Is UK too cash-poor for the buyout?

[Imafan4evr_]

Reason I’m asking: if we have to pay Stoops his salary next year as he fully burns this mess down, then buy him out afterward anyway, what’s the point in bringing him back at all? It’s not like the buyout magically goes away the longer we keep this going. On top of that, how much money does the program stand to lose by reverting back to the Joker days? How much ticket revenue, NIL donations, etc? Multiple millions per year, surely.

I realize the buyout is a stupid amount of money, but he’s getting it either way and carrying on just kills the whole program. Are we too “broke” to afford that massive hit up front by paying him now and moving on?

(By the way, I believe the wording of his contract states he gets the full amount within 60 days, which is an entirely different discussion on the stupidity of that agreement by our AD.)

 

[rick64]

You could pay another coach probably half or less of what Stoops is making for pretty much the same results. He's never been worthy of a top 10 salary.

 

[ManitouDan]

Maybe paying $$$$ for the team to stay at a hotel in Lexington on Friday nights is a bad investment.. can you imagine the price tag on a season of that ?

 

[CRZ4UK]

Only 2 schools have ever paid a buyout that high I read. If Barney has shown anything it’sthat he’s NOT a trailblazer.

 

[R.O.T.Muckinfush]

Is it true that stoops buyout is a lump sum???

 

[CRZ4UK]

Is it true that stoops buyout is a lump sum???

Yes. Due in 60 days.

 

[R.O.T.Muckinfush]

Yes. Due in 60 days.

LMFAO... that is pure shiiiite... we get to sit back and watch the program go belly up over the next few seasons. I would say stoops will be here 3 more years. The dang buyout can't be paid in a lump sum.

 

[JPFisher]

If we were considering buying Cal out, we can buy Marky Mark out. We have the best alum coach ON A SILVER PLATTER and if we slow ball this crap, we stand to lose out on at least next year's ticket revenue, a ton of fan support, and NIL – all of that in addition to an awesome coach.

IDGAF how motivated Stoops is. He had this program going well and let it slip through his fingers. I watched Kentucky football and basketball with my dad. Watching UK football is how I remember grilling and eating wings in Commonwealth Stadium's lots with him and his work buddies. I will not watch a single game and relive those days if Stoops and his inept staff pollute the sidelines next year.

And I hate saying that, but it's painfully apparent that Stoops has completely lost the plot.

 

[UKWildcats1987]

If we were considering buying Cal out, we can buy Marky Mark out. We have the best alum coach ON A SILVER PLATTER and if we slow ball this crap, we stand to lose out on at least next year's ticket revenue, a ton of fan support, and NIL – all of that in addition to an awesome coach.

IDGAF how motivated Stoops is. He had this program going well and let it slip through his fingers. I watched Kentucky football and basketball with my dad. Watching UK football is how I remember grilling and eating wings in Commonwealth Stadium's lots with him and his work buddies. I will not watch a single game and relive those days if Stoops and his inept staff pollute the sidelines next year.

And I hate saying that, but it's painfully apparent that Stoops has completely lost the plot.

Barney wasn't considering buying cal out this past off season. Arkansas saved barney.

 

[CRZ4UK]

Barney wasn't considering buying cal out this past off season. Arkansas saved barney.

Not even in his dreams. He would have tanked the Basketball program, just like he is going to the football program. Both would have been in a death spiral if not for Cal bailing his Azz out.

 

[AzubuikeandFitch]

Reason I’m asking: if we have to pay Stoops his salary next year as he fully burns this mess down, then buy him out afterward anyway, what’s the point in bringing him back at all? It’s not like the buyout magically goes away the longer we keep this going. On top of that, how much money does the program stand to lose by reverting back to the Joker days? How much ticket revenue, NIL donations, etc? Multiple millions per year, surely.

I realize the buyout is a stupid amount of money, but he’s getting it either way and carrying on just kills the whole program. Are we too “broke” to afford that massive hit up front by paying him now and moving on?

(By the way, I believe the wording of his contract states he gets the full amount within 60 days, which is an entirely different discussion on the stupidity of that agreement by our AD.)

College coaching Golden Parachute.

These buyout clauses are everything wrong with athletics. If you aren't performing your job to the expected standard then you should be terminated, not awarded a large sum of money to cover the remaining yrs.

This is on Mitch for agreeing to the terms of an absurd buyout amount for mediocre results. Only a select few coaches should be able to dictate large buyouts.

 

[rick64]

Is it true that stoops buyout is a lump sum???

I'm sure if Mitch did decide to cut bait, it could be negotiated to spread over several years. Would be less of a tax hit for Stoops, and less painful for UK.

 

[bthaunert]

College coaching Golden Parachute.

These buyout clauses are everything wrong with athletics. If you aren't performing your job to the expected standard then you should be terminated, not awarded a large sum of money to cover the remaining yrs.

This is on Mitch for agreeing to the terms of an absurd buyout amount for mediocre results. Only a select few coaches should be able to dictate large buyouts.

The buyout amount 75% is the going rate for coaching contracts at the P4 level. That's pretty much the standard. Whether we think he should have it or not, it's what is in coaching contracts nowadays. Texas A&M had the Jimbo buyout and Elko's contract includes the 75% clause (80% if he's fired with 3 or more years remaining on his contract).

The issue isn't the 75% buyout as that is never going away. The issue is the length of the contract. Stoops original contract was 5 years (Pope just signed a 5 year contract). UK should never have more than 5 years remaining on a contract. If they have 2 years remaining and you want to give them a raise...add 3 years on to the contract, keeping it at 5 years. Had his last contract been 5 years, he would only have 2 years remaining. Instead, the contract he signed was for 9 years.

Your premise about coaches not being able to be fired for what they are hired to do...win football games...is spot on.

 

[Imafan4evr_]

I’m not overly familiar with buyouts at other places, but it’s the upfront payment on this one that rubs me wrong. Are they mostly all like that now? $44 mil paid over 5 or 6 years, for example, looks much more palatable on paper for the university. Stoops should never have been considered so valuable to us that the AD would feel the need to agree to that stupidity.

 

[R.O.T.Muckinfush]

Stoops ain't going nowhere guys. The leadership is ignoring us dumb fans. We gotta make em pay. All the spin and propaganda in the world won't trick the fans into supporting this crap this time.

 

[BlueBallz]

Only 2 schools have ever paid a buyout that high I read. If Barney has shown anything it’sthat he’s NOT a trailblazer.

From what I looked up, only one and that was Jimbo, the next highest was Malzahn at Auburn, which was $21.5 million, unless I missed something

 

[CRZ4UK]

From what I looked up, only one and that was Jimbo, the next highest was Malzahn at Auburn, which was $21.5 million, unless I missed something

I can’t believe all the people that say … just pay it. Like 44 million grows on trees.
Plenty of schools are stuck with a coach because of insane buyouts.
Florida, Florida St. , Auburn, and LSU would all have new coaches if it wasn’t for their buyouts.

 

[chevyman 50]

Ky paying Stoops 9 million a year its going to cost as much of a buyout anyway in a few years. I think they could come up with the money Ky is not a poor school.

 

[TACcat7]

They have the money. Don’t let anyone lie to you. They will just have to move it around a bit and delay anything they were going to do for a short period of time.

In the end, it will be worse if they don’t make the move now. If you say you can’t afford 44 million then you can’t afford 33 million. Which is what it will be after next year. Soooooooo, if you choose to keep Stoops the Fraud, then what you’re saying is that you’re going to keep him at least two more years.

If they do that, there will probably be fans that never come back as long as Barnhart is around. Maybe even after he’s gone. People are tired of being forced an awful product with smoke and mirrors and their puppets gaslighting people who question any decision they make.

Any serious football program would’ve cut him loose last season at minimum.

 

[R.O.T.Muckinfush]

They have the money. Don’t let anyone lie to you. They will just have to move it around a bit and delay anything they were going to do for a short period of time.

In the end, it will be worse if they don’t make the move now. If you say you can’t afford 44 million then you can’t afford 33 million. Which is what it will be after next year. Soooooooo, if you choose to keep Stoops the Fraud, then what you’re saying is that you’re going to keep him at least two more years.

If they do that, there will probably be fans that never come back as long as Barnhart is around. Maybe even after he’s gone. People are tired of being forced an awful product with smoke and mirrors and their puppets gaslighting people who question any decision they make.

Any serious football program would’ve cut him loose last season at minimum.

Apathy will reign supreme

 

[BlueBallz]

I can’t believe all the people that say … just pay it. Like 44 million grows on trees.
Plenty of schools are stuck with a coach because of insane buyouts.
Florida, Florida St. , Auburn, and LSU would all have new coaches if it wasn’t for their buyouts.

The really interesting thing is, they paid Jimbo, an 8-4/7-5 coach, $76 million to go away to hire an 8-4 coach after whiffing on coaches they thought they would get lol.

It remains to be seen long term how Elko will do, but I think that’s where he will be too.

 

[NoDef]

Barney wasn't considering buying cal out this past off season. Arkansas saved barney.

Cal did UK a favor. He was already rich and knew it was time to move on and was appreciative of what UK did for him. Stoops going to try and get what he can on the way out. He was out the door to A&M until their fans threw a fit about the hire.

 

[southindycat]

Barney wasn't considering buying cal out this past off season. Arkansas saved barney.

You don't know Barney. Guy is playing 3D chess while everyone else plays chutes & ladders. He used a private security firm to collect intimate photos of Arkansas AD and principal booster with their respective gf's (or bf's) and blackmailed them into financing our hoops salvation. Guy is a straight hustler. You know that...

 

[Disappointed Cat]

Reason I’m asking: if we have to pay Stoops his salary next year as he fully burns this mess down, then buy him out afterward anyway, what’s the point in bringing him back at all? It’s not like the buyout magically goes away the longer we keep this going. On top of that, how much money does the program stand to lose by reverting back to the Joker days? How much ticket revenue, NIL donations, etc? Multiple millions per year, surely.

I realize the buyout is a stupid amount of money, but he’s getting it either way and carrying on just kills the whole program. Are we too “broke” to afford that massive hit up front by paying him now and moving on?

(By the way, I believe the wording of his contract states he gets the full amount within 60 days, which is an entirely different discussion on the stupidity of that agreement by our AD.)

Just fire him for the NCAA infractions and pay nothing.

 

[BlueBallz]

Just fire him for the NCAA infractions and pay nothing.

I’m not sure why people keep bringing this up, he was cleared by the NCAA on this, so didn’t violate his contract. UK would have no grounds.

 

[CRZ4UK]

The really interesting thing is, they paid Jimbo, an 8-4/7-5 coach, $76 million to go away to hire an 8-4 coach after whiffing on coaches they thought they would get lol.

It remains to be seen long term how Elko will do, but I think that’s where he will be too.

The thing is the school didn’t pay that. Several big money boosters got together and paid it. UK has the Krafts. That’s it. A&M is the model of everything that’s gone wrong with NIL.

 

[Jakerz]

I fully believe Barnhart is so stupid that even if there was no buyout he’d keep stoops on.

 

[BlueBallz]

The thing is the school didn’t pay that. Several big money boosters got together and paid it. UK has the Krafts. That’s it. A&M is the model of everything that’s gone wrong with NIL.

Yep agree, Kentucky doesn’t have big money donors to support the second highest buyout in NCAA history. It’s just not gonna happen.

 

[ManitouDan]

I’m not sure why people keep bringing this up, he was cleared by the NCAA on this, so didn’t violate his contract. UK would have no grounds.

So who was at fault ? If he was " cleared" by the NCAA ? I'm not looking to argue , just curious how a team forfeits 10 wins but the coach didnt have anything to do with it ?

 

[BlueBallz]

So who was at fault ? If he was " cleared" by the NCAA ? I'm not looking to argue , just curious how a team forfeits 10 wins but the coach didnt have anything to do with it ?

Apparently the players and whoever gave them the money. Honestly a coach can’t track everything that goes on with players. Believe me, if that could be an out for firing I’d be all for it, but everything I’ve read, it wouldn’t be for cause.

