous retirement gifts and a six figure pension.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CaptainBoogerBuns
That's not exactly a good description of capitalism.
Try working on Wall St. We have a system that rewards production and growth and incentivizes it to a point that causes individuals to set aside their morals in the pursuit of wealth. I'll give you an example. My brother sells medical devices and he used to work for Medtronic a long time ago. He was making $400-$600k, with a base salary of under $100k, a year selling something that cost $10-$20k per surgery. He had like a three state territory. So I'm living in Japan and I meet the sales guy who sells the exact same product and his territory is Tokyo, so roughly 40mm people. His salary is just under $100k, he gets very little merit compensation, and he has access to several end of year bonuses that are based on the profitability of his team, division and entire company which put his max comp at around $120k+. I told him what my brother was making and he said he gets paid about the same as the Japanese CEO. As a sales person, my brother is only incentivized to max out his bonus. The Japanese guy is incentivized to make sure the company if profitable. In the US All the sales people get the hospital HR folks to order extra at the end of the year to help the sales people they like reach bonus milestones, then Jan 1 the rat race starts up again. This is the reason medical costs are sky high here when I paid 75% less in Japan, never needed an appointment and could see a Dr, then prescribed an MRI and go back to the DR to discuss the MRI all in a few hours and spend less than $0 including prescriptions. A may not be a good description of the capitalism we want, but hard to argue that its not the one we have.
 
NCAA doesn't have anything to do with TiTLEIX, but members of the NCAA who sponsor every team in the NCAA certainly do. Unless laws change, not likely, there will be a female scholarship for every male scholarship. Why did so many schools give up sports like wrestling and start up volleyball? It was to fall in line with TitleIX. Break Title IX law and NIL is the least of your worries. Well the university's because they lose federal funding.
Agreed. I just think Football and Bball will go outside the ncaa model. That gets them outside title 9. They will basically be semi pro teams with just the University name on the jersey.
 
Agreed. I just think Football and Bball will go outside the ncaa model. That gets them outside title 9. They will basically be semi pro teams with just the University name on the jersey.
Which they’ve been for a while now! Our administration is just stuck on the way things used to be instead of looking ahead to what’s coming. Likely bc you have so many nearing retirement over there that just need to go ahead and do it. (President, AD, basketball coach) They’ve all got one foot out the door anyways and feel no need or desire to adapt and change for the betterment of the fans. The fans something those 3 care zero about.
 
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT