Is Duke out-working everyone else, or is it something else?

[GonzoCat90]

1. Team USA.
2. Coach K saw he had to adjust to the 1-and-done rule.
3. He's had plenty of OAD studs and only won a title this year, so all the freaking out is a bit much.
4. Coming off a title, it's natural to be in good shape with future recruits.

Combine 1 and 4, with the best coach of all time, in a state rich with talent, while their main rival is being laughed at nationwide, and the most successful school of the last 30 years is probably going to recruit pretty well.


...and yet, we're right there with them, without the Team USA boost, from a program that was at one of its lowest points when Cal was hired. That speaks volumes.

 

[mj2k10]

Honestly, I think there are 2 differences now. One is that Duke has 0 hesitation going after a kid they know is going to be one and done. I don't think that was the case 3-4 years ago. Yeah, they'd recruit certain guys who might be one and done, but they wouldn't have been willing to take 3 in one class, like they did last year.

The other is that I think K is being a lot less selective when it comes to academics. Duke has always made a lot of exceptions for basketball players (they never would have become a power if they hadn't), no matter how much they wanted to pretend that all their players were truly guys who had the academic background to get into Duke even if they didn't play basketball, but as K nears the end of his career, the recruiting focus seems to just be more and more on whether the guy can play. You're not hearing the stories about Duke players' huge SAT scores, like you did with Shane Battier, Jay Williams, etc. They might pass on a kid who's barely going to qualify, but they're not limiting themselves much beyond that, whereas in the past, they might have.

 

[Lumpy 2]

I don't see how things have changed that much. Everyone was expecting Duke to have a great class in '16 and Tatum has been a Duke lean for a while, so his commitment was no surprise. They usually have a top 5 class and this one will probably be #1. I think ours will be pretty good too.

 

[Uk1111]

PLEASE, PLEASE stop saying that any coaches, ( K included ) changed their philosophy about one and done!!!!! Every coach, every year, has gone after top talent! Every friggin year! This is nothing new. The only difference is that K, and Self have gotten extra top tier players since UNC stoped getting any, and K has capitalized on both his titles, and his USA position!

Some of you'll actually believe that Coaches weren't going after the top 10 players the past 6 years, LOL! Just because they're now getting some, does NOT mean they weren't trying before!

 

[Maubris]

This is like fans of Superman being worried about Batman.

 

[mj2k10]

PLEASE, PLEASE stop saying that any coaches, ( K included ) changed their philosophy about one and done!!!!! Every coach, every year, has gone after top talent! Every friggin year! This is nothing new. The only difference is that K, and Self have gotten extra top tier players since UNC stoped getting any, and K has capitalized on both his titles, and his USA position!

Some of you'll actually believe that Coaches weren't going after the top 10 players the past 6 years, LOL! Just because they're now getting some, does NOT mean they weren't trying before!

Nice, simplistic view. Unfortunately for you, it's not really true.

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

It also helps that Tatum sees himself as the OAD type who doesn't want the stigma of the OAD label, ala Jabari Parker. Duke offers the "I'm going to classy program with a classy coach" for the OAD guys trying to shed the stigma. Is it BS? Absolutely, but it's also their reality.

 

[WildcatfaninOhio]

come upins

Made me laugh!

 

[johnl1219]

First rate education? lol They all major in freaking sociology.

You really have no idea what you're talking about. On last year's team, the only player majoring in Sociology was Rasheed Sulaimon. You can easily go to the team page and read exactly what their major is.

 

[johnl1219]

1. Team USA.
2. Coach K saw he had to adjust to the 1-and-done rule.
3. He's had plenty of OAD studs and only won a title this year, so all the freaking out is a bit much.
4. Coming off a title, it's natural to be in good shape with future recruits.

Combine 1 and 4, with the best coach of all time, in a state rich with talent, while their main rival is being laughed at nationwide, and the most successful school of the last 30 years is probably going to recruit pretty well.


...and yet, we're right there with them, without the Team USA boost, from a program that was at one of its lowest points when Cal was hired. That speaks volumes.

I'm amazed when reading these responses that no one is mentioning that Jeff Capel is a great recruiter. He was the one that was extremely instrumental with Tyus Jones and Jahlil Okafor. I've read stories where he would talk to them every day.

While I agree that team USA has helped K seem cooler to young kids, Capel is just as instrumental to the recruiting success.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

I have no doubt they are working hard, but think about it. You are charged with populating these U16 and U19 teams with the best talent available in the United States.

That "scouting" can be done completely outside the realm of the NCAA's influence. I just wonder how that process happens, who does the scouting, and who has access to that information. So does K have access to information that there is this really good PG in Bumfuque, Alaska through his Team USA affiliations that no one else knows about?

It's interesting because everyone else - Cal,Self, Pitino, etc. seem totally reliant on AAU summer scene to identify guys to target, yet Duke keeps finding these gems before anyone else knows about them.

Exactly. He has additional resources and access to these kids through USA basketball that others dont. Combine that with being a good coach, and the media slurping him all the time; and its a deadly combination.

 

[Jmeeks54thebest]

I hate Duke, and I don't like Coach K. But Coach K deserves more respect than you have given him. He is a graduate of the United States Military Academy at West Point, and anyone who doesn't think that's enough to respect him clearly has never even visited a military academy, much less attended one (I attended the Air Force Academy until I was told I couldn't fly- en route to being a firefighter now, not one for desks). That he means he served this country for at least 5 years (that's the minimum after graduating from one of those places and totals 9 years of service to his country), and I'd be willing to be bet that's 9 more years of service to America than you yourself have given.

Make fun of Duke and Coach K's face as much as you want, but for anyone that serves this country (esp a West Point grad) deserves a certain level of respect, and a person who served 1 year short of a decade deserves even more than that.

As far as recruiting goes, quit your whining. We have the #1 class with Murray, who cares if we lost a few battles? This board isn't concerned with how much Duke is scaring every other team in the country. Like Cal has said over and over "I'm concerned about MY TEAM." That's how we should operate as a fancies, imo, since Cal has backed up his speeches with trophies.

 

[jrpross]

It also helps that Tatum sees himself as the OAD type who doesn't want the stigma of the OAD label, ala Jabari Parker. Duke offers the "I'm going to classy program with a classy coach" for the OAD guys trying to shed the stigma. Is it BS? Absolutely, but it's also their reality.

Haha. That's kinda true. Duke is the spot for one-and-doners who are pretentious, basically.

 

[CatDaddy4daWin]

I just wish we had had a chance to play them in the championship. They had the easiest path to the championship by far. We had Wisc, Arizona and ND on our side, who'd they have? A bunch of patsies.

 

[Svarog]

Duke has a ton of advantages and also they are able to offer perks like jobs for parents/family that any other school would get blasted for being associated with. Look at Jewelry store Lance, that was a blatant violation that the NCAA had all the information needed to rule that it was an impermissible benefit (what student with no job can walk into a New York jewelry store and get a 100K line of credit) but nada.

 

[Mark Gastineau]

but not if you want a big audience.

What? 95% of Duke's games are on ESPN, and every home game is a sell-out.

 

[Mark Gastineau]

The other is that I think K is being a lot less selective when it comes to academics.

I'd be surprised if you had any tangible evidence to back up your opinion. Very surprised. Very, very surprised.

 

[Mark Gastineau]

They might pass on a kid who's barely going to qualify, but they're not limiting themselves much beyond that, whereas in the past, they might have.

Again, there is absolutely zero evidence pointing to your conclusion. While this kind of statement supports your agenda, it's pretty ridiculous to toss it out there as a fact.

 

[Mark Gastineau]

Duke has a ton of advantages and also they are able to offer perks like jobs for parents/family that any other school would get blasted for being associated with.

Tyler Hansbrough's mother says hello.

 

[UKCATSFREAK]

For those of us who follow recruiting almost as closely as we do the actual games, something really unusual has been going on the last couple of years with Duke's recruiting.

Duke has shown an uncanny ability to get in early on kids and establish relationships with them before any of the other big schools - and before these kids blow up the national scene. What I can't figure out is whether the Duke guys are just outworking us, UNC, Kansas, and everyone else, or if they are realizing some kind of immense scouting network advantage because of K's Team USA affiliations.

Some recent examples - Frank Jackson was an under-the-radar talent that Duke became heavily involved with before he showed up at the Summer events and blew up - suddenly the guy is in the discussion as one of the Top 2-3 PGs in the class and Duke already has him in the bag. None of the other big time programs were involved with him.

In the 2017 class, Trae Young is another under the radar, Top 50-ish kid that Duke has been heavily involved with - he too blows up this Summer. He also just happens to be best friends with Michael Porter, the Jayson Tatum of the 2017 class.

So what is it? Are they just working harder and doing a better job of finding these kids before everyone else, or is this just another way that Duke is benefitting from the Team USA affiliation?

I think its a combination of things but mostly his affiliation with USA Basketball. Other coaches, including Coach Cal saw this coming a few years ago when they said it was an unfair advantage being the coach of Team USA. Coach K has a lot of people working for him with that team and alit of people scouting young talent. Now I'm sure he has them looking because of the national teams but its not like he just forgets the info when it comes to Duke recruiting. So, its no surprise to me that they have hit on some exploding talent and probably will continue to do so while he is coach of the national team.

 

[LineSkiCat]

They have a cracker-jack arena.. selling out 10k with a bandwagon fanbase isn't real difficult.

Please, do us a favor..

 

[Mark Gastineau]

They have a cracker-jack arena.. selling out 10k with a bandwagon fanbase isn't real difficult.

How do you explain every game on the road being a sell out?

 

[LineSkiCat]

The same reason every other SEC team packs the arenas when we come to town, in hopes of seeing Goliath go down.

 

[LineSkiCat]

And playing 3 other in-state teams doesn't hurt. Kentucky is in foreign and enemy territory when they play every SEC team.

 

[Mark Gastineau]

And playing 3 other in-state teams doesn't hurt. Kentucky is in foreign and enemy territory when they play every SEC team.

Wouldn't expect anything less. Everyone other school marks a home game against UK or Duke as a must-see.

And playing 3 other in-state teams doesn't hurt. Kentucky is in foreign and enemy territory when they play every SEC team.

As a Duke alumnus, I can definitively tell you that there is not much love for Duke inside the state of North Carolina. Hell, even the food service guys on our own campus would give us grief about how they liked UNC more. If anything, a game against UNC or NC State (Wake has been down too much recently to include in this conversation) is far more insane than a game against a team like Clemson, Boston College, etc.

 

[BlueBlood66]

And playing 3 other in-state teams doesn't hurt. Kentucky is in foreign and enemy territory when they play every SEC team.

You really think public schools in the state of North Carolina aren't "enemy territory" for Duke?

 

[anon_q409idbs5m40a]

Duke has always gotten top recruits, so it's hard to understand why the sudden distress over their classes. Having the No. 1 recruiting class means you have the top talent, however, it does not guarantee anything, much less a National Title. Remember, in this era of college basketball, it is next to impossible to win every year. Too much talent spread out over the nation and way more parity than ever before. A lot has to go right for a team to win the title and Duke had absolutely every break possible in their last two titles.

 

[ArmyWildcat81]

They won yet another title, while UK blew two titles in a row. End of story.

 

[anon_q409idbs5m40a]

They won yet another title, while UK blew two titles in a row. End of story.

Yes, and while doing that you're always going to get top recruits. Chances at the title don't come easy.

 

[ArmyWildcat81]

Yes, and while doing that you're always going to get top recruits. Chances at the title don't come easy.

Yep.

 

[Teachable Moe]

What? 95% of Duke's games are on ESPN, and every home game is a sell-out.

Yes. I was thinking of Ga. Tech there. Athletics are a tough sell at lots of schools. Alums are bigger fans than the students.

 

[mj2k10]

Again, there is absolutely zero evidence pointing to your conclusion. While this kind of statement supports your agenda, it's pretty ridiculous to toss it out there as a fact.

It is speculation, and there's no way I can have facts on it, because it's not like schools release the academic records of recruits (although Duke has always been more than willing to trumpet the SAT scores of certain guys they sign).

None of which means I'm wrong.

Beyond that, if you want a Duke love-fest, go back to your own board, jackass. On this board, we're not necessarily going to buy into the Duke mythology, and we will discuss things like Corey Maggette getting money in HS, the job that Chris Duhon's mother got in Durham when he signed with Duke, the SUV that Carlos Boozer was driving while playing at Duke (and the 18 hours of summer school he was taking while being out of the country for 3 weeks), and Lance Thomas's 6 figure jewelry purchase. Deal with it, or else go the bleep away.

 

[Xception]

We should get N.C. State to look into it .

 

[anon_9qtxg60vqzy0y]

Coach K is basically a basketball junkie. He's as competitive now as he was his first year at Duke. Gotta give credit where credit is due. He and Coach Cal are more alike than they are different.

 

[Teachable Moe]

Coach K is basically a basketball junkie. He's as competitive now as he was his first year at Duke. Gotta give credit where credit is due. He and Coach Cal are more alike than they are different.

Well, except for the whole rodent face thing.

 

[Bigblueforever]

What? 95% of Duke's games are on ESPN, and every home game is a sell-out.

S

I'm amazed when reading these responses that no one is mentioning that Jeff Capel is a great recruiter. He was the one that was extremely instrumental with Tyus Jones and Jahlil Okafor. I've read stories where he would talk to them every day.

While I agree that team USA has helped K seem cooler to young kids, Capel is just as instrumental to the recruiting success.

Capel has been in some trouble with the NCAA with different program.

 

[Svarog]

You need a biometric faceprint reading to take the elevator up to the great Krycholsky's office.

 

[SWEc/o95]

How many people do a secret high five with their inner-self if K comes down with back injuries again? Funny how his back only acted up the one year when Duke absolutely sucked.

Yep. Duke was a horrible 9-3 when he up and quit on them. Two wins over preseason top 25 teams and a close loss to a Ray Allen, Donyell Marshall and Kevin Ollie UConn squad. Guess he saw the writing on the wall after a five point loss to Clemson opening ACC play....

 

[SosaUK]

Didn't read the thread but can we please stop with all the duke threads? Good god. We are KENTUCKY! Duke is not close. Stop it

 

[SosaUK]

Yep. Duke was a horrible 9-3 when he up and quit on them. Two wins over preseason top 25 teams and a close loss to a Ray Allen, Donyell Marshall and Kevin Ollie UConn squad. Guess he saw the writing on the wall after a five point loss to Clemson opening ACC play....

My memory is hazy but was it that long ago? Ray Allen was still in college? I don't think so.