 

[UKnCincy]

The buyout amount 75% is the going rate for coaching contracts at the P4 level. That's pretty much the standard. Whether we think he should have it or not, it's what is in coaching contracts nowadays. Texas A&M had the Jimbo buyout and Elko's contract includes the 75% clause (80% if he's fired with 3 or more years remaining on his contract).

The issue isn't the 75% buyout as that is never going away. The issue is the length of the contract. Stoops original contract was 5 years (Pope just signed a 5 year contract). UK should never have more than 5 years remaining on a contract. If they have 2 years remaining and you want to give them a raise...add 3 years on to the contract, keeping it at 5 years. Had his last contract been 5 years, he would only have 2 years remaining. Instead, the contract he signed was for 9 years.

Your premise about coaches not being able to be fired for what they are hired to do...win football games...is spot on.

I agree that the overall buyout amount isn’t that outlandish when you look at the market for head coaches. Jedd Fisch has a $40M buyout and Jeff Brohm has a $39M buyout. Coaches have leverage and their agents are going to use that.

However, I’d disagree to some extent about the length of the contract. I don’t have a huge problem with paying Stoops a high salary and offering him a long term deal. While some of that is a reward for what he accomplished, it’s also part of trying to make UK as attractive a job as possible when it comes time for the next head coach search.

But paying the buyout in one lump sum almost immediately following a firing is a bigger issue. One, that’s much more difficult to manage in terms of cash. Two, it takes mitigation off the table. If Stoops were to be fired, it’s not unreasonable to assume that Stoops could find another head coaching position at another power 5 school, likely making at least $4M per year.

If the buyout were paid out over the remaining term and the contract included a duty to mitigate, then the buyout payments could potentially be reduced by 60%, if not more. Which even for a 9 year contract, becomes much more manageable. But you don’t have that as an option if you have to make a lump sum buyout payment up front.

I can understand why UK switched to that buyout structure in 2017, but it probably should have been reconsidered during negotiations for the most recent extension. Not sure if that was an oversight or if UK didn’t have the leverage to revisit the buyout structure.

 

[ManitouDan]

I cant state how badly I hate this situation , and Barney .. it's all on you . Stoops gonna burn the program to the ground and live like Hugh Heffner while he does it .

 

[Phil_The_Music]

Why in the hell would you sign a contract you know good and well you can't honor if things go south. Especially with a coach like Stoops who has shown plenty of times over the years that he's very flawed. Just sheer stupidity.

 

[chevyman 50]

Mitch will not fire Stoops just like he would have never fired Cal while other schools in the SEC has got rid of coaches some a couple of times since Stoops has been at Ky, Mitch needs to go also guess the head of UK would have to get rid of Mitch.

 

[jeffky]

why don't MITCH do us all a favor and just step down. he has made some of the worst hires and contracts in all of collegiate sports .

 

[BigBlue1992]

None of us truly know but I would guarantee UK can come up with the money.

Some are forgetting to look at it through Mitch’s eyes. How bad would that look if he’s forced to fire, then pay out $44 million to a coach who has a losing record? What would that say about him and his decisions?

Guys it’s simple in my opinion. They are begging the fans for “one more year” then if we were to get lucky and win 6 or 7 games next year (which I see zero chance of), then this whole thing starts all over, everybody is content again, and his safety net is extended.

My belief is Stoops wants to get fired so he can get his money (it’s obvious he doesn’t wanna be here and nobody wants him here) and Barnhart doesn’t wanna pay him the money. Those two guys are holding the program hostage.

That’s why it’s important that the fans keep the pressure on the program and its leaders.

 

[ManitouDan]

We need an insider from the AD's office or football program letting the truth leak out .. is there any talk about a buyout going on . Has Purdue contacted Stoops ? Is it dead silent ? We gonna sacrifice a few years of football and be awful because we refuse to make a move on canning Mr Stoops ? How much harm is gonna come from getting savaged 2-3 more years in a row in the SEC gonna cost UK in overall revenue ? No Bowl appearances , Attendance drops in a big way , people find their way back to spending travel money on the hoops team etc and etc ? What's more costly ? Stoops record been dropping like a hot rock for a couple years . NOW is the time to move